A second Miss USA judge rips into the bigoted California contestant

[ruggerson]

http://aliciastage3.blogspot.com/

"As she continued to speak, I saw the crown move further & further away from her. When she finished, she looked strangely proud for a moment. Personally, I was STUNNED on several levels. First, how could this young woman NOT know her audience and judges? Let's not forget that the person asking the question is an openly gay man, at least 2 people on the judges panel are openly gay. Another judge has a sister in a gay marriage. Her very own state pageant director, KEITH LEWIS is an openly gay man who has been a very generous benefactor of hers...in many ways. (2 ways in particular....if you get my drift??) Did I mention I was STUNNED? I was also personally insulted & hurt. Prejean's words hit very close to home for me. Some of the most important people in my life, happen to be gay. A few months ago, on November 1, 2008, I was maid of honor at the wedding of my very dear friends, Robert Aganza & Jorge' Rodriguez. I flashed back to that beautiful wedding ceremony, where everyone in the room was crying tears of joy & love. How can she be saying this, is all I could think in that moment. Remembering that we were on live television, I actually recall having to close my wide-opened mouth, I then looked over to Perez, who was seated right next to me, he was just shaking his head, he actually seemed a bit hurt? Then came the very loud booing in the theatre, followed by "a word from our sponsors."

[flvegan]

1. "Then came the very loud booing in the theatre..."

Good.

Take your 500 new Facebook idiot "friends" and cram them up your ass.

[Stephanie]

2. I want to see the booing!

Where is the YouTube of the booing?

[Gold Metal Flake]

3. Pretty on the outside.

But really, could it be that no one around her knew what she thought? My experiences with bigots has always been that they just can't wait to share their feelings. I can't believe that she was a Manchurian Contestant. She has dropped a hint or two during those long hours of fittings, makeup, rehersal, walking lessons, whateverthefucktheydo.

Kieth Lewis (I don't know who that is) didn't know? Please. They built a monster, and in front of the cameras it went all true-self on them. Maybe they should use better judgement when choosing their toys.

[ejpoeta]

25. why would anyone know unless she had a reason to talk about it.

do you think they sit in the back and just talk about gay marriage or politics?? not that i don't think she probably would let everyone know if they gave her a reason to. i just don't think that is what they are focusing on in the dressing rooms and such before the pageant.

[Gold Metal Flake]

32. As I wrote...

"My experiences with bigots has always been that they just can't wait to share their feelings."

[Cha]

50. And, it turns out she

did..with the whole country..er, World.

[BlooInBloo]

4. It adds to the hilarity of this that she really thought it wasn't a big deal.

:rofl:

[malaise]

73. She'll be a Faux anchor in no time

and maybe that's all she wants. What a stupid barbie doll.

[McCamy Taylor]

5. Slap some more makeup on her, and you have the next Tammy Faye Baker

[tuvor]

6. Please don't insult Ms. Baker.

Gay men came to embrace Ms. Messner as a camp figure, making her the subject of gender-bending look-alike contests. She embraced them as well. She began attending gay pride events, and in 1996, she became the co-host of a syndicated television talk show with Jim J. Bullock, an openly gay actor.

“I refuse to label people,” Ms. Messner said in a 2000 documentary, “The Eyes of Tammy Faye,” when asked about her attitudes toward gay rights. “We’re all just people made out of the same old dirt, and God didn’t make any junk.”

http://www.nytimes.com/2007/07/22/us/22bakker.html

[ColbertWatcher]

47. She did begin to open her mind later in her life. n/t

[Name removed]

19. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[AngryAmish]

24. That is perfect

Sums it all up in one little sentence.

You should make it your sig line.

[mix]

7. very moving n/t

[LisaL]

8. Is the suggestion that the woman should have lied and not

give her actual opinion, because that would give her a better shot at winning? If you are asked for your opinion, instead of giving that opinion, should you figure out what the person asking the question wants to hear, and answer accordingly?

[JohnnyLib2]

9. That's what troubles me about the uproar.

:shrug: Seems like a deliberate lie in her response could have produced unwanted results in that contest.

[Believing Is Art]

15. She did lie, kind of

She said she thinks it's great that we live in a country where people can choose same-sex marriage or "opposite" marriage. That's not true. Wasn't a deliberate lie, just ignorant.

