There's some deep irony in the Spanish inquiry into bushco torture

[cali]

For decades Spain resolutely refused to look at its own ugly record of torture and murder under Franco. No one was ever tried for these crimes, or brought to account in any other way. And Franco's crimes extended far beyond and after the Civil War that ended in 1939.

In fact, it wasn't until 2008 that a Spanish Judge, Garzon, who is also the judge examining the bushco torture crimes, opened an inquiry into Franco era crimes. He shut down his inquiry within a month, under pressure from state prosecutors.

Now, I'm not opposed to Garzon's inquiry into bushco. I support it, but I don't have any particular respect for Garzon, who's also been incredibly harsh when it comes to the Basque, going so far as to shut down a Basque language newspaper with no known ties to ETA.

How would DUers react, I wonder, if the U.S. were to open a court of inquiry about torture committed by another state? My guess is that there would be howls of hypocrisy, etc. I'm not howling over Spain's hypocrisy, here- just pointing it's hard to escape it. Virtually everyone and every nation is guilty of it to some degree or another. I also want to point out that Spain recovered from out and fascism, torture and murder.

[DemoTex]

1. I'm surprised you did not mention Baltazar Garzón action of 10/10/1998.

On 10 October 1998 Judge Garzón issued an international warrant for the arrest of former Chilean president Augusto Pinochet over the alleged deaths and torture of Spanish citizens during his tenure; the Chilean Truth Commission (1990-91) report was the basis for the warrant, marking an unprecedented use of universal jurisdiction to attempt to try a former dictator for an international crime.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baltasar_Garz%C3%B3n

General Augusto Pinochet was indicted in 1998 by the Spanish magistrate Baltasar Garzón, arrested in London and finally released by the UK government in 2000. Authorized to freely return to Chile, he was there first indicted by the judge Juan Guzmán Tapia, and charged of a number of crimes, before dying on 10 December 2006, without having been convicted in any case. Pinochet's arrest in London made the front-page of newspapers worldwide as not only did it involve the head of the military dictatorship that ruled Chile from 1973 to 1990, but it was the first time that several European judges applied the principle of universal jurisdiction, declaring themselves competent to judge crimes committed by former head of states, despite local amnesty laws.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Augusto_Pinochet's_arrest_and_trial

Judge Garzón's record with the Basque notwithstanding and past Spanish iniquities aside, Garzón might be the last best hope for prosecuting Bu$hco that we have.

[cali]

2. I figured that most here know about Garzon and Pinochet

but I find it interesting that you brush off the lack of accountability in Spain re Franco era torture and murder.

What would your reaction be if the U.S. opened an inquiry into the torture practices of another country? Again, I'm supportive of what Garzon is doing because it suits my own desires, but I find the paradox quite interesting.

[DemoTex]

5. I do not "brush off" Spain's responsibilities for Franco-era iniquities ..

Judge Garzón's attempted investigation into Franco-era crimes was shut down by state prosecutors, just like they have tried to shut down his prosecution of Bush-era crimes. Garzón tried and Spain, which is culpable, thwarted him.

[cali]

7. he was not forced to drop it.

and my point here isn't really Garzon, but the fact that Spain never held its own accountable for serious crimes against humanity.

[DemoTex]

11. Well, we certainly agree on Spain's lack of accountability.

And in the great scheme of these things, Garzón is a mere beadle. But in the microcosm of 2009, and given the ephemeral nature of general public interest in these sorts of things, Garzón might possibly be the only shot at Bu$hco.

[izquierdista]

10. They have

You speak as though the U.S. hasn't already meddled into the affairs of a foreign state. What was all that indignation about "he gassed his own people!!" that Republicans were yelling 5 years ago?

It seems that in the future, torturers will have no where to hide; if they aren't prosecuted by their own country when they are found out, then other countries will pick up the slack.

[malaise]

3. So did Spain investigate Pinochet?

War crimes are war crimes and either countries sign treaties and abide by the rules or face the consequences

[cali]

6. what do you think about

Spain never holding its own responsible for torture and war crimes? After all, Franco died in 1975. Should Spain have investigated those responsible for torture and mass murder?

[shadowknows69]

4. There's some deep bullshit in us investigating ourselves for it

We should submit all suspects to The Hague and abide by the decision of a world court. Worked pretty well in dealing justice to the Nazis.

[endarkenment]

8. Nobody expects the Spanish Inquisition

[cali]

9. that's an inane response.

It has absolutely no bearing whatsofuckingever on anything I posted.

[endarkenment]

12. no. really?

I thought it was incredibly deep and highly relevant.