Liz Cheney: Calling Waterboarding Torture is Irresponsible and Libelous

[BlueJessamine]

Run time: 04:38 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Os0r3HPrzVA   Posted on YouTube: May 28, 2009 By YouTube Member: Views on YouTube: 0   Posted on DU: May 29, 2009 By DU Member: BlueJessamine Views on DU: 3085

 
Marcy:

http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2009/05/28/liz-cheney-tries-to-avoid-prosecution-question/

•She hasn't seen the memos she's convinced show torture was effective (no mention of whether she saw the IG report which says torture isn't effective)

•She still ignores the part of Admiral Blair's statement that shows we only got general info from torture--like the 10 pieces of intelligence we got after waterboarding Abu Zubaydah 83 times

•She says respect for the law is a "policy difference"

•She invokes libel if we call her Daddy or those incompetent contractors who waterboarded KSM 183 times torturers.

[jwirr]

1. Go ahead baby sue us - there is nothing we would like better than

getting your old man in court under oath.

[Puzzler]

2. Why do any of us (including the MSM) have to give a f**k about ...

... what Liz Cheney thinks or says?

Correct me if I'm wrong, but she wasn't part of the last administration was she?

[hotnuke]

5. Actually, she was.

According to the video, if you watch the scroll bar, and I'm pretty sure I remember this as being factual anyway, Elizabeth Cheney was given a position as Deputy Secretary of State. Nepotism at its finest, which is only par for the course when you're talking about Repuglicans.

[Puzzler]

15. OK, thanks... I stand corrected.

.

[Rhiannon12866]

35. That's also what Ed Schultz asked tonight...

Since when has Liz Cheney been an expert on national security, other than what she learned from her dad?

[Rhiannon12866]

10. I think the exact same thing whenever she turns up... WTF?

She may have held some minor post because of her dad, but why does this give her the right to a national forum? If she's on, why not Sasha or Malia? Chances are that either of them has more on the ball and would be much more entertaining to listen to... ;)

[spindrifter]

11. She was part of the last administration--

Principal Deputy Assistant Secretary of State for Near Eastern Affairs and Coordinator for Broader Middle East and North Africa Initiatives, heading the Iran-Syria Operations Group

http://www.sourcewatch.org/index.php?title=Elizabeth_Cheney

[pattmarty]

42. that's why things are going so "peachie" over there now.

[annm4peace]

3. Let's send her the photos of those "not being tortured"

29/05/2009



A former U.S. general said graphic images of rape and torture are among the photos of Iraqi prisoner abuse that Barack Obama's administration does not want released.



Retired Major General Antonio Taguba, who oversaw the U.S. investigation into the abuses at Baghdad's Abu Ghraib prison,said he agreed with the President's decision not to release the pictures.



'I am not sure what purpose their release would serve other than a legal one and the consequence would be to imperil our troops, the only protectors of our foreign policy, when we most need them,' he said.



'The mere description of these pictures is horrendous enough, take my word for it.'

One of the horrifying images that an Australian TV network claimed was a detainee being abused in Iraq's Abu Ghraib prison in 2003



One of the horrifying images that an Australian TV network claimed was a detainee being abused in Iraq's Abu Ghraib prison in 2003



It was not exactly clear what photos Taguba was referring to.



A U.S. military official in Baghdad, however, said 'the photos referred to are ones that Taguba is not aware of.'



The Obama administration would not comment about Taguba's remarks.



Iraqis have called for an investigation into his claims.



'The Iraqi government must demand the reopening of the Abu Ghraib scandal case again,' Ali Kadom, 45, who works at the Ministry of Transportation, said.



Khalid Bashi, 35, a trade office owner in Baghdad, said Mr Obama should release the photos to put a stop to a possible scandal.



'Sooner or later, more scandals will appear that show crimes against humanity carried out by American troops in Iraq,' Mr Bashi added.



The prisoner abuse scandal at Abu Ghraib exploded after photos taken by soldiers appeared in 2004.



According to newspaper reports, the new photos depict much more serious abuses than previously documented.



One photo allegedly shows an American soldier raping a female prisoner and another was said to show a male translator raping a male detainee.



The photos apparently relate to 400 cases of alleged abuse between 2001 and 2005 at Abu Ghraib and six other prisons.



SOURCE: Daily Mail

[Enrique]

4. "Waterboarding is torture, period"

sez the libelous irresponsible John McCain

"It's unacceptable. It's unacceptable. One is too much. Waterboarding is torture, period. I can ensure you that once enough physical pain is inflicted on someone, they will tell that interrogator whatever they think they want to hear. And most importantly, it serves as a great propaganda tool for those who recruit people to fight against us. And I've seen concrete examples of that talking to former high-ranking al-Qaeda individuals in Iraq."

[lokichogio]

48. So if...

So if "libelous, treasonous John McCain" says so, should we trust what he says? It's a confusing statement.

[Necon-Be-Gone]

6. She studied law?

She must believe in the Unitary Principle. If Daddy says it's policy than it's legal.

[Titonwan]

31. Unitary Executive theory.

Which I like to call the Urinary Executive theory. because it pisses on the Judiciary and Legislative branches of Government.

[liberal N proud]

7. Maybe she would like to volunteer for a waterboard demonstration

[truth2power]

9. Just what i was thinking...

When's SHE gonna man-up? (so to speak). :eyes:

[Triana]

8. Maybe calling HER a "human" is irresponsible and libelous. n/t

[GaYellowDawg]

12. I am SO sick and tired of this nasally shrill ASSHOLE.

When the hell is someone going to interview her and crush her? She throws such blatant lies out there - when the fuck is someone just going to blast her? Why the hell is the media being so damn hands-off with her? One competent interviewer could completely kick her ass.

[madeline_con]

13. She's either stupid, or is counting on an ignorant audience.

"policy differences" and war crimes are very different things.

spell edit

[DCKit]

23. As if her crowd understands the term "libel".

You'd better file that suit in the reddest county of the reddest state in the country if you don't want to get laughed out of court Liz. Just remember, the attorneys defending the suit won't be from Liberty U, they'll have earned their degrees.

[glitch]

14. Prove it Lizzie. Be waterboarded. If Mancow can do it so can you. 183 times in a month.

Then be raped, have your children raped in front of you, and have your head bashed into a wall repeatedly. Then get back to us on what is and is not torture.

Asshole.

[TankLV]

16. Hey LIZZIE - your dad is a WAR CRMINAL!!!

I DARE you to sue me...!!!

[stlsaxman]

17. Sounds like she's scared to death, and rightly so.

[tomm2thumbs]

18. she's a dimwit, no question about it using term 'libelous'

'maliciously defamatory' doesn't count when 'fact' goes along with it

[pitchforksandtorches]

19. Here is more that you MUST know about this punk Liz Cheney:

More on Liz:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liz_Cheney
Elizabeth graduated from McLean High School in 1984. She received her bachelor's degree from Colorado College where she wrote her senior thesis, "The Evolution of Presidential War Powers," in 1988

http://www.slate.com/id/2210084/
By Zac Frank
Posted Thursday, Jan. 29, 2009, at 1:00 PM ET
In 1988, while Dick Cheney was Wyoming's sole representative in the House of Representatives, his daughter's senior thesis was quietly published in Colorado Springs. The 125-page treatise argued that, constitutionally and historically, presidents have virtually unchecked powers in war. Thirteen years before her father became vice president, she had symbolically authored the first legal memorandum of the Bush administration, laying out the same arguments that would eventually justify Guantanamo and extraordinary rendition, wiretapping of American citizens, and, broadly, the unitary theory of the executive that shaped the Bush presidency.


Some good comments about Liz here:
http://www.dailykos.com/story/2009/5/12/730605/-Liz-Cheney:-White-House-siding-with-the-terrorists
The Cheney's don't fight the wars they start, they profit from them. It's not personal; it's business.

I never thought a face would exist that would give me a more visceral negative reaction than Cheney's. But lo and behold, Liz's seems to be doing it for me. I literally can't stand to look at a picture of her, much less listen to her voice. For some reason, what she's doing and saying I'm finding even more horrifying that what her horrid piece of shit father says. I guess somehow the second generation of evil seems even worse somehow. Please tell me she doesn't have kids, so we'll

[PatSeg]

28. It could be more disturbing seeing it in

a relatively young woman.

I'm not sure, but I think she does have children. What a terrifying thought!

[beac]

30. I'll take "Fathers Who Wrote Their Kid's Senior Thesis" for $1000, Alex.

Possibly the most disgusting example of "daddy issues" in modern history. :puke:

[defendandprotect]

20. She's as nutsy as her father -- but confirms that he fears prosecution!!!

That's a good thing -- !

I think it's also what brought Zeilkow out --

protecting himself and Rice --

[mckara]

21. So, Sue Me Bitch! I Would Love to Discuss This in Court!

[Kaleko]

22. Hard to watch.

She's got the squeaky, cold, tin voice of a Minnie Mouse and the looks of Tonya Harding. The white trash daughter of the most hated man on earth sitting there, smiling a little as she twists the truth beyond recognition must be inspiring raw hatred among Iraquis and anyone else whose life has been destroyed by these bigoted sociopaths.

I left the same comment at the YouTube site but couldn't bring myself to give the video a recommendation. It's just stunning, how low America has sunk, letting these sewer rats pontificate freely on TV after what they've done to the country and elsewhere.

[Name removed]

24. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[troubledamerican]

25. Waterboard Liz Now

[rhymeandreason]

26. "We shouldn't suggest that they'll be punished for what they did."

Liz seems to forget that the "heroes" she refers to have already been scapegoated, tried and incarcerated for what they did at the direction of the Bush White House. Charles Grainer is still in jail, I'm sure he would enjoy having her dad as a cell mate.

[Hulk]

27. Yeah...you go girl....lol

What a hag. This sleazy bitch is spewing as much smoke into the air as possible. The words are beginning to frighten her, and I LOVE IT!! Prosecution for crimes committed. Very simple, bitch.

Your old man is a CRIMINAL...and he had better have the big one quickly, or he is going to swing from the noose, like his old buddy Saddam did.

This bitch, along with all the others involved, need a special place in the Disgrace Hotel as well.

[beac]

29. Calling Liz Cheney a person whose opinion we should give a crap about

is ridiculous.

[MADem]

32. And calling Liz Cheney a qualified GOP commentator is something akin to torture! nt

[Piewhacket]

33. A "policy" of criminality is a CRIME, not a "policy difference".

Its torture, not libel. Your father committed multiple war crimes, Liz. He's
a monster who should be prosecuted and imprisoned.

What's insulting, Liz, is for you to wrap your father's criminality
in the flag, thus insulting honest patriots who actually did serve
their country honorably.

[burning rain]

34. Even in Star Wars they didn't give Chancellor Palpatine a daughter.

This is sick.

[BlueMTexpat]

36. Count me among the "irresponsible and libelous," Liz baby.

Then sue me. Have you no shame?

Truth is always a defense to libel. What your Big Daddy authorized was indeed torture. Characterizing it as anything else is simply a lie.

What is irresponsible is for any TV station/program to give you, Big Daddy, or your fellow torturers and torture-enablers a forum where it even looks as if such actions could be justifiable under any circumstances whatsoever.

It's time for us all to call a spade a spade.

The very idea that the daughter of the Vice President on whose watch 9-11 occurred, a major US city (NOLA) was destroyed, two (I am among those who believe that we also took the wrong course in Afghanistan, although it could be more justified there than in Iraq) illegal and immoral wars were begun, with a third one a-brewing in Pakistan largely because of our many wrong policy and other decisions in Afghanistan, the US economy was practically destroyed, and our global standing was literally ruined would call anyone "irresponsible and libelous" because they call torture what it is where it exists is in itself irresponsible and libelous.

How dare she ... and who the H*** gives a flying f***?

[mwb970]

37. The whole cheney family is apparently trash.

What a worthless group. America would be better off without them.

[pam4water]

38. Lies and she has a voice like finger nails on a chock board.

[Enthusiast]

39. Brave Americans?

There is nothing brave about advocating or administering waterboarding. It doesn't matter if torture was effective, it is still against the law.

[tclambert]

40. The point of "enhanced interrogation techniques"

such as waterboarding and other things seldom discussed yet, is to inflict such physical "discomfort" that the subject will beg for mercy and agree to talk.