I've watched the clip a couple of times and I'm honestly not 100% sure what she's trying to say. Does she think it's great that citizens can choose whether it's legal or not, and she doesn't believe it should be legal? Or does she think it's great that people have the option of marrying someone of the same or opposite sex (which they don't, but she didn't seem well-informed) but she personally thinks homosexuality is a sin?

If it's the latter, it would seem that she does in fact support gay rights even though she thinks it's sinful. I honestly cannot tell.

[anigbrowl]

40. I assumed she was referring to the Democratic process

I don't actually think she's a bigot, or particularly right-wing (which to me implies an active rather than a passive political stance). I don't agree with her opinion since I strongly support gay marriage, but I do agree with her right to hold and express it. To me she didn't say anything derogatory about gay people, just expressed a widely held belief that the basic purpose of marriage is procreation.

frankly, a female beauty contest is not somewhere I'd look for cutting-edge political opinions. I mean think about it, it's basically a modern fertility rite, what else would you expect? Be happy that we don't also elect a Mr California/USA and burn him in a giant wicker basket after he's has sex with and knocked up the winners of the female contest.

Seriously, folks...these beauty contests are about as meaningful as something out of Conan the Barbarian....'A mighty evil has come to the land, you say? Let us hold a parade of our fairest women, and invigorate the men of our tribe!' You don't go asking this year's incarnation of the fertility goddess about the secrets of the village shaman.

[ConsAreLiars]

10. I think the suggestion is that she would have had a better shot

if she had not been such an ignorant and hateful bigot. You may support her views, or believe she should/could have hidden them better, but the discovery that she was was in fact a truly ugly person was what cost her.

(edit typo)

[LisaL]

14. Obama doesn't support gay marriage.

Does what you say about her apply to him as well?

[ConsAreLiars]

17. You may disagree, but I don't see Obama as an ignorant and hateful bigot.

You are entitled to your own view that the contestant and Obama are fundamentally similar in terms of intelligence and tolerance, if that is your reason for suggesting that they should be both painted with the same brush.

[whopis01]

34. I certainly don't think Obama is an ignorant and hateful bigot, but

he did say:
"I do not support gay marriage. Marriage has religious and social connotations, and I consider marriage to be between a man and a woman."

Which is not all that different from the view she was expressing:
"I believe that a marriage should be between a man and a woman."

I'm not claiming that they are fundamentally similar in terms of intelligence and tolerance... but they do share a common view on this issue.

[LisaL]

60. So you call this woman an ignorant and hateful bigot because

she thinks the marriage should be between a man and a woman. But you don't think that Obama is an ignorant and hateful bigot despite the fact that he thinks marriage should be between a man and a woman. What gives?

[spoony]

63. That is interesting, isn't it?

On one hand there's this young woman who has absolutely no control over the policies she's talking about, and thread after thread denounces her as, basically, Hitler. Then on the other hand you've got the President with the same opinion, who holds all the powers that go with that position, and he's given the pass. I know which one's stance I'd be more invested in.

[LisaL]

66. Exactly. The woman paraded around in the bikini, for crying out loud.

How important is her opinion, really? On the other hand, Obama has been elected president, so presumably his opinion could matter a lot. Yet he is totally getting a pass for the same opinion as this woman.

[Maru Kitteh]

74. People in bikinis do not have consequential opinions?

interesting

[LisaL]

76. The woman participated in a beauty competition, and was

given scores based on how good she looked in a bikini or an evening gown. She isn't a politician. Surely her opinion isn't more important than that of Obama?

[ejpoeta]

26. i did notice them show obama answering a similar question when he was a nominee

when talking about this miss usa thing. i don't think he is a bigot. and i think that he did intimate that he does believe that gay couples should be treated equally. i was a little disappointed when he said he supported something other than marriage. but at least i know that obama has an open mind and is willing to listen to other ideas. at least there is the ability to reason with him, whereas some other folks refuse to even hear anything else and these are the people that i worry about.

[bullwinkle428]

28. Political expedience, plain and simple. Anyone failing to

recognize this is woefully naive, I'm afraid.

[screembloodymurder]

31. I agree with Obama.

;)

[Zuiderelle]

39. Oh that's nice. So you agree that marriage is exclusively between a man and a woman.

:eyes:

[Name removed]

55. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[burning rain]

57. One problem there is that not all marriages are religious.

You can just as well get married by a justice of the peace, whose salary is paid by the public, including gays. So why should gays not have the right to avail themselves off the justice's services on an equal basis? Now, if the state recognized only civil unions (for anyone, gay or straight) and left recognition of marriage solely to private entities, secular or religious, then that argument would hold more water, but that is not the case.

