The most important truth that Assange has revealed is not contained in

[tblue37]

in the documents he has leaked.

By leaking those documents, which are generally about information that we, as a supposedly free society in which the "people" have sovereignty, have a right to know, Assange has done only the precise job the Founding Fathers wanted the free press to do. Rememeber that according the the Founding Fathers, a free press is absolutely essential to the ability of a people to prevent its government from becoming a tyranny.

Think about the way that our government has turned all of its considerable power to hunting down a man who has merely revealed the truth, while refusing even to inconvenience those who have committed war crimes, and think about the way our government has pressured other countries' governments into helping to persecute Assange. Many people probably have been dramatically enlightened by the government's unconscionable reaction to WikiLeaks and persecution of Assange.

Not only has Assange exposed the tyrannical authoritarian mindset at the core of our government, but he has also proven without a doubt that our so-called free press is actually in collusion with the government it is supposed to stand as watchdog over.

Furthermore, the fact that so many politicians, office hodlers, and "journalists" are actually calling for the extrajudicial murder of this man is a much more damaging revelation about how the US conducts business than the revelation that some diplomats have mocked government leaders of other countries.

The reaction of the US government and its lapdog press is the most important and damaging truth revealed thus far by WikiLeaks!

[notesdev]

1. Our "free press" isn't

not when they are owned by companies getting bailout $$$

That's why they aren't reporting this story any more than is required not to admit their abdication of the role that the free press is supposed to play.

[tclambert]

43. Whattaya mean? We have the best free press money can buy!

And Rupert Murdoch bought it.

[liberation]

77. Technically it is the "expensive" press...

... given the salaries that Beck, O'Reilly, et al demand...

[molly77]

69. I think that is one of Assange's points. He says that Amazon dropping

him proved his point.(paraphrased) I've dropped Amazon and now Pay Pal. Just found out Amazon donates big time to republicans.

[defendandprotect]

99. "Amazon donates big time to Republicans" ..... hmmmmm.....

Thanks !!

[Bodhi BloodWave]

127. it proved his point on what tho?

That he can't break the rules he agreed to when he started using Amazon and paypal?

[ananda]

2. That is so true.

Well spoken.

[tblue37]

3. Wow! 7 recs before I even finished editing for careless typos!

Thanks!

[tavalon]

7. Methinks this one is going to the top

You hit an important angle.

[tblue37]

8. Yeah-- I see that. I have before never gotten over 20 recs within

4 minutes of starting a thread the way I did with this one!

[treestar]

9. Amazing, considering you have basically said nothng

and equated classified documents with freedom of the press.

So there should be no classified documents? maybe we should all know where the nuclear codes are. Of course, if we know, so will the rest of the world.

[tavalon]

11. Treestar, I may be mixing you up with another poster but the Treestar

I have watched with such respect is better at parsing meaning in a post than I've seen here.

Look at the reaction of the PTB. That's the summation of what the poster said. Basically, look not at what is being leaked but how the PTB are responding. You can actually parse far more information from the response than from this cable dump.

[tblue37]

19. False dilemma. Some things should be classified, no doubt. But I specified that

what he has been revealing this far has been mostly things that a free people should know about its government's actions. (I do think the backstabbing diplomatic gossip aspect is not necessary information and probably should have been omitted.)

The government classifies a lot of info not because it should be secret, but because they are doing wrong things and don't want to be caught doing wrong things. (Or because they are doing dumb things and don't want to be embarrassed.) The people absolutely sould know about such actions!

[canetoad]

76. Maybe this is the first step

to a world where there are NO nuclear codes.

[JDPriestly]

89. The Wikileaks documents, at least those I have seen, do not contain

any nuclear codes. They contain the impressions of our employees, yours and mine in the state department, of meetings they have held, people they have met and of course, gossip they have heard.

These items should not be secret in the first place.

Assange and the NY Times, Guardian, Der Spiegel, etc. know the rules. We are supposed to have a free press. Our press could probably get the codes to nuclear weapons if they really wanted them, but no one would want that kind of thing leaked.

But keeping the Wikileaks that I read secret is completely absurd and unnecessary. Good reporters should be ferreting this information out. If our press were doing its job, Wikileaks would not exist.

[PufPuf23]

109. What won't you excuse?

The State Department documents released are not top security and covert compartmentalized communications.

