Democratic Underground Latest Greatest Lobby Journals Search Options Help Login
Google

Why have we not gotten Osama Bin Laden??

Printer-friendly format Printer-friendly format
Printer-friendly format Email this thread to a friend
Printer-friendly format Bookmark this thread
This topic is archived.
Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion (1/22-2007 thru 12/14/2010) Donate to DU
 
samrock Donating Member (501 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-09-09 09:45 AM
Original message
Why have we not gotten Osama Bin Laden??

Sooo he is in Pakistan.. his thumbs in his ears.. his toungue out saying ... Naa Naa Naaa you can't get me!! Why can't we tell Pakistan.. sorry.. excuse us but we HAVE to go into your country to get the man responsible for the worst attack on us since Pearl Harbor.. I mean if in May of 1945 Hitler had gotten into Swizterland.. and the Swiss could not or would not get him would the world snap ther fingers and say DAMN!!! We almost got ya Adolph!!.. Don't ya DARE step out of there or we will get ya..
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
trumad Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-09-09 09:47 AM
Response to Original message
1. Because he's been dead for years...
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
get the red out Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-09-09 09:48 AM
Response to Reply #1
4. +1
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
joeycola Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-09-09 09:55 AM
Response to Reply #1
7. I have thought that for a long time now.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
OmmmSweetOmmm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-09-09 10:02 AM
Response to Reply #1
9. +1000
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
lamp_shade Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-09-09 09:47 AM
Response to Original message
2. He's in a freezer in Dick Cheney's basement.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
madokie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-09-09 09:47 AM
Response to Original message
3. Are we for sure that he is the one behind 911
I'm not so sure myself. I think there is a good chance that that our very own vp may have had a hand in this.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
bigjohn16 Donating Member (747 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-09-09 09:48 AM
Response to Original message
5. Because he died in a cave years ago.
But he's still needed so we can spend piles of cash on the military while fighting over pocket change for health care. We'll still be looking for an "Osama" 100 years from now.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Buzz Clik Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-09-09 09:55 AM
Response to Original message
6. He was Bush's bogeyman, used to conjur fear.
He's now old and irrelevant. I can't see marching into Pakistan and initiating a door-to-door search. That sounds uncomfortably like something Bush would have suggested.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Mist Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-09-09 10:01 AM
Response to Original message
8. 1. He was a CIA asset. 2. He's been dead for a while. nt
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
samrock Donating Member (501 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-09-09 10:06 AM
Response to Original message
10. ok ok ok... IF he IS dead..
I can understand while Al Queda/the Taliban want to keep the story going that he is still alive going.. and I can understand while the right wing wants to do the same.. BUT I would think it would be in Obama's interest to PROVE he is dead.. ( if he is).. IF he can prove he is dead it would be a HUGE boost for him..
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
MadHound Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-09-09 10:09 AM
Response to Reply #10
12. Why would it be in Obama's best interest? He can keep his war expanding in South Central Asia
While ramming through that pipeline(s) and thus keep his masters in the military industrial complex happy. A dead bin Laden means no excuse for this war of empire:shrug:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
samrock Donating Member (501 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-09-09 10:12 AM
Response to Reply #12
14. Sigh,,..
ok call me naive.. but I do NOT think Obama is in the hands the military industrial complex.. and is conspiring to keep wars going for the profits of arms manufacturers.. Do many here really believe that!?!?!?!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
MadHound Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-09-09 10:32 AM
Response to Reply #14
19. Exhibit 1: Vietnam
No good reason to be there, but hey, we were planted in that country to one extent or another for almost twenty years.

Exhibit 2: Iraq, again, no good reason to be there, but it's now been almost eighteen years that we've been conducting military operations in Iraq with no end in sight.

Do I really need to go on or do you get the picture?

Eisenhower didn't issue his warning against the MI complex just for shits and grins, he knew full well the power of the MI complex, the big power behind the throne. Every president since then has had to deal with that power and quite frankly be at it's beck and call. This isn't some wild conspiracy theory, this is reality. Why do you think that we haven't ever seen that "peace dividend" that we were all looking forward to after the end of the Cold War? Why do you think that we now go from one "war" to another, Cold War, Drug War, War on Terror? Why do we spend twenty eight times more money on our military than the next thirty nations on the list combined, even in times of peace?