[Starry Messenger]

64. Pizza time!!

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=user_profiles&u_id=111177

Thank you mods.

[Zuiderelle]

65. Yeah, thanks mods!

:toast:

[spoony]

75. That someone would be TS'd

for saying "I agree with Obama" is hilarious, I think. That must mean the President is unwelcome here, and yet others have been TS'd for criticising him. This site has a very schizo feel sometimes.

[Zuiderelle]

79. Are you saying you don't agree that the context of that statement makes it different...

than what you are insinuating? In a thread about the Miss USA snafu, and how bigoted the contestant's comments were towards gays, someone saying that they agree with exactly what she said "I believe marriage is between a man and a woman" is a bit different than saying that he simply said he agrees with our president. He specifically responded to agree with our president's belief that marriage is between a man and a woman.

This site has specific rules about how its members are to respect and support civil rights for all americans, including the rights of marriage. I'm happy to see them enforcing that particular rule.

[spoony]

82. And that's fine

but just keep it in mind when you look at the man in your avatar. He, the pageant girl, and the TS'd poster are all in agreement on that issue. And out of the three, there's only one that has any power regarding it.

[TahitiNut]

72. Wow! You sure took your time. R.I.P.

:eyes:

[ruggerson]

23. her answer was classic religious rightwing doubletalk

if she had said she doesn't believe in interracial or interethnic marriage, would she not deserve to be condemned? No one is censoring her right to be a bigot, merely highlighting the fact that she IS a bigot.

[DevonRex]

45. I am glad she said what she thinks and that she got booed. Those bigots

need to be exposed and they need to know that the majority of us don't agree with them and that in fact we find their beliefs to be vile and revolting.

[Mike Daniels]

51. I always presumed it was the manner of answering the question that counted

not the specific content of the answer per se.

IOW, if you were able think fast, have a basic understanding of the principles behind the question and answer the question with coherent thought then you got the points.

Now, from what I've read she failed on a few of those counts so she probably would have lost points anyway. But for people to be penalized because their answer isn't "correct" is total crap.

[TahitiNut]

11. Independent of her opinion, it was VERY poorly reasoned and supported ...

... and presented even more poorly. She not only proclaimed a stance that was at odds with her claim of "choice," she essentially abdicated any responsibility for that stance by blaming it on the way she was "raised."

Typical mindless, right-wing bigot. :puke: Her intellectual sloth was on display for all to see.

[Love Bug]

13. Exactly!

Incoherence alone should have been enough to eliminate her.

[HillWilliam]

53. Thank you

She appeared unable to answer the question directly.

A forthright bigot I find irksome enough. A bigoted idiot who doesn't even know why she's a bigot -- only that she's repeating what a good kkkreeschyin girl should parrot -- is intolerable.

There's a reason I don't watch those tits-and-teeth shows and it's not just because I'm a gay man. I'm a gay man with more than two brain cells in the same orbit. I can only bear so much stooput (and whirled peas!) in one place at one time.

[TahitiNut]

56. Hell, even as a straight, I'd rather sip a latte and watch an Act Up protest than that T&A parade.

A vacuous, vapid, and venal parade of nip-and-tuck plastic didn't appeal to me even when I HAD a libido. :shrug:

[HillWilliam]

67. Whenever you're in central NC

the latte's my treat. Life's slow here, but the conversation's pretty good.

[burning rain]

58. Opinions based on religious belief tend to be the most ill-supported of all.

I often suspect someone's just trying to shut you up when they claim a religious basis for some view or claim, because the notion that you can't criticize anything faith-based holds so much sway in US culture.

[JerseygirlCT]

68. Totally agree

that was an extremely inarticulate display, regardless of content. She appeared completely vapid to me - all lip gloss and no substance.

[Love Bug]

12. She's entitled to her opinion

and the judges were entitled to choose who they thought would best represent the values of the US. Cry me a river, sweetie.

[LisaL]

16. What would be the values in the US?

Do you think majority in US supports gay marriage?

[bridgit]

21. Well......let's do be serious, the 'majority' of Americans do not...

Were that to be otherwise there'd be no contention today as regards all these issues question is...how do we get past those *realities*? By stuffing childlike others in contravention into a crash can one-by-one? Aside from that being an extremely ill-use of time management...it only serves to reinforce the ramparts on every...single...side,

They will say we are stupid...we will call them every other name they have not called us...there will be no resolution it will just go on & on ~

[bullwinkle428]

29. The majority of the U.S. was opposed to inter-racial marriage at the

time of the Loving vs. Virginia decision.

[Love Bug]

33. Maybe I should have said what our values SHOULD be.

In any event, she's entitled to her opinion, and I'm entitled to think she's an idiot.

[Change has come]

59. Why the hidden profile Sug?

Whatcha got to hide?

[bridgit]

20. No she isn't...she an asshole thus spake DU! Deal or no deal

[whopis01]

35. Exactly - I fail to see what the issue is here.

She got up and answered the question as she saw fit. She gave her honest answer. Good for her. She has every right to express her opinion as she sees fit. Then the judges use that information to decide who wins the contest. What's the big deal?

In all honesty, I don't care much about who wins this contest - but for having to deal with people in general I would rather deal with someone that honestly expresses their beliefs (no matter how much I may disagree with them) than someone who is deceptive and attempts to tailor their beliefs and parse what they say for each situation they might find themselves in.

[anigbrowl]

42. Same view here

To me, 'marriage is between a man and a woman' is a conservative opinion - one I disagree with, but no more.

Bigotry (again to me) would be adding '(something bad) should happen to anyone says/behaves otherwise'. In fact, she acknowledged that some people would disagree with her and did so politely. I'm OK with that. I see marriage as a social and legal institution, rather than a religious one or specifically geared to the production of children. I don't think she's for oppressing gays any more than I'm for preventing people from getting married in church if they want to do that.

[kiranon]

54. But she was not entitled to the Miss America crown. Discretion and poor

communication skills were her downfall. I also did not find her the prettiest but beauty is in the eye of the beholder. She has, in my opinion, a vacant look as though there isn't much upstairs. More smarts are needed to be an effective Miss America.

[JerseygirlCT]

69. Exactly

Free speech comes with responsibilities.

[bridgit]

18. That's fucking bullshit!!

What "this young woman (did) NOT (fucking) know (about) her audience and judges" was *their* brittle, intransigent bigotry what-the-fuck-ever!

edit for the round about :woohoo:

[tomreedtoon]

22. Question: who cares what any Miss America thinks?

The only person who gave a damn about them was Bob Hope, to put them on his TV specials, and he's dead. (And, some believe, securely in Hell.)

Does anyone believe a pampered, micro-managed walking mannequin represents the women of America? Ellen DeGeneris, Michelle Obama, Roseanne Barr/Arnold/Whatever, Pink and Joan Baez make better representatives of American women than any of those fembots with crowns.

Big deal if one of them is angling for a Rush Limbaugh personal appearance. (He isn't into women, so she'd be perfectly safe on his show.)

[ejpoeta]

27. it's miss USA. get it right!! hehe.

i personally don't care what this girl thinks about anything. as long as she isn't in a position to make policy or pass laws. I kind of feel bad for her, actually. I wonder if she is trapped in her 'beauty' and so now that's all she has. I worry about that kind of thing. I emphasize intelligence to my girls. Emily, who is 10, has told me she wants to get science illustrated magazine, go to science camp and be a vulcanologist when she grows up. we'll see if that lasts, but i'm going to encourage any endeavor that emphasizes her brains over her looks. she is a very cute girl. And i remember when people would tell her she was cute and she would say 'i know'. but she was never a jerk about it. she can be confident about how she looks... as long as she isn't her looks. I just hope i can keep her feeling self esteem and smart and happy to be throughout her teen years.

[LeftHander]

44. If it was Miss America there would be naked pix....nt

[MiniMe]

41. Miss America think?

I think that is where the problem lays.

[Beer Snob-50]

30. does anyone think that if she presented her views

in a more coherant fashion she would have been okay (regarding the contest) afterall, the reason for this exercise is to present a coherant thought. that you are more than silicon and hairspray?

she is an ignorant bitch but our country is built on free speech and as such she can say what she thinks. now granted she should have thought about her audience....

[whopis01]

37. You mean if she had said something like this:

"I do not support gay marriage. Marriage has religious and social connotations, and I consider marriage to be between a man and a woman."

That seems to be more acceptable around here.

[slackmaster]

52. Saying you believe marriage should be one man and one woman automatically makes you a bigot on DU

It may not be the most productive way of discussing the issue, but on this forum that's the way things are.

(Says slackmaster who gave money to No on 8, had a No on 8 sign in his yard for several weeks, and voted No on 8 last year.)

[LisaL]

61. But not believing in plural marriage is well and good.

Why shouldn't the marriage be between two men and one woman, two women and one man, etc?

[slackmaster]

78. Because that's something a few Mormons do

And therefore icky.

[JerseygirlCT]

71. Well, really, that pretty much makes you someone in favor

of discrimination, and taking away certain people's civil rights - whether you're here at DU or anywhere.

I'm becoming far less patient with people who expect to be let off the hook IRL when they express those sort of positions. Don't "believe" in gay marriage? Don't enter into one. But attempt to legislate your personal beliefs to the detriment of other people? No, that you do not have the right to do.

So I don't think it's just DU, nor do I blame anyone, here or anywhere, for speaking out against those who would strip people of civil rights.

[slackmaster]

77. I think I have a better handle on the anti-same sex marriage arguments than most DUers

Although I strongly disagree with their reasoning, it does make some logical sense - They don't see opposition to same-sex marriage as discrimination, because any man of legal age can marry any woman of legal age (married individuals notwithstanding). I think most of us have known at one time or another a homosexual man or woman who was married to a heterosexual and stayed in the relationship in order to take care of their children (and were generally miserable).

Obviously people who support same-sex marriage see it as discrimination because homosexuals aren't permitted to marry the person of their choosing.

I honestly believe that a substantial percentage of people who oppose same-sex marriage are simply misinformed. A lot of people out there believe that sexual orientation is a matter of choice, though they are completely unable to articulate the moment when they themselves "decided" to be heterosexual. Responses from men almost invariably boil down to a description of a moment at which they realized that they were aroused by the sight of a woman. Confront them with "But that's not a CHOICE you made!", and you usually get silence in return.

[JerseygirlCT]

83. Oh, no doubt there's ignorance aplenty on the issue

but I think explaining that ignorance is one thing, accepting it as a rationale for giving an anti position equal credibility is another.

There are undoubtedly still ignorant people who really think that African Americans are scary and different and shouldn't be allowed to mix with "white" people, too. But how much credence or patience are those opinions given?

The question of rights for our gay brothers and sisters will ultimately be won by people being made aware that actual people - people they may know even - are being forced into less of a life by what amounts to simple ignorance resulting in discrimination. I think there are moments when those easily held uninformed opinions butt up against the reality of one or more real people in their lives, and eyes get opened.

I had the same-sex argument with my husband more than 20 years ago, at which point he, a perfectly liberal and open-minded person, was just unable to accept the idea. (I remember the argument because it's one of the few I can say I won decisively in our marriage, lol). It was an immediate, visceral response. Perhaps because at that point he'd had fewer gay friends than I? Who knows. So I do see it happening. But I don't have to accept it. (And I didn't then, and he'll acknowledge that's a good thing now).

And I know that in a generation, this will cease to be much of an issue, except at the corners of society. Kids have, by and large, an entirely different mindset about the issue. Our kids won't stand for this sort of discrimination, and that's heartening.

[slackmaster]

85. Briefly - My point is that ignorance is something that can usually be fixed

True bigotry, not so much so.

Accusing someone of bigotry is good way to get them to stop listening to you, whether or not they are actually a bigot.

[JerseygirlCT]

86. I do understand that.

And yes, first you give them the benefit of the doubt. But I won't go so far as to consider it an issue on which reasonable people may disagree. Reasonable people won't disagree, because there really is only one reasonable position. YKWIM?

[slackmaster]

88. No, I disagree with you about that

Reasonable but uninformed people may take a position that differs from that of informed, reasonable people. Reasonableness is relative to one's level of knowledge and life experiences. A person can be reasonable and misinformed, and be wrong from the perspective of a better informed person.

It is the job of reasonable, informed people to educate people who are by nature reasonable but misinformed about something.

There are some people who just aren't reachable. They're the real bigots.

[JerseygirlCT]

90. I'm not sure you can hold a reasonable yet uninformed position

There's nothing reasonable about an opinion based on ignorance and/or bigotry.

I'm not talking about the person's delivery of the opinion - whether they're screaming or talking. I'm talking about their justification for the position - and I do not believe there's anything reasoned in a position based on fear, misunderstanding or bigotry.

[slackmaster]

91. People who are ignorant usually don't know they are ignorant

If you have never met an openly homosexual person, and have been told all your life by people you love and trust that homosexuality is a mental disorder, and you have no training in psychology, then it is reasonable to think that homosexuality is a mental disorder; UNTIL you are confronted with authoritative opinion that it is a normal variation of human behavior. If at that point you insist on continuing to call it a mental disorder, you are probably unreachable.

Imagine such a person's first encounter with an openly homosexual man or woman is that person getting in his or her face and screaming "Bigot!". That person is not going to learn anything from that encounter. It may even reinforce the mistaken view that homosexuals are messed up people.

[JerseygirlCT]

70. I think there was likely some room for that

But we'll never know, because from what I saw, that was an extraordinarily inarticulate and poorly reasoned response. She looked like an idiot, on both content and delivery.

[rcrush]

36. How would she answer a question about Americans and maps?

[Starry Messenger]

38. That's interesting.

It doesn't sound like there were many conservatives on the panel. I had a conversation with someone on DU who claimed she might be afraid of offending the conservative judges if she said she was pro-marriage equality. Doesn't appear that was the case at all.

[Shell Beau]

43. I think her answer was stupid and ignorant, but what

this judge seems to be saying is that the girl should've changed her answer to appeal to the judges. So she should have lied? What good does that serve? At least her true colors have shown.

[DevonRex]

46. I understand what you're saying. I think the judge was shocked that the girl

didn't know or care that she was being insulting.

I see that in my own family, too. They're so busy sqawking about their own beliefs that they have no idea that they're hurting real people.

[Shell Beau]

48. I said before that this gal would've pissed off many people either way

she went with this answer. Although I believe there is a right answer to the question, had she answered the correct way, we'd probably be hearing loons from the right bitching.

I am guessing the girl had no clue she was being insulting. She didn't seem to have a clue. I bet she has a clue now. Not that it will make any difference.

[LisaL]

62. Exactly. The judge seems to be saying she should have figured

out who the judges are (gay, or have gay relatives) and answered accordingly.
Which to me is ridiculous. Means the woman should have different opinions depending on who she is speaking to.

[Cha]

49. That blog likes a good one to tune

into Tomorrow!

A Random Choice..that is really interesting!

What is also not gracious about Miss California is her blaming her own bigoted views on Christianity.

[skooooo]

80. That judge that called her a "bitch" isn't any better whatsover.

[Bluebear]

89. Denying people equal rights is equivalent to calling somebody a bad name?

[skooooo]

93. wrong is wrong...

If you're drawing attention to someone's bigoted beliefs, you don't do that by heaping more bigotry into the discussion. He lost the high ground.

[paulk]

81. it seems kind of strange to me

that this judge is openly saying that in order to win the contest, contestants needs to say what the judges want to hear, in other words, lie about their true feelings - "First, how could this young woman NOT know her audience and judges?" OTOH, maybe that's what these "beauty" contests are all about - what the ultimate woman should aspire to - presenting yourself as someone you are not...

[Blue_Tires]

84. kick

[ProudToBeBlueInRhody]

87. Okay...she is an idiot.....

But the problem is how many of these contenders for the crown would have said the same thing? Beauty queens have a tendancy to live in very sheltered worlds of country clubs and charm schools. I think this one is getting pillared while the others are breathing a sigh of relief they didn't have to answer that question.

[npk]

92. If it was anyone else other than Perez Hilton asking the question I might agree

But as far as I am concerned Perez Hilton is a piece of human garbage. Plain and simple. He may think he is funny or creative, taking his name from one of the dumbest people on this planet, but he is really just a pathetic sack of shit who happens to be gay. I support gay rights. I also support that people have a right to their opinions. And Perez Hilton going around and trying to "out" celebrities and call them gay, when they have not made that decision on their own, is wrong. And whoever wrote that bullshit referenced in the "OP" criticizing someone for giving their opinion instead of trying to simply please that idiot Perez Hilton is beyond ridiculous.

[kevinbgoode]

94. It's the whole "My religious belief is that YOUR religious belief comes from Satan, and therefore

OUR government must endorse MY religious belief to prevent you equal protection under the law because the government was created as an extension of MY church."

Or, of course, it's the typically heterosupremacist notion that "MY faith entitles me to pass judgement on YOUR right to marry and it must be enshrined into law or you are discriminating against MY right to worship as I choose."