At the risk of flamewarring, who are we going to support in the 2012 primary?

[Taverner]

Since I think a lot of us are PISSED at Obama for support of DOMA

And unless he backpedals, they can expect no money, no votes and no support.

However, I'm still a Democrat. I'd like to see Dean run.

[960]

1. No one will challenge him in the primary.

[Taverner]

2. Shit, I will if no one else will

[billyoc]

28. Bring your checkbook. Obama will have $1 billion+

[960]

68. Total BS he'll be lucky to get half of what he got in 2008.

[billyoc]

80. As an incumbent President he'll get less than half?

Maybe if he goes on vacation for two or three YEARS.

:rofl:

[960]

124. Where will it come from? Do you think there is any excitement and all of those

"grassroots" people are going to pour in tons of small donations? I don't think so.

[donco6]

125. He won't need the small donations anymore.

He'll have insurance cos, mining interests, oil and coal, etc. etc.

He certainly doesn't care if he gets a dime from gays. Which he won't.

[billyoc]

132. Incumbents don't give a shit about grass roots. They have the support of the entire moneyed class.

[WeDidIt]

88. That's crazy talk

No way does he get anywhere less than 150% of what he got in 2008.

[mitchtv]

131. Good for him

He won't need my help

[movonne]

7. I guess that leaves the repugs...and we all know how that will turn

out...

[Blasphemer]

96. I hope that is not the case

While I would not expect a challenge to go anywhere, I abhor that our political system has become one of anointment. Even the sitting President should have to *really* earn his nomination. It should not be taken for granted. And even if any challengers have no chance of defeating him, it opens up the floor to discussions which we must have. It's bad enough that we are limited to a two party system.

[redqueen]

3. Wow.

[Taverner]

6. If Obama backpedals he gets my support

But did you read the paper the DOJ released? Not only did support the DOMA, it also did so for financial reasons - its pure homophobia.

[LooseWilly]

93. Yeah, used Michael Steele's argument.

It's mind bottling...

[camera obscura]

4. As pissed as I am, I will support Obama unless he decides not to run.

[sutz12]

5. I doubt there will be a challenge...

and I'll wait until at least 2011 before I even contemplate this "question."

[SacredCow]

8. Haven't thought that far ahead....

Except that I will not actively support a candidate that doesn't support unconditional civil rights. And I don't think I'm alone in that.

[Taverner]

11. You're not alone at all

[BuyingThyme]

9. Lynn Woolsey and Barbara Lee.

[rcrush]

10. I dont see how anyone else would do any better. Maybe Kucinich.

But they will all sell out eventually. Come 2013 we'll still be pissed off if someone else is in charge.

[Kitsune]

12. I almost posted this question.

My answer: Anyone but Obama, unless he shapes up in record time.

I'm getting to the point where I'm ashamed to have voted for him.

[hfojvt]

13. I am not gonna answer a hypothetical

Unless we are still at 10% unemployment, I doubt if Obama will have a serious challenger. Unless Gavin is old enough to run.

[onehandle]

14. I'm supporting either Newt or Palin so that Obama's win will be astronomical.

Oh, and go the Hell away.

[tritsofme]

15. Is the Kucinich 2012 movement inevitable?

I feel it is, especially at DU.

I doubt he will seriously consider the prospect, and quickly endorse the President's reelection.

[WI_DEM]

50. If it is he will once again come in fourth in the Ohio primary.

[angstlessk]

16. are you a 'ONE ISSUE' voter? like the right to lifers?

just askin? :shrug:

[Taverner]

17. No but support for DOMA is a deal breaker

Sorry

I will not vote for a homophobe

[redqueen]

21. Soooo... did you vote for Clinton in 06?

Just curious.

[Taverner]

24. No I voted for Obama

Supported him big time - manned phones, sent cash - the whole thing

When he said he was against DOMA (and he did, in 04 and 06) he had me on board

Little did I know he would cave at the first sign of trouble...

Granted - I will give him a chance. If he repudiates that report, pulls it or even backpedals - I'm cool like the Fonz

[LooseWilly]

95. Do you mean '96?

Cause I voted for Cthulu in '96...

[redqueen]

102. D'oh... yes.

What an unfortunate typo. :blush:

[LooseWilly]

116. Heh...

Makes you feel old, too... doesn't it? (I know it does me...)

[angstlessk]

22. well, that sounds like ONE ISSUE to me?

I agree that it should be done, and I believe Obama will do it eventually, but that IS one issue. That then allows the worst of the worst..the repukes...to take control and you know how THEY feel about gays.

