Does Helping Beggars Really Help?

[The Straight Story]

Does Helping Beggars Really Help?

STOCKTON, CA - With the economy still struggling, it's not unusual to see people on sidewalks and streets begging for help.

But is it really helpful to help with a little spare change?

The man who runs Stockton's Shelter for the Homeless wrote in a letter to the Stockton Record, it's best to say no to those people.

He wrote, "I am getting sick and tired of seeing panhandlers and people going door to door or accosting me in front of stores." Reynolds claimed in his letter much of the money offered to beggars goes for drugs, alcohol or prostitution.

"This community has a safety net for the homeless and the hungry. If you want to help, give your 'spare change' or contribution to agencies providing emergency assistance to the poor," Reynolds wrote.

Debra Trunnell is 54 years old and has been homeless for three years. Friday she was begging for money at the Hammer Ranch shopping center in North Stockton.

"The most I make during the day, nothing over 20 dollars. It's for food, and I smoke, and for dog food for the two dogs," said Trunnell.

http://www.news10.net/news/local/story.aspx?storyid=56595&catid=2

[JuniperLea]

1. I used to think, no...

I used to think it only enabled them to remain a beggar... now, it feels more like survival.

[cali]

2. I don't know, but I'm not about to stop

And the head of the homeless shelter doesn't sound terribly compassionate.

[The Straight Story]

4. I won't stop either (nt)

[RiverStone]

9. It is more compassionate NOT to feed their addictions

Giving money hurts more than helps (most of the time).

See post #9

I have tons of compassion; so much in fact that I worked directly with many street folks for over a decade of my career.

[cali]

10. Be that as it may, I'm not going to stop and no, I don't believe it hurts.

[RiverStone]

15. It does - and I know that for a fact

I spent years as a caseworker serving folks (homeless or hurting) in downtown Portland Oregon; I know what I experienced and what they taught me.

I trust that experience. They told me the truth.

[cali]

17. Let me explain why I give money to people begging

I don't want to treat someone who's that down and out as if I know what they need better than they do- even if I do. It has to do with granting them dignity and respect. It's not like I'm doubting you or anything, but that's the way I feel.

[RiverStone]

26. dignity and respect - we agree there!

And I have not the time to cover the tears of joy I shared once a homeless and addicted person feels like he/she can contribute to society in a meaningful way!

Independent living, job skills, and a healthy body --- all gained back through rehab and assistance.

Whats the saying...

“Give a man a fish; you have fed him for today. Teach a man to fish; and you have fed him for a lifetime”

peace~:)

[EFerrari]

11. It's not up to you or to me to try to make decisions for other people.

That's their decision.

And I call bullshit on your assertion that giving something hurts more than it helps.

[RiverStone]

18. Call bullshit on giving $$$ after you have worked with them for years

And have witnessed first hand those who have died from being addicted.

I did not say giving SOMETHING hurts, in fact - I gave examples of giving that helps!

I am only referring to giving $$$$$$$$$!

[EFerrari]

22. Okay. Bullshit. n/t

[Name removed]

3. Deleted sub-thread

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[H2O Man]

5. Yes.

[LaurenG]

6. If someone asks or informs me that they have a need, I usually give whatever I can

It's usually cash but I'm good with giving items or food.

I don't care what someone does with the money I have given them. Once it's left my hands it's up to the receiver to do with what he will. I usually won't give cash to the same person twice without a service or barter in return, though I will help in other ways.

[RiverStone]

12. You would care more if you knew that many of them hurt themselves with it

I know you mean well LaurenG, but from over a decade of direct experience working with street folks --- most of them do not use the money in ways that are productive.

Most use it to feed addictions that make their lives worse. GIVE to them, but give them something other than $$$ to buy drugs or alcohol with.

Upthread I mentioned I worked with street folks for many years, so this cause is near to my heart - they need help, just the right kind of help.

[EFerrari]

20. I know YOU mean well, but WTF are you to decide for other people

what is productive? What patronizing cr@p that is.

