Why do some DUers automatically hold strong opinions on situations they know almost nothing about?

[jpgray]

I'm thinking of the Baldwin case, several criminal trials discussed here, etc. In all instances, there is this bizarre cadre of emotional hand-wringers who -know- the truth, -know- the motivations of those involved, -know- where all the blame should fall, and -know- who the innocent and guilty parties are. Since when are DUers so talented at arriving at absolute judgment of people based on a snippet of a whisp of an article that contains none of the information to even barely validate -one- of the obsessive beliefs they hold so fiercely? Is it some sort of victim identification thing, wherein the accusation or the circumstances elicit an emotional response that obviates all need for facts to back up one's views? This phenomenon is really bumming me out lately, especially seeing it on an ostensibly progressive website. Why are some so eager to arrive at absolute judgment of people in situations we know next to nothing about?

[emanymton]

1. Question Your Basic Assumption ...

Is by any chance your source for this comment, "Some Say News Network?"

When did I express my "strong opinions on situations they know almost nothing about?"

When did I make this, "at absolute judgment of people based on a snippet of a whisp of an article that contains none of the information to even barely validate -one- of the obsessive beliefs they hold so fiercely?"

May I suggest one be more careful when one is painting with such a big brush?

[xchrom]

2. lol -- i think of it as exhibitionism.

they have righteous outrage and the internet provides the opportunity to expose it.

[NoodleBoy]

3. I don't really believe in that whole projection thing

it's probably just in-group competition to appear to be the most insightful, radical, partisan reply in the thread. I was just looking at an article, and a Republican woman was repeatedly called a bitch, probably by the same people who decried Don Imus for being a mysoginstic racist.

[T_i_B]

4. Because this is DemocraticUnderground.com

It's just not DU for the GD forum not to be full of drama queens being outraged over something silly.

[ms liberty]

22. ...

:rofl:

[MethuenProgressive]

5. That's a strong opinion - how much do you know about this?

:boring:

[jpgray]

29. Take the Baldwin case (please!)

We have side one, which -knows- that Baldwin is a good father who was heartbroken and honestly if angrily expressed himself. Then we have side two, which -knows- that Baldwin is an abuser, a narcissist, threatened his daughter with physical violence, doesn't love his daughter, etc., etc.

Now, based on one voicemail message, how does anyone know either of those two things? They simply can't. I'm not asking for people not to have opinions, I just wish they'd tone down the volume or the ridiculous claims of "certainty" that seem to be far to prevalent on DU.

[elocs]

6. Because opinions are like assholes, everybody has one.

DUers are pretty much the same as everyone in this respect and need no facts to express an opinion.
Hearing about something automatically gives a license to give an opinion, your "expert" opinion.
Add to this the need to frequently start a new thread without anything new to say. Also, the ever popular beating a dead horse and then continuing to beat it over and over and over again. It's dead already!

Let me add that "some" people and posters do that--a pretty safe assumption since "some" probably do almost anything. I'd hate to be accused of painting with a broad brush.

[C_U_L8R]

7. some say that straw dogs don't hunt

[Bucky]

8. That's because Harvard-educated vegetarian elitists LIKE YOU are secret DLC infiltrators at DU

I'm certain in my opinion in this matter, and don't you dare try and dissuade me with any of your so called facts.
I"M SERIES!!1!

[dorkulon]

9. It's called intellectual dishonesty; we are not immune. (nt)

[rasputin1952]

10. Well, for one thing, not too many parents talk to 11-12 yo

children like that, and if they do, they are assholes.

Not being able to control yourself, to some extent, as a parent, and to have the audacity tomake a phone call like that is pretty poor behavior by anyones stazndards.

I for one don't really care what Baldwin had to say, but if he were going to face the chile "on the 20th", he could have held back on the rhetoric and the what seems to be hatred.

FWIW, these people have an overblown sense of self worth, he will find out that he is little morre that a shell filled with crap, and that will begin the spiral into oblivion, something he is probably terrifeid of. If I were to walk in on one of his triades,, I'd call it like I see it, and just call him azn asshole.

[salin]

11. conditioned outrage?

After all of these years of bushco, I think many are really predisposed/conditioned to outrage.

*when in doubt - blame it all on bushco!*

[ScreamingMeemie]

12. All I ever posted on the subject is that I think name calling of one's

children is wrong. I in no way passed judgement on either Mr. Baldwin's or Ms. Basinger's parenting abilities. This is an opinion board. I posted my opinion...and that's really all there is to it.