You can think that Obama isn't in the hands of the MI complex, but as you say, with Osama dead, why are we in Afghanistan? Why are we still in Iraq? Oh, and why will we still have a military presence in both countries when Obama comes up for reelection? Think about it.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
samrock Donating Member (501 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-09-09 10:47 AM
Response to Reply #19
21. Afghanistan is different..

Neither Vietnam or Iraq were used as a base to attack us!.. I agree we should not have gone into either of those 2 countries.. But Afghanistan was used as a base to train and launch attacks on us.. and if we just leave it will be used again.. we have no choice we HAVE to be there.. i do not want to be there.. but I did not want to see the twin towers come down either..
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
MadHound Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-09-09 03:18 PM
Response to Reply #21
23. Let's see
An Arab was originally using Sudan to train his forces until we forced him out of there. Then he used Afghanistan to stage his attack, which involved zero (0) Afghanis. Now that particular person, bin Laden, is dead, so he can no longer launch attacks.

So why are we in Afghanistan again?

To say that it could possibly be used to launch an attack on us isn't good enough. Any country in this world can be used to launch an attack on us. The soda bottle bombers were from England, if their attack had succeeded do you think we should have gone and blown the British to hell and gone like we're doing in Afghanistan?

And to try and claim that we're somehow either stabilizing the region, or making it save from terrorists, or any other such claptrap nonsense is just bogus bullshit. Every attack that we undertake there creates more people who are desperately pissed at the US. Every bomb we drop, every missile that we launch, every bullet that we fire simply means that much less stability in the region. We have, and are, creating our own perpetual hell over there, much like we did in Vietnam. But hey, the makers of bullets, bombs, missiles and other military gear are enjoying healthy, if not record profits, all the while people are dying and entire regions will be laid to waste.

What will success look like in, what will victory look like in Afghanistan? Even the highest of high ups can't say that. Petraeus himself has said that we will never be able to use the word "victory" in conjunction with Afghanistan.

We have made the same mistake time and again, this time in Afghanistan. We have brought our military into what is, essentially, a war of ideas. When you do that, you automatically lose. Read an old, but classic book on this, "The Ugly American." Also look at what we've done in Afghanistan recently. Last December there was a large earthquake along the Afghanistan-Pakistan border region that left thousands out in the cold without shelter or food. We could have immediately started dropping aid packages, sending in convoys, all stamped with that big fat MADE IN USA brand. Instead, we sat back and got beaten to the punch by the local terrorist groups who sent in their own convoys and aid packages. So who gets the better publicity, yeah, the terrorists.

You don't win a war of ideas using bombs and bullets, we've seen that doesn't work time and again. You win a war of ideas by presenting the better alternative. You send in you NGO's, you send in aid, you work with the locals, you help the people and create an air of good feeling about your country so that the next time somebody like bin Laden comes in the people will tell you of his coming while simultaneously not giving him aid because they don't want to bite the hand that feeds him. The trouble with this course of action, at least in some quarters, is that it is vastly cheaper to carry on the war of ideas than it is to bring in the military. Giving aid to the locals, bringing in NGO's, etc. doesn't make a buck for the MI complex. And that's the rub, the MI complex has a stranglehold on this government and this country, and until we break that hold, we're going to continue to destroy our own country while blowing others to hell and gone for no good reason.

Something else for you to think about in terms of what a little aid can do. Bin Laden himself has said that after the mujahideen had put their lives on the line, after the Afghani people had seen their country blown to hell and gone during the proxy war they fought for us against Russia, the Afghani people deserved some payback for what they did. They defeated the Russians and had suffered horribly for it, and thought that they deserved a nice aid package to start rebuilding as a show of gratitude. But the US didn't send that aid, instead we turned our backs on them, and that it was this act of ingratitude that set bin Laden down the path towards 911. Hmm, a few tens of millions of dollars twenty years ago and we would have scored a big win in the War of Ideas, oh, and prevented 911 and not be in Afghanistan now.

