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I know this is irrelevant, but are there still people who think OJ didn't commit murder?

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mudesi Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-06-08 09:53 PM
Original message
I know this is irrelevant, but are there still people who think OJ didn't commit murder?
I thought it was broadly accepted, even among the African American community, that he did indeed get away with murder. Let's face it, in hindsight, it is crystal clear that the prosecution bungled its case and that Judge Ito did a terrible job at ensuring that justice was done. (He shouldn't have allowed cameras in the courtroom, for one thing)

Let's not be irrational now. He did it.
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greenbriar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-06-08 09:55 PM
Response to Original message
1. I do not think he physically did it
he may have had it done, but I don't think he did it himself

he is not that good of an actor (I saw naked gun) and I was watching the program when they showed the photos of his wife and Goldman . You can not fake that kind of reaction

so while he may have had it done, he didn't physically do it
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MadMaddie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-06-08 09:58 PM
Response to Reply #1
4. I will admit I am probably one of the few Black Americans who
thinks he did it and got away with murder.

People underestimate knife wounds, when I took some training years back we were told that knives are always not taken as seriously as guns. OJ had the training at the time and he was enraged. I think he did it, besides would a guilty man run the way that he did?
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tularetom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-06-08 09:56 PM
Response to Original message
2. well now we'll never know - if he goes to jail he won't be able to find the "real killer"
:evilgrin:
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TahitiNut Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-06-08 09:56 PM
Response to Original message
3. So, if one believes there's reasonable doubt ... they're "irrational"??
Ain't that just the most CIVIL way of starting a thread? Fascinating.

Ass.
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knowbody0 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-06-08 10:25 PM
Response to Reply #3
10. thank you
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mudesi Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-07-08 09:04 AM
Response to Reply #3
24. There's a difference between reasonable doubt and innocence
Like I said in the OP, I think the prosecution bungled its case and that judge Ito handled the whole thing terribly. In fact, the LAPD was also responsible for his acquittal. From a completely legal standpoint, the jury made the right decision. But I'm not talking about this in a strictly legal sense.

From all the forensic evidence, and more importantly, his tell all book where he essentially confesses to the whole thing, it's clear that he did it and got away with it. I don't understand how anybody can think otherwise given the overwhelming evidence.

Again, from a legal standpoint, there was reasonable doubt and therefore, he had to be acquitted. All that means though is that the government didn't meet it's burden of proof. If I were on that jury, I would've acquitted as well, even though I'd have still believed he was guilty.
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JeanGrey Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-07-08 09:45 AM
Response to Reply #3
29. I believe that anyone who looks at the mountain of evidence
against OJ and believes he is innocent is irrational, yes
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mike_c Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-06-08 09:59 PM
Response to Original message
5. I dunno-- I just don't really care....
eom
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atreides1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-06-08 09:59 PM
Response to Original message
6. Personally I don't know
And neither does anyone else, with the exception of Simpson and God.

We can all suspect anything we want, but he was acquitted in a court of law and in this country, so far anyway, that's all that's required. A jury of his peers found him not guilty of the charges.

By the way you're right it is irrelevant!!!
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cali Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-07-08 09:06 AM
Response to Reply #6
25. there was an abundance of evidence- incuding DNA- indicating
he did it.
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Poll_Blind Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-06-08 10:01 PM
Response to Original message
7. All I know is that a jury of his peers acquitted him and they had...
Edited on Mon Oct-06-08 10:02 PM by Poll_Blind
...access to more information than I do. I really don't know- or presume to. I have an opinion of him that he's a guy who can be unstable when angry, but just because a person has bad character traits, or is an asshole, or any number of other personality flaws- doesn't necessarily make them a murderer.

  The jury system, like most any other involving humans, is fallible. That's why there are 12 plus alternates. I don't presume to have the collective reasoning of 12 humans combined, though I often claim to on the Internet.

:)