The current State Department misled the public regards to the coup in Honduras and inappropriately applied pressure against Spain while denying domestic and international law brought about because of victory of the Allies in WWII to not prosecute Iraq war criminals that we hanged from post WWII tribunals in Germany and Japan.

The releases are embarrassing, hypocritical, and ignore domestic law and international treaties and supposed norms of modern civilization. Documents and actions of higher classifications of comparmentalized intelligence, actions, and most agencies have not been released.

One could ponder the fact that there are likely competing pods in our government-economic structure that are lawless and in competition. Some if not most are in convergent interests with elite globalists.

Your mention of nuclear codes is a false dicotomy and you know that there are shades of gray.

I have wondered how to judge WikiLeaks and the reaction is telling in the media, government, and at DU.

[Enthusiast]

134. Plus one.

As we have seen time and again, there are those on DU that would excuse ANY behavior by the Obama Administration.

[tekisui]

114. OH NOESS!!!11!! TEH NUCULAR CODEZ111!!!!!1

Be afraid! Submit! Don't ask questions! Don't look for truth!

[rhett o rick]

158. Once again you are on the wrong side of freedom. "Classified documents" now include everything our

government does. They "classify" anything that might be the least be embarrassing. Our government's misuse of document classification is putting the real classified documents in danger.

This issue proves that we dont have freedom of the press. Classified documents my ass.

Seems you are on the side of tyranny.

[laughingliberal]

4. K & R nt

[tavalon]

5. Yeah, it's what I called the Rumsfeld Doctrine many years ago

It's not the act that is illegal, it is the documentation of the act which is illegal. You can torture them, but don't take pictures.

:banghead:

[KoKo]

138. +1.....another good insight!

[tblue37]

6. Oh, and by the way, the fact that the government has reacted so

ham-handedly shows that they have no clue about what really matters or about what their behavior reveals about them.

[EFerrari]

10. It shows that they are not very concerned about what we think.

[tavalon]

17. Pretty much becomes clearer with each iteration

National politics is FUBAR. While I'm going to stay here to keep sharp, I'm going local with my actions. I have a number of friends who continue to use direct action with many causes, some who are vets of the famous WTO shutdown up here. They know the ropes and I've come to realize that all of those letters I write to the White House, to members of Congress, letters to the editor are just not doing anything except increasing my typing skill.

[EFerrari]

28. A tipping point has been reached, definitely.

I still don't know which way to step. But it has been nauseating watching administration officials join the right wing in lying to the public with impunity.

[tavalon]

106. Hasn't it, though?

I never expected such rage fatigue with this administration.

[Enthusiast]

137. Rage fatigue.

You said it.

[Raksha]

48. I'm starting to think along the same lines. Why keep signing all these damn petitions

when it's obvious the PTB don't give a damn what we think? They don't even bother to hide it any more.

[defendandprotect]

103. Don't want to suggest that signing petitions is meaningless... however...

what we have to note is that these liberal organizations are not uniting in

actions -- demonstrations. There are a few exceptions.

[dixiegrrrrl]

87. "letters to the editor are just not doing anything"

We send letters, we e-mail, we call.

TPTB send checks...lots and lots of checks.
And percs.

Which makes the Congress robots very comfortable and happy.

So what do we need to suggest that will make them uncomfortable and unhappy?

They know they have until 2012 to do what they want.

[Enthusiast]

135. Not a spec of moral justice

in their hearts. Except for blue collar criminals, that is.

[Toucano]

12. Agree whole-heartedly, but I just want to point out that the "Founding Fathers"

were not a monolithic block of enlightened thinking.

There were Federalists and Republicans (Democratic-Republicans) just as today...

The Alien and Sedition Acts were a product of "the Founding Fathers" as much as the Bill of Rights.

[tblue37]

15. Yeah. Mainly I was thinking of Jefferson and Franklin, to be honest.

[tblue37]

13. Something just occurred to me. I know that Assange is said to be unusually

brilliant. I wonder whether he actually realized this and deliberately worked to make sure the government's reaction was as stark as it turned out to be.

I have been wondering why he keeps telegraphing his document releases, thus giving the government time to try to prevent him. I also was wondering why he dribbles them out so slowly. Maybe he wants the government to publicly and repeatedly reveal itself as tyrannical and to do so over a period of weeks and months, thus keeping not just the documents but also the tyrannical attitudes and behavior of the government (and of its lapdog "journalists") front and center in the news over the long term, rather than letting this news become a momentary flash in the pan.

In other words, Assange might be the guy playing twelve-dimensional chess here!

[tavalon]

20. Yeah, I think he really is

Every breath he draws is more proof that he's winning.

[indimuse]

36. very interesting..I guess we shall see..

knr!

[Kaleko]

47. That is exactly Assange's strategy: Keep our oppressors sweating bullets

and revealing themselves as criminal conspirators who act as if they are above the law - which they more or less are at this point.

Wikileaks functions as a litmus test, and the Obama admin failed it!

[Ramulux]

73. Read his book

He explains exactly what he hopes to achieve by doing all this. His goal is to force the government to crack down on their secret-keeping to the point where it cannot function and engage in this kind of transparency-free behavior without risking losing secrets.

The point is that if the risk of leaks on a large scale is always present it severely diminishes the ability of the government to spread out their secret activities amongst the various government agencies. If that happens, America will be simply unable to do all the things it currently does, for fear of leaks.

The documents themselves dont mean anything, it is simply the fact that they have been leaked that produces the result Assange is aiming for. Obama wishes he could play three-dimensional chess this well. The best part is that the media is still scratching their heads wondering why he is doing this, and they somehow dont realize that the dude put his beliefs in a book that anyone can buy.

[defendandprotect]

93. Not familiar with his writings and other projects, but Thom Hartmann was

noting his previous campaigns the other day --

exposing our system.

[dbmk]

75. Or maybe he has a lot of product.

..and don't want to unload it all at the same time to avoid saturation of the market, but he wants attention when he does.

The latest release sadly makes it seem that attention is more important for wikileaks than content that matters.

[defendandprotect]

95. Keep in mind that unless you're playing chess on a computer, there are emotions

involved which effect the game --

Think most of all -- as desperately as US government wants to destroy this

messenger -- it keeps info about the leaks and details of them in the news --

rather than a one day story.

Though internet is examining the info -- looks more like corporate-press is

trying to bury it/?

[Bluerthanblue]

14. I think that if our government REALLY wanted to catch Mr. Assange he would

be caught already.

What's more, it isn't only the US that is angry with Mr.Assange.


I think your point could be well made if applied to some of the republican politicians and right wing pundits who are calling for his murder. That reveals the ugly truth of what they are really all about-

And the sloppy and biased way in which much of the media is covering this issue should trouble people- no matter which side of the fence they stand on.

[tavalon]

21. Why do you think they want Assange to remain rogue?

How does it serve them?

[Bluerthanblue]

27. I don't know if they want him to "remain rogue" or how

his being free serves them at all. I do believe that if the US really and truly wanted him- with the malicious intent that some suggest, it would have been a done deal by now. He could have been "gotten" before he leaked anything of substance about the US imo- I'm relieved that didn't happen, even if I have some problems with what Mr.Assange is doing.

Bush wanted Hussein, he got him.

[calimary]

51. VERY telling. Especially when bin Laden still walks free.

Suddenly I'm wondering if there's just a whole shitload people (many of them in power NOW, NOT just during the miserable bush years) who still want him walking around out there without being caught. "bush wanted Hussein, he got him." Perhaps he didn't want bin Laden. Maybe Obama doesn't either?

DAMMIT! As time goes on all that happens for me is I grow more suspicious and cynical. Somehow (I know I know, pretty damn stupid and naive of me) I had hoped that Obama might be different.

[Bluerthanblue]

85. I'm not so sure that Bin Laden still walks free- do you

remember those videos that were released that were supposedly him yet when compared with actual photos of the man the features were WAY off?
I don't think Bush wanted bin Laden- If he'd been captured what would he have used as the reason to continue his war on 'terra'?

He even said that he didn't really care about finding bin Laden during an interview. I'll try and locate it if you are sincerly interested.

I KNOW that President Obama is different than Bush was- If you don't than I'm sorry, but you are not looking very clearly or closely.

:hi:

[Enthusiast]

141. Bingo!

I mean, come on. We couldn't get Bin Laden if we really wanted him?

