Can we have a discussion about 2012

[xiamiam]

Would love to hear your thoughts. I am not happy with Obamas' performance and I dont think he will win again in 2012. The idea of Repubs in the white house is even more loathsome. Downright scary.

I dont want to debate Obamas' performance. Just talk to your neighbor or co worker and that is indicative of widespread disappointment and frustration. But what now?

The campaigning will start next year. It will be full tilt and I fear nothing is going to be accomplished between a gridlocked congress and the campaign trail frenzy.

I'm feeling a little hopeless.

Please, some rational ideas or direction.

[nevergiveup]

1. I am not sure how one can talk about 2012

without discussing Obama's performance. The people I know who voted for Obama are still very supportive of him and I have heard zero talk from them about a Democratic challenger in 2012. There are certainly some areas where I think Obama needs to improve but the fact of the matter is that we either sink or swim together when it comes to 2012. After watching Republicans vote down the temporary extension of unemployment benefits yesterday it really did hit me on the head how critical things have become. We either become unified and strong together and fight these animals or this country is in deep doo doo. The campaign slogan in 2008 was "Yes We Can", not "Yes He Can".

[Le Taz Hot]

2. There has been so much disappointment with this administration

I think there is no other alternative but to look for primary challengers. If, at some point, he stops listening to the Washington Insiders and listens more to the populace, he would not only gain back his base but he would gain support from many other sectors (dare I say, moderate Republicans?). If, however, he continues on the same path (Cat Food Commission? Really??) then those of us who refuse to support an appeaser will have to look elsewhere for a candidate who will represent our interests.

[WI_DEM]

4. Well these primary challengers better get out there soon because

if they are to challenge the president they will have a huge task and can't start late. So far Dean, Feingold, and DK has denied they will do it. I don't know any other dem of stature who will want to risk dividing the democratic party and challenging Obama especially when if they are nominated many African-American voters will sit out the election.

[Le Taz Hot]

6. I believe DK

when he says he won't run and the probability of Dean and Feingold is against the run, but I remain forever the optomist. I agree with your prediction re the African-American vote. I think that says something significant that we at DU are probably not ready to talk about yet.

[WI_DEM]

3. Unless Obama is on the ticket the Dems will not win--period.

1) If the president faced a primary (and he won't), and was denied re-nomination-the party would be wrecked to tatters, worse than in 1980. Why? African-American voters still like and strongly support this president. They will still probably vote strongly Democratic for the person who defeated Obama but the turnout will be way down from 2008 as many will just sit it out.

2) People here don't seem to understand that Obama is actually in very good shape politically considering all he has had to deal with. His approval ratings have been stable in the mid 40's for a year or more--even with high unemploymnent. St. Ronnie was down in the 30's at this point in his presidency and Mondale was beating him in January, 1983 Gallup Poll. Clinton had lower approval and the GOP was beating him in generic polls for re-election. Both went on to win big two years later. Furthermore Clinton lost both the house and senate--Obama kept the Senate and Governor losses were minimal when compared to 1994. Furthermore PPP just released a poll showing Obama beating all the leading GOP candidates by 6-11 points in Virginia. If Virginia votes for Obama again in 2012 that is an indication that he will win handily.

3) Obama's record isn't really all that bad. He did prevent another depression. The Stimulus has created about 3 million jobs. He did pass HCR which eluded other presidents (yes, I know it's not what most on DU want), he did pass Financial Reform (again many DUers are not happy with that either). The economy is showing signs of picking up again in the last couple of months and if it does and we are creating jobs at a stronger rate then 2012 will be a cake walk for Obama.

[MineralMan]

5. So, who do you think could be a candidate who would do better

in 2012 than President Obama? If you're going to discus primarying the President, you're going to first need a candidate who is willing to run in the primaries against him, and who has a good chance of getting elected in the General Election. Frankly, I cannot think of a single one. Maybe you have some people in mind, so we can discuss something concrete, rather than just a concept.

Both the willingness to run against a sitting President in the primaries, and a chance of winning the General election are the two critical factors. I'm thinking you're going to have little success in finding such a candidate.

[xiamiam]

7. I just presented the dilemna I feel we are facing and asked for possible solutions.

[MineralMan]

9. And I just asked you a very important question as a way to

keep the discussion going. Without the answer to that question, there is no discussion.

[xiamiam]

12. I posted this in hopes that some had ideas which would ensure the repubs not win 2012

this upcoming election will not be the same as 2008. That hope and change slogan is not gonna bring voters out. I dont have any answers. I had hoped that I would feel differently about this administration. I continue to hope along with others that the wars will be over, that war profiteers will be held accountable, that at least one person will be held accountable for the wall street fiasco, that the help for homeowners plan was effective, that I could really afford health insurance, that I didnt see the corporations controlling the media and the message, that we were not sending drones into pakistan, etc. These are things which voters wanted to see changed. It hasn't happened. That will refelct in the election.

I live in a progressive area of the country. I could have a discussion any day of the week with any number of people who shake their head and are disappointed. Will we all vote dem as we did in 08? Who knows?

[groundloop]

8. When was the last time a sitting president lost in primary and that party won?

I can't think of a a single example, though I know there are better historians here than me. Bottom line is we sink or swim with President Obama. And the truth of the matter is that he's done a hell of a lot of good things. Granted I'm disappointed in some of what he's done as well, but once again - would you rather have a president whom you agree with 75% of the time or one whom you'll agree with 10% of the time? That's the reality of politics and we'd damned well better stick together or we're sunk.

[kctim]

10. Feeling a little hopeless?

All of my neighbors and co-workers who are Dems and 80+% of the Democratic Party are satisfied with the job President Obama is doing.

This disappointment and frustration you speak of isn't as "widespread" as some believe or want it to be.

[xiamiam]

13. that is surprising to me, really...not so here in northern cal..nt

[jpgray]

11. It's a long way from hopeless. He has higher approval than Clinton after '94 midterms

Unfortunately he's poised to do a similar right-turn to Clinton, but at present I don't think he's a huge liability in 2012 by any means. Quite the opposite, depending on events between now and then.

[superduperfarleft]

14. Obama will run, without a primary challenge, in 2012 and he'll most likely win. n/t

[DainBramaged]

15. The world's is gonna end, what's to discuss?

:shrug: