Frustrated Owner Bulldozes Home Ahead Of Foreclosure

[WriteDown]

MOSCOW, Ohio --

Like many people, Terry Hoskins has had troubles with his bank. But his solution to foreclosure might be unique.
Hoskins said he's been in a struggle with RiverHills Bank over his Clermont County home for nearly a decade, a struggle that was coming to an end as the bank began foreclosure proceedings on his $350,000 home.

"When I see I owe $160,000 on a home valued at $350,000, and someone decides they want to take it – no, I wasn't going to stand for that, so I took it down," Hoskins said.

Hoskins said the Internal Revenue Service placed liens on his carpet store and commercial property on state Route 125 after his brother, a one-time business partner, sued him.

The bank claimed his home as collateral, Hoskins said, and went after both his residential and commercial properties.
"The average homeowner that can't afford an attorney or can fight as long as we have, they don't stand a chance," he said

http://www.wlwt.com/news/22600154/detail.html

Sounds like he had plenty of equity. And another guy who doesn't think he should pay taxes.

[aquart]

1. The bank refused $170,000.

I'm a little confused about that.

[WriteDown]

3. They probably were owed over that with taxes and attorney fees...

They could easily recoup all their outlays if the home was sold anywhere near its fair market value.

[thunder rising]

19. We just make up scenarios around here. This is as good as any Grim Bros fairy tale.

[WriteDown]

31. Why do you choose to believe a fatcat tax cheat?

Banks do not refuse full payoffs for kicks.

[WatchWhatISay]

38. Maybe not just for kicks, but maybe so for a nice profit

I doubt that they worry that its just not fair

[WriteDown]

42. They cannot profit...

They can only take what is owed on the lien. Same as a car.

[Robb]

2. Maybe the land alone is worth the balance owed?

It would start to make "sense" if so. :shrug:

[WriteDown]

4. Maybe...

But any overage the foreclosure brought in would be forwarded to this guy, soooo....

[Robb]

5. They're not obligated to ask market value at the auction in Ohio, are they? nt

[WriteDown]

7. Doesn't matter....

You'd have bids that were at least more than 170K. Anybody who bought it even at 250K could make good money selling it soon afterward.

[laughingliberal]

6. I'm not sure that makes sense

Why would the bank have refused to take the $170,000 he offered saying they could get more by selling it if they just have to give him the difference, anyway. Doesn't sounds as if they do have to.

[WriteDown]

8. Because the bank was owed more than that...

That's a sales price of 170K so subtract commissions and closing costs, about 10% of sales price.

[laughingliberal]

11. In the article he said he owed $160,000

Even if true, they were going to forclose to get a difference of about $7,000. Wonder who the bank was?

[WriteDown]

12. Yeah, that was his estimate..

If you lent someone 100K and they offered you 90K, would you just call it even if there was a very easy way to get your full 100K? This guy was a fatcat business owner who didn't want anyone to get what he thought was HIS and his alone.

[laughingliberal]

16. The article said he's been fighting the bank for a decade

I'm thinking he knew what he owed and wasn't just pulling it out of his butt.

[WriteDown]

17. A decade to sell his 350K home?

I wonder how long he was fighting the IRS. He may have owed 160K in UPB, but 50K in interest if he was fighting it for a decade. Tax cheats aren't usually the best sources.

[laughingliberal]

22. It does not say how long he'd been fighting the IRS

but they had a lien on his carpet store and commercial property.

[thunder rising]

20. This is just fantasy .... you don't know, you're making stuf up.

[WriteDown]

25. Please feel free to explain. nt

[AllentownJake]

13. The story isn't the guy

The story is a bank used the legal system to take the man's house and the man instead decided to destroy the property rather than turn it over.

Now second part of story, how much support does the individual have amongst others for breaking the law.

[WriteDown]

15. What legal system dis the bank use? The IRS?

:eyes:

[AllentownJake]

18. The IRS is a part of the government

last time I checked, which does exert legal authority.

Half of what we do in this world is the result of societal pressures, particularly like when we decide not to bulldoze our house rather than to hand it over willingly after the governing body tells us we have to. The other half is fear of punishment.

What would people think if I bulldozed my house is half the equation. The other half is what will happen to me. This man appears not to have given a shit about either, and the fact people are supportive of what he did, means that more people are going to do it in the future because fear of punishment doesn't motivate people all the time.

[WriteDown]

26. I think many more people should just decide to not pay their taxes!

Don't be afraid anymore people! Paying for infrastructure is for suckers!

[AllentownJake]

30. See and here is the crux of the situation

I point out a reality, people are engaging in anti-social activity and being cheered, which will inevitably lead to more anti-social activity, and you want to build a strawman that I don't think we should have infrastructure.

Do you want to have an honest discussion of what is going on right now, or would you prefer to play keyboard internet hero.

[WriteDown]

33. You're defending a fatcat tax cheat for reasons I can't understand.

If you want to justify that then go ahead.

[AllentownJake]

35. Where have I defended this action

I believe I called it anti-social and said it concerns me that there is a significant portion of the population who would relate to his actions.

[laughingliberal]

23. I think we are seeing is something I've been expecting.

Remember, during the depression the anger at the banks was so intense the public was rooting for the bank robbers. They became folk heroes who people saw as surrogates for their own anger at the banks. It took a massive PR campaign on the part of the government and fledgling FBI to gain public support for catching and prosecuting the bank robbers.

[proud2BlibKansan]

9. He owned a lavish home and couldn't afford an attorney?

I am calling bullshit.

[laughingliberal]

14. Sounds as if he had an attorney

Here's what he said:

""The average homeowner that can't afford an attorney or can fight as long as we have, they don't stand a chance," he said"

That part, "that can't afford an attorney or can fight as long as we have..."

Sounds like he is stating he doesn't know what people who can't afford an attorney to fight as long as he has are supposed to do. Sort of like when I caught a huge mistake a doctor was about to make in something he was going to prescribe for me and I said. "I'm an RN. WTF is a lay person going to do at the mercy of some of these people?"

[AllentownJake]

10. Let me see two anti-social actions committed this week

and there appears to be understanding of the anti-social actions.

Not a very good sign.

[thunder rising]

21. Sounds like somebody wants change as long as it doesn't upset anything.

[AllentownJake]

27. 1 of 3 things are going to happen

and possibly all 3.

1) Reform
2) Brutal Repression
3) Fall of the institutions

Forgive me, but when institutions fall, something replaces them. The replacement could be awesome, or it could be mad max.

[WriteDown]

29. The IRS has to go down...

People are really angry at them out there. Maybe a national sales tax instead or no taxes at all.

[AllentownJake]

32. The IRS is one of many institutions people are pissed off at

and frankly, these actions tend to spread to other institutions rather quickly.

[WriteDown]

34. Yes, but people are REALLY mad at the IRS.

This guy is just Stack-lite.

[AllentownJake]

44. Yeah I think I said that. nt

[northernlights]

24. too many holes in the story to *understand* it

the writer or editor left too many gaps in the sequence of events to fill in.

1. his brother/biz partner sued him
2. which somehow resulted in IRS lien against his home and business
3. he thinks he owes bank $160K, and bank refused $170K payment
4. bank instead foreclosed

A lot of gaps there. I remember 30+ years ago, my father embezzled money from his employer *in my name & SSN* while I was away at college, and left me stuck with the tax bill, along with interest, penalties and threat of jail from the IRS. Luckily I had enough saved to pay the bill immediately, because I had no means to fight the IRS or my family, never mind both.

The fact is, we don't have many facts to understand what really went down. As far as the banks refusal to accept payment, maybe somebody there took a fancy to his house and thought they were going to get it cheap. I've seen that sort of thing happen in my life too.

He does say at the end he understands and accepts the consequences of his decision to bulldoze the house he built.

If you take the vote at the end, you'll see that the vast majority of responders support him.

[WriteDown]

28. My guess is that his brother turned him in for lack of paying payroll taxes...

Probably a lot of labor paid in cash. Just a theory, but I'll throw it into the hat.

[northernlights]

37. but that's my point...it's a guess

and doesn't qualify as a theory (at least in the world of science,where theories require ample evidence). Not even enough evidence to qualify as hypothesis. Pure speculation.

Maybe his brother sued him for something his brother totally trumped up. Hell, my sister would sue me in a heartbeat if she thouht she could get money out of me. Not because I've ever done her or anybody wrong. Just for $$ and because she hates me.

Bottom line...based on the article, we just don't know.

[WriteDown]

39. No, its not...

The IRS does not come after you because someone sued. Nor do they come after your assets at that point. The only time they do this is when you owe taxes. This person obviously had the means to challenge the IRS and the outcome was not to his satisfaction so he decided to take his toys and go home.

By the way, if your sister sues you, the IRS will not come after you.

[northernlights]

40. if I had not paid the taxes, interest and penalties on the "income" my father embezzled

the IRS would have come after me. Would that mean I owed taxes? If I accused my father of forging my signature and faking my employment, and he responded by suing me, and I lost by virtue of his having superior resources and the family lying to protect him... would *that* mean I owed the taxes?

You don't know why his brother sued him. People don't only sue other people because they've been wronged. Sometimes they throw a lot of mud at somebody else to cover their own tracks. Family relationships can involve incredibly tangled messes. The person who appears to have done wrong as often as not may be the one wronged. Parent lie for favored children and sabotage the ones they didn't want in order to protect themselves from the reality of themselves.

You don't know what taxes the IRS came after him for, or whether he actually owed them.

[WriteDown]

41. So you didn't even try to sue your father?

Then you probably deserve to pay those taxes.

And this guy never claimed that the IRS was in error. Guess they got to him first.

[northernlights]

43. that's a pretty harsh judgement you have given that you know nothing about me. what are you, 12

years old? I'll keep it short and sweet. These days we put people in jail for the things my parents did to me and to my eldest sister. She once told me she remembered being picked up by her hair and bounced off walls by my upper-middle-class mommie dearest. Nobody ever alerted authorities back then. They just looked the other way and left us to fend for ourselves.

I had no resources to sue and I was terrified of my parents. You have no idea what they were capable of and it's pretty obnoxious of you to pass that kind of judgement. I think I'll just introduce you to my ignore button now. You appear to have the experience and understanding of a teenager. It's all easy, black and white to you... :eyes:

[WriteDown]

45. Reality is harsh...

Like a battered woman, if someone doesn't fight for what's right then everyone suffers. You're right, people didn't start coming forward until some brave people paved the way.

[Subdivisions]

36. Results of poll:

http://cf.wlwt.com/cin/sh/con_surveycontest_display/displaySurveyResults.cfm?contentid=22610508&sitekey=CIN&questionum=0&answer1=0