[midnight]

148. So many good conclusions.....

[liberation]

81. So you do know, or you don't know... make up your mind.

Your only justification for your train of thought is that no one can ever outsmart America because we're the bestest, or at least that is what the movies show.

[Bluerthanblue]

88. what???? I don't presume to

KNOW what the Administration thinks- and I'm hardly claiming that America is "the bestest"- if you've read many of my posts over the years you'd probably argue the opposite. What I was TRYING to say was that I believe that our government is VERY capable of causing Mr.Assange to disappear, or of bringing him into custody if they truly desired.

As for his "remaining rogue" that wasn't my description. I don't think the Administration is happy with what Mr. Assange is doing, but because he is not an American citizen, he is not subject to our laws. He can't be tried with "treason" and killing him (besides being wrong) would only make him a martyr and be counter productive.

:shrug:

[LiberalLovinLug]

45. They don't want a martyr?

The attention on him and Wikileaks would only increase with an arrest and a big show trial.

And secondly, I don't think there is anything legitimate they could charge him with is there? He did not "steal" the information, he is only the messenger. As well, he can only be tried for some kind of treason or crimes against the state if it is brought on by Australia. Which got me wondering...did he leave out sensitive Ausie documents to avoid that?

[axollot]

53. Australia is fully complying with the USA's wishes in hunting him down. Not sure

what they are charging him with but do know they are 'co-operating' whatever that means.

John Howard made sure Australia's diplomacy was in lock step with the US after 9/11 the arsehole.
cheers
Sandy

[defendandprotect]

96. Having Australia do the dirty work may be more what US intends....

less evidence of our "tyrannical" behavior -- !!

[Bluerthanblue]

97. It is my understanding that Australia was pretty annoyed with him

even before the recent US document dumps-
he has more 'enemies' than just the US.

[glitch]

16. Not just the lapdog press, google, paypal, amazon have all proven to be craven.

Corporations are outing themselves all over the place.

[tblue37]

22. Yep. We (i.e., the people) are actually learning quite a lot from these reactions! nt

[EFerrari]

29. The tiny space between government and corporations is closing fast

and right out in the open.

[glitch]

40. Right out in the open and quite gleefully by the closers.

What a weird world they inhabit. :shudder:

[PufPuf23]

115. Reality for individuals that pay attentionis ever more B&W as the

curtains are drawn back, whether strategically, tactically, or anti-entrenched convergent interests.

Peace to you and yours EF.

[meow mix]

18. +rec

[N_E_1 for Tennis]

23. K & R ++++ n/t

[leftstreet]

24. K&R

[lunatica]

25. kick'd and rec'd

Our eyes are being pried open, like it or not.

[Champion Jack]

26. K & R +100,000,000,000

[Odin2005]

30. Julian has expose the brick wall behind the curtains and props.

Politics is a joke, they are all on the same side, the Corporatist side

[Cleita]

31. He has proven that our government is a developing tyranny.

Also, the memos sent to government employees that they cannot go to WikiLeaks even on their home computers without risking their jobs or being hired at future jobs sure smacks of totalitarianism to me and there is no other way to spin it.

[avaistheone1]

42. That message was also sent to college students in the political science department

at Columbia University. Essentially they were told if they wanted future government employment they had better not access or look at the wikileaks files. They were told the documents were confidential and as government employees they have to learn to keep confidences. Oh my...these kind of confidences!!

[Raksha]

52. That kind of invasive tyranny reminds me of the former Soviet Union.

I grew up believing America was SOOOO much better than that. Wonder how old I was when I first heard the phrase "it's a free country." Probably around three.

[northernlights]

32. The reaction by US and all governments was Assange's goal

drive them freakin' insane in response to their loss of privacy/secrecy. Didn't take much, either, did it.

The final goal is for them to choke themselve's on their own nutty response.

As to the supposedly embarrasing leaks (love how they chose the word "embarrasing" to downplay the significance of the contents), well I suppose you could find Obama strongarming an ally (Spain) to protect our well-known war criminals and going in the face of the Geneva Conventions on torture -- to which we are a co-signer -- embarrassing.

Personally, I find that makes him a war criminal after the fact. More than a little embarrassing.