[Taverner]

23. Then I'm one issue - I would have been one issue when Lincoln ran too then

Oh eventually slavery will just go away...

[SemiCharmedQuark]

25. Then you probably wouldn't have voted for Lincoln.

[Bluebear]

26. "eventually" - - oh brother

[Starry Messenger]

38. I guess

"Yes We Can...Eventually" lacked the same zing and took up too much space on the posters.

[Bluebear]

39. Much love to you.

Your posts bring me joy :)

[Starry Messenger]

41. =)

:hug: Least I can do on such a rotten day. Have you checked out Pam's House Blend yet? I'm reading over there right now.

[LostinVA]

74. lol

[angstlessk]

42. I am glad 'NEVER' sounds better to you cause if the GOP wins..that is the new timeline! n/t

[Bluebear]

52. Frankly, on GLBT issues, how would things be better under the GOP now?

The constant threats to gays and lesbians that Democrats are "at least better" than the GOP are getting tiresome.

[angstlessk]

56. then vote republican...no one is stopping you...go for it!

hell, abortion ain't your issue after all!

[Bluebear]

59. Yes, choice is certainly my issue. But don't tell me we are "at least better". We suck on progress.

[LostinVA]

76. That's political blackmail, and I'm fucking tired of being told that

EQUAL CIVIL RIGHTS isn't being "one issue." It's sickening to see you nd others on DU write that.

And, Bluebear is a huge advocate of women's rights.

I want the President to act like a Democratic leader and use his "bully pulpit" for gay rights. I want him to, at the very least, advocate for DADT and DOMA to be overturned and ENDA to be passed. Anything less than that means I will NOT vote Democratic. I will vote for a candidate and party that advocates and works for equal civil rights.

I will no longer lock my own shackles.

I'm sick of this talk on here. Especially after that disgusting brief comparing same sex marriage to INCEST.

[LostinVA]

77. That's political blackmail, and I'm fucking tired of being told that

EQUAL CIVIL RIGHTS isn't being "one issue." It's sickening to see you nd others on DU write that.

And, Bluebear is a huge advocate of women's rights.

I want the President to act like a Democratic leader and use his "bully pulpit" for gay rights. I want him to, at the very least, advocate for DADT and DOMA to be overturned and ENDA to be passed. Anything less than that means I will NOT vote Democratic. I will vote for a candidate and party that advocates and works for equal civil rights.

I will no longer lock my own shackles.

I'm sick of this talk on here. Especially after that disgusting brief comparing same sex marriage to INCEST.

[Rockholm]

81. It's one issue that effects MY life.

[NMMNG]

113. LGBT rights are hardly one issue

They may seem that way to you, but they are not. We have every right to withhold support from candidates who don't care about our rights, our families or our very lives.

[Sapphocrat]

117. Many issues sound like "one issue"...

...to those who do not understand that they are all the same issue.

Consider whether you would have been one of the few in the following thread who didn't understand the meaning of the OP -- and then tell me if you still think anything is "one issue":

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x4593703

[liquid diamond]

128. Don't bother. They do this shit every night.

[Deja Q]

31. Hey, I'm a one-issue voter too...

Of course, my issue is the economy - for which we ALL suffer if it goes kaput... unless there's proof of otherwise, of course, but there is no better national security than a sound economy. It's all intertwined but the economy is the key stone.

Of course, I'm starting business fundamentals next month - it's probable I'm the one living in fantasyland and that an unsound economy is so much better... oh well.

[SacredCow]

40. Comparing with "right to lifers" = apples and oranges....

Right to lifers want to control what goes on in OTHER people's lives. Great if they don't believe abortion is sometimes medically necessary- Make that decision for yourself.

GLBT people are fighting for civil rights that we should already have as citizens and taxpayers of this country.

BIG ol' honking difference.

[JVS]

43. Take your pick: the unending wars, gay marriage, looting corporations, entitlement "reform"

I'm aware that we're only a few months in, but I'm not really seeing many positive developments under this administration except for the fact that we don't have W still around making things much worse.

[LostinVA]

73. I think the OP never got this:

[Bluenorthwest]

90. Why don't you count the blatant lying as an issue

Obama got the votes from gay people by promising leadership and very clearly that he would work to end DOMA. He called it abhorrent.
He's not fulfilled his pledges regarding taxes on the elderly, he's overlooking huge crime in the previous administration, he's ramping up more war when we are broke, simply broke. How many issues is that so far? More than one, right?
And the very idea that you would equate basic human rights with any other issue reminds me of the folks who used to tell the Civil Rights marchers that there was a war in Viet Nam that simply had to be dealt with prior to their pet issues. I remember people calling those marchers 'selfish' in the face of the constant return of dead bodies.

