'NATO bombed Libya back to Stone Age'

[The Northerner]

Run time: 04:19 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TNczox-l0Sk   Posted on YouTube: October 19, 2011 By YouTube Member: RussiaToday Views on YouTube: 306   Posted on DU: October 19, 2011 By DU Member: The Northerner Views on DU: 1377

 
During her unannounced visit to Libya, U.S. chief diplomat - Hillary Clinton - stated that Washington hopes to see ousted leader Colonel Gaddafi captured or killed. To discuss the situation in Libya and country's international relations RT's joined by Annie Machon, a former MI5 intelligence officer.

[walerosco]

1. And the country goes from #1 standard

of living in Africa to near bottom. But dont worry, the IMF vultures would be descending soon to finish off whats left of it.

Yay for Kinetic action

[stockholmer]

2. +1000

Plus now al-CIAda now has a base to launch 'piracy' on the Mediterranean, thus another way to fund the false flags and justify more war, more invasion, more spending, more death by the US/UK NATO empiric war machine.

[Lars77]

3. Err, you saying Al Quaida is CIA?

[stockholmer]

5. absolutely

al-Qaeda is a West-created/funded insta-war/invasion/liberty crackdown/fear machine, an artificial hydra, utilizing the 150 year-old methods the British practised in the middle east. The 'tip of the spear' low-level terrorists are many time actual believers in their cause, but the operational control is far removed from that paradigm.


The Imperial Anatomy of Al-Qaeda: The CIA’s Drug-Running Terrorists and the “Arc of Crisis”

http://andrewgavinmarshall.com/2011/07/15/the-imperial-anatomy-of-al-qaeda-the-cia%E2%80%99s-drug-running-terrorists-and-the-%E2%80%9Carc-of-crisis%E2%80%9D/

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The Power of Nightmares

subtitled The Rise of the Politics of Fear, is a 3 part BBC documentary film series, written and produced by Adam Curtis.
The films compare the rise of the Neo-Conservative movement in the United States and the radical Islamist movement, making comparisons on their origins and claiming similarities between the two. More controversially, it argues that the threat of radical Islamism as a massive, sinister organized force of destruction, specifically in the form of al-Qaeda, is a myth perpetrated by politicians in many countries—and particularly American Neo-Conservatives—in an attempt to unite and inspire their people following the failure of earlier, more utopian ideologies.



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K5lByw7kvS0&feature=related part 1

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ai6LhnW4Oa8&feature=related part 2

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5HvzR8w1z2g&feature=related part 3

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Remember, the USA seeds of al-Qaeda started in 1978 and 1979, under Robert Gates and Zbigniew Brzezinski of the Carter regime, (now Gates has been the Sec of Defense under both Bush and Obama) and Brzezinski is a de facto chief architect of geo-political policy for the Obama administration http://www.foreignaffairs.com/articles/65720/zbigniew-brzezinski/from-hope-to-audacity http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/21134540/vp/23726367#23726367 http://www.bibliotecapleyades.net/sociopolitica/sociopol_obama08.htm .



Zbigniew Brzezinski:

http://www.historycommons.org/context.jsp?item=cambodia_662


1980-1986: China and US Support Kymer Rouge

http://www.yale.edu/cgp/us.html

China and the US sustain the Khmer Rouge with overt and covert aid in an effort to destabilize Cambodia’s Vietnam-backed government. With US backing, China supplies the Khmer Rouge with direct military aid. Zbigniew Brzezinski, national security adviser during the administration of President Carter, will later acknowledge, “I encouraged the Chinese to support Pol Pot…. Pol Pot was an abomination. We could never support him, but China could.”

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September 4, 1997: Brzezinski’s ‘The Grand Chessboard’ Advocates Overthrow of Iranian Goverment


“The Grand Chessboard: American Primacy and Its Geostrategic Imperatives”. In the book Brzezinski details how in order to protect America’s status as the last remaining super power on earth it would be necessary to invade and control key locations in the Middle East, particularly Iran. The book theorizes that America could be attacked by Afghan terrorists which would lead to our invasion of Afghanistan and ultimately control of Iran as a key strategic country to hold in the war for global supremacy.



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Th US empire's currency (the rapidly-dying dollar) is backed up, collateralized by oil, and the oil is backed up by the global Anglo-American war machine.

This crisis point with the current global monetary debt regime will occur in the next 5 to 10 years max, it even may cause a new world war, as many industrialized countries (not just 3rd world periphery states) will simply be unable to continue to operate at a level that will prevent their own citizens from outright civil wars and coup d' etats (much like we see now in the 'arc of crisis' ie. Morocco to the Chinese border).

This concept was laid out over 30 years ago by Zbigniew Brzezinski (chief geo-political strategist for Carter, now for Obama) in his books, speeches and CFR articles. His goal is to use this arc to force a China vs. Russia war by 2020. This will complete the elimination (in his mind) of the last threat to the Anglo/American banking cartel for true, lasting technetronic global hegemony.

http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,921766,00.html

http://www.foreignaffairs.com/articles/32309/george-lenczowski/the-arc-of-crisis-its-central-sector

http://www.bibliotecapleyades.net/sociopolitica/sociopol_chessboard.htm

http://www.commondreams.org/view/2011/01/04-0

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2 key books by Zbigniew Brzezinski

The Grand Chessboard

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Grand-Chessboard-American-Geostrategic-Imperatives/dp/0465027261/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1299979870&sr=8

http://sandiego.indymedia.org/media/2006/10/119973.pdf

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Between Two Ages

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Between-Two-Ages-Americas-Technetronic/dp/0313234981/ref=ntt_at_ep_dpt_5

http://wearechange.org.uk/london/wp-content/themes/arras-theme/resources/misc/Zbigniew%20Brzezinski-Between%20Two%20Ages.pdf


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Creating an "Arc of Crisis": The Destabilization of the Middle East
and Central Asia
The Mumbai Attacks and the “Strategy of Tension”

http://www.scribd.com/doc/24770171/Creating-an-Arch-of-Conflict




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Case Study - the Libya invasion and US/UK/NATO support of al-Qaeda :



Abdel Hakim Belhaj is a ranking al-Qaeda leader (emir of the Islamic Fighting Group of Libya)

http://www.pvtr.org/pdf/Report/RSIS_Libya.pdf (page 18 has interview with Belhaj)

One of Belhaj's underlings is Nasser Tailamoun, who was Osama bin Laden's driver. Qadaffi released these 2, plus dozens of other radicals, in September of 2010.

http://www.ndtv.com/article/world/libya-releases-islamists-including-bin-ladens-driver-48737

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US and NATO use and support of al-Qaeda in the Libya coup d' etat

Abdel Hakim Belhaj, Tripoli's newly installed military governor (also a key official within Libya's National Transitional Council), is linked to Al Qaeda, reports Liberátion (Leftist French newspaper).

http://www.liberation.fr/monde/01012356209-abdelhakim-belhaj-le-retour-d-al-qaeda

http://translate.google.se/translate?js=n&prev=_t&hl=en&ie=UTF-8&layout=2&eotf=1&sl=fr&tl=en&u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.liberation.fr%2Fmonde%2F01012356209-abdelhakim-belhaj-le-retour-d-al-qaeda

Belhaj is the former head of the Libyan Islamic Fighting Group (an affiliate group of Al Qaeda). In 2003, Belhaj was arrested in Malaysia in 2003, later being interrogated by CIA in 2004 in Thailand. He was set free in Libya in 2008.


It's important to note Belhaj is supported by NATO, as Le Parisien and MSN France report:


http://news.fr.msn.com/m6-actualite/monde/libye-calme-relatif-%c3%a0-tripoli-avanc%c3%a9es-dans-louest-statu-quo-dans-lest-2

10 h 20. Un islamiste à la tête du commandement militaire de la rébellion à Tripoli. Abdelhakim Belhadj a été le chef militaire qui a préparé, avec l'aide de l'Otan, la prise du QG de Kadhafi, à Bab Al-Azizya. Al-Jazeera lui a consacré un long entretien en direct du QG à l'issue des combats. Ancien dirigeant du Groupe islamique des combattants libyens (GICL), lié à Al-Qaida, Abdelhakim Belhadj, a été arrêté en 2004 par les Américains en Asie et livré par la suite à la Libye, selon la presse arabe. Il aurait bénéficié de l'amnistie de centaines d'islamistes libyens en mars 2010 ordonnée par Saif Al-Islam, fils préféré de Kadhafi.



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Karel Abderrahim, a researcher at the Institute of International and Strategic Relations (Institut de relations internationales et stratégiques, a French think tank) said in an interview to La Croix, a Catholic French newspaper, that he is skeptical about the dissolution of Al Qaeda-Libyan Islamic Fighting Group:

http://translate.google.com/translate?js=n&prev=_t&hl=pt-BR&ie=UTF-8&layout=2&eotf=1&sl=fr&tl=en&u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.la-croix.com%2FActualite%2FS-informer%2FMonde%2FKader-Abderrahim-chercheur-a-l-Iris-Je-ne-vois-pas-qui-pourrait-federer-la-Libye-_EG_-2011-08-24-702836

Further background:

http://www.haaretz.com/news/middle-east/libyan-fighting-factions-to-unite-under-single-military-command-1.380955?localLinksEnabled=false

http://www.roadstoiraq.com/2011/08/27/al-qaeda-in-libya-started-to-act-killing-friends-and-foes

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Libyan rebel commander admits his fighters have al-Qaeda links


http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/africaandindianocean/libya/8407047/Libyan-rebel-commander-admits-his-fighters-have-al-Qaeda-links.html

"Abdel-Hakim al-Hasidi, the Libyan rebel leader, has said jihadists who fought against allied troops in Iraq are on the front lines of the battle against Muammar Gaddafi's regime.

In an interview with the Italian newspaper Il Sole 24 Ore, Mr al-Hasidi admitted that he had recruited "around 25" men from the Derna area in eastern Libya to fight against coalition troops in Iraq. Some of them, he said, are "today are on the front lines in Adjabiya".

Mr al-Hasidi insisted his fighters "are patriots and good Muslims, not terrorists," but added that the "members of al-Qaeda are also good Muslims and are fighting against the invader".

His revelations came even as Idriss Deby Itno, Chad's president, said al-Qaeda had managed to pillage military arsenals in the Libyan rebel zone and acquired arms, "including surface-to-air missiles, which were then smuggled into their sanctuaries"....................


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flashback 2 years (including Young Turks video) more US support of terrorist groups

Saudis and CIA back Khalid Sheikh Mohammad’s Jundullah in Pakistan and Iran?

http://aangirfan.blogspot.com/2008/12/saudis-and-cia-back-khalid-sheikh.html

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flashhback to 2007 (BBC)

Libyan Islamists 'join al-Qaeda'

Zawahri called for North African leaders to be overthrown
A Libyan Islamist group has joined al-Qaeda, according to an audio message on the internet attributed to the radical network's second-in-command.
Ayman al-Zawahri purportedly said the Fighting Islamic Group in Libya was becoming part of al-Qaeda.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/7076604.stm

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flasback to 2002 (Guardian UK) French intelligence experts revealed how western intelligence agencies bankrolled a Libyan Al-Qaeda cell

http://www.guardian.co.uk/politics/2002/nov/10/uk.davidshayler

MI6 'halted bid to arrest bin Laden'Startling revelations by French intelligence experts back David Shayler's alleged 'fantasy'about Gadaffi plot

British intelligence paid large sums of money to an al-Qaeda cell in Libya in a doomed attempt to assassinate Colonel Gadaffi in 1996 and thwarted early attempts to bring Osama bin Laden to justice.
The latest claims of MI6 involvement with Libya's fearsome Islamic Fighting Group, which is connected to one of bin Laden's trusted lieutenants, will be embarrassing to the Government, which described similar claims by renegade MI5 officer David Shayler as 'pure fantasy'


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Lies, War, and Empire: NATO’s “Humanitarian Imperialism” in Libya (Video + Article)

http://andrewgavinmarshall.com/2011/08/26/lies-war-and-empire-nato%E2%80%99s-%E2%80%9Chumanitarian-imperialism%E2%80%9D-in-libya

snip

It has been said, “In war, truth is the first casualty.” Libya is no exception. From the lies that started the war, to the rebels linked to al-Qaeda, ethnically cleansing black Libyans, killing civilians, propaganda, PR firms, intelligence agents, and possible occupation; Libya is a more complex story than the fairy tale we have been sold. Reality always is.

What Were the ‘Reasons’ for ‘Intervention’?

We were sold the case for war in Libya as a “humanitarian intervention.” We were told, of course, that we “needed” to intervene in Libya because Muammar Gaddafi was killing his own people in large numbers; those people, on the same token, were presented as peaceful protesters resisting the 40-plus year reign of a brutal dictator.

In early March of 2011, news headlines in Western nations reported that Gaddafi would kill half a million people.<1> On March 18, as the UN agreed to launch air strikes on Libya, it was reported that Gaddafi had begun an assault against the rebel-held town of Benghazi. The Daily Mail reported that Gaddafi had threatened to send in his African mercenaries to crush the rebellion.<2> Reports of Libyan government tanks sitting outside Benghazi poised for an invasion were propagated in the Western media.<3> In the lead-up to the United Nations imposing a no-fly zone, reports spread rapidly through the media of Libyan government jets bombing the rebels.<4> Even in February, the New York Times – the sacred temple for the ‘stenographers of power’ we call “journalists” – reported that Gaddafi was amassing “thousands of mercenaries” to defend Tripoli and crush the rebels.<5> Italy’s Foreign Minister declared that over 1,000 people were killed in the fighting in February, citing the number as “credible.”<6> Even a top official with Human Rights Watch declared the rebels to be “peaceful protesters” who “are nice, sincere people who want a better future for Libya.”<7> The UN High Commissioner for Human Rights declared that “thousands” of people were likely killed by Gaddafi, “and called for international intervention to protect civilians.”<8> In April, reports spread near and far at lightning speed of Gaddafi’s forces using rape as a weapon of war, with the first sentence in a Daily Mail article declaring, “Children as young as eight are being raped in front of their families by Gaddafi’s forces in Libya,” with Gaddafi handing out Viagra to his troops in a planned and organized effort to promote rape.<9>

As it turned out, these claims – as posterity notes – turned out to be largely false and contrived. Doctors Without Borders and Amnesty International both investigated the claims of rape, and “have found no first-hand evidence in Libya that rapes are systematic and being used as part of war strategy,” and their investigations in Eastern Libya “have not turned up significant hard evidence supporting allegations of rapes by Qaddafi’s forces.” Yet, just as these reports came out, Hillary Clinton declared that the U.S. is “deeply concerned by reports of wide-scale rape” in Libya.<10> Even U.S. military and intelligence officials had to admit that, “there is no evidence that Libyan military forces are being given Viagra and engaging in systematic rape against women in rebel areas”; at the same time Susan Rice, U.S. Ambassador to the United Nations, “told a closed-door meeting of officials at the UN that the Libyan military is using rape as a weapon in the war with the rebels and some had been issued the anti-impotency drug. She reportedly offered no evidence to backup the claim.”<11>


snip

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article is heavily footnoted and sourced (127 total footnotes) with hyperlinks as well

[jakeXT]

7. I like how security experts are confused

Security experts question U.S. support of NATO strikes against Gadhafi

NATO launched a campaign against Col. Moammar Gadhafi in support of the rebels, while many in the security field were in disbelief. Members of the Libyan Islamic Fighting Group (LIFG), an Al Qaeda affiliate, led the rebel forces. How ironic to be targeting Bin Laden, yet supporting his Libyan affiliates at the same time.

Take for example, Abdel Hakim al Hasidi, the Libyan rebel leader, who admitted the very jihadists who targeted our troops in Iraq were leading the charge in Libya.

Or Former LIFG commander Abdul Hakim Belhaj (aka Abu Abdullah al-Sadiq), who was released under a de-radicalization program, but declared of Gadhafi, “The tyrant fled and we will be after him.”

Rather than working towards a negotiated solution, these forces appear to have used reconciliation to strengthen their forces prior to launching their attack. While Gadhafi worked to normalize relations with the world by releasing political prisoners and allowing greater freedoms, they built their organization and strength to stage a revolution. There is a real possibility this group will hold senior leadership positions in the resulting state, while the LIFG remains on the State Department’s list of terror organizations.

http://blog.chron.com/bakerblog/2011/10/security-experts-question-u-s-support-of-nato-strikes-against-gadhafi/

[redgiant]

4. What bullshit

A little pepper spray and some temporary arrests = Gaddafi-like tyranny.

Nah, no hyperbole there.

Bombed back to the Stone Age? Really?

Nah, no hyperbole there.

[stockholmer]

6. NATO has killed thousands in concentrated bombing raids, and destroyed vast swaths of the most

advanced infrastructure that an African country possessed, whilst installing al-Qaeda affiliated goons into power. In addition, the US now murders its own citizens via presidential fiat, with no semblance of judicial process. So I do not see hyperbole, I see rank hypocrisy flowing like a river.

I will not bring OWS into this, as it is too tangential to my first 3 points.

[redgiant]

8. Get a grip

Annie Machon brought OWS into it when she made a moral equivalence between the (isolated) macing and (temporary) arrests of protestors in the US with the long-term tyranny and human rights abuses of Qa-Daffy. That's hyperbole and BS.

Annie Machon said the infrastructure was bombed back into the stone age. More hyperbole. Let's see how fast the infrastructure gets fixed, with NATO/US money.

Those were my two main issues with the OP. I stand by them.

BTW, I never supported US involvement in this war. I'm not, however, sad that Qa-Daffy finally got his.

Re the two "US citizens" taken out by fiat. Meh.

[swilton]

9. The NATO/US money

fixing Libya comes from US tax dollars and could be better spent in the US - we spend tax dollars to bomb them and then more tax dollars to repair what we destroy.

Iraq was an analogous victim - we destroyed their infrastructure from the first Gulf War and now the present quagmire....Prior to the first Gulf War Hussein's medical system was relatively advanced and only second to that of Israel's in the Middle East....Went from spending $90 per person to less than $20 dollars per person - electrical infrastructure that was destroyed went a long way into providing medicine and sanitation....The list goes on in Iraq....

The same case can be made in the former Yugoslavia....Depleted uranium, cluster munitions left behind, infrastructure destroyed, casualties primarily non combatants....

And I agree with Machon's point that the US is no better than Gadaffi - we torture prisoners based upon accusations rather than evidence, extraordinary rendition, assassination of US citizens w/o trial - and censorship of free speech.

[L. Coyote]

10. Great to get some objective perspective on US foreign intervention and conduct

At least a few people on the planet still believe in the rules of law!