[Marie26]

13. You've described

pretty much every DU thread. Let's face it, if we weren't a bunch of opinionated know-it-alls, we wouldn't be here. :)

[patricia92243]

14. Bingo!!! That sure describes me. I admit it - some don't - but it is still the truth!

[Marie26]

21. Yep.

The first step is acceptance. :) I am willing to bet, that should you perform a search, you would find that the people on this thread who are so upset about judgmental, dramatic posts have done plenty of that themselves. Opinionated people tend to express strong opinions? On a discussion board? You're kidding!

[Skidmore]

15. Sometimes you just recognize ugly when you see it, and

are not obligated to condone it out of group loyalty either.

[Redbear]

16. Indeed.

I was able to avoid most of the Baldwin stuff, but I am concerned about our general trend toward knee-jerk judgementalism.

[WinkyDink]

17. Because we can?

[MonkeyFunk]

18. Because it's considered weak

NOT to have a strong opinion, or to KNOW the answer to every problem, no matter how complex.

Saying "I don't know" seems anathema here.

[porphyrian]

19. Does it really bother you that much?

Most people are instantly judgmental.

[melody]

20. Because ignorance and loudness seem to go hand in hand

Nutjobs will have angry, contentious, passionate arguments about stuff they've never studied in their lives because
ignorant people spark first off their emotions without any reductive interference. When you point out to them that
they haven't followed any rational thought process to come to their perspective and thus can't "know" what they "know",
they will start pounding their chests and bellowing like a silverback gorilla.

[omega minimo]

23. And why do some repeat Limbaugh's Blame The Victim propaganda on an "ostensibly progressive website"

[jpgray]

28. Asking for facts to back up an absolutist opinion is hardly Limbaugh-esque

In fact, it's the exact opposite.

[SmokingJacket]

24. It's not just DUers -- it's people.

And it also just has something to do with the fact that what we say here doesn't really matter -- we're anonymous, and can state our unproven suspicions as fact without any consequences, purely for entertainment value.

[trumad]

25. Well geez... imagine if we didn't speculate???

[leftofthedial]

26. you're right. only bona fide experts should have opinions

so why don't we all just shut up and watch Fox? They have lots of experts.

[SoCalDem]

27. People often have opinions..and sometimes there are many different ones

People always see news stories through a personal filter, based on stuff that's happened in their own lives.. and also, there are many sources of news, all of which may spin a story in a different way.

That's why I stay away from many threads..

[Catherine Vincent]

30. Because we can?

:shrug:

[jpgray]

32. You have a perfect right to! I'm just wondering if it adds to contentiousness here

And adds to the phenomenon wherein one "hot-button" issue takes over an entire forum with very similar threads.

[mudesi]

31. People having opinions without facts? On an internet message board?

Welcome to reality!

[Madspirit]

33. You're

You're pretty good at making assumptions yourself.

I don't think anyone here said Baldwin deserved to be executed or anything. We said that snippet of him going off on his daughter was verbally abusive. It was. His foul and abusive temper is well-known. I have friends in "The Biz" who have worked with him and found him to be insufferable, hot-tempered and unpleasant. All we needed to know, of his tirade, to know it was wrong, was his tirade. I don't need any other information to judge that particular behavior.
Lee

[jpgray]

35. I guess I just find this rush to judgment extremely tacky and board-clogging

And you can't judge someone from a single statement like that--how many parents of DUers would look like good parents if some of the more hurtful things they said were disseminated throughout the internet? How many imperfect but good parents say hurtful things they regret later? I just don't see how people can be so sure about themselves based on a single point of evidence.

[Madspirit]

36. As I said

I have friends who have worked with him. They don't like his wife much better but his temper is well-known. I hate red-faced blustery-assed, bullying men in children's faces. You only have to know ONE statement to judge the ONE statement.
Lee

[jpgray]

37. People aren't judging "one statement." They're judging Baldwin, his daughter, Basinger, etc.

Why are you so sure that this is a case of a red-faced, blustery-assed, bullying man? Do you know whether or not Baldwin loves his daugther? Do you know how Baldwin's daughter behaves? Do you know the specifics of the relationship of Baldwin, Basinger, and Ireland? No. So why do you feel so comfortable judging all three?

[Madspirit]

39. One Thing I Do Know

The daughter is THE child, in the situation. Unfortunately, neither of the adults in the situation, seem to "get" that.

...and a man who is blustery, red-faced, in-your-face with people they work with are usually that way in general. I do know psychology.
Lee

[jpgray]

40. So, knowing psychology, you feel free to diagnose this man based on a single quote

And a few anecdotal bits of hearsay. Are you Bill Frist?

[Madspirit]

42. Do You Only Read One or Two Words?

I said I have a close friend who has worked with him.

I said it would be very very rare for someone to be an asshole with people he works with and a sweetie pie elsewhere and I said I judged his statement.

Now make up something else I didn't say.
Lee

[jpgray]

43. I just don't see how one anecdotal experience gives anyone more right to judge someone

Maybe we have different definitions of anecdotal experience?

[Madspirit]

48. It wasn't HIS voice on the tape? n/t

[jpgray]

51. No, but neither you nor your friend have enough evidence to judge it

Unless your friend was personally involved in his relationship with his wife and daughter, know the dynamics of that relationship, etc. I have a hard time seeing how you can just "know" what's going on, and make diagnoses and judgments based on a near-total lack of important information.

[SaveOurDemocracy]

46. Is that like ..."some people say..."?

How do we know your 'close friend' is accurate and doesn't have an agenda or a personal grudge? Different people, different experiences, different perceptions.

[Madspirit]

47. My Friend

Has more integrity than almost anyone I know. She is in the UK and is a production coordinator. You can see her name roll by in the credits at the end of the new Casino Royale...Waking Ned Divine, etc. She has been my friend for over 10 years. She almost ALWAYS loves the stars. You should hear her rave about people like Judi Densch. She could get in trouble for saying these things. You are only supposed to kiss the star's asses, so she told me these things privately, thus my not mentioning her name. I have a really long interview with HER...my friend...from a UK paper. If you want to read it, PM me. She's real and she's a close friend and she has more integrity than all the abuse defenders on this board put together.

I, along with many others, find people defending the verbal abuse of children really disheartening.
Lee

[jpgray]

49. So I am now defending verbal abuse? When all I advocate is evidence before judgment?

Nice.

[Madspirit]

54. We heard evidence.

So you just think, out of the blue, this warm fuzzy man went off on his daughter. There is a reason she doesn't want to see him. THAT speaks volumes, in itself.

Now blame wife...snort...while saying not to judge.

I never said Alec Baldwin should be executed. I appreciate his work on the left. I wish him and his family well. I think an anger management class and some parenting classes would be a good thing for him to consider. It couldn't hurt anyone. I think his heart is in the right place. I think divorce can make the nicest people act like big assholes. We have two friends, who had twins and then got divorced and they both turned into people we didn't even recognize. I wish people could be civil...FOR THE KID'S SAKE...when they decide they no longer want to be together. Divorce doesn't HAVE to be down and dirty.

I have great hope for Alec. He can turn this around.
Lee

[Lex]

34. 1. It's an internet messageboard. 2. They are opinions. 3. Discussions welcome here.

4. Rinse and repeat.

[Dr Fate]

38. Those coveted swing-voters & "moderates" do the exact same thing.

It's not just DUers- it's everyone.

[TahitiNut]

41. We have lots of graduates from Bill Frist University.

Some have law degrees. Some have degrees in sociology. All the degrees confer upon people the absolute certitude in their own remote diagnosis/analysis, relying upon the infallible and "fair and balanced" corporate media for all the relevant facts - requiring only 10 or 15 minutes of study to come up with, not just an opinion, but an infallible position without doubt or uncertainty of any kind.

It's all about judgment. Some people got it and some people don't. Screw that stuff about "hate the sin and love the sinner"!!! Ignore that stuff about attacking the message instead of the messenger!! Hang 'em high when we judge them wanting.

Let it be a lesson to us: The message is merely evidence of the person being an evil-doer - so we should (like Cho) just blow 'em away with our infallible judgment. It's not about discussion - it's about a "take no prisoners" all-out war. Every event is an opportunity to climb on our beloved-issue soap box and fire away. They're either with us or against us!

:eyes:

[enigmatic]

44. Great post

:thumbsup:

[treestar]

45. Thinking in black and white terms isn't limited to freepers, we find

IA that when it comes to trial related things, people of all types seem to get a gut reaction about it and then go from there framing everything to support the side they took.

The Baldwin mess - with a divorce rate as high as we have, it could hit home. Those kind of fights aren't even limited to Hollywood types - that one just got the publicity.

[LibertyUntoDeath]

50. For the same reason democrat radio failed...

Because most democrats (though not all) are 99% emotion and 1% reason. I know a few democrats in the press who make reasonable points, but they are few and far between. It's time we got an education and stopped making our party look so stupid.

[stirlingsliver]

53. Please.

Most Democrats are 99% emotion and 1% reason?

I don't think so.

(Welcome to DU, by the way. I hope you enjoy your stay.)

[LibertyUntoDeath]

55. Thanks, and...

...thanks for not responding with, "Hey screw you dumbass!" :)

[stirlingsliver]

52. People Are People

Geeze.

People are people.

Instead of being so judgmental and condemning, why don't you just relax and enjoy the interaction with other people?

[aikoaiko]

56. Strealth Baldwin thread - --- look away before its too late. Its tooo late for me.............