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"We have a gay guy. He's big, he's mean, and he kills lots of bad guys."

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Bucky Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-30-10 11:14 PM
Original message
"We have a gay guy. He's big, he's mean, and he kills lots of bad guys."
Edited on Tue Nov-30-10 11:15 PM by Bucky
from Adam Serwer's blog at American Prospect:

DADT Survey: (Most Of) The Troops Don't Care.

Here are the key points from the just-released Pentagon Survey on repealing "don't ask, don't tell":

When asked about how having a Service member in their immediate unit who said he or she is gay would affect the unit’s ability to “work together to get the job done,” 70% of Service members predicted it would have a positive, mixed, or no effect.

When asked “in your career, have you ever worked in a unit with a co-worker that you believed to be homosexual,” 69% of Service members reported that they had.

When asked about the actual experience of serving in a unit with a co-worker who they believed was gay or lesbian, 92% stated that the unit’s “ability to work together” was “very good,” “good,” or “neither good nor poor.”


So most service members think they've served with someone who is gay or lesbian, and more than nine out of 10 of those people concluded -- much as the 1993 RAND study did -- that their ability to perform tasks was unaffected. Predicting that opponents of repeal would argue that the problem would be with open service, the DoD report includes a thoughtful rebuttal:

In the course of our assessment, it became apparent to us that, aside from the moral and religious objections to homosexuality, much of the concern about “open” service is driven by misperceptions and stereotypes about what it would mean if gay Service members were allowed to be “open” about their sexual orientation. Repeatedly, we heard Service members express the view that “open” homosexuality would lead to widespread and overt displays of effeminacy among men, homosexual promiscuity, harassment and unwelcome advances within units, invasions of personal privacy, and an overall erosion of standards of conduct, unit cohesion, and morality. Based on our review, however, we conclude that these concerns about gay and lesbian Service members who are permitted to be “open” about their sexual orientation are exaggerated, and not consistent with the reported experiences of many Service members.


{snip}

According to the report, "While the percentage of the overall U.S. military that predicts negative or very negative effects on their unit’s ability to “work together to get the job done” is 30%, the percentage is 43% for the Marine Corps, 48% within Army combat arms units, and 58% within Marine combat arms units." In practice, though, even combat unit members who believed they were serving with someone who was gay overwhelmingly believed it didn't matter:

Meanwhile, in response to the same question, the percentage is 89% for those in Army combat arms units and 84% for those in Marine combat arms units—all very high percentages.19 Anecdotally, we heard much the same. As one special operations force warfighter told us, “We have a gay guy {in the unit}. He’s big, he’s mean, and he kills lots of bad guys. No one cared that he was gay.”
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Skittles Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-30-10 11:18 PM
Response to Original message
1. yup
"like racists, when placed in foxholes, homophobes tend to become an endangered species"

yes INDEED
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Bucky Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-30-10 11:33 PM
Response to Reply #1
2. As someone posted in another thread: What's the matter with the Marines?
But of course there's more people saying "I'm afraid it'll cause our service branch problems" than those saying "I have a problem with it." The problem is far more perceptual than factual.
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Skittles Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-01-10 12:10 AM
Response to Reply #2
3. CORRECT
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boppers Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-01-10 12:16 AM
Response to Reply #2
5. What's right with the Navy and Air Force?
Perhaps that's a better question.
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BR_Parkway Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-01-10 11:47 AM
Response to Reply #2
11. While serving and over the years since, I've noticed that the military
Edited on Wed Dec-01-10 11:48 AM by BR_Parkway
gays I met tended to be the most closeted, the most in denial about their own sexuality when they were in the Marines - I think there's something about it's ultra macho culture that attracts guys like this, hoping to finally prevail against the thoughts and feelings they have about sex and other men if they go into this branch of the service.

As has been proven time and time again in every format, the guys most likely to have a problem with someone else's sexuality tend to be the least comfortable with their own. Truly str8 guys aren't threatened by me - in fact, many of them realize I'm one less to compete with as they pursue the ladies.
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Bucky Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-01-10 12:12 AM
Response to Original message
4. Kicks just keep getting harder to find.
14 recs, but hardly any kicks. This post's admirers are all in the closet. Go figure.
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Roon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-01-10 12:16 AM
Response to Reply #4
6. I'll give her a kick!
:kick:
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PVnRT Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-01-10 07:38 AM
Response to Original message
7. Warfighter?
What in fucking hell is a warfighter? Is "soldier" no longer an acceptable term? Fuck.

Anyway, yeah, Senate, get off your lazy rich asses and repeal the fucking law already.
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MilesColtrane Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-01-10 08:11 AM
Response to Original message
8. K & R
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rug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-01-10 08:13 AM
Response to Original message
9. Well, there's a compelling argument.
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BlueIris Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-01-10 08:15 AM
Response to Original message
10. To quote a great American, "When I'm president of the United States,
as long as you want to kill the enemy, you can fuck whoever you want."
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Bucky Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-02-10 06:22 PM
Response to Reply #10
12. Who said that?
It's a brilliant quote.
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