The MI complex has a stranglehold on this country, and it's been that way since the end of WWII. The "Merchants of Death" had seen what a wonderful new money stream they had during WWI, but after that ended couldn't figure out how to make that stream continue to flow, and had to deal with some serious backlash from the US population. WWII was a different matter, since the Soviet Union provided a ready made target, thus we launched into the Cold War, and the arms race began. After the Cold War, there was the War on Drugs and now the War on Terror. How does one win a war on nouns? Anyway, the point of the matter is the MI Complex has successfully insinuated itself throughout government to such an extent that virtually everybody and every agency puts the priorities of the MI complex first, and everything else, including health care, the environment, education, the very welfare of the people comes in a distant second. You can't conceive of Obama being part of this? I hate to disappoint you, but he's been bought and paid for too. And woe be to those who try and buck the MI complex. Funny, how Kennedy was shot just after he issued NSAM 263 and the rough draft of NSAM 273, before these two memos could be put into effect. These two memos would have ended our involvement in Vietnam by 1965 at the latest. Funny how one of Johnson's first actions was to tear up those orders, and instead accelerate the war. Ever since then, it seems as though whenever the MI complex has said "Jump" the government merely asks "How High?"

If you don't see this at work here and now, then you need to wake up. Just because our current president talks a good game, just because he is affable and charismatic doesn't mean that he isn't in the same grasp of the MI complex as all the rest. He has double down in Afghanistan, and while he has drawn down in Iraq, he hasn't, and won't completely withdraw from Iraq. What will it take for you to wake up and smell the roses? The complete draining of our treasury, with no end in sight? That's where we're at right now. Wake up, stop being a pawn, a dupe, a tool. There is no reason for the US to be militarily engaged in Afghanistan, and the longer we stay there, the worse we make matters, both for the Afghan people and for ourselves.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
SammyWinstonJack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-09-09 10:13 AM
Response to Reply #12
16. The 'Good' war. Great for war profiteers/campaign donors and the MIC.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
tiny elvis Donating Member (619 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-09-09 10:13 AM
Response to Reply #10
15. how many would you kill to prove you didn't need to kill them?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
tiny elvis Donating Member (619 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-09-09 10:08 AM
Response to Original message
11. because you have not sucked dick cheney's balls hard enough
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Romulox Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-09-09 10:10 AM
Response to Original message
13. We'd have to call off two very profitable wars if we found him. nt
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Soylent Brice Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-09-09 10:15 AM
Response to Original message
17. it's not economically viable.


Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Golden Raisin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-09-09 10:25 AM
Response to Original message
18. Ask McCain.
All during the campaign he kept saying he, "Knew how to find and capture Osama bin laden."
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Tierra_y_Libertad Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-09-09 10:37 AM
Response to Original message
20. He's far too valuable as a live bogeyman for politicians and generals to threaten us with.
Or, at least, allegedly alive.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
OffWithTheirHeads Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-09-09 10:49 AM
Response to Original message
22. Because he is now the President of the U.S.
Haven't you been paying attention?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
DU AdBot (1000+ posts) Click to send private message to this author Click to view 
this author's profile Click to add 
this author to your buddy list Click to add 
this author to your Ignore list Tue Apr 30th 2024, 06:36 PM
Response to Original message
Advertisements [?]
 Top

Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion (1/22-2007 thru 12/14/2010) Donate to DU

Powered by DCForum+ Version 1.1 Copyright 1997-2002 DCScripts.com
Software has been extensively modified by the DU administrators


Important Notices: By participating on this discussion board, visitors agree to abide by the rules outlined on our Rules page. Messages posted on the Democratic Underground Discussion Forums are the opinions of the individuals who post them, and do not necessarily represent the opinions of Democratic Underground, LLC.

Home  |  Discussion Forums  |  Journals |  Store  |  Donate

About DU  |  Contact Us  |  Privacy Policy

Got a message for Democratic Underground? Click here to send us a message.

© 2001 - 2011 Democratic Underground, LLC