If the Dems can't keep the tax cuts for the lower income people

[napi21]

and repeal those on the wealthy, I believe they should just let the whole thing die!

I did some checking, and with the help of some DUers, foun the following.

If you earn $30-$40/yr. Your tax cut was about $15/wk
" $40-$50/yr. $20/wk
" $50-$75/yr $26/wk

Here's where I http://www.factcheck.org/here_we_go_again_bush_exaggerates_tax.htmlgot most of the inf.

The lowes incoms didn't receive any cut at all, and of course the higher the income goes, the higher the benefit.

Wouldn't you be willing to give your up to help getus out of the mess we're in right now? I would!

[bobbolink]

1. What is missing for most people is not only that the lowest rungs got no cut at all,

but that for those on fixed incomes, THE AMOUNT WAS PUT ON HOLD!

So, we effectively got a cut, while the rest of you got at least a bit of a bonus.

....

........

Now, here come all the nay-sayers.....

"You shall know them by their big hearts."

[DJ13]

4. + 1

And they seem determined to give $0 in COLA for next year as well.

[bobbolink]

9. Yet, we get told to STFU and vote for the fuckers again.

[slackmaster]

2. As I understand it, the lowest income people did get a cut

A special 10% bracket was created for individual earnings from $0 – $8,375, and for joint earnings of $0 – $16,750. If all of the tax cuts are allowed to expire, that bracket would go back up to 15%. That means up to $837.50 in higher taxes on a low-income family.

Someone please correct me if that is not accurate.

[bobbolink]

7. YEs, we definitely got a cut. No COLA for at least two years.

Soooo fucking fair.

All heart.

[slackmaster]

16. COLA on taxes?

How does that work?

[bobbolink]

17. Are you aware of what a COLA is?

[slackmaster]

22. Cost Of Living Allowance

I've only seen the term applied to items on the income side of the balance sheet of an individual or a family, such as a salary, pension, or government-provided benefit. A COLA is an increase to compensate for higher living expenses.

I've never seen the term applied to a tax or other expense. Please explain what you mean.

[bobbolink]

23. YOU got tax cuts.

Those of us on fixed incomes got a CUT in the amount we receive.

COLAs were put on hold for at least two years!

Thanks, Dems. :grr:

[Statistical]

11. It is accurate. Also child tax credit went from $500 to $1000 and is fully refundable. n/t

[napi21]

13. The majority of incomes under $9,000 don't PAY income taxes.

Check your tax table. You get an automatic deduction for yourself which I believe at that time was $3,500, and a standard deduction and I don't recall how much that was. If you dedct both of those items WHICH EVERYBODY GETS, you have a NEGATIVE TAXABLE INCOME!

[slackmaster]

14. So, people who pay zero in federal taxes got a zero percent cut

Makes sense.

[w4rma]

3. And blame it on the Republicans for raising the vast majority of Americans' taxes. (nt)

[pnwmom]

5. Politically, that would be stupid. The Republicans would be the only ones to gain.

It doesn't matter what the facts are about the NUMBERS. The Rethugs would be screaming about higher taxes for everyone and that would be enough to enrage a significant segment of the population.

[Greyhound]

8. Yes, well if Obama had come out against the bailout as did the overwhelming majority of Americans,

he could blame the hike on the republiks.

Another problem with doing things their way.
:eyes:

[bobbolink]

18. Being chessed into a corner is sooooo uncomfortable.

:hi:

[pnwmom]

20. He made the best decision with the limited information he had. He's President now.

He wasn't, then.

[Greyhound]

24. Amazing how millions of normal Americans knew it was all BS, and said so,

yet out "leaders" were completely snookered by lies on a par with "What's that on your shirt?"...:eyes:

[Cant trust em]

6. Congress should keep the tax cuts for low/middle incomes and force the republicans to filibuster it

If they want to hold out to make sure that the wealthy get tax cuts, then they can be on the losing end of that debate.

[Statistical]

10. Not sure why you put it into weeks. It is real money.

Most people are more familiar with annualized amounts. I mean one could break it down to days; a $2,000 tax increase is "just" $5.47 a day.


Annual averages:
$30K - $40K - $825
$40K - $50K - $1,012
$50K - $75K - $1,403
$75K - $100K - $2,543

Anyways you look at it that is a real chunk of cash. On average like taking a 3% paycut. Take a survey of households and see how many can take a 3% paycut right now without pain. Also you have to consider what that 3% reduction in consumption does to aggregate demand.

Lastly remember this is the average. Households with children will be affected more as will households that are married. Child tax credit was $500, 2001/2003 tax cuts bumped it to $1000 and made it fully refundable. So a 3 child household will be looking at $1500 more in taxes on top of any tax boost due to rate structure changing. Marriage penalty can be substantial with 2 working spouses ($3,000 on $80,000 taxable).

There is no reason why Democrats can't get it extended. We just need to keep the pressure up. If they think it is "ok" to just let it all expire they will set the bar that low and let it all expire.

Obama made a promise not to raise taxes on those making less than $200K ($250K married). We should hold him to it.

[Cant trust em]

12. Love this post from a DUer called "statistical".

:)

[slackmaster]

15. I roughed out my increase as about $2,050 if all of the bracket changes are allowed to expire

I know that would have a significant effect on my budget.

My tentative plan is to start making contributions to my 401k, to chop off the top of that increase.

[Statistical]

21. I ballparked our family at $2850.

My assumptions. Deduction & Exemptions stay same compared to 2010. 10% bracket merged into 15%, 25% bracket becomes 28%. Marriage penalty back into effect (Married Filing Jointly rates are 166% of single vs 200% of single now).

That puts the brackets looking something like for married filing jointly
15% $0 - 56,800
28% $56,800 - 137,400

$2850 a year, $240 a month? Ouch. I already am maxing Roth IRA and putting the minimum to get max match in my 401K so no room to cut the overhead there. Likely I will just cut my consumption. Find $240 a month worth of stuff I don't "need". That (combined with millions of others) means less demand for business and they lay people off which results in less demand, etc.

Raising taxes on working class in middle of a recession is an "anti-stimulus". The effect is even greater felt on people like you who are planning to get out ahead of it. Say you increase your 401K contribution by $2,000 to dent your tax increase. Well now your consumption has declined by $1,500 (higher taxes) + $2,000 (more money saved) = $3,500. It is called tragedy of the commons. You (me, everyone) doing what is in your best interest creates a bad macro-economic effect. The govt should be encouraging the opposite not feeding into it.

Even worse the $400 per person "paying work pay credit" (2009 and extended to 2010) also expires at end of the year. So not only will income tax deductions increase but paychecks will decrease by about another $400 at the exact same time. It will be a 1-2 punch which will be instantly obvious to anyone looking at their paystub.

[napi21]

19. I put it into weeks because that's the way that most people

view their income (or by paycheck however often that is). Havn't you ever heard someonesay, "BI WHOOP! I got a whole $2/we increase!"? I sure have! That's the way their money goes out so that's the way they see it come in.

I'm not saying they shouldn't do everything possible to make sure the high rate cuts expire. My point is that I don't want to see them extend the whole tax cut package. That's the rumblings right now. I'm more than willing to give mine up if the only other option is for the whole thing to continue. I've heard several times thatsome Dems are thinking about extending the whole package for 2 years. I DON'T WANT THAT AND I'M WILLING TO GIVE UP OME OF MY CUTS SO THE RICH HAVE TO GIVE UP THEIRS TOO.!