[donco6]

126. Well, let's see -

Vote for someone who thinks my relationship is like an uncle fucking his niece . . .

or not voting at all.

I'm thinking B.

[TheKentuckian]

18. My guess is thatI'll be strongly supporting Obama

You guys can support Cantor or who ever if you like.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

19. You're going to give him your money, and your vote, and your support.

And you're going to like it.

[Name removed]

91. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[NMMNG]

115. Let me see

Give him my money?
Give him my vote?
Give him my support?

Didn't do it in 2008, I see no reason to do it in 2012.

Those strong-arm tactics didn't work before, why do you guys think they'll work now?

[cagesoulman]

20. STEVEN COLBERT~

FUCK YEAH!

[LooseWilly]

98. If he campaigns in that camouflaged suit, he's got my support!!

[Name removed]

27. Deleted sub-thread

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Renew Deal]

29. Are you drunk?

:beer:

[Taverner]

32. Nope stone cold sober

[depakid]

30. You might want to wait and see how all this plays out

before talking about 2012.

[Taverner]

34. Well yes, I will

[depakid]

45. Of course, as you may have read, I've not been pleased with this or other matters, either

but in this instance, I think we have the momentum- and the race is not always to the swift.

I'm giving Obama's DOJ about another year before I make up my mind as to what really going on there. Thus far, however- I'm thoroughly unimpressed. As are a LOT of other seasoned and experienced observers.

[redqueen]

85. But... you're *already* talking about 2012.

So... you didn't.

[loyalkydem]

33. I want Palin

to win so we can whip her ass in 2016

[Deja Q]

35. What's your take on Paul Wellstone?

(He was for the DOMA too...)

[fujiyama]

36. I seriously think he's going to come around

or be forced to come around on this in time. Hopefully with enough pressure, he'll convince the DOJ to drop its defense of it.

DOMA is a relic and will be repealed in time. Unfortunately it IS the law and will be, unless it's repealed by congress or struck down as unconstitutional by the Supreme Court

[timeforpeace]

37. If we are still in Afghanistan and Iraq,

I won't vote for him again. That's my issue(s). Innocent lives are being lost. Still. Even if the media doesn't report it anymore, it's happening.

[TornadoTN]

44. As much as I love and support Obama, the "bipartisan" bullshit we've seen lately..

Has really turned my support to lukewarm.

I know I'll vote for him in 2012 but I won't actively support him if this current trend continues. My vote will be to offset the radical right wing more so than it will be FOR Obama. This time last year, I didn't think I would ever hear myself say these words.

There's a lot of time between now and 2012 and I'm going to see how all of this shakes out. A lot of things can happen and I hope that we start seeing some fundamental changes in the administration. Playing bi-partisan with Republicans doesn't work - it never has and it never will.

[dmallind]

46. Real worlds never have serious primary challenges to sitting presidents these days. NT

[angstlessk]

47. WHY HASN'T BARNEY FRANK PRODUCED LEGISLATION TO QUASH DOMA?

anyone know?

[LostinVA]

78. Give me a FUCKING break

[Sapphocrat]

119. Now, now, LVA, follow the logic.

Gay rights are "one issue." Why should anyone but the Barney the Token Homosexual (and that, uh, whatshername, that Baldwin woman) take any interest in "one issue" that doesn't affect them personally?

Why, that would be like expecting a heterosexual -- say, Jerry Nadler -- to take an interest in same-sex immigration rights, when-- Oh, wait... he's been reintroducing PPIA/UAFA since 2000, hasn't he?

Well then, it would be like expecting a woman, who should really be sticking with all those womanly-type issues, like, I dunno, Anna Eshoo, to lead the charge on alternative energy, and-- Oh, wait, she did.

OK, then it would be like expecting John Conyers, who must be interested only in issues that affect African-Americans, to take a stand on torturing people who aren't even, you know, black, which-- Oh. Um...

I'll get back to you on this.

[NMMNG]

120. Seriously

If gays fight anti-gay legislation we're "one issue voters". If gays don't fight anti-gay legislation people ask why the fuck we're not fighting the anti-gay legislation. We just can't win!

[bluedawg12]

134. They don't want us to win .

That is clear.