[RiverStone]

24. If someone has lost all their teeth to a meth addiction...

And I know they spend most of their money on meth --- yes, I assume it is not healthy.

I can think of zillions of better ways to spend that money (to really help them escape their addiction and desperate circumstances).

[EFerrari]

27. Then spend your money in better ways and stop trying to control your fellow creatures.

You don't stop addiction by trying to control it. As a case worker, that's an idea I assume you'd be familiar with.

[RiverStone]

31. Just don't feed the addiction

And how you think helping folks crawl outta the gutter is control is beyond me.

Where do you see helping them as "CONTROL"???

[EFerrari]

32. Trying to control the behavior of an addict is not "helping". n/t

[RiverStone]

7. More folks then not spend it on drinking or drugging - better to give food or items than money!

I know what I'm talking about; having worked as a case manager in a large city that included many "street folks" for 6 years and with the Division of Vocational Rehabilitation for another 5 year serving many physically and psychiatrically disabled adults.

A small percentage are simply too crazy or PTSD to work and genuinely use/need the money to survive.

A much larger percentage use about 75% of money given to them to feed addictions that are not healthy.

A far better thing to give the beggars are gift certificates to local grocers ($5 for example) or real leads to job training centers or homeless shelters. If the dude looks cold - give him a blanket, but not money.

Believe me, what you think is a street person on the corner will frequently drive away in a van after it gets dark ---- many, many scammers out there. Go directly to the homeless camps with groups from local nonprofits (never alone) and hand items directly to the folks in the tent city. At least that way you know that they are getting usable items vs money.

Young beggers in particular benefit from job skills training more than anything. If he/she looks like they can work, they usually can!

[EFerrari]

14. Did you call your clients "beggers" while in that job, too?

[RiverStone]

21. I called them....

By their first names.

And I met many amazing souls.

[EFerrari]

23. But you call those "amazing souls" beggers here?

[RiverStone]

29. They do beg! And this does not take away from the point

...that there are far better things to give than money.

Most do not give a shit what you or I think of them. Do you prefer the word panhandler?

What adjective do you use to describe their behavior?

I did not say during my years working to help them --- hey beggar! I did say --- hey (persons name).

Most do respond great tho if someone cares enough to help them stop doing it.

Problem is, they hide in plain sight and giving money does not help most.

[EFerrari]

34. Sincerely, I find that I do better with other people

if I don't try to make their decisions for them. If I give what I can when I can without strings and try to mind my own sh!t the rest of the time.

[EFerrari]

8. Wow. What an @sshole he his. "Beggers"? Really?

:puke:

[alcibiades_mystery]

13. General empathy would shitcan the phoney utilitarian calculus

and try to relieve somebody's need or pain in the moment.

I'm all for larger systemic change to solve the larger problem. Let's not pretend we can't do both at once.

[EFerrari]

16. That shelter guy seriously needs to get into a different line of work. n/t

[CreekDog]

19. I give through paycheck donations to St. Anthony's, SF Food Bank and housing crisis in my county

my money goes farther, doesn't require anyone to spend their days panhandling to get that money and doesn't support any alcohol or substance abuse.

most of the homeless are not panhanding BUT WORKING and cannot panhandle while other who aren't working are panhandling. giving to panhandlers does nothing to help the mostly invisible homeless.

gifts to places like St. Anthony's feeds people, shelters people and provides other forms of help that people in crisis need.

i used to believe it was no problem to give someone money who was going to buy a drink with it. i no longer believe that's the compassionate thing to do.

[EFerrari]

30. People have to do what they're comfortable with.

I myself have found, working in our neighborhood, that building relationships is the most valuable use of time and money. One of the worst, dehumanizing things about poverty is the isolation. The dollar I give to my homeless neighbor will help more than it hurts because it may be the only contact with another person he has that morning. The choice he now has on how to spend it may be the only moment of the day when he feels like he has a choice. Unless you're half dead, you don't walk into recovery from nowhere. You walk into it because you've enough support to do that. (Okay, you may be half dead, too. :) )

So far, we're two for two on our block, knock on wood.

[lunatica]

25. I always try to give something to older people who I know can't possibly get work

I have my two or three regulars who I give to all the time. I know their names and always have a word or two with them. One likes to read so I buy him reading glasses. Some I know have precious little social security to live off of and that goes for whatever room they might rent. For the rest they are forced to beg. I've seen people who are hobbling from arthritis and who don't dare go to shelters and will sleep out in the cold if they have to. Old white haired people of both sexes.

This guy isn't running much of a shelter if people would rather be out in the cold begging.

[Mike 03]

28. I don't know. But this is why I do it:

1. I don't have cause to doubt the needs of those who 'beg' in my community, which is small. This is not like when I am in Los Angeles, and more judgment is called for.

2. Sometimes I can tell on the spot that someone desperately needs help and I have no hesitation to help them.

3. I don't really care if he or she might buy cigarettes with the money I give them. After reading Jonathan Kozol's amazing work, I don't care if people in poverty have some enjoyment in their life, if it is nicotine or even alcohol, so long as hopefully they are not depriving children from basic needs.

4. Who the fuck am I to judge how they spend the money I give them when I spend recklessly myself?

My major regret is that I don't have more to give.

My judgment may not always be stellar, but at times like this it's not my job to be perfect, but to give where there might be a need. Someday, I might need help.

[Fire1]

33. +1

[RiverStone]

35. We agree on the GIVING part

...but I learned from many years working on and in the streets with homeless folks - that there are far better things to give than money.

The weird thing is Mike 03, some folks here have accused me of being "judgemental" because I have "no right" to assume how that money is spent.

I guess after 11 years of working the streets (and caseworking the homeless) in a big city --- I know what I saw and money did not help most of these people, so my observation is more than an assumption. I know what they told me. Of course, 100 years experience is only that from one's persons perspective, and that alone does not mean anybody has to agree.

Ironically, all the other non-monetary ways we helped them necessitated a tremendous amount of compassion and patience. Fix the broken down systems that keep them stuck --- worth a lot more than a hand out of $...

peace~:)

[EFerrari]

36. Were you this, um, indirect, as a case manager, too?

You know, imposing your POV is not helping, it's not supportive and it's not sharing. It's just adding another burden to other people. Maybe you didn't see as much as you needed to see in all those years working the street.

[RiverStone]

38. Your making wild assumptions

And what I and my co-workers did --- day after day to help people that most would either totally ignore or look at with disdain needs no justification to you.

My and others POV was usually greeted with by the folks we worked with as a present - because simply treating them as human beings was more then most got on a daily basis.

I know your wrong because of the many countless hugs and tears I got from hearing how we treated them with dignity and caring and more then anything --- took TIME to get to know them.

You can question my 11 years working with them all ya want, but assuming our good work was a burden is one royally fucked up assumption.

[EFerrari]

40. So, your clients in Poverty World viewed your "work" as a gift?

How nice for you.

[Iggo]

37. Helping helps.

Not helping does not help.

Rocket surgery, my friends!

[Marr]

39. I occasionally give food. Never money.

After seeing my brother live on the streets intermittently for years, along with some of his peers, I realized the money would only go straight to the liquor store or dealer.

[LeftyMom]

41. You have to be reasonably street smart about it.

There's a guy who begs around here who has terrible burn scars. Obviously he couldn't work if he wanted to, his hands are like claws from the scarring, and in any case I can't imagine he'd have much luck with job interviews. I give him money when I have it, as I've never seen any indication that he's any sort of substance abuser. He's generally only out asking for money a few days a month, I think he does it to supplement disability money or some other income he gets, since they generally don't give enough to starve on.

There's a couple who parks their little motorhome in the parking lot of an abandoned storefront near my Dad's house. I think they have a drug problem so I don't give them money but I pick up a sack of dog food while I'm getting food and litter for my cats and I bring it by. Their dog is looking less underfed and so are they- I think they were feeding the dog out of their food.