"Negro" on the 2010 Census (Rachel Maddow)

[Randall Flagg]

Per Rachel and an interesting discussion follows.

The options are "Black, African Americans or Negroes."

This seems way bad to me, as one might consider our past, or, in the case of our current President, who may have an entirely different opinion on the subject as so many of us are of mixed races and would rather give credence to all of our heritage.

I can understand (slightly) with the elderly who have the nomenclature on their Birth Certificate, but isn't it time we put the descriptor to rest on public documents in this country?

[MadMaddie]

1. This was a bad decision

I don't think it will stop people from filling it out but it's time to get away from the terminology.

[Gormy Cuss]

2. The likely reason it's still listed is that in testing of the forms Census found sufficient people

still self-identifying this way. They would also weigh this against whether others would be put off by its inclusion.

That's one reason that over time some categories are added and some disappear -- to keep up with the trends on how people describe themselves.

[Randall Flagg]

3. (Serious question) Would one be that differential to identifying themselves

on a form as "Black or Negro" or :"white or Caucasian?"

And within the Asian and Latino communities there are so many different variances that it would be nearly impossible to sort everything out.


I have a map of North America from 1858 which has the census published on it. It had categories like free and slave blacks, literate and illiterate whites and indentured... And that was about the depth of it.

It doesn't seem as if we've come very far since then.

[Gormy Cuss]

6. When designing Race/Ethnic origin questions, if you don't include terms that most people use

to identify themselves, they choose other and write it in. Census (and others collecting similar data) would then categorize the response to the Black/A-A designation for certain aggregate statistics and footnote that the term 'Negro' was treated that way. Similar deal for Asian and Latino subcategories. I've written race/ethnicity questions for surveys and using the most common designations in the question is the most straightforward way to handle it. People tend to be more offended when the designation they prefer isn't listed. One example I recall from focus groups is that some Americans who hailed from the Caribbean didn't like the term African-American, because they didn't consider themselves as such -- they were inclined to call themselves Black or Negro or African-Caribbean.

You noted earlier that it's probably older people who call themselves Negro, and I agree. Within twenty years the generation most comfortable with that designation probably will die off and Census will drop 'Negro' from the fixed categories. One of the recent major changes to racial/ethnic designations is an acknowledgment that many more people want to be recorded as multiracial, often without specifying which races.

I've dealt with historical data as a genealogist and what I find interesting is the way persons of color are categorized differently by state. In slave state areas I noticed there were many more mulattos than in free states, where if the race was designated it was either white or Negro. Indians who didn't live on tribal lands often show up as white in nineteenth and early twentieth century Census too.

[Captain Hilts]

20. The term 'Caucasion' has always confused the shit out of me because folks from the Caucuses...

are very dark.

[Captain Hilts]

4. There are now a lot of recent 'Africans' in the US. So, African-American has become confusing. nt

[Kahuna]

10. I heard Nora O;Donnell refer to the undie-bomber as an African-American..

I was like, what? The lights are on, but nobody's home. :scared:

[Captain Hilts]

18. He's African, but also black. But not an African-American. Theresa Heinz Kerry is African...

but not black, but is an African-American culturally.

[ProgressiveProfessor]

21. Key pont there are many of us with African ancestry that are not Aftrican-American

including the current president and the wife of John Kerry.

[shawcomm]

12. As in

very confusing...



:P

[marshall]

15. Didn't Teresa point out she is hyphenless?

She said African-American is a term used for people with African ancestry descended from slaves. Those like her and Charlize Theron are African American, without the hyphen.

In which case I suppose Barack Obama is also hyphen free.

[HipChick]

14. Africans like Charlize Theron?

or do they just get labelled White? :shrug: but black Africans get labelled African-American?

[Captain Hilts]

16. It's confusing. Here in DC there are a lot of recent immigrants from Africa...

who see themselves as being distinct from people who have lived here for generations.

It's confusing.

[shraby]

5. What is the object of categorizing people? Aren't we all

humans? That's enough of a break-down for me.

[Gormy Cuss]

7. One of the justifications for asking race/ethnicity is to determine if some populations

are receiving different and insufficient services or otherwise treated differently in a way that seems tied to racial or ethnic discrimination. When we are confident as a nation that such differences no longer occur there will be no need to collect the data.

[apocalypsehow]

8. There will *always* be a need to "collect the data." For any number of legitimate reasons.

I must say I doubt your claims to have any knowledge of this field of study/business as stated above by you in this thread, having read that egregiously absurd statement.

And please don't reply with your supposed resume: this is the internets, not a job interview. Anyone can claim to be anything they say. But by their posts do I measure them, to coin a phrase.

Edit: phrasing.

[Gormy Cuss]

9. What a strange post.

[Tx4obama]

11. Something that Rachel did NOT mention...

The word 'negro' pronounced 'nay-grow' (not knee-grow) means BLACK in some foreign languages such as SPANISH.
The word for 'black' in Italian is 'nero' (pronounced 'nair-oo).
So, perhaps the reason that 'negro' is on the census has more of a meaning than we understand at the moment, in order for foreign folks to know which option to pick.

[Captain Hilts]

17. Yes. 'Nego' is descriptive, with no cultural/geographic assumptions. nt

[Tx4obama]

13. Other...

If I remember correctly the last time I filled out a census from I checked the box that said 'other'.
I am not White, Black, Asian, or Latino.
I am ITALIAN-American... very dark olive skinned and there wasn't a box that I fit into.
At one time in American history (1800s and early 1900s) Italian immigrants were considered 'COLORED' and NOT white people.
Now, in modern times, Italian-Americans are supposed to check the little 'white' box, but I refuse to say that I am white when I am actually darker than most Hispanics that I know!

Just my thoughts and opinion ;)

[Captain Hilts]

19. Interesting stuff. Some Jews see that as a race and don't like being considered

"Anglos" along with WASPS. And a lot of folks now consider Catholics WASPS, oddly enough. 'White' and 'black' do not make cultural assumptions as 'African-American', or 'northern European' do.

'Anglo-phones' speak English. 'Hispanics' speak Spanish. 'Chicanos' originate from Mexico.

Pedro Martinez probably does not think of himself as an 'African-American' but as Dominican, and so forth.

Folks have really forgotten how much Italians and Irish were discriminated against for so long.