[Kaleko]

65. So true. And another byproduct of Wikileaks is that it gives honest businesses

a fighting chance to compete against their lying, betraying, people-stomping competitors.

The more ruthless you are, the greater the danger of someone going to expose you on the platform that Wikileaks has created for truth-tellers.

[northernlights]

79. yup. expose the criminals and the honest have a fighting chance...nt

[livingonearth]

33. Recommended1

How does one "kick" something like this? Or is kick and recommend the same thing?

[druidity33]

41. You "kicked it" by replying...

A rec is different in that you have to hit the "Recommend" button.

:)

[abelenkpe]

34. K & R

All great observations. Personally I just hope we get to see what documents he obtained from the banks. :)

[DemReadingDU]

62. I think the strong reaction this week is because

Wikileaks has info about the banks that if released will bring down some banks. Nope, TPTB don't want anything to come out that would upset their global financial system.

[Enthusiast]

144. Considering recent revelations about actions of the fed

I would say that is a distinct possibility.

[indimuse]

35. KNR! n/t

[pnwmom]

37. The Founding Fathers never thought that diplomatic messages

needed to be exposed to the public view.

[Raksha]

46. That's true, but they never thought exposing those messages was "treason"

or a crime deserving of death either. I think the founding fathers knew the difference between embarrassment and treason.

[pnwmom]

50. If such exposure could lead to the death or exposure of a US spy

such as Valerie Plame, I'm certain they would have.

Why were we so up in arms when Valerie Plame and her network were exposed, but we think it's fine when an Australian anarchist could do the same thing?

[Raksha]

56. Because of WHO outed Valerie Plame, among other things.

None other than Vice-President Deadeye Dick, who did it knowing full well she was undercover and that he was endangering her and her network. AND he did it out of spite, because her husband wrote an Op-Ed called "What I didn't find in Africa" exposing the POTUS for the liar he is.

There is no reason to believe Julian Assange is acting out of spite or deliberately endangering anyone. I think one reason the information has been leaking out relatively slowly is that Wikileaks is redacting the names of anyone who might be compromised in that way.

[Enthusiast]

145. I agree with you

I honestly don't understand how anyone could see it differently.

[liberation]

83. That's a false equivalence, and as such a fallacy....

... next excuse, please.

[TheMadMonk]

120. Would you include those "spies" actively engaged in illegal activities?

Or engaged in them in the past and now find themselves outed?

The outrage over Plame (here at least) was far more about the reasons for the exposure than what was exposed.

[EFerrari]

59. Oh, baloney. The Adams' letters to each other were published all over

the country.

Of course they knew it could happen.

[bhikkhu]

66. And Madison's full notes of the "secret" constitutional convention

were intended to be held unpublished until some later date, but then they went ahead and released them anyway. When good people act with good intentions, there is nothing to hide.

[Enthusiast]

146. Thank you for this.

"When good people act with good intentions, there is nothing to hide."

[liberation]

82. The founding fathers also thought that blacks were worth 3/5ths as much as whites...

... and that only land owning white males had the right to vote. I guess then the NBA should allow teams to use 6 players in court when they are all black... especially on election day.

However, the more pertinent question is what were the founding father's views on having sex without protection, which is the charge against Mr. Assange. Given Jefferson's history with Sally Hemings, one could make a case that they were A-OK with not using ye olde raincoat. Which makes your point of invoking the founding fathers sort of moot, no? Since they seem to agree with Assange in that regard, both in passive opinion and active behavior.

[Bluenorthwest]

139. The Founding Fathers! They WERE Julian!

They were all traitors to their nation, England. They fucked more 'state secrets' than any group of peopel up until that time. Get real.

[ZombieHorde]

38. Recommended for the following line...

"Think about the way that our government has turned all of its considerable power to hunting down a man who has merely revealed the truth, while refusing even to inconvenience those who have committed war crimes, and think about the way our government has pressured other countries' governments into helping to persecute Assange."

I don't think our government has turned all of its considerable power to hunting down a Assange, but the fact they have been putting more pressure on him than war criminals is telling.

[PufPuf23]

117. An agnostic Amen, Clear and to the point. nt

[Enthusiast]

147. PLUS ONE!

Telling indeed. It's something we would expect from the old Soviet Union or our enemies in WWII.

[Lint Head]

39. There is no free press in the United States of America

Democracy Now is the closest thing but it does not reach enough people.