[earth mom]

48. Gore/Kucinich 2012!

:woohoo:

[Sensible321]

58. I hope Kucinich wouldn't lower himself to that - VPs have no power and ...

... Gore is another corporate insider wearing a green mask. Kucinich, on the other hand, is at the top of my list. He would end the wars quickly; restore the Constitution as regards civil rights and privacy; end extraordinary rendition and allow those tortured to seek justice; and end corporate welfare / banksterism.

Obama has failed on all those fronts. So far, the 'energy plan' looks like more corporate giveaways - notice the absence of decentralized electric such as home-solar.

[WI_DEM]

49. Dean would never run against Obama who will be renominated without any trouble.

[Kaleva]

51. Obama

He'll probably run unopposed except for maybe a few opponents who wouldn't have a chance in hell running against a popular incumbent.

[montanto]

53. World ends in 2012. End of message.

[timeforpeace]

63. I saw a trailer of a good looking movie about that a few months ago.

Whatever happened? Has it been released yet? Think it was called 2012, had the oceans cresting over the Himalayas, the usual stuff.

[flvegan]

54. WetzelBill/Kurovsky of course!

[Hippo_Tron]

61. Yup, I was promised an important role in the Wetzelbill/Kurovski administration

[anonymous171]

55. I don't base my support on social issues, but Obama hasn't been to good on the economy either.

We shall see what happens over the next 4 years. Maybe Obama will suddenly become Kucinich or something. Who knows?

[DCKit]

57. 2010 and 2012 are the time to concentrate on Congressional elections.

It's time for a progressive Congress to set policy and make laws that benefit teh peoples over the corporations.

W* would have been impotent without a complicit Congress.

[WI_DEM]

60. I wonder why there wasn't as much controversy when Bill Clinton signed DOMA and initiated DADT?

[Mari333]

64. there was from me

and I opposed his flyovers in Iraq and opposed NAFTA too.

[Bluenorthwest]

92. You may have missed it due to no internet

And of course at the time these were both 'compromise' bills that 'prevented' far worse laws. So they were not out of the blue 'let's do this' things. Bill kind of tried to get military inclusion, the compromise was DADT. The GOP wanted an amendment to the Constitution defining marriage, DOMA was the compromise.
Also, Obama specifically pledged to lead the fight to end DOMA. Not to allow it, to lead it. Said he'd use his 'bully pulpit' if we helped him get it. He called DOMA abhorrent. He called himself a fierce advocate for GLBT rights. Not merely an advocate, but a fierce advocate. He presented himself falsely and that is part of why he is not getting the typical 'politician benefit of the doubt'. He said he was not like the others.

[angstlessk]

62. i still have my eye teeth, and would give them both for the following:

1. Set the work week at 30 hours so we would have fuller employment
2. Set the minimum wage at a livable wage...
3. Pass the equal pay amendment
4. Pass the Brady Law...automatic & semi-automatic weapons...illegal (sic)
5. Universal health care..SINGLE PAYER!
6. Help for people being forced from their houses due to foreclosure
7. Help for small business in attaining loans
8. AD INFINITUM...

There are many things that a progressive wants to see done, now that we have a Democratic president...but guess what....we all suffer because of the reight wing!..they have moved the country so far right there is no left left! Just here on DU!

[Name removed]

79. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Name removed]

82. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Name removed]

83. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Name removed]

84. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Sensible321]

114. I'm with you on all that except ...

... the Brady Law. Automatic weapons are already illegal, as they should be. Semi-autos can be used for defense in the home.

Lets add to the list the other issues Obama has thrown under the bus:

1. Ending the War in Iraq
2. Accountability to Banksters / Wall Street
3. Ending Government Spying Without Warrants
4. Justice to People Who Were Tortured

With regard to the 'reight wing', with Wall Street, Banksters, Defense Contractors and their DNC cronies running the show, what is the difference? Gays were thrown under the bus today - the differing issue left seems to be abortion. Ironically, many in the 'reight' never actually wanted to overturn that anyway - from their racist perspective, it prevented many brown people from being born. The purpose, circa 1980, was to split the Catholic vote and get the evangelicals to vote RNC en-masse - worked like a charm. (I support safe, legal abortion from a civil-rights perspective, BTW)

[solstice]

65. I doubt there will be anybody to vote for in 2012 - Obama will probably have

declared martial law by then, he is so intent on out Bushi-ing Bush.

[SemiCharmedQuark]

67. Obama will have declared martial law...

[Mari333]

66. you can always write someone in

Its kind of sad..my brother, who voted for Bush, became disenchanted with the GOP after 7 yrs...he finally woke up..he said he would check out Obama, but is disillusioned now, and intends to campaign for Ron Paul. He said Obama is behaving too much like Bush.
so if Obama was trying to appeal to the right to get re elected, he picked the wrong strategy . My brother calls him Obushma.

[Taverner]

69. If anything I might sit the next one out

[Mari333]

70. I may also do that

unless some huge turnaround occurs..and I mean huge. huge. so far its one disappointment after the other.

[Taverner]

71. I'm pretty easy to please too - say, 2012 the Iraq war is over and we're out

That would be good enough for me

But so far - we have had a lot of talk, not any action - and when we do have action, its usually a mistake

[Mari333]

75. Im going a step further

out of Iraq and Afghanistan, support of gay marriage...DOMA and DADT repealed..if he does that I might give him a chance again..otherwise no go from me.

[JustABozoOnThisBus]

72. Sarah Palin

Obama's a lock for the Democratic ticket, so let's go mess with the Republicans.

Say - Rah!
Say - Rah!
Say - Rah!
Say - Rah!
Say - Rah!

[RedCappedBandit]

86. I'll suport Kucinich again!

If he runs. :|


Otherwise.. more of the same.

[redqueen]

87. Unless he leaves the party, he won't run.

Unlike so many here, he's a loyal Dem.

[LostinVA]

94. OMFG -- you don't stay married if your spouse won't stop beating you

[redqueen]

100. I guess Kucinich doesn't see the situation as so black and white.

He somehow got through the Clinton years, when DOMA was passed (among all the other insults), and is still a Dem.

Many Dems who support gay marriage won't decide today to start talking about primary challengers, despite the indefensible motion. I don't think that means they enjoy being abused.

[RedCappedBandit]

105. Your meaningless personal attack aside,

one can dream.

[redqueen]

106. How the hell is that a personal attack?

The people here who aren't loyal dems are fucking *proud* of it!

It's not a crime you know. Hell our best Senator isn't a loyal Dem for fuck's sake.

Jaysus.

[RedCappedBandit]

108. The intent behind the words, obviously. n/t

[Individualist]

99. As will I

[KoKo]

111. Truly....it would be the best thing for "Honor." We've

sort of been taken too many times. Sometimes those "underdogs" just might have "THE RIGHT STUFF."

[WeDidIt]

89. The DOJ supported DOMA, not Obama

The president isn't supposed to interfere with the inner workings of the DOJ.

You expect Obama to act like Bush.

[HughMoran]

97. Laughing my fucking ass off

:rofl:

The election is more than 3 years away!!!!


Holy fuckin' shit, take a chill-pill!!

[redqueen]

101. It is insensitive to laugh ...

but yeah.

[Individualist]

104. Laugh all you want. Time will tell who laughs last.

[LooseWilly]

103. With the right candidate, I think the Repubs could take California over this...

I don't know about others, but if the Repubs put forth a candidate that seemed legitimately pro GLBT equality, that candidate might be able to peel off enough pissed off GLBT supporters, which, in addition to the usual Republican support... they might be able to peel California from the Democrats.

Just a theory, but at this point I think it would serve the Democrats right... accountability for taking a chunk of the "base" for granted.

Without the "right" candidate though... I'll be voting for Cthulu. Once again, I'm sick of the "lesser evil".

Or, maybe Nader will run again. What the hell? If my interests are going to be ignored anyway... why not vote for an asshat (again)?

[Skip Intro]

107. Hillary!

C'mon, somebody had to do that. And as much as I love the lady, she won't be running against Obama in 12.

Seriously, tho. I think your post points out the difference between real change and talk. And what viable choices we have to effect that real change. (Also, what "change" we are talking about should be defined and discussed, rather than remain some vague, blurry shiny thing dangled before us as little more than a slogan).

What I am afraid of, and almost unwilling to acknowledge is that we seem to be faced with two sides of the same party. More and more it seems to be one big machine. As if McDonalds secretly owned Hardees and Wendys, and there was only the illusion of choice.

I wish, wish we really had a viable third party in this country. More than one even. Then again, I wish honesty and information were the blood of our political system, rather than double-talk and marketing.

*heavy sigh*

[RubyDuby in GA]

109. Anyone stop to think that maybe the President is maneuvering on this issue?

If he comes in guns blazing on an issue that is this red hot with a majority of Americans and immediately shoves "values" positions down the country's throat, 1) he's no better than Bush and 2) he'll just give the anti-civil/gay rights nutjobs more ammo. Remember, this past election the Dems did manage to slice away a significant portion of the Christian/evangelical vote.

