How do you deal with with the *stupidity*?

[calmblueocean]

I was just reading this Wired story where the editor denies that their "Al Gore invented the internet" smear actually damaged Gore or the country. The story made me angry enough, but what drove me over the edge was reading all the wingnuts who responded in comments, attacking Gore, smearing him again and again in each post as only wingnuts do, with that insane mix of sarcasm, arrogance, ignorance, insults and flat-out bone-crushing stupidity.

Sometimes I see threads like these and I nearly lose all faith in humanity. How can so many people be so dumb and so mean at the same time? It's like there's an army of them, inpenetrable to truth, or kindness, or rational argument. Letting their lies stand without rebuttal is awful, but you can't fight them because they're really more like automatons than human beings. They just barf up their hate and get it all over you. No words you write connect with any thinking part of them.

How do you deal with that feeling of futility you get sometimes from seeing how stupid and mean these people are?

[amitten]

1. Just barely. n/t

[EstimatedProphet]

2. Point at them and laugh

Laugh at them hard publically. The only thing they are after is attention. they want everyone to recognize how incredibly brilliant and manly they are, so if you point at them and laugh and make fun of them, it gets to them the way nothing else will.

[depakid]

15. Exactly right

Had people like this been ridiculed all along- instead of legitimized- we wouldn't be in half this mess.

[calmblueocean]

18. I'm going to have to post and ask people how to ridicule right wingers

I'm not very good at it. I suppose there's always the classic, "Hahahahahahahaha!" after whatever they post, but somehow I feel like I should be writing something more. :)

[EstimatedProphet]

57. You're right-that's not enough

Here's a possible example. Let's say freeper says something stupid (!) like:

"Them consarned doggone goldarn Ay-rabs is all terraists!"

Your response:

"HAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!
Look at the stupid freeper! Duck before he throws shit on you!
The 'terraists', if you're referring to 9/11, came almost exclusively from Saudi Arabia. We KNOW that that's where they're from, so why aren't we doing anything about the Saudis? Why does Bush hold Prince Bandar's hand like they're spooning? Why is Bandar jokingly called a Bush by the rest of the family? Why are we in Iraq, which has been demonstrated time after time to not only have NO INVOLVEMENT in 9/11, but was one of the more enlightened countries in the Middle East and was keeping a lock on 'terraists' before we encouraged them all to come and attack our forces?
You're stupid, freeper. STUPID! HAHAHAHAHAHA!!! Ignorant fucktard freeper. Look at the bumblehead freeper everybody! Isn't your family embarrassed to open the cage door and let you out in the morning? Do you even have opposable thumbs? Wait-you can't, they're a sign of evolution and I'm sure you don't believe in evolution. And you're right in your case because you're a throwback. You're a genetic flub. You probably have opposable toes, and 6 on a foot at that. Go spout drool and vomit somewhere else. We don't want your kind here. We only want decent people."

Probably something like that would work. Have some fun insulting them and laughing at what they say.

[Kutjara]

3. I think you have to accept...

...that stupid and mean inevitably come as a set. Some people are mean because they're stupid. Some are stupid because they're mean. But the two are like Chip n' Dale: you don't often get one without the other. Sometimes, just sometimes, you can see enough of a chink in their armor of belligerent ignorance that it might be worth taking the time and energy to crack the shell and expose the human being within to the light. But, most of the time, it's a wasted effort. You peel away layers and layers of garbage to find nothing beneath. Some people are the sum of their prejudices and nothing more.

The trick is to be able to tell the hopeful from the hopeless cases. As soon as I figure that one out, I'll let you know.

[calmblueocean]

49. "You peel away layers and layers of garbage to find nothing beneath."

That's a really apt way of putting it.

I usually feel like it's my fault, like if I were better at explaining myself or understanding them, they would listen and see things differently. But more and more, I'm starting to come to the conclusion that more often than not, these people have become so twisted up in themselves that they're unreachable.

The crazy thing is, if Rush told 'em global warming was bad and the Democrats were at fault for it, they'd change their tune in a heartbeat.

[ComerPerro]

4. the right wing has mastered creating lies and making them stick

remember Clinton's "outrageous" $200 haircut?

Whole story was complete BS


And the whole "Clintons trashed the White House" bullshit is still being touted as literal fact...

[Erika]

12. No, they just keep embellishing it to their own tiny circle

They can't face the fact that the Clinton's have far more valuable assets than Air Force I China.

Chuckle, chuckle.

[annabanana]

44. read "Blinded by the Right" by David Brock

There is a right wing noise machine that is deliberate, relentless and very effective. This guy was part of it, saw the light, and exposes the machinery in this book.

[StellaBlue]

5. I was talking about this today with someone

Only more in regards to religious literalism.

I think (as did she) that it's genetic. Seriously. Not as in IQ or intelligence level or whatever, but in logical capabilites. And whether one has the 'god' gene. Like the insatiable need for a supernatural explanation. I daresay I think these two phenomenons are related. It also has something to do with ability to accept reality, and innate, insurmountable fear.

$0.02.

[Erika]

9. Yeh, we can tough it out or call for a GOP nanny regime

Ran into the same complex many times. Republicans seem to want and need someone (else) to protect them and fight their battles. They want to be safe as long as they don't have to fear or sacrifice.

Same reasoning the Chickenhawk Gop uses for sending our troops to war. They want to be safe, but not inconvenienced. As Cheney said during Vietnam, he had other priorities than fighting in Vietnam.

[Erika]

6. Al Gore has an intellectual depth

Their God, W, is a mediocre rich boy who can't even pronounce "intellectual depth" much less define it.

Al Gore humanely cares about people. W sees them as components to produce widgets to produce a profit.

Big difference.

[calmblueocean]

17. I'll just never understand

how they can look at Gore -- the multimillionaire entrepreneur who wants to bring peace and prosperity to the planet -- and call him a 'lunatic', then look at Bush -- the daddy's boy who failed upward into the presidency, who wants war everywhere and could give a shit about you if you're not wealthy -- and call this fuckhead a 'hero'. It just blows my mind.

[Breeze54]

7. You answered your own question. .... their "stupidity" --

Relish in the fact that you are much smarter and intelligent!
Then use their stupidity against them!
"Revenge is sweet." and will be sweeter in Nov. '06 and '08! ;)

[Vexatious Ape]

11. Thanks for the great wallpaper.

[calmblueocean]

14. If we win one of the houses of Congress back this year...

it'll go a long way towards restoring my faith in humanity and in this country. I love America, but this country has become so aggressively, proudly stupid in its discourse that sometimes I feel much of the country deserves what they get with W.

[OneBlueSky]

8. I know what you mean . . . check out this review of . . .

An Inconvenient Truth in today's New York Post . . . (yes, I know it's a Murdoch rag) . . .

Gore's Hot Air: Flaky Flick Suffers From 'Truth Decay'
http://www.nypost.com/movies/movies.htm

makes you wonder just how hard people have to work to achieve this level of stupidity . . .

[calmblueocean]

13. God, that's not just stupid, that's bad writing!

I was going to say it reads like a fifth grader wrote it, but I know fifth graders who are more intelligent than that. Unbelievable.

[Vexatious Ape]

10. I seek comfort

with a big fat glass of bourbon on the rocks and a few hours blogging on DU. Makes me feel like I'm not the only guy out there disgusted with my country and the direction it's taken.

[calmblueocean]

16. Heh, haven't tried the bourbon..

but maybe I'll have to make that an addition to my normal DU habit. Truthfully, if it weren't for DU, I'd be a lot more depressed about the state of the world than I am. Seeing all the energy and hope and camaraderie on DU always reinvigorates me.

[PublicRadioVet]

19. Al Gore would be president now, if...

....William Jefferson Clinton had not fucked, or otherwise been blown by, Monica Lewinsky. I don't care if people think it was none of anyone's business what Bubba did in the Oval Office. I don't care if half the women at DU would have gladly exchanged places with Monica. Sitting presidents ought to know that they cast a huge shadow on their veeps, and the president who leaves his veep in a poor shadow, is shaving off hundreds of thousands, even millions, of potential votes. All the election day chicanery in the world would not have kept Gore out of office in 2000 had more swing voters not felt so disheartened by the Clinton-Gore White House in the aftermath of Lewinsky.

Hell, even if Clinton had come clean and said, OK America, I fucked this little intern, and it was incredibly stupid, and I deserve all the shit I can get for it, and my wife is a saint for not pulling a Lorena Bobbit on my womanizing ass, it would have been different. Clinton would have been owning the problem, and the uproar would not have been such an uproar, and Al Gore might have emerged mostly untouched.

But alas, Clinton, the man you and I and everyone here voted for, did what politicians always do in a scandal: he lied. He lied, he lied, he lied, and when the truth came out, it was embarrassing and it was enough of a cement shoe for Gore that it pulled the poor man under at a critical moment.

People want me to be angry at the Republicans for the 2000 election.

I'm more angry at what the Democrats did wrong, to cause a loss. Just as I am angry at the path the Democrats took in 2004. I mean, the decision making... UGH! It's enough to make a man vote Green! Just to spite his face by cutting off his nose!!

:mad:

[calmblueocean]

20. 100% agree

You always read articles blaming Gore, saying Clinton was popular throughout his impeachment, but I was there and I remember the Clinton fatigue of the time. People wanted to send a message. They'd had 8 years of Kenneth Starr and Clinton's wiener shenanigans and Monica's blue dress and many of them wanted a change. Gore had a tough job, and had Clinton kept his dick in his pants, Gore would've been in the White House today. No doubt in my mind.

[Erika]

23. If Gore had engaged Clinton

in campaigning, he would be president. He chose not to.

Remember, Clinton would be elected today if rules allowed. He brought peace, hope, and a good economy. Everything Bush has failed in.

[calmblueocean]

25. Maybe

There are probably a lot of things Gore could've done differently. But Clinton squandered the momentum Gore should've had because he couldn't control his sexual urges. And no, it shouldn't have been anyone's business but theirs, and I blame the Republican sleaze machine most of all.

[Erika]

26. Clinton was at a high rating during his impeachment

The public was with him. What did sexual urges have to do with anything other than GOP voters?

Clinton could have helped Gore win.

[Breeze54]

28. and NAFTA ...

but although the republi-cons made a huge deal about a BJ, he could
have cut it off (no pun intended);) by just admitting it outright.
But he played into their game by dragging it out! He was stubborn!

The S-election of 2000 was STOLEN! Get that through your heads!!
The SCOTUS decided who was the winner!
Remember Katherine ("gawd speaks to me!") Harris??

Gore won the popular vote!
He didn't lose to a little blue dress! That's the repigs version.

[Broken_Hero]

21. you are more

mad at Clinton for getting oral sex, and not "immediately" taking responsibility for it, than the stolen election of 2000, with the debacle in Florida? Is this what you are saying?

[Erika]

24. Seems pretty silly, doesn't it. W kills thousands

Bill gets an adult consensual blow job. But some equate the two?

[Broken_Hero]

27. True, true...n/t

[PublicRadioVet]

36. Who equated the two?

I simply think it's strange how Clinton has been enshrined in certain sectors, when from where I sit, he left a giant, smelly skid mark across the final two years of his Presidency, and Gore had to walk across them no matter what he did, and it cost Gore a lot of sympathy votes because Gore was just too damn close to Clinton because he was the veep. Clinton should have been thinking about more than just getting his rocks off when he had Monica around. He should have been asking himself, "Will this hurt my Presidency, including my successor, if it gets revealed?" That Clinton apparently failed to ask these questions, and also apparently thought he could fuck an intern and not have the news leak eventually, is amazing for a man of his intelligence. And unforgiveable. At least Bush is stupid. Clinton was not stupid! Which is what makes me so fucking mad!!

[PublicRadioVet]

29. I'm tired of people canonizing Saint Bubba

And yes, I voted for him. And I count myself as being profoundly uncomfortable when Clinton uttered the words, on national TV, "I did not have sex with that woman... Ms. Lewinsky!" I knew he was lying. It was so obvious. Painfully, maddeningly obvious. And I knew then that poor Gore was going to have to deal with the fallout, even though he had nothing to do with it.

If I were Gore, the day after losing the 2000 court battle, I'd have walked up to Clinton and kicked him the balls for being so boneheaded (bonerheaded?) as to bring a SEX scandal (America loves nothing like it loves a scandal involving fucking!) to the White House just two years before my run. I would have kicked Clinton in the balls, hard, and as Clinton lay doubled over I'd have gone all Joe Pesci on his ass.

Yeah, I am still mad. But why get mad at the Republicans? It's been done already. The truth is we had the Republicans BEAT and BEAT GOOD and all it would have taken was a few hundred thousand more voters to ensure that no chicanery, nor electoral college, stood in Gore's way.

But no. As has been stated by someone else (read above) the public had Clinton exhaustion syndrome following the Lewinsky B.S. and whatever shit the Republicans pulled in that fracas, it would not have mattered had William Jefferson Clinton not given the Republicans a mile of rope with which to hang him, his wife, his friends, fuck, anyone associated with him.

Hey, I loved the 90's like everyone else. It doesn't change the fact that Clinton colossally fucked up, right when Gore needed him to be absolutely on his game.

[Broken_Hero]

31. Okay,

just making sure where you stand, is all...Nice, talking with you.

[hfojvt]

33. the way I remember it is that

people had Starr exhaustion and Clinton had 70% approval ratings (or somewhere up there). I also remember when Clinton made the first denial, some talking head on TV chortling that Clinton will be "a goner in days" if the Lewinsky affair is true. So, at least some opinion at the time was that he could not admit to this affair, that if the affair happened, then he was done. The denials created weeks of reasonably doubt, even though I was fairly sure he was lying when he made his "I did not have sex ..." statement, I also still had some slim hope that he was not. It was only when the unwashed blue dress surfaced that denials no longer worked.

Why get mad at the Republicans - uh, because they flogged that story, in direct opposition to the will of the voters who elected Clinton they beat the bushes for spurious reasons to get rid of him and keep him from accomplishing anything.

[PublicRadioVet]

35. See my NBA Title Game anology...

Again, any team unable to recognize when its own players are damaging the team effort as much as the opposing team, has already lost the game.

[hfojvt]

40. not a good analogy

since Presidents cannot be subbed in and out like NBA players. When this was going on, Clinton still had 3 years of his 2nd term left, probably a little bit more important than any future Gore terms.

But to use a sports analogy, we should berate our own players when it is the opposing team which has turned "the game" into a street fight with knives? Sorry, I will pass, even with hindsight, and even though I never voted for Clinton. Clinton was not the problem, the vast RW conspiracy was.

[PublicRadioVet]

51. Well then nothing will ever change

If the VRWC is always to blame, and we hold our own leaders blameless on all counts, then the VRWC has won going away. The first step in beating the Right is in holding our leaders on the Left to a higher standard. If the Republicans are dirty, then we need the Democrats to be ultra squeaky clean. It's not an accident many Americans have Party apathy; they think the two parties are the same because if it's not some Republican being a lying, money-grubbing S.O.B., it's some Democrat being a lying, money-grubbing S.O.B.

Blinding ourselves to what's going wrong on our "team" does nothing to solve the issue. It just means we're condemning ourselves to perpetual losses, in spite of the outrageousness going on on the other side. If, over the next decade or two, the Democrats could really create a record of honesty, responsibility, accountability, and forward vision, from small party officials to big party officials, America would sit up and pay attention, and the VRWC couldn't do a damn thing about it.

[Erika]

22. Bush lied, thousands of Americans have died

and you care about a blow job between consulting adults?

[PublicRadioVet]

30. No blowjob, no Bush!

Get my drift?

It's pointless to entirely blame every bad move on the Other Guys when we can't bring ourselves to recognize when our own people are, for lack of a better phrase, being just as idiotic.

Clinton botched it. Badly. The longer we stay in denial, the longer the Democratic party as a whole is going to remain in the backseat while the Republicans have the wheel. The Democratic party needs a reformation, and a backbone, and a willingness to stare at its own foolishness and ugliness, before real change can happen.

Recognizing Clinton's hand in the Bush victory is just a start.

Or does saying that kind of thing around here get you banned?

[Broken_Hero]

32. proper

voting tabulation in florida, NO BUSH...:) Remember the SCOTUS decision? Oh wait, its Clintons fault...:)

[PublicRadioVet]

34. Missing freethrows can cost you the NBA Championship...

...as easily as botched refereeing or bad calls.

Any good coach will tell you: stop worrying about what the other guy is going, or not doing, or what the refs are doing, and just shut up and play the damn game. If you lose, and you know you blew plays and blew freethrows along the way, you have nobody to blame but yourself.

Clinton/Lewinsky was like missing freethrows AND racking up a bunch of technical fouls WHILE almost getting kicked out of the game, and for what?

Republicans took care of their business. Game over. I don't care if the refs messed up or the Republicans tried to fix the game. Clinton, the fucking star player, was intentionally giving the enemy all the help he could, whether he realized it or not.

[Broken_Hero]

37. I will go along with this

but, what happened in 2000...using your basketball, free throw analagoy is this...

Gore made the free throws, he scored the points to win...

Florida and the powers that be, plus SCOUTUS didn't see it that way, and W became the president.....:)

Even with the clinton/monica thing, Gore did score the free throws, he scored the points to win the presidancy, but of course...the rest is history...so much for our votes counting...oh wait, its Clintons fault, sorry forgot about that....:) :toast:

But, I do see where you are coming from, I am sure, that people did vote against Gore because of Clinton's ...well, affairs with Monica, but even with that, Gore won...the mess in Florida, is probably the single most blantant slap in America's face, that I have seen in my life. But to blame Clintons affair? Nah, Gore won, but Florida/SCOTUS put a stop, to what the voters wanted, and got W in the white house...but, we can agree to disagree of course, :) :toast:

[PublicRadioVet]

38. Yeah, I am not here to pee in cherios!

Just getting shit off my chest. As a Clinton AND a Gore voter.