[Citizen Worker]

44. Well said and on point but there are too many dots for Joe and Suzie Sixpack to connect.

[axollot]

49. Agree. I think the US looks weak chasing this man who is still a few

chess moves ahead of them no matter what happens at this point. It's like not taking lotions on the plane.

It takes the US eye off the ball, has us chasing our tail, giving away money and covering our tracks all for the very elite. Not in the US in the world.

We need to get a collective grip as a country and we need to let our government know we do not believe in the hunting down of Assange - we are far to comfortable becoming a banana republic for some ungodly reason.

How soon everyone forgets history, even the wealthy are not immune, not if they are to be served up as sacrifices by the media.

God I hope Assange has used a sophisticated disguise when he became the face of these file dumps. *sigh*

/rant off

[robinlynne]

54. I was shocked to watch PBS newshour. They spoke against Assange for 20 minutes.

the question of whether the leaks were good for our country was never discussed.

[EFerrari]

60. When was that? Maybe I can go to the site and watch. n/t

[sendero]

55. Well said..

... and exactly correct.

For anyone that thinks we still have a "democracy", you'd better reevaluate in light of our "democratic" governments's response to this.

[Uncle Joe]

57. Ich bin ein Beijinger

Thanks for the thread, tblue.:thumbsup:

[Mhak]

58. I agree entirely OP, but you're still painting this issue as black and white.

It's really not. Yes, I think Assange is doing a great thing. Yes, I think the public deserves to know about these things. Yes, I think if the entire world agreed to be 100% transparent on every issue there is, this world would be a better place. But considering that will never happen, no, I don't think it's fair to tell America "you can't keep secrets, even if the rest of the world will and you'll be at a severe disadvantage in terms of international relations and national security if you try not to!"

I'd love it if the world worked in a way where secrets weren't necessary. I'd LOVE to see wikileaks start a trend that eventually has every nation scared to keep secrets because they know they might just get revealed. THAT WOULD BE GREAT! But considering it will never happen, I'm not willing to agree to cripple our nation by just saying "don't keep secrets, they're bad."

[EFerrari]

61. I don't think Wikileaks is starting a trend.

They are just manifesting one. And the government knows that. That's in part why they are so viciously attacking Julian, they know their M.O. will be increasingly challenged and they can't stop it unless they shut down the net.

[DemReadingDU]

63. TPTB are fearful of the info Wikileaks has about the banks

If the info about banks is released, it could bring down a bank or more. The TPTB don't want anything to upset their global financial system. So TPTB is attempting to stop Assange and Wikileaks.

[EFerrari]

64. Sure. And they are looking around, worried about any other

point of entry as well.

Hillary Clinton Blasts Wikileaks: Nothing laudible, nothing brave

http://upload.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=385x531079

[liberation]

101. Why do some people keep thinking a strawman argument tastes better with a side of red herring?

Straw and fermented fish are not even a good taste combination!

[molly77]

67. If the govt. is totally secret about everything that is important

And we no longer have our constitutional rights after 9/11...the media is "state" ...over 50% of the budget going to the DOD...can we just conclude that we are fascist.Not to mention the difficulties which come with traveling now. In one of the Julian Assange videos , he says that Europe is actively persecuting the poor, insulating itself against the rest of the world, and still stealing other country's resources. Are we any different? Looks like a world wide effort.

I have put the videos up on a few other posts.Very revealing to see him talk in person. I trust him even more.Have read that his heroes are Kurt Vonnegut and Che Guevera.

[defendandprotect]

92. +1 --

and I also have positive response to Assange --

Our "free press" is so long gone even I can't remember it --

CIA "journalists" going back to 60's and probably before that with

Congress never banning that practice.

And, Military journalism covering the wars -- only "embedded" journalists

with military troops to speak of what's really going on!!

[Hardrada]

125. CIA -backed literary magazines (1950's)

[DeSwiss]

68. Exactly!!!

"The reaction of the US government and its lapdog press is the most important and damaging truth revealed thus far by Wikileaks!"

And now they are threatening http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/12/04/state-department-to-colum_n_792059.html">college students with the purpose of trying to further tamp down the explicit exposure of their naked assess by telling them to never post anything about Wikileaks on their Facebook accounts, nor should they link to Wikileaks if they ever want to work for these MASTERS OF TYRANNY.