Now define torture.

Oh, here's one, from the United Nations Convention Against Torture:

"any act by which severe pain or suffering, whether physical or mental, is intentionally inflicted on a person for such purposes such as obtaining from him, or a third person, information or a confession."

[Seldona]

41. Someone needs to ask her if she supports amnesty

for anyone convicted of 'not' torturing US troops. Like in WW2, when we hung at least one soldier for that exact crime.

Is that an injustice Liz? Will you apologize to his family?

[Butch350]

43. Hey Lady, are you trying to save your da da's bacon?

[olegramps]

44. Liz is a good Fascist from a family of Fascists.

Fascists are able to justify any atrocity as being a patriotic act if it is in defense of the Father Land. They subscribe to the evil concept that the end justifies the means and anyone who questions them is a unpatriotic traitor. Just as the Nazis believed, they have convinced themselves that that they are the true protectors of the Father Land.

It is impossible to reason with them, just as it was impossible to reason with the Nazis. They are a cancer that can only be defeated by their total eradication. Liz Cheney exemplifies the fact that they are totally without any hope of redemption.

It is truly unfortunate that far too many Americans fail to grasp that the neo-cons are a far more dangerous threat to our survival as a Democratic Republic than any terrorist threat. What will it take to awaken Americans? The neo-cons suspended Habeas corpus, ordered secret wire taps, abolished the Posse Comitatus Act to allow the president to use the military to enforce law, pushed the Unitary Executive theory to point that the president would have virtual dictatorial power, established secret prisons where they tortured detainees, outed a secret agent to get revenge against her husband for telling the truth about their lies to the American people and this is but a small sample of their illegal acts.

[sattahipdeep]

45. Arrest warrants have already been issued or will be soon.

"1,331,578" Iraqi people including children were massacred by her dick dad.

The Nuremberg Principles, a set of guidelines established after World War II to try Nazi Party members, were developed to determine what constitutes a war crime. The principles can also be applied today when considering the conditions that led to the Iraq war and, in the process, to the deaths of hundreds of thousands of people, many of them children, and to the devastation of a country's infrastructure.

http://www.gather.com/viewArticle.action?articleId=281474977693679&grpId=3659174697244816


....
Michael Ratner, president of the Center for Constitutional Rights has said it “is conceivable that arrest warrants have already been issued or will be soon. Indictments will almost surely follow. The torture team’s travel options are narrowing.”

http://www.ccrjustice.org/newsroom/press-releases/ccr-applauds-spanish-judge%E2%80%99s-decision-open-new-criminal-investigation-u.s.-t

The Spanish writ does not name specific defendants or suspects in its investigation, but rather seeks to investigate the role of those who planned, coordinated and implemented the torture of its citizens and residents. “This systematic plan may point to the existence of a coordinated action for the commission of a multiplicity of torture crimes… a plan that would seem to approximate an official level and that, therefore, would give rise to criminal liability for the various schemes of committing, ordering, designing, and authorizing this systematic plan of torture.” On April 29, Garzon gave the green light to the investigation citing Spain’s Universal Jurisdiction law.

Judge Garzon says the treatment of these men, combined with recently declassified US documents show “an approved systematic plan of torture and ill-treatment on persons deprived of their freedom without any charge and without the basic rights of all detainees as set out and required by applicable international treaties.”

http://rebelreports.com/post/109514909/spanish-investigation-reveals-an-approved-systematic


Former Interrogator Says Thousands of US Lives Lost Due to Torture

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ExAtzqli2nQ

[RainDog]

46. so let's go to court with that claim then

I'm all for it. take a claim to court and let's see if Cheney authorized something known as torture. not just waterboarding either, of course. let's see if waterboarding = actually it's the whole torture program, let's not pretend, is a violation of the Geneva Conventions.

then, if a court rules that waterboarding is torture, let's place charges against Cheney for war crimes - and it would be great to have Addington, Feith, Yoo, Rumsfeld and Bush to testify in return for lesser

Criminal activity is not policy difference. the repukes are still not reality=based.

[lokichogio]

47. "Is Waterboarding torture" poll

http://www.adailypoll.com