:bounce:

[Broken_Hero]

39. Okay n/t

[Tactical Progressive]

43. No, you've got it exactly backwards

Al Gore would be President now if it weren't for people who can't put the vital importance of the politics of this country in perspective. People who think a blowjob is anything at all, let alone something that would sway your vote even one percent.

People who think sex is bad. People who think oral sex is bad. People who think infidelity is unforgiveable when 2/3 of the population is guilty of it. People who think lying about an infidelity to strangers is some major character flaw. People who have the ethical malfeasance to taint someone - Gore - with someone else's perceived failings. Etc etc etc.

There was a percentage of Democrats who turned away from Clinton, and even Gore and thereby Democratic politics, for the Lewinski affair. Maybe even millions. Those people have the deaths of 3000 WTC innocents on their hands along with nearly 3000 Iraq and Afghan combat casualties and 20,000 wounded, not to mention probably ten times that many Iraqis caught in the crossfire. Not that they'll ever understand a speck of their responsibility in any of it.

People who don't understand the difference between consentual adult sex and the greedy, bigoted, murderous reality of right-wingers get no pass from me, though their shallow consciences may give them every pass they ever need through anything.

Let me be succinct. Clinton extramarital dalliance and lying about it - zero. Democratic voter affect - unconscionable in the extreme on every level.

The 2000 election showed us many things - about right-wing corruption pervasive from the street right up through the Supreme Court - about the banality and permanent untrustworthiness of American journalism - and about the character failures of Democrats: not Clinton, but rather centrists so ethically shallow that they'd turn on a blowjob and greens so dishonest they have no compunction about lying and backstabbing the rest of progressives.

Monicagate was an eye-opener. I'm actually glad it happened at this point. It showed the depravity of everyone but Clinton: Republicans everywhere, mainstream journalism, and finally callow Democrats.

Don't be part of that last group.

[Speed8098]

47. Well said

You are 100% correct.

Thank You

[Breeze54]

48. On target!!!

:woohoo: I'm going to copy this one! I have a feeling I'm going to need it! ;)

I'll give you kudo's though!
:thumbsup: :thumbsup:

[PublicRadioVet]

50. Some of us actually care that Clinton lied

I still voted for Gore.

But I know a few fence-sitting folk who opted for 3rd party, or not voting at all, simply because they felt like Clinton, as nominal head of the Democratic party, has badly let them down.

And it had nothing to do with the sex. It had to do with the fact that Clinton didn't immediately own the problem, the second it broke the media. He behaved badly.

[deaniac21]

53. Little intern?

[B Calm]

41. I find it amazing that people openly display their stupidty. Yesterday

I noticed two Bush bumper stickers in a 170 mile trip. After the past 6 years, how in the HELL could ANYBODY still support this man?

All I can do is laugh at them. Believe me, I do laugh!

[Skittles]

42. Reagan made idiocy fashionable

idiots are no longer in the closet

[Breeze54]

46. ROFLMFAO !!

Argh!! reagan? "Who's that? I don't seem to remember...." :sarcasm:
What a beautiful morning!! He,he,he!! :rofl: Good to wake up with a laugh.
And the sun is out too after two weeks of rain!!
:woohoo:

[U4ikLefty]

45. How??? Well, I usually ignore your posts!!!

Aw cmon...that was a good shot wasn't it?!? ;)

[Lydia Leftcoast]

52. There's a certain variety of stupid person who isn't happy unless

he can tear down a smart person. It's the "mean and dumb" variation of stupidity.

One of the identifying marks of a stupid person is a readiness to ridicule an intelligent person, idea, or experience or to label that person, idea, or experience as "boring." I'm not talking about things that actually are boring, but about the type of person who has never before read a serious book/attended live theater/talked about something besides sports or celebrity gossip and refuses to do so because s/he is sure it will be "boring."

[calmblueocean]

56. I'm writing this one down.

One of the identifying marks of a stupid person is a readiness to ridicule an intelligent person, idea, or experience or to label that person, idea, or experience as "boring."

This is so true. The reflexive need to ridicule anything new is the essence of stupidity.

Definitely one to put in my Quotes file! :)

[zbdent]

54. I usually delete the e-mails from

my RW brother . . .

Sometimes I direct him to snopes . . . and a few times, I fly off the handle . . . if it weren't for letting my niece know who her uncle was, I'd write them off completely . . . (personally, I think he's adopting his in-laws' attitudes . . . that his wife married below her station, so all the people he grew up with weren't good enough . . .)

[porphyrian]

55. Get really, really stoned.

Then, they just seem a little stupid.