- Tyranny hates the light. If we won't stop them now, it is surely too late..........

K&R

[sabrina 1]

70. Well said, and I could not agree more. Very revealing, the reaction

of both parties and our useless, coopted media. Have you ever seen such bi-partisanship before? If ever anything proves that our democracy is only an illusion, this has done it.

[caseymoz]

71. It is a signal that the US has died.

Its culture, its ideals are gone. Its press has been subverted but made to look free. Its government system as it was designed to work is dead. Its propaganda apparatus is massive, and its people so misled and mis-educated that that they can't detect it.

Anybody opposing our government now is not "the opposition" or "progressives" or even democrats. We're actually now dissidents, soon to be treated as such as the government tries to contain the damage.

Things look to get far worse this next decade but this can't continue much longer than that. Looking at where we stood in 2000 and what our country looks this trajectory is just terrible, how far we've fallen and stooped in such a short time is just incredible. Amazing what electing the worst president ever will do.

[defendandprotect]

98. +1 --

[Enthusiast]

149. We fell off a cliff in 2000.

This being the direct results of a presidential election with falsified results. They did not steal an election because they had good intentions. By 2008 they had rectified the election conundrum. I will say nothing to clarify my previous sentence.

[caseymoz]

156. Except the election was close enough to steal in one state.

I know strictly speaking we didn't elect him, but even there, it was so damn close. Why? I mean history, if any, will see clearly how undeniably poor a candidate George W. Bush was. It should have never even been close. The guy should have never been in the same region as a nomination.

Yet, somehow, so many people were so dumb as to vote for him, then voted for him again four years later, and now that they know how bad he was, still put up candidates with the very same incompetence, meanness and ideological delusion.

And now that the choice has been affirmed with an army of politicians as bad or worse than Bush, I think it's unfortunately, proper to say we elected him.

[MrMickeysMom]

72. K & R

Highly, highly recommended!

[bc3000]

74. K&R good post

[Oceansaway]

78. K&R...n/t

[malaise]

80. Great post

Rec

[tblue37]

108. Thanks! nt

[madrchsod]

84. yup...that`s why the internet is so important for freedom...

[jannyk]

86. Kick & Rec!

[Name removed]

90. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[defendandprotect]

91. +1000% -- k/r

Not only has Assange exposed the tyrannical authoritarian mindset at the core of our government, but he has also proven without a doubt that our so-called free press is actually in collusion with the government it is supposed to stand as watchdog over.

Furthermore, the fact that so many politicians, office hodlers, and "journalists" are actually calling for the extrajudicial murder of this man is a much more damaging revelation about how the US conducts business than the revelation that some diplomats have mocked government leaders of other countries.

The reaction of the US government and its lapdog press is the most important and damaging truth revealed thus far by WikiLeaks!


:)

[harmonicon]

94. Revealed? Once again highlighted, maybe, but this has been known for too long. nt

[tomp]

132. agreed! though current specifics are nice. nt

[Faryn Balyncd]

100. +1000

:kick:

[BrklynLiberal]

102. Oh yes...I do remember something during the campaign about "TRANSPARENCY"

[Gravel Democrat]

104. Fußtritt und empfohlen

[xchrom]

105. Recommend

[PufPuf23]

107. Our democratic society and free press is not a fact. circa 2010. nt

[democrank]

110. Who is on Dancing with the Stars next?

[Enthusiast]

150. Dancing with the Stars?

Oregon is playing Auburn in the national championship game!

[tblue37]

111. Cool. I never got to the top of the right-hand side of the "greatest"

page before. It looks as though a lot of people have been thinking the same way that I have been thinking.

[Catherina]

112. Enthusiastically rec'd. n/t

[mackerel]

113. Let's face it their going to take Assange down

but please let it be after he exposes the banks.

I love Aussies!

[Catherina]

119. We have a long history of executing inconvenient people.

Remember this guy?



