Democratic Hate Ground?

[denem]

A friend of mine once said,"You know I'm never really happy unless I'm complaining!" Here at DU, complaint and dissent is par for the course, but if you want a long lived thread, write an incendiary OP and have a good old flame war. That's the way to go.

In the Bush years, finding a target for anger and outrage was easy. Today, a Bachmann or some outburst from Fox will usually do, but it's not quite the same.

Today we have the Obama Administration, but if anything, the anger has increased. As an Australian, living in the US about half the year, I find an unfocused, anger and resentment amongst Americans that the cities, suburbs, towns, and even shopping malls, are not much like the society we imagined growing up. Something has gone desperately wrong.

But everyone has a different explanation, an blurry focus of fury. I hardly need to list the many things DU'ers correctly condemn. But I will say this - There is a long tradition of black hats / white hats in the American mindset, IE: There has to be a culprit.

But where does DU go when the traditional culprit of American dissatisfaction is Government. That was easy under the Bush Administration, but more problematic now.

Believe it or not, I trust the judgment of Americans, when they are informed and have an opportunity to discuss matters amongst themselves: The very thing thing stifled by the MSM and hate radio

My perhaps idealist hope for the netroots and activists, is organization and an exchange of ideas, rather than an echo chamber, where increasing levels of outrage take poll position, bereft of subtlety or research, in a vain expedition to find the culprits, usually amongst our own side.

The challenge of turning the ship of state when the barges are huge corporations is all but impossible unless we turn a strategy of divide and conquer against them, rather than ourselves.

If we occupy our time with sound and fury signifying nothing, the culprits may well be us.

[vadawg]

1. good post even if it is in Ozzie, i think its the peoples job to always distrust the government

and i say this as a tool of the government.

[FudaFuda]

5. Except Obama.

:sarcasm:

[lostnotforgotten]

8. Sarcasm Not Required - Many Of Us Would Like Our Votes Back

eom

[tekisui]

2. The most effective tactic against the proletariat is divide and conquer.

We fight each other, while the ruling elite march forward.

[Mari333]

4. you said it. nt

[Mari333]

3. yes, but think about how many people on DU,

by having a forum to vent their frustration, are not shooting up innocent people in shopping malls or drowning their sorrows and angst in gallons of jack daniels?

It seems to have always been a problem, when the huge institutions and corporate giants in the USA abuse the populace, instead of pointing at the source of the problem, people point fingers at each other. I wonder how much of that is welcomed by the powerful institutions, as the rabble fight amongst themselves. I often wonder if the MSM works diligently towards that end with blessings from the wealthy and powerful. maybe its just easier to blame the family next door than to focus on the bigger picture.

[mucifer]

6. It's difficult. We are a diverse group with many varying opinions.

I believe the word in our title "Underground" means we are not mainstream dems. I also have to say as a Jewish person arguing about politics and not agreeing with others is culturally appropriate and feels right. I think, however, the internet is not face to face and people interpret things wrong and it's not the same as having an argument in person. People are more likely to be misunderstood and it can be easier to get nasty and mean. Another thing to remember and I must say this applies to me, it is easy to spend lots of time at DU and little time to do real activism.

[islandmkl]

7. i'm not happy 'till you're not happy, too!!...

[H2O Man]

9. It is an individual trait.

Some people on DU tend to see the good -- or potential good -- in most situations. Others are chronic Chicken littles, who process all in-coming information as proof the sky is falling. And still more fall somewhere in-between.

[zeemike]

10. Some very astute comments.

And divide and conquer is the name of the game...and has been used sense Roman times effectively.
And the left is particularly vulnerable to it because they do think for themselves and are a diverse group.

[Obamarama]

11. I saw a glimmer of something during the financial meltdown that I wish we would see more of....

I actually saw people, out in the streets (In NYC), protesting and undertaking non-violent acts of civil disobedience. I think we need a LOT more of that here.

I always marvel at the French. If the government is even thinking of doing something the French people do not want, they take to the streets en masse. They also frequently go on strike. They don't vote then sit quitely on the sidelines like we do and throw up their hands and say "We don't have the power to do anything about it." They get out into the streets and send a message to the government: "Like HELL you will try to pull that one off!!"

I am not advocating violence. Just frequent and vocal demonstration against governmental actions that we don't agree with. Why just wait until the next election year, when we can "vote them out."
Fuck that...rattle their cages NOW. Make them respond to OUR will. It's OUR governemnt, supposedly.
I've never understood why we're such whimps when it comes to civil disobedience (again, non-violent) in the face of the government's stupidity.

[FredStembottom]

15. Your post makes me think......

....that the "divide" here at DU is, maybe, simply what it looks like as people become too desperate to wait any longer.

I think that "French" model you describe is what this nation is transitioning to. Again, because millions of us are simply all out of waiting time. The Next Election is light years away for people being thrown out of their homes.

A societal change like that is bound to have reflections of it here at DU.

Those who can still wait vs. those under immediate threat.

[RufusTFirefly]

19. That's because the French have unions. Their workers are actually VALUED. n/t

[denem]

12. Divide and conquer: For example, Big Oil and Health Insurance

I more than understand the rage against Wall Street, but consider this: Big Oil and the Health Insurance Industry are low hanging fruit. Getting the information out there, organizing, protesting are popularist causes that are not a big sell.

And they are morally right. We have a recession / depression that will ruin many lives. Private health care kills and maims every day. Oil/carbon may kill the planet.

By targeting them, slitting them off from the mainstream, airing the stench of their pots of poison, they willcome to the negotiating table weakened.

I am not minimizing the Financial Crisis one iota. What I am saying is we can getting going on divide an conquer, person to person, street by street, block by block. Improbable journeys are not only the stuff of legend.

[GeorgeGist]

13. By design, humans have divided the world into nations.

[HamdenRice]

14. Excellent! But hatred and cynicism are the "water" that many DUers swim in so they can't see it

I think it's a little more systemic than even your fine post describes. With Bush gone, some of the more alienated turned that hatred to a president who actually wants to address most of our issues.

[nichomachus]

16. Criticism is not hatred

Please go to the board and write that 10,000 times.
The notion that criticizing someone means you hate them is a right-wing talking point made popular by freepers during the Bush presidency.

[HamdenRice]

21. When people make up irrational complaints, that's hatred not criticism

If your gripe is that Michelle doesn't look dirty enough while gardening, that's not rational.

[slay]

17. wow. another "people on DU aren't acting like I want them to" thread

*yawn*

[Mari333]

18. lol

[Windy]

20. wonderful post!!! Thank you. nt

[stubtoe]

22. Some seem to want this to become Democratic Fight Club.

It's gotten almost as bad as the primaries. You have to hunt to find the worthwhile threads.

[cagesoulman]

23. denem, great post!

Obama's only been in office a little over two months, and the fact that everything in the world hasn't been fixed yet is only a reflection of the fact that Obama is one human being with more challenges ahead of him than any President in recent memory.

[denem]

24. ...

Kick

[omega minimo]

25. Black hats/white hats, Us/Them, Human ego fighting to be right....

"But everyone has a different explanation, an blurry focus of fury. I hardly need to list the many things DU'ers correctly condemn. But I will say this - There is a long tradition of black hats / white hats in the American mindset, IE: There has to be a culprit."

"The challenge of turning the ship of state when the barges are huge corporations is all but impossible unless we turn a strategy of divide and conquer against them, rather than ourselves."



What remains unspoken in most all the threads is the culpability of many of us in going along with, aiding and abetting, giving our lives to, receiving our livelihoods from, paying our money to those huge corporations, participating in the gluttony of conspicuous consumption, ransacking resources to support unsustainable lifestyles.................................

"If we occupy our time with sound and fury signifying nothing, the culprits may well be us."

Indeed.