Can people who fall off unemployment apply for welfare?

[dkf]

How hard is it to qualify and how do welfare benefits compare to unemployment?

[The_Casual_Observer]

1. The alternative to unemployment for the otherwise able-bodied

population is more likely crime or some other underground pursuit. Welfare isn't generally an option in this country.

[tedbear]

34. Welfare

If you don't have any money at all or any assets at all you can get food stamps and maybe a check monthly depending on things like children, etc.), and you can get free healthcare which is part of why the healthcare bill got through (because there have been so many people in ER's because they cannot afford healthcare). The truly inane part of the greedy Republican thinking or lack of thinking, is they have tunnel vision - you know, they follow their wealthy leaders just like Bush did and don't worry about the consequences, because I guess they think their wealthy friends will pay for their food and healthcare, when in actuality it is "we the people" who are paying for their food and healthcare.

[Curmudgeoness]

2. If you meet certain criteria, the answer would be yes.

Each state has different criteria so how to qualify is dependent on the state. And yes, you are thinking along the right lines---this is what will happen. So much for the savings.

[NorthCarolina]

27. Unless they happen to be property owners. nt

[ejpoeta]

3. well first of all, you can't have any stocks, savings anything pretty much.

you have to have gone through all of that. that is why i find this idea about saving money so funny. even if people have done all that, then they have to spend it all.... i know they tried to tell my husband he has 401k so he should be taking money out of that which he refused to do. not sure they can actually make you take a loan out of your 401k. but i digress. even if you do qualify for benefits, in some states (like NYS) there is a 60 month maximum for cash assistance for your lifetime. they will also make you look for a job. and they made me look for a job when i had no daycare and expected me to work at mcdonalds for minimum wage. which would be fine if the cost for daycare wouldn't be as much or more than i would have made. but this was several years ago and i only had one kid at the time. we were really struggling back then. not sure if they would make anyone wait because they had that income. i hope not. and i hope they can get whatever assistance they need.

[Very_Boring_Name]

5. Yup, when my grandfather left my grandmother she was forced to apply for welfare

She told us the story of how they asked her how much money she had in her savings, and she said 44$ (which is equal to around 250$ today). They told her to go spend it and then come back and reapply.

[Xithras]

6. Here in California, they'll make you cash your 401k completely out.

Forget taking a loan against it. A 401k is a "liquifiable asset", and therefore has to be eliminated before you'll qualify for welfare. They don't care about the tax penalties.

[bliss_eternal]

11. True.

They figure if you have "anything" that can be liquified, you don't need their help. :shrug:

[Hello_Kitty]

12. That is such bullshit. If you liquidate it due to unemployment there should be no penalty. eom

[Xithras]

28. You can always borrow 100% of the 401k money and spend the proceeds before applying.

Federal law, and most 401k's, will permit you to borrow up to 100% of the accounts value without any tax penalty, if you can show financial hardship. If you do that, they'll see it as debt, and not an asset.

[Hello_Kitty]

31. But eventually you'll have to pay it back, with interest.

And my understanding was you had to be using it for a down payment for a home or college.

[Yupster]

37. And you typically cannot borrow from a 401 (k)

once you have left the company.

You also must pay back loans in full within a few moinths once you leave a company.

People -- Warning -- Please fon't take financial advice from posts on DU. It is an area of expertise that DU is particularly weak in.

[Xithras]

38. It's not something I would advise, but federal law does permit 401k hardship loans.

My post was made in relation to the original discussion. You are, of course, correct, and I hadn't though about the fact that you can't borrow once you've been fired.

For all practical purposes, the best bet would just be to cash the thing out and deal with the tax penalty. Welfare requires poverty, and it's as good a first step as any.

What a depressing conversation.

[laughingliberal]

40. Well, when we had to pull ours, there was a very narrow definition of 'hardship.'

Being flat broke and out of work did not qualify and we were subject to the penalty.

[ejpoeta]

18. then when you have no retirement it's your own fault. you can't win.

here we are where my husband is right on the edge. we qualify for the state insurance. if he got a raise he would then make too much and end up on the $10k deductible policy. he told his boss if he was going to give him a raise it had better be a $15k raise to cover the insurance. we get screwed no matter what. i like to say you pretty much have to be living in a cardboard box to get any help.

[dkf]

8. Eye opening and sobering.

Thanks for the info.

[JVS]

17. While on unemployment it's a good idea to draw your savings out in cash as if your spending is...

the same as when you were employed.


Cash can also be good for getting under the table business moving.

[Curmudgeoness]

32. Good idea, and really sad that we should have to plot like this. nt

[dkf]

35. Damn never thought of that.

Smart.

[Xithras]

4. Welfare, when available, generally requires that all assets be depleted.

In other words, if you've been using unemployment to hang onto your house while you search for a new job, most welfare programs are going to require that you sell the house, liquidate your retirement accounts, and sell off anything else of real value before they'll cut you a check. Many middle class people collecting unemployment tend to be asset-rich but cash-poor. To collect welfare, you have to be poor across the board. No welfare program in the country is going to cut you a check to help cover your mortgage payment.

[bluestateguy]

7. That's the thing

All of these faux deficit hawks that claim unemployment benefits will break the bank should know that cutting off people's unemployment will mean more people enrolling in welfare, food stamps, Medicaid and subsidized school lunches (if they have kids).

So I don't see much savings for the taxpayer here (if that's what's important to some people).

[dkf]

10. Ironically it decimates peoples retirement funds so that they will need more support

In the future when we already foresee budget problems.

[bliss_eternal]

9. Depends...

..call your local department of social services (where you would apply for welfare) to learn what their terms are (i.e. if you qualify). You would want to find out BEFORE going, and spending an entire day in the office. Not sure if they do the on-line thing, yet. Usually it's based on how large your family is, what your income was prior to becoming unemployed, etc.

In some cases, those not eligible for welfare funds, may still be eligible for food stamps. But my state may be different from yours, so you should definitely call the agency personally.

Good luck, and hope this helps!

:hug:

[dkf]

14. Aw that's so sweet of you.

I'm okay for now though. Hopefully my job will be around at least til we get out of this.

When faced with this reality, all this argument seems so cavalier. I don't understand why no one points these things out. Why do we not hear about these realities from the media?

[bliss_eternal]

15. Because it's not sexy...

...or fun, or funny or anything else that they *think* makes viewers watch their programs. Hang in there, this too shall pass. ;)

[ejpoeta]

22. and people would rather believe that these people are lazy and not looking for a job.

it's easier than facing the reality that that could be any of us. just like people on welfare... there must be something wrong with them... lazy.... greedy.... it must be because it can't just be that they lost their job because it can't be so simple because it could be me!! i am confident that has a lot to do with it. i've been on welfare and i am very aware and remind myself often.... that could be me. all it would take is for bob to get hurt. one of his coworkers got hit by a drunk driver walking out of a store last week. the guy is in the ICU and will probably be out of work for some time. they started a collection to tide the guy and his girlfriend and baby over for a bit... but something like that could be enough to sink a person. none of us are immune. some may have more savings so they may last longer.... but we are all at risk. i wish people would get their head out of the sand and see that. then maybe they would be more interested in having these things available for if it did happen to them.

[Hello_Kitty]

13. Where I am welfare is nigh impossible if you don't have small children.

You can get food stamps and you were able to get Medicaid up to 100% FPL (until Jan Brewer cut it off).

[bliss_eternal]

16. shame on her.

:grr::mad: (cutting that benefit, for those eligible).

[Hello_Kitty]

21. And now she's talking about putting it to a vote.

The AZ GOP wants to put a referendum on the ballot to roll AHCCCS (our state's Medicaid) back to pre-2000 levels where you have to be at 1/3 FPL to qualify, as opposed to 100% FPL where it is now. The good thing about that is that it probably won't pass (oddly enough, real death panels are unpopular). But we'll still be faced with a budget shortfall where they can dick eligible people around.

[TorchTheWitch]

19. same with where I live

Either you have to have small children, be pregnant, a drug addict or an alcoholic and no savings whatsoever.

[CreekDog]

20. many unemployed are trying to stay middle class --not until they are fully impoverished however...

can they qualify for welfare (which will be too late...because their fall into poverty unleashes a wave of new problems that will cost our society in innumerable ways)

and for those that would otherwise qualify but don't have children, there's likely no welfare for them.

[ejpoeta]

23. yep. that's another thing. people without kids may have a harder time.

it's not right though. somehow it's ok to let childless people starve?

[CreekDog]

26. actually, i think it's okay to let children starve too

Rush was saying they get too fat anyway. :wtf:

[ejpoeta]

33. he should know. that and prescription drug abuse.

[asdjrocky]

24. There is no welfare for the poor.

Another great Democrat helped to make sure of that, his name was Clinton. If you have no dependent children, there is no help in California. None.

[laughingliberal]

39. +1 nt

[Madam Mossfern]

25. However...

If you were poor to begin with, found a job, worked for a few years and managed to make ends meet...and then were laid off and couldn't find another job....and your unemployment ran out.....you could apply or (in some cases) re-apply for welfare. We are seeing an incredible recidivist rate in our welfare offices.
Many who have been off the rolls for five to ten years are back on.

pardon the unconventional writing style

[w8liftinglady]

29. this is actually a very good question..I need these facts when I write my editorial

[SOS]

30. In NYC

If you are an able-bodied adult, without children they will not accept your application.

If you are physically unable to work (or have children) you may apply, but must have zero assets.
$10 in a checking account would disqualify you.

[Hannah Bell]

36. in most jurisdictions you have to have kids to get welfare proper, what used to be called afdc.

now tanf.

TANF was created by the Personal Responsibility and Work Opportunity Act instituted under President Bill Clinton in 1996. The Act provides temporary financial assistance while aiming to get people off of that assistance, primarily through employment. There is a maximum of 60 months of benefits within one's lifetime, but some states have instituted shorter periods.<4>

In enforcing the 60-month time limit, some states place limits on the adult portion of the assistance only, while still aiding the otherwise eligible children in the household. While on aid, there is a component requiring non-exempt clients to attempt to find employment.

Unmarried minor parents have to live with a responsible adult or guardian. Paternity of children must be established in order to receive benefits. These requirements have led to massive drops in the number of people receiving cash benefits since 1996,<5> but there has been little change in the national poverty rate during this time. <6>

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tanf

The purposes of the TANF program as described in section 601 of the Social Security Act are as follows:

1.provide assistance to needy families so that children may be cared for in their own homes or in the homes of relatives;
2.end the dependence of needy parents on government benefits by promoting job preparation, work, and marriage;
3.prevent and reduce the incidence of out-of-wedlock pregnancies and establish annual numerical goals for preventing and reducing the incidence of these pregnancies; and
4.encourage the formation and maintenance of two-parent families.
TANF sets forward the following work requirements necessary for benefits:

1.Recipients (with few exceptions) must work as soon as they are job ready or no later than two years after coming on assistance.
2.Single parents are required to participate in work activities for at least 30 hours per week. Two-parent families must participate in work activities 35 or 55 hours a week, depending upon circumstances.
3.Failure to participate in work requirements can result in a reduction or termination of benefits to the family.
4.States, in FY 2004, have to ensure that 50 percent of all families and 90 percent of two-parent families are participating in work activities. If a state reduces its caseload, without restricting eligibility, it can receive a caseload reduction credit. This credit reduces the minimum participation rates the state must achieve.