We organized 15,000 special force guerilla types to hunt him down, encircle him and, execute him and then lie about it to pretend he died in combat. To add insult to injury

CIA agent auctions Che Guevara's hair

Gustavo Villoldo, one of the CIA agents responsible for the death of the Che Guevara, shown on the left, will auction a lock of hair that he cut from the Che's head before his murder on October 9, 1967. He claims he is doing it for the good of history and to close the subject. He's also selling a scrap book that includes a map used to follow the Che. The auction will be conducted by Heritage Auction Galleries in Dallas, and he expects to make around $7m

That lock of Che Guevara's hair fetched $100,000 at a Dallas auction.





Julian Assange better watch out. In his case, I don't expect an execution, I expect them to try to make him mad, chemically. As they tried with Ellsberg.

Ellsberg later claimed that after his trial ended, Watergate prosecutor William H. Merrill informed him of an aborted plot by Liddy and the "plumbers" to have 12 Cuban-Americans who had previously worked for the CIA to "totally incapacitate" Ellsberg as he appeared at a public rally, though it is unclear whether that meant to assassinate Ellsberg or merely to hospitalize him.<24><25> In his autobiography, Liddy describes an "Ellsberg neutralization proposal" originating from Howard Hunt, which involved drugging Ellsberg with LSD, by dissolving it in his soup, at a fund-raising dinner in Washington in order to "have Ellsberg incoherent by the time he was to speak" and thus "make him appear a near burnt-out drug case" and "discredit him". The plot involved waiters from the Miami Cuban community. According to Liddy, when the plan was finally approved, "there was no longer enough lead time to get the Cuban waiters up from their Miami hotels and into place in the Washington Hotel where the dinner was to take place" and the plan was "put into abeyance pending another opportunity".<26>

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Daniel_Ellsberg

[Enthusiast]

151. "I love Aussies!"

With the exception of Rupert Murdoch.

[pmorlan1]

116. Excellent Post

Sadly, your post is right on target.

[Honeycombe8]

118. The problem....

is that the information was possibly illegally leaked, and besides "informing" the American public, it also "informed" the rest of the world. Harm has been done to the country. By a person who is not an American, to boot.

Assange didn't print leaked information for the public good. Assange cares about one thing: Assange.

Follow the money. If there weren't money in it, Assange wouldn't have bothered.

And who the hell cares what he thinks about Hillary Clinton, anyway? This guy has a real arrogance problem. But what do you expect from a possible rapist?

[Gravel Democrat]

126. "But what do you expect from a possible rapist?"

A fascinating, and stunning, line of "reasoning".

Assange didn't print leaked information for the public good. Assange cares about one thing: Assange.

Follow the money. If there weren't money in it, Assange wouldn't have bothered.

You can read minds too!

This much I know:

My government wants to read my email, listen to my phone calls, track my spending and tell me what to buy.

So I'm absolutely ecstatic that for once, just once, even if a temporary thing, someone has a scope up Uncle Sams underwear for a change. See, I'm so old that I remember when the Media did something besides read press releases and talk of warm feelings running up their legs.

[Celtic Raven]

142. Right there with you

See, I'm so old that I remember when the Media did something besides read press releases and talk of warm feelings running up their legs.

:thumbsup:

[DemReadingDU]

154. yep, me too

"See, I'm so old that I remember when the Media did something besides read press releases and talk of warm feelings running up their legs."

[Enthusiast]

152. You must be joking.

:rofl:

[Arctic Dave]

121. Fantastic summary. Tip of the hat. Nt

[AllyCat]

122. Oddly enough, I tell "progressive" people this and they look at me cross-eyed

People just seem to have no conception. Our vantage point is so skewed.

[newtothegame]

123. I highly doubt the Founding Father's goal for the press..

was to try as hard as possible to widely disseminate every document deemed classified by the very government they were forming.

Just a hunch.

[EFerrari]

128. "Information is the currency of democracy." Jefferson. n/t

[tomp]

133. fail.

the number and nature of secrets kept in jefferson's time vs the number and nature of those kept now are CLEARLY AND INARGUABLY apples vs oranges. that you would conflate the two time periods and and ignore historical developments since jefferson says an awful lot about the way you think (or don't).

[Canuckistanian]

124. Eloquently stated, tblue37

K&R

Glad this made it to the top.

[Smarmie Doofus]

129. An even 300. n/t

[gtar100]

130. Yes, Yes, Yes!

[leveymg]

131. The worst part is the prohibitions on reading the materials released. Like a totalitarian state

This is a step toward an Official Secