"Calling an illegal alien an 'undocumented immigrant'

[bighart]

is like calling a drug dealer an 'unlicensed pharmacist.'"

Got this as a tag line on an email today from a co-worker. Curious what others think. Won't state my opinion at this point and won't be able to check back any time soon as I have meetings all day today, YIPEE!

[Deep13]

1. Not exactly an apt analogy.

What illegal aliens do would be lawful but for their illegal presence in the country. So it is more like illegally present aliens are more like an unlicensed pharmacy that fills otherwise lawful prescriptions.

[RB TexLa]

2. If the "drug" dealer were selling prescription drugs to people with valid prescriptions

then that right wing talking point would make a little sense.

[TechBear_Seattle]

3. I hate the phrase "illegal alien"

Most people think of aliens as inhuman creatures from outer space. And "illegal" assigns them the same status as cocaine, rape and theft.

If we are to stop the hate expressed by the supremacist groups, we must first change our terms so as not to question the humanity of these people.

[Deep13]

8. Their alienage is illegal, not their humanity.

Alien just means "foreigner" whatever readers of paperback sci-fi novels think.

[anigbrowl]

34. Well, it's their presence here as aliens, not the fact that they're aliens to begin with.

Though as an alien myself, I always find this word amusing.

[Romulox]

11. "Alien" is a legal term with a precise meaning (and it has nothing to do with outer space.) nt

[TechBear_Seattle]

13. "Torture" does too

That does not alter common perception of the term, however.

[Romulox]

15. "Non-sequitur" isn't a legal term, but it's easy to see why it applies here.

:hi:

[earthside]

4. It works.

As hyperbole it is meant to emphasis the use of "politically correct" speech.

In this case, to rename a person who has committed a crime into something more acceptable to the U.S. Chamber of Commerce types.

[olegramps]

6. It is not politically correct here to oppose illegal immigration.

Don't even think of opposing this flood of people seeking emergency care that has left hospitals struggling to keep the doors open. Don't opposed the illegals taking over the building trades. Such complaints are not acceptable here. Don't worry about the extensive damage that has been done to honest citizens because their identity has been stolen. Here is an example of how far it has gone. When a American citizen with extensive experience applied for a construction superintendent job here in our city he was rejected because he didn't speak Spanish. He complained about the situation in a letter he wrote to the local newspaper. I welcome people from all over this world who want to share the American dream. That is what has made the nation great. E Pluribus unum.

[Romulox]

12. Perfectly acceptable to be anti-Labor here on DU though. Strange. nt

[Lance_Boyle]

23. anti-labor and pro-illegal are rather the same, aren't they?

"Fuck you lowly workers! Bring me some LOWLIER workers! They demand less, and can be threatened with deportation."

[pampango]

32. Not exactly, unless the AFL-CIO and Change to Win are anti-labor.

"A.F.L.-C.I.O. officials said they agreed with Change to Win leaders that, with more than seven million unauthorized immigrants already working across the nation, legalizing their status would be the most effective way to protect labor standards for all workers ."

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/04/14/us/14immig.html?_r=1&th&emc=th

If organized labor is in favor of legalization (or if you prefer RW buzz words - "amnesty") for "illegal aliens", does that make them "pro-illegal" and therefore "anti-labor"? The same organizations were in favor of legalization in the 2007 immigration reform debate but were defeated by the "amnesty" hysteria whipped by Rush and the boys at Fox News.

[uppityperson]

29. Odd. None of that in my area is from illegal immigration.

Hospitals are struggling to stay open because of economy and high salaries those at the top make. Our building trade has fallen due to the economy and housing bubble bursting. Had a sib's "identity stolen" and it was by a USAnian. Had mail stolen, including checks, and they were cashed by a local white USAnian woman.

Everyone speaking Spanish is not an illegal immigrant and requiring someone supervising a spanish speaking crew to speak their language is not a bad thing. Perhaps you have issues with any immigrants, sounds like at least those who do not speak English as a first language.

[baldguy]

5. Only if Betty of Suburbia drove her Hummer to the "unlicensed pharmacist" to get her Xanex.

Because it would be cheaper & she wouldn't have to pay taxes on it.

[Donald Ian Rankin]

7. Exaggerated, but with an element of truth to it.

Using the word "undocumented" rather than "illegal" *is* a deliberate attempt to obfuscate the fact that they are breaking the law, but illegal immigration is not comparable to drug dealing in seriousness.

[noamnety]

9. You can either be on the side of dehumanizing people, or not. (nt)

[doc03]

10. Works for me. The alien entered the country

illegally so they are an "illegal alien." The drug dealer is distributing drugs illegally so he is a "drug dealer."

[lies and propaganda]

14. i like it more than 'illegals.'

the term widely used in AZ.. its offensive and shitty and sounds the same as when those assholes say 'liberal' or the n-word. Little distinction btwn who they hate and how much..

[sledgehammer]

16. The analogy is weak

A drug dealer is almost always selling illegal drugs illegally. So to use "pharmacist" is incorrect, since a pharmacist doesn't dispense illegal drugs.

Illegal alien, illegal worker, illegal immigrant, undocumented immigrant, undocumented worker...take your pick, it all means the same thing. Personally I don't think any are particularly insulting or negative.

BTW, I was called a "resident alien" on my documentation when I had my green card. And IRS documents refer to resident and non-resident aliens. So I don't think the word alien is supposed to imply negativity, but thanks to sci-fi movies it has started to have a negative connotation.

[uppityperson]

31. Good post. Thank you. eom

[mainegreen]

17. A drug dealer is worse than an illegal alien, but the metaphor is apt. n/t

[anigbrowl]

35. It depends. I've known plenty of nice drug dealers.

If I choose to buy marijuana from someone in a private transaction,as I have, I can hardly argue that I am on a different moral plane from them.

[Stinky The Clown]

18. I really dislike the term "illegal alien"

I have few better suggestions.

[lumberjack_jeff]

19. Yes. It's a euphemism.

"undocumented"? WTF is that?

"illegal" and "alien" are the adjective and the noun which best describe a person who sneaks across the border to live/work in another country.

[WorseBeforeBetter]

20. Will you be checking back in after your meetings to state your opinion? (n/t)

[TahitiNut]

21. I tend to agree ... but personally prefer "unlawful alien."

The term 'immigrant' implies some intention to actually take up permanent residence and become a member of a community ... and that's not the case with many who come for economic reasons and send money 'home.'

[bighart]

22. Got a quick break. Thanks for the replies.

I in no way equate the 2 in terms of severity but do completely agree with the sentiment that changing the term by which something is referred in no way lessens it's impact. I don't feel the need to intentionally offend people by using antagonistic terms just to make a point, but I also refuse to hide something behind flowery language just so I don't hurt someones feelings, ie prostitute vs. "sex worker". If someone has violated immigration law they are, in my opinion, here illegally calling them undocumented does not change that.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

24. Calling undocumented workers illegal aliens is like calling black people porchmonkies.

What's the matter, don't like exaggeration when it goes the other way?

[Lance_Boyle]

25. Bullshit. The legal term for those in the country without permission is "illegal alien."

Working or not, they are here illegally.

Your attempt to be cute with race-baiting is frankly despicable.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

26. The legal term?

I was under the impression that all racist euphemisms were legally.

"Working or not, they are here illegally. "

They broke a minor civil law which hurts nobody, is the moral equivalent of jay walking, and comparing them to drug dealers is racist slander.

[Lance_Boyle]

27. Ask an immigration lawyer, or read the law yourself.

A person in this country illegally is an illegal alien. Regardless of how that term may offend your delicate (non)sensibilities.

[lumberjack_jeff]

30. What is the legal term "alien" racist? n/t

[anigbrowl]

36. Can't say I've ever felt that way about it myself...

even though of of those descriptions has been applicable to me.

[EFerrari]

28. The right wing nuttery tries to criminalize undocumented workers all the time.

This is just more of that. I bet they don't call themselves by legal terms from administrative law.

[hunter]

33. I call some people racist assholes.

They are not assholes, but they smell just as bad.

This thread stinks.

[bighart]

37. are you calling me a racist?

[hunter]

38. Well, maybe you are just a nationalist. That's a slightly different flavor of inhumanity.

I don't remember telling my mom I wanted to be born in the United States of America. How about you?

The immigration problem would evaporate if we had strong labor unions, a high minimum wage, and vigorous enforcement of labor laws.

Corporations and individuals who hire undocumented workers always do so with the overt intention of abusing them by paying them substandard wages and/or subjecting them to otherwise intolerable and illegal working conditions.

[bighart]

39. because I say if you break the law you have done something

illegal I am a nationalist? Do you think that those you have crossed the border without permission, ie here illegals, and are working in the US are in fact having a net negative effect on the economy and on social services? What about the identity theft that accompanies this issue? You can call them "undocumented" and me a racist or nationalist if you choose, but the facts are that many of those you are "undocumented" purchase what they know are fraudulent papers to obtain work and social services and that is a crime as well. My wife's niece was lived with an "undocumented" immigrant for about 4 years and he and I discussed some of these various issues
repeatedly. He know what he was doing was against the law but had very little fear of being caught. I never called INS or local law enforcement on him but he ended up getting rounded up in a work place raid and deported. He and my wife's niece had split up a couple years before that so there were no family issues other than the son they had together whom he never came to see after they split anyway. He said he would be back but I don't know if he has ever returned.