If he's seen as a bully, it will backfire. If he's seen as someone trying to follow the laws that Congress enacts, but there is a huge groundswell for getting rid of these asininely ridiculous laws that regulate people to second class citizenship, then he forces Congress' hand and makes them do what they should be doing already.

This man isn't stupid. He's a chess player. It sucks being the pawn for the time being, but if it means you ultimately win, then look what will have been accomplished by popular demand of the people of this country.

[Individualist]

112. Yeah! Chess game...and ponies...and, and better than McCain.

[donco6]

127. 3D Chess! Blindfolded!

And heavens, we can't lose the RW voters!

[bluedawg12]

133. Incrementalist 3D Chess! Blindfolded.

The most disingenuous line of the brief, at p. 32:
"DOMA does not discriminate against homosexuals in the provision of federal benefits."

[KoKo]

110. No One...that I can see at this point....

It will take awhile to sort out the next "Bright Light."

[Neecy]

118. at this rate, I'm sitting it out

I won't give Obama money, won't volunteer, won't lift a finger. Fool me once...

[bluestateguy]

121. . Uh huh

http://www.popularcookierecipes.com/Chocolatechip.html

• 3/4 cup sugar
• 3/4 cup packed brown sugar
• 1 cup butter, softened
• 2 large eggs,beaten
• 1 teaspoon vanilla extract
• 2 1/4 cups all-purpose flour
• 1 teaspoon baking soda
• 3/4 teaspoon salt
• 2 cups semisweet chocolate chips
• if desired, 1 cup chopped pecans, or chopped walnuts

Preheat oven to 375 degrees. Mix sugar, brown sugar, butter, vanilla and eggs in a large bowl by hand. Stir in flour, baking soda, and salt. The dough will be very stiff.

You can even use a Kitchen Aid mixer for this first step. I use the batter attachment and mix on a lower setting. Just be sure that the dough is well mixed before moving on.

Stir in chocolate chips by hand. You'll need to use a sturdy wooden spoon for this and a bit of muscle. You can add the pecans, or other nuts, at this time if desired. Keep stirring and folding the chocolate chips and nuts into the dough until they are evenly dispersed. (This makes sure you have enough chocolate in each cookie!!)

Drop dough by rounded tablespoonfuls 2 inches apart onto ungreased cookie sheet. The chocolate chip cookies need to be this far apart because the dough spreads during cooking. No one wants to cut the cookies apart after baking.

Bake 8 to 10 minutes or until light brown. You may even think that the chocolate chip cookies are underdone, but they will finish cooking through out of the oven. If you leave them in too long, the cookies will be tough or crispy. (My kids eat them anyway. I always over cook at least one sheet because of the phone, a child wanting some attention or some other reason)
The centers will be soft. Let cool completely then remove from cookie sheet. I use a flat spatula to remove the cookies from the sheet. It helps to get them off quickly. If you try to remove the cookies while they are still warm, the chocolate chips are still very soft and this can cause a very big mess as well as messy looking cookies.

[burning rain]

122. Obama's going to sail right through the 2012 primaries, as easily as Clinton did in 1996..

Remember who stood against Clinton in the Democratic proimaries that year? I sure don't! Oh wait... it was Samantha Cypher and Arnie Asterisk!

I abhor the administration's refusal thus far to make headway on gay equality issues but still have no truck with the idea of sitting out the 2012 election or voting third party when (not "if") Obama's renominated. We had that all out in 2000 with Nader / Gore / Bush, and boy did we reap the whirlwind. Among other things, for years to come we'll have to live with Bush's fascist Supreme Court picks, Alito and Roberts. Gore would have given us decent, humane justices.

[slipslidingaway]

123. Let's see who the media pushes. n/t

[Sebastian Doyle]

129. I'm pissed about DOMA, but healthcare is the true dealbreaker for me

If we get RomneyHillaryCare, or the Conrad Co-op, or anything BUT a viable public option (at the very fucking least) then the Democratic party will prove that it is just as useless now as it was in 2002, and that it was only Howard Dean who gave it a brief resurrection in between then and the last election.

DOMA can always be raised as an issue anytime. But once an illusion of health care reform is allowed to stand, there will NEVER again be an opportunity for the real thing.

So repeal DOMA and DADT? Absolutely. But it's health care that's the real line in the sand. Fuck that one up and this party's done for good.

[mitchtv]

130. Don't worry, he'll let us down on Healthcare too

mark my words