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This is what I don't understand. I just spent two days researching South Carolina elections.

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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-15-08 03:25 PM
Original message
This is what I don't understand. I just spent two days researching South Carolina elections.
Edited on Tue Jan-15-08 03:29 PM by sfexpat2000
The ES&S iVotronic system has no paper ballot. Not a receipt, not spit. Nothing you can hold in your hand. Nada.

The machines they use STATEWIDE are unstable. Vulnerable to a virus and they've been found to not register your choice. The state can't even keep up their own computers, let alone secure the computers used in statewide elections.

The South Carolina constitution calls for public vote counting. You can't count what you can't see, can you?

You also can't recount what you never saw, can you?

The state provides one machine for every 250 voters. Lines form around the block, people get discouraged and go home. Who can blame these voters? This is a form of vote suppression. An effective one.

In addition to this obvious cr@P!, if you are a first-time voter, you must have ID. That sounds very reasonable, doesn't it? Unless you don't know it until you get to your polling place and have waited in line for hours and can't wait any more.

If you hand in your provisional ballot in the wrong place (no matter if it is accepted by a poll worker) it will not be counted. You have to check the internet to learn the status and if your case is accepted, you have to go to a hearing to assert your case. Vote suppression on skates, anyone?

Reputable election protection outfits like VoteTrustUSA have also reported "challengers" at the polls who prey upon black voters and students in particular.

South Carolina knew exactly what it was doing when it went to this horrible voting equipment. People with election tech cred handed in solid objections.

South Carolina has the biggest block of black Democratic voters in the country.

South Carolina flew the confederate flag at the state house until 2000. They were the last state to recognize MLK Day as a holiday for their state employees.

Tell me this is an accident. Tell me they aren't stealing our elections on the backs of black voters. Then please tell me, what are you willing to do.

ETA: :nuke:
















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mth44sc Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-15-08 03:31 PM
Response to Original message
1. And there is more...
Many polling places closed on primary day
By JOHN O’CONNOR - joconnor@thestate.com


Many South Carolina voters will be sent to new polling places on presidential primary day, as one-fifth of regular state polling places will be closed.

The closed polls are the result of a state law passed last year turning control of the Jan. 19 Republican primary and Jan. 26 Democratic primary over to the South Carolina State Election Commission.

About 400 of 2,200 polling places will be merged, according to Chris Whitmire, spokesman for the State Election Commission.

The change was meant to ensure a professionally run election, with the use of state resources and electronic voting machines. But in trying to limit costs, the Legislature required local election officials to merge some precincts into one polling place.

This year’s changes have been approved by the U.S. Justice Department, and local officials said they have worked to limit the inconvenience. But the result, many observers said, is that voters will be surprised to find their normal polling place closed on primary day.

“I think it’s a huge mistake that any county should opt to close precincts,” said Rick Beltram, chairman of the Spartanburg County Republican Party. He worries it could discourage voters. “The candidates need to look at that because I think it could cost them.”

http://www.thestate.com/politics/story/282555.html
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-15-08 05:22 PM
Response to Reply #1
17. That's right. Changing or closing polling places = vote suppression.
We really need to come up with an award for these bastards.
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DemoTex Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-15-08 03:31 PM
Response to Original message
2. Jim Crow is alive and well in South Carolina.
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-15-08 05:20 PM
Response to Reply #2
16. It's as creepy as possible. I talked to the PR guy at the state house.
He was nice as you'd want.

And, he knows. He's a nice guy who know that half the voters in his state are being disenfranchised as hard and fast as the Republicans can manage it.

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DemoTex Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-15-08 08:33 PM
Response to Reply #16
22. SC paradox: My neighbors who consider themselves liberal Episcopalians ..
They now have a "McCain for President" sticker on their Suburban.
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dkofos Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-15-08 03:35 PM
Response to Original message
3. It's not who votes that count, It's who counts the votes.
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-15-08 03:36 PM
Response to Original message
4. I never said what I don't understand.
I don't understand how we ever, for a minute, could put up with this shit and still have enough self respect to wake up in the morning.

:nuke:
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mnhtnbb Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-15-08 04:53 PM
Response to Reply #4
12. It's a holdover from the Confederacy. States' rights. SC is notoriously Red and full of red neck
Republicans.
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-15-08 04:57 PM
Response to Reply #12
14. I recently learned that "redneck" orignally meant
a union worker that put a red scarf around their neck to ID themselves when confronting union busters.

How low we have fallen.
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mnhtnbb Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-15-08 05:01 PM
Response to Reply #14
15. Indeed. I use it to mean uneducated, knee-jerk, Ronnie Reagan lovin'
type guys.
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knitter4democracy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-16-08 11:10 AM
Response to Reply #14
24. I thought it meant a sunburned neck from someone who works outside for a living.
That's what I was always told growing up in a rural white area. Rednecks were farmers and others who worked outside all summer and got sunburnt.
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-16-08 09:31 PM
Response to Reply #24
25. That's what I always thought, too, knitter.
I saw a documentary on PBS on Sunday night about "Hillbillies" and they had pictures of "rednecks".

They tied a red scarf around their neck so other union people could recognize them in a crowd. They were trying to organize a miners' union. Fascinating. :hi:
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knitter4democracy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-17-08 10:00 AM
Response to Reply #25
28. That is fascinating. I wonder if that's why it became a pejorative.
Interesting. I'll have to check the OED. Thanks!
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-15-08 03:43 PM
Response to Original message
5. And for an added special bonus, this year they are holding Rethug and Dem
primaries on two different days.

For those of you who don't know this, one vote suppression tactic that these thugs use is to tell you to vote on the wrong day. Congrats, South Carolina! You've managed to add confusion to the PRIMARY process!

:puke:
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hootinholler Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-15-08 04:48 PM
Response to Reply #5
10. Not only that! It sets up the two day thing to be believable for the GE!
Unreal that this is accepted by the party.

-Hoot
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-15-08 04:51 PM
Response to Reply #10
11. Exactly. They try to confuse people as to when they should go vote.
How do we like that, DU?

South Carolina has made it effen POLICY.
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-15-08 03:51 PM
Response to Original message
6. Here is a link to the info I turned up should anyone want to look.
Edited on Tue Jan-15-08 03:55 PM by sfexpat2000
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=203x493832

I don't know if I've ever been so angry in my life. Whatever. Go, read.

/oops
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-15-08 04:05 PM
Response to Original message
7. Kick once more so people can see and think for themselves.
:kick:
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Lydia Leftcoast Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-15-08 04:08 PM
Response to Original message
8. What's the procedure for asking for U.N. observers?
:grr:
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-15-08 04:56 PM
Response to Reply #8
13. I think at this point, the UN is just trying to survive us.
:grr:
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Peace Patriot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-15-08 04:26 PM
Response to Original message
9. Wow! Awesome research, SFexpat2000! What an outrage this is!
I don't know what angers me more--these corrupt election officials and their corruptible machines, or their mean, petty, sneaky, disgusting, ILLEGAL bigotry against black voters.

The latter is a personal thing with me. I was student volunteer in Martin Luther King's voting rights project, SCOPE, in Alabama in 1965. I saw the bigotry for myself. It is ugly beyond belief. And I felt so proud of my country when we outlawed it, and when even Republican regimes in Washington DC felt honor-bound to enforce the law--the Voting Rights Act of 1965.

Now I feel shame and disgust. Where is honor and decency in this country?

And the two things are related, of course--unverifiable, unseeable, non-transparent vote counting, with no paper trail whatsoever, controlled by "trade secret" code owned by rightwing corporations, and the intention to suppress the votes of the poor and steal elections for the corporate rulers and war profiteers.

Something else that touched me deeply in 1965--the incredible courage of black citizens in the south, with all the danger and continual insults that they endured. Their courage. Their belief in peaceful change. And their determination, not just to gain rightful power as citizens, but to change the hearts, and save the souls, of people who were consumed with hatred.

Looking at BushWorld, it's easy to think they failed. But they didn't. The legacy of the black citizens of the south of that era lives on. BushWorld is a thin illusion--greedbags and murderers trying to stoke up that ugliness. It's still around, for sure, in some unsaved persons. But there is a much, much bigger reality beneath the surface of this bitter Bushite minority, and that is the yearning of the majority of Americans to live in a good country, devoted to justice and fairness. I feel it. I know it's real. It keeps me going.

So, we are going to solve this problem--of the voting machines, of the disenfranchisement of black and other minority voters, and of our general disenfranchisement as a people. When you see that a whopping 70% of the American people oppose the Iraq War and want it ended--up from 56%, already a significant majority before, back when this horror began--and yet, the war just goes on and on, you know something is deeply wrong, and that we are all unrepresented in our nation's capitol.

One solution I thought of yesterday is that Dennis Kucinich must remain in the presidential race, if he will, and must challenge each and every one of these "trade secret" primaries. Another idea is to try to convince Edwards to join him--because Edwards' campaign may be killed possibly as early as the South Carolina primary (Jan 26), his first southern contest, which is quickly followed by Florida (Jan 29)--both of these states with very easily riggable voting systems--or possibly in his home state North Carolina (May 6), which has made some improvements (I believe they now have a paper trail), but, as we've seen in NH and elsewhere, a paper trail alone is no guarantee. It is already clear that the corporate rulers want him out--despite the fact that he is holding his own in the polls. He is expecting a boost in SC (or maybe it was NC--I'm not sure), and when they deny it to him, he will be finished, and the only anti-corporate voice among the leading three in the campaign will be gone. They are already treating him prejudicially. Next, he gets Diebolded, and that is that.

And I do think he is aware of the problems with these riggable machines. He's said some things about it (and I've heard that he wanted to challenge the results in 04). What does he have to lose? They are surely going to get him anyway.

Of course we just keep plugging away, and doing what we can--and support the Kucinich effort in NH. There are MANY election integrity experts who have converged on NH to help out. As Brad Friedman says today, this is going to be like no other recount. We've got the knowledge and the ammunition and the gunslingers now. We've learned so much! This is going to be an expose of the system.

Read Brad and be heartened: http://www.bradblog.com/?p=5560#more-5560

------------------


TO CONTRIBUTE TO THE KUCINICH RECOUNT (he needs $69,600 immediately--full upfront for the recount):

Bradblog provides this updated contact phone number for donations to Kucinich's challenge:

Donations to Kucinich's count can be made by calling (877) 413 3664 (updated info).--BradBlog

Brad says Kucinich has to produce $69,600 immediately. Kucinich has challenged the need for immediate full payment, but he has pledged to write the check, so the recount can go forward.

I donated directly via Kucinich's web site the other day, when I learned of his request for a recount. I know he is using campaign funds for this challenge. It doesn't matter to me how he uses my donation--directly for the recount, or to reimburse his campaign. Past experience shows, too, that there are MANY OTHER COSTS--for lawyers, for copies of documents, for transportation, for volunteer support, for media work, and on and on. This small campaign chest will be bearing the heavy burden of our democracy, and may well save it --if this recount can help change our vote counting procedures and move them into the light.

Kucinich for President 2008, 11808 Lorain Ave, Cleveland, OH 44111 - Phone: 1 (877) 41-DENNIS.

http://www.dennis4president.com/home /

Donate on line at the web site, or call (877) 413-3664

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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-16-08 09:42 PM
Response to Reply #9
26. I was in my pre teens when that was happening. But old enough
to listen, to watch and to never forget.

This is one of many reasons why we need to keep Dennis running, couldn't agree more.

We also need to confront the reality that, despite the Voting Rights Act, minority voters are always targeted FIRST in election fraud schemes. That's how it works in this country. And, we can't say we have a democracy and allow this to continue.
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Blarch Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-15-08 05:23 PM
Response to Original message
18. I demand a recount.
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-15-08 05:27 PM
Response to Reply #18
20. SC voters have nothing to gain from a recount -- because
Edited on Tue Jan-15-08 05:27 PM by sfexpat2000
there is nothing to recount.

Their machines only can spit out the same unverified totals.

How sweet it is for the fraudsters.
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lonestarnot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-16-08 09:44 PM
Response to Reply #18
27. Count what? Fucking air?
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annabanana Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-15-08 05:24 PM
Response to Original message
19. kicking for Peace Patriot's post. . . . . n/t
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-15-08 06:34 PM
Response to Reply #19
21. I'll kick to that.
:kick:
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-15-08 11:18 PM
Response to Original message
23. One more cathartic KICK.
:nuke:
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