PB
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AlCzervik Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-06-08 10:02 PM
Response to Original message
8. i don't know if he did or didn't do it, only OJ knows for sure and that all i got
to say about that.
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The_Casual_Observer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-06-08 10:07 PM
Response to Original message
9. No, he did it while wearing those "ugly ass" shoes he said he didn't own.
Edited on Mon Oct-06-08 10:08 PM by The_Casual_Observer
That was the dumbest jury in history.
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ecstatic Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-06-08 10:28 PM
Response to Original message
11. Nobody who didn't watch all the testimony should have input
and I didn't watch all the testimony. :shrug:
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LiberalHeart Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-06-08 10:42 PM
Response to Reply #11
12. I watched it all and would not have convicted him.
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Incitatus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-06-08 11:59 PM
Response to Reply #12
19. You think the cops planted his DNA at the scene?
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JeanGrey Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-07-08 09:46 AM
Response to Reply #19
30. It could not have been planted. It was impossible.
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LiberalHeart Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-07-08 09:54 AM
Response to Reply #19
33. I think there were serious questions re the blood evidence and the footprints.
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arthritisR_US Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-06-08 11:10 PM
Response to Original message
13. yes there are, but I'm not one of them. n/t
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L. Coyote Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-06-08 11:17 PM
Response to Original message
14. And wackos killed the Kennedys.
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Luminous Animal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-06-08 11:44 PM
Response to Original message
15. OJ didn't do it.
I came to that conclusion after watching this documentary, "The Overlooked Suspect" http://www.theoverlookedsuspect.com/

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ContinentalOp Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-07-08 12:06 AM
Response to Reply #15
20. Is that documentary saying that it was his son who did it? -nt-
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Luminous Animal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-07-08 12:09 AM
Response to Reply #20
21. Sort of...
It is the documentary that illustrates that the evidence pointing to OJ's son is very compelling. More compelling than the evidence brought against OJ.
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JeanGrey Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-07-08 09:50 AM
Response to Reply #21
32. No. There WAS no evidence implicating Jason. NONE.
He had no motive and no opportunity to kill Nicole. He LIKED her. He was a chef and was at work and on duty the night of the murders which was testified to by many people including his boss and coworkers. ALL of the blood evidence found pointed to one man, and that is OJ Simpson.

I've seen other websites trying to convince people that his brother Melvin did it too, who wasn't even in LA that night. It is quite sad really.
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JeanGrey Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-07-08 09:48 AM
Response to Reply #15
31. I went to that site. The very first paragraph is wrong.
There WERE cuts and bruises found on OJ. It was in trial. Lord.
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Lucian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-06-08 11:45 PM
Response to Original message
16. I believe he got away with murder.
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LisaL Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-06-08 11:49 PM
Response to Original message
17. Lots of these people post on DU.
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Incitatus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-06-08 11:53 PM
Response to Original message
18. I thought the blood trail from the crime scene to his bathroom was pretty convincing.
Edited on Mon Oct-06-08 11:56 PM by Incitatus
some more

1. Nicole's pet dog Kato, a ferocious Akita, did not attack the killer, suggesting the murderer was someone who the dog knew, such as OJ.

2. Nicole's neighbor Robert Heidstra testifies he heard two men arguing and then saw a white van (similar to a Ford Bronco) rapidly leaving the murder scene.

3. Police find two sets of keys to Nicole's condo on OJ's possession. Nicole reported a set of keys missing a few weeks before the slayings.

4. Expert testimony state that the killer walked from the crime scene and did not run, proving he was familiar enough with his surroundings to safely walk away.

5. Witness Jill Shively says she saw OJ driving his speeding Bronco from the Bundy murder scene around the time of the slayings.

AT THE ROCKINGHAM ESTATE:

6. At 9:37 p.m. on the night of the murders, houseguest Kato Kaelin said he saw Simpson wearing a dark blue cotton sweat suit, the same kind of suit that produced the fibers found on Ron Goldman's shirt.

7. Kato hears thumps outside his window between 10:50 p.m. and 10:51 p.m. near where the bloody glove is found.

8. Kato testified that at around 11 p.m. the night of the murders, when he was loading OJ's five bags into the limousine for Simpson's trip to the airport, OJ told him not to touch the smallest black bag which was ready to be loaded into the car. It was the only bag Simpson told him not to touch.

9. Prosecutor believed the black bag held Simpson's bloody clothing and the murder knife. The bag was never seen again.

10. Limo driver Allan Park testified he saw five bags loaded into the car before he left Rockingham but skycap James Williams counted only three bags when OJ got out of the car. He said he noticed Simpson standing by a trash can afterward which led prosecutors to speculate that Simpson stuffed the small bag into the bin. Defense attorney's failed to produce the missing black bag.

11. A week before her death, Nicole tells friend Cici Shahian: "He's going to kill me and get away with it and charm the world because he's OJ Simpson".

12. Pals Faye Resnick and Robin Greir say Nicole told them OJ was going to kill her.

13. Nicole confides in therapist Susan Forward she feared OJ would murder her.

14. In 1982, OJ throws Nicole against a wall: In 1987, he shoves her to the ground; and in 1989, he slaps her and pushes her from a moving car.

15. Nicole makes out her will five weeks before she was murdered.

16. Police respond to a 911 call on New Year's Day 1989 to find a bruised and bleeding Nicole hiding in the bushes, wearing only a bra and sweatpants, crying: "He's going to kill me! He's going to kill me!"

17. Nicole has her sister Denise Brown take pictures of her bruised body, locks them in a safe-deposit box, and tell Denise: "I need proof that OJ beat me. Without proof no one will ever believe me. The public thinks he's a hero who can do no wrong.

18. A nightmarish 911 police recording in 1993 has Nicole shouting: "When he gets this crazed, I get scared...He gets a very animalistic look in him...His eyes are black, just black, I mean cold, like an animal."

19. Nicole tells Faye Resnick, "I look at (OJ's) arms and think 'God, are these going to be the arms that kill me someday?"

20. OJ admits to Resnick he was seeing a therapist over his volatile feelings for Nicole.

21. Nicole tells Kato she thought OJ would kill her with scissors.

THE DAY OF THE MURDERS:

22. The murders happen after Nicole reject OJ's company at their daughter's dance recital.

23. In preparation for what appeared to be a rendezvous with someone, Nicole has a bath ready and is burning candles just before her murder. Prosecutor Chris Darden believes OJ spied his ex-wife Nicole lighting candles and killed her in a jealous rage.

24. DNA evidence proved that five blood drops found near the killer's footprints at the Bundy murder scene belong to OJ.

25. DNA evidence showed that OJ's blood trail from his Bronco to his Rockingham estate included: one blood drop behind the Bronco on the street (Rockingham), one on the driveway just inside the Rochingham gate, three more on the driveway leading to the front door of Simpson's residence, five on the floor of the foyer and one on the bathroom floor.

26. DNA test proved that spots of blood on the driver's door of the Bronco was OJ's.

27. DNA tests proved that three blood stains found on the rear gate of Nicole's home belonged to OJ.

28. DNA tests proved that in at least one blood drop found at the Bundy murder scene, the chances of it belonging to anyone but OJ are about 170 million to one.

29. Just on the blood evidence alone, there's only one out of 57 billion chance that Simpson is innocent. Fifty-seven billion is approximately 10 times the current population of the entire world.

30. At the Bundy premises, Simpson's blood was found at the exact spot where the murders were committed.

31. Drops of OJ's blood lead from his driveway into the foyer of his Rockingham mansion.

32. Blood on socks in OJ's bedroom matches OJ's and Nicole's.

33. Cops find blood in the shower and sink of OJ's bathroom after the murders.

34. Tests show that three stains on the Bronco's console were a mixture of OJ's blood with that of both of the victims. Another console stain is a mixture of OJ's and Ron's blood, and Nicole's blood was found on the driver's side carpet.

35. Nicole's DNA in blood found on OJ's socks, occurs in olny 1 out of 21 billion people.

36. DNA from Ron Goldman's blood found on the Rockingham glove, has only a 1-in-41 billion chance of belonging to someone else.

37. Cellmark, the nation's largest private DNA laboratory, ran 11 genetic tests on blood drops found at the crime scene and on a blood drop found in OJ's house - and every test matched it with OJ's blood.

38. Fibers on the knit cap found at the murder scene match material in OJ's Bronco.

39. Fibers on the bloody glove found behind OJ's house match carpeting in OJ's Bronco.

40. Forensic test confirm fibers on Ron's shirt match the dark sweatsuit Kato says OJ wore the night of the murders.

HAIRS

41. Hairs found in the knit cap match OJ's.

42. Hair matching OJ's is found on Goldman's shirt.

43. A 12-inch hair matching Nicole's is discovered on the bloody glove.

44. A bloody glove matching the glove found at the murder scene that was found on OJ's property within hours of the murders contains a hair with the same microscopic characteristics as Ron's and Nicole's.

45. The killer's bloody shoe print found at the murder scene is from a size 12 Bruno Magli shoe, the same size worn by OJ.

46. OJ denies owning Bruno Magli shoes but a photo of OJ from a 1993 football game shows him wearing Bruno Maglis that match the prints at the murder scene.

47. GLOBE publishes photos of the Juice wearing Bruno Maglis at another football game.

48. FBI agent William Bodziak testified in the trial that an area of the bloody shoe print inside OJ's bronco could have been made from the corner of a Bruno Magli shoe.

49. Only 299 pairs of these size 12 rare Italian-made Bruno Magli shoes were ever distributed in the United States in 1991 and 1992, and were sold in olny 40 stores in the entire country, one of which is Bloomingdales in New York, where Simpson just happens to have a regular customer during the same period.

THE GLOVES

50. A bloody glove matching the one at the murder scene is found behind OJ's house near the air-conditioning unit, where Kato hears three thumps.

51. The glove at the murder scene and the glove at OJ's home are extra large: OJ's size. And they are a matching right and left glove.

52. Both gloves are identical to the type Nicole bought for Simpson at Bloomingdales in December of 1990, one of only two hundred pairs like them sold through out the whole country that year.

53. Photos and videos of OJ show him wearing the gloves that match the ones found at his home and the murder scene.

THE CUT ON OJ'S FINGER

54. On the night of the murders, OJ cuts the knuckle of his left middle finger. Investigators determine the murderer is cut on the same side based on the blood drops found immediately to the left of the killer's shoe print.

55. Asked by police how he cut his finger, OJ first said: "I don't know". He then said he cut it in Chicago and immediately afterward said he reopened the cut in Chicago, admitting that he cut himself in L.A

56. When Simpson was interrogated by LAPD detectives on the afternoon after the murders, he said he had not cut himself the last time he was at the Bundy address a week earlier. Defense attorney tried to say that his blood at the murder scene came from a previous visit to the address; not on the day of the murders.

57. When police arrested Simpson he had three other cuts besides the deep wound on his finger and seven abrasions.

ODD BEHAVIOR

58. OJ doesn't ask questions about his ex-wife's murder when police notify him in Chicago.

59. The Juice doesn't ask police anything about the safety of his two youngest children after he's told his wife has been murdered at her home.

60. Simpson complains about the heat and sweats during his limo drive to LA airport- even though it is cool out and the air conditioning is on.

61. Flight attendant Beverly Deteresa says OJ gulped down glasses of water and went to the bathroom every 15 minutes throughout the flight.

62. OJ does not shed one tear during his first interview about the murder of his ex-wife.

63. He spends less than a minute at Nicole's grave during his first visit after he's acquitted of murdering her.

64. OJ promises to hunt down the "real" killer of Nicole and Ron Goldman, but fails to pursue his own investigation- even when private investigators offer their services to him for free.

65. The Juice expresses no surprise when police tell him he's a suspect in the murders.

66. Photos show OJ holding a gun to his head during the low-speed chase.

67. Simpson writes a suicide note that is read after his escape from arrest on June 17, 1994. The note is written from pal Robert Kardashian's house on June 15- and reeks of guilt.

THE BRONCO

68. Cellular phone records put OJ in his Bronco at 10:03 p.m., only minutes before the murders took place.

69. OJ's Ford Bronco is parked at a haphazard angle in front of his home the night of the murders.

70. OJ flees from cops on June 17, 1994 in Cowling's Ford Bronco.

71. Jennifer Peace, Cowling lover, tells a grand jury AC admitted OJ was heading to Mexico in the Bronco.

72. After OJ's arrest, police find in his possession a passport, a gun, a fake mustache and a beard, and fresh changes of underwear in the Bronco.

73. Police find cash totaling $8, 750 in Cowling's possession after the Bronco chase. Cowling later says OJ told him to carry the money.

74. A receipt found in the Bronco shows OJ purchased his false beard and mustache on May 27, 1994, just two weeks before the murders.

75. Denise Brown testifies her reaction to Nicole's death was: "Oh my God, he killed her. He always said he would kill her".

76. Juditha Brown says OJ threatened to kill the Brown family in 1979 if Nicole left him.

77. Juditha says after OJ and Nicole divorced in 1992 he became "very neurotic" and phoned his former mother-in-law "six times a day" to tell her how upset he was about the split.

THE CHICAGO HOTEL

78. Two plastic bags were missing from the hotel room in Chicago where OJ stayed.

79. A broken glass is found in OJ's Chicago hotel room the day after the murders. Simpson says he had reopened the cut on his finger on that glass after he heard the news of his ex-wife's murder. But the glass didn't have any blood on it.

OJ'S ALIBIS

80. Defense witness Dr. Robert Huizenga, at one time the team physician for the Los Angeles Raiders, was called to the stand in the trial to establish that Simpson's arthritic condition would have prevented him from commiting the murders. But he conceded on cross-examination that Simpson definitely was physically capable of commiting the murders of Nicole and Ron.

81. There's only one hour during the 24-hours day that OJ does not have an alibi: the hour of the murders. OJ brushes that off by saying he was home alone.

82. Defense attorney Johnnie Cochran tells the jury that OJ was chipping golf balls at the time the murders took place, while Simpson tells the limo driver he was napping.

83. When he's late for his limo, Simpson tell the chauffeur that he overslept. But the driver seeing a large figure about 6-ft 2-in tall, dresses in black and weighing 200 pounds, walk into the entrance of Simpson's home-at the time OJ says he was sleeping.

84. Also, the chauffeur says he saw this figure at the time he saw Kato walking around with a flashlight (after hearing the three thumps). And the figure was coming from the direction where Kato heard three thumps.

85. Limo driver Park said he rang OJ's buzzer for 20 minutes without a reply, but shortly after he saw the figure going into Simpson's home, OJ answered the buzzer.

86. An expert testifies the bloody gloves would have fit OJ except that blood and moisture caused the extra-large gloves to shrink a full size.

87. OJ claims he couldn't have murdered anyone because of his old football injuries, but just before the slayings, he made an exercise video and he still plays golf on a regular basis.

88. OJ's son Jason, admits he originally thought his father was guilty.

89. OJ says blood at the murder scene came from times he played there with his children before, but the drops are close to the bloody footprints leading from the bodies.

90. Experts say the murders are consistent with a rage killing, not a Mafia hit or a professional slaying. There is no sign of a break-in or a burglary at the murder scene.

91. In 60 percent of all domestic murders the killer beats his victim, strangles his victim, stabs his victim or slashes his victim's throat.

2. Jennifer Peace says AC told her the knife "sleeps with the fishes".

93. Friends say OJ knew Nicole's worst fear was to be killed with a knife

CONFESSIONS

94. Nicole's mom Juditha Brown reveals she overheard OJ moaning "I loved you too much," over Nicole's casket.

95. Pals say OJ told Nicole "If I can't have you, no one else can".

96. Prosecutor Darden claims OJ told a pal the night of Nicole's murder "I'm going to get her. I'm going to teach her a lesson".

97. Ron Shipp say OJ told him he had dreams of killing Nicole.

98. OJ sobbed: "I didn't mean to do it. I didn't mean for things to turn out this way," according to Cowling's girlfriend Jennifer Peace.

99. GLOBE discovers OJ took a polygraph test before the trial and scored a minus 20, which is classified as deceptive.

100. OJ lawyer Robert Shapiro says "probably did it" is not sufficient to convict his client.

101. Prison guard Jeff Stuart in the room when OJ talked to minister Rosey Grier swears in an affidavit he heard OJ shout: "I didn't mean to do it. I'm sorry."
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JeanGrey Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-07-08 09:57 AM
Response to Reply #18
34. Yes. Mounds of Evdience. Unbelievable, isn't it?
Also on the flight back from Chicago he told a passenger that his ex wife had been killed along with "another man". No one had given OJ that information.

One of OJ's best friends was just on Dr. Phil, whining and begging forgiveness from the Goldman's for his part in "helping OJ get away with murder". He wrote a book with the same title. On the glove, they also withheld OJ's arthritis medication and tried to get his hands to swell as much as possible.

That was such a circus I remember when watching it husband saying "P.T. Barnum was right".

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woolldog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-07-08 12:17 AM
Response to Original message
22. I don't think he did it. n/t
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Two Americas Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-07-08 12:24 AM
Response to Original message
23. reasonable doubt
There is in my view, and in the jury's view, reasonable doubt as to his guilt. I have little doubt that the prosecution failed to make the case, and no doubt whatsoever that the jury rendered a verdict.

For me though, the more compelling and interesting story is not about this one murder case and one jury verdict, among so many. It is the bizarre obsession over it by the white community.
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OPERATIONMINDCRIME Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-07-08 09:33 AM
Response to Original message
26. I'm Downright AMAZED That There Are Some Who Would Not Think He Did It.
Personally, I rank their perception of this specific issue right up there with those who think the Earth is only 5000 years old. If they haven't been able to see things accurately yet with all the information at their disposal, then they just ain't gonna (both groups).
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ProfessorGAC Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-07-08 09:35 AM
Response to Reply #26
27. We Don't Agree Often, But We Sure Do This Time
You nailed it, OMC.
The Professor
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JeanGrey Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-07-08 09:58 AM
Response to Reply #26
35. You and me both.
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Donald Ian Rankin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-07-08 09:41 AM
Response to Original message
28. I think he probably did, but I'm not certain beyond all reasonable doubt.
Which is not to say that the evidence wouldn't justify such certainty if examined closely, but I haven't done so and see no need to do so, and I don't think most other people have either.
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