Which of OUR "freedoms" did we fight the Vietnam war to defend?

[sixmile]

To stop the "Red Menace"?
Freedom of speech?

The Vietnam vets in my family are still messed up 40 years later and have no consensus about why they were sent to fight
a brutal, long, costly war in southeast Asia for with no defined reason or exit strategy.

My point is Vietnam was one of the worse chapters in U.S. history, and those who seek to glamorize it, or put lipstick on it if you will, are
misguided and uninformed.

[mth44sc]

1. We fought for the right

to be wrong...

How little we've learned.

[RUMMYisFROSTED]

2. Freedom to funnel trillions to our "defense" manufacturers.

Thank God we won.

[JimWis]

3. You've got that right.

[MadMaddie]

4. Don't you find it interesting that we have

literally and figuratively come full circle when we talk about the Vietnam war? I believe that the Iraq war's very being started with the withdrawal of troops in Vietnam. The Dick Cheneys, Wolfowitz, Rumsfeld, * and all of the others that got us into Iraq never got over Vietnam.

They never got over Vietnam because they were so steeped in their ideology that bombs and greed are the cure for everything that they never stopped to look at the human costs.

It was a mistake not to prosecute all of the men i mentioned above and others for their Crimes during the Nixon Watergate years and Vietnam. If we would have prosecuted them and put them in jail there would have been no Iraq and we probably could have prevented 9/11.

We still have Vietnam Vets homeless in this country, many Vietnam vets suicides to count.

Until we rectify the past with the present we will never truly be able to move ahead in this country.

[Aristus]

5. None of them. Whenever we send our troops into harm's way,

the ones doing the sending insist that they are "defending freedom" so we don't impeach their lying asses for sending them in the first place. Unintelligent, uninformed people insist we are "defending our freedom" because that's what you're supposed to think when our young men and women march into battle. There are almost certainly intelligent informed people out there who, nevertheless, insist that war is about "defending our freedom" because contemplating the real reasons for phony war is too frightening.

When I served in the Gulf in 1991, I knew it was just about oil; but I made believe it was really because of Kuwait's violated sovereignty, because that was easier to believe in when I thought about the possibility of dying.

My dad, who served in Vietnam, has been bitter and angry about it since he got back, knowing how many American boys died propping up the sleazy, corrupt, morally vacant dictatorship of South Vietnam. It sure as hell wasn't about freedom or democracy.

[sixmile]

7. Thanks for your service, Aristus

Because all of the men in my family served in Vietnam, I was urged by them not to enlist -even during peacetime. Plus I'm not big on giving unearned respect.

[Aristus]

9. That's very kind, thank you.

Care to join me in a salute to my father?




SAL-LUTE!! :patriot:

Oh, here's me: (You don't have to salute; I was enlisted... :-) )

[sixmile]

12. I've got to get some pics of my Dad, Stepdad and Uncles to post

Handsome bastards. I salute your Father and You.

[Aristus]

14. Thanks. I'm looking forward to seeing pics of your family.

Salute to them, too. :patriot:

[cliffordu]

17. I salute you BOTH!!!

:patriot:

[Aristus]

19. Thank you.

:blush:

[MilesColtrane]

20. Both of my grandfathers were in France during WWI.

CM returned to his farm and weathered the depression while raising 6 kids.





One of his sons, my Dad, enlisted and served in the Air Force during the Korean War. (second from right)

[Aristus]

23. A salute, and a hearty thanks.

:patriot:

I was going to give them a "shout-out", but Governor Snowjob Squareglasses has effectively killed the term...

[MilesColtrane]

24. Thanks for what you do, sarge.

It's a gig I couldn't handle.

[shraby]

6. We fought to thin out the young men in the country

because they are a threat to old men. That's what old men do..start wars to get rid of competition.

[conspirator]

27. That is accurate in a scary way nt

[Horse with no Name]

8. You won't find anyone here that will glamorize the Vietnam War

However...hate the war, not the warriors.
Lots of folks had no choice but to serve.
I am not talking politics here and not referencing ANY high profile Vietnam vet...but we not only fucked over the Asians we also fucked over quite a few soldiers and their families.

[Beregond2]

10. The "domino effect" was the excuse always used at the time.

If Vietnam "went red" then all of Asia would soon follow, and then Australia, and so on and so on...

It was an example of a logical fallacy called "the slippery slope," which says that if A and B happen, then C, D, and F must follow. Conservatives love it, because it inspires fear, and fear makes people irrational and easy to manipulate.

Obviously it wasn't true, and that is the real "lesson of Vietnam:" nothing is inevitable, and if someone says it is, be very suspicious.

[Historic NY]

11. .

:patriot:

[otherlander]

13. To stop people from realizing

that communism and democracy were not mutually exclusive. We didn't have to worry about Kerala back in '57 because that was just a state... who cared that they were ruled by democratic communists? But Vietnam? That was a whole country, so if a Communist was democratically elected there, people would know. Same reason we killed Salvador Allende: His Marxist leanings didn't stop him from ruling democratically.

[Lydia Leftcoast]

15. The U.S. military hasn't fought "for freedom" since World War II, possibly

Korea.

All other military actions since then have been meddling in the internal affairs of other countries or barging into conflicts that regional powers could have handled.

[Name removed]

16. Deleted sub-thread

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[McCamy Taylor]

18. Our "freedom" to enact colonial rule in other countries for their resources, of course.

The Cold War was nothing but a big exercise in colonialism, US vs. USSR. Just think Spain vs. England circa 1600 and change the major players.

Lots of oil in them there southern Asian waters.

BTW, the whole notion of the prosperous middle class with money to spare to invest in the markets and to spend on luxury items that would drive an industrial revolution and fuel capitalism----that was only possible because Europe was busy plundering other lands for their wealth starting esp. in the 18th century. We still depend upon the two tiered world to maintain our standard of living and our economic systemic. The majority of the world lives in poverty while those in the US and Western Europe live in affluence.

[upi402]

22. War is a racket - General Smedley Butler right?

Huge money to be scammed. That my think!

That's the "other things to do" that Cheney was referring to, wasn't it? War for profit and justifying bald power grabs.

[billyoc]

21. To generate capital for big business.

[cliffordu]

25. Yep. Bell helicopter and Hughes tool made brazillions.

So did the Springfield armory and Colt.

[and-justice-for-all]

26. For no real reason....

To fight a phantom enemy. There always seems to be an enemy, even where none exist at all.

Communism posed no threat to us and the entire bases for invading and occupying Vietnam was a lie. War is unethical, barbaric and inhumane; but it is profitable to some and they are willing to sacrifice people in the name of money and greed.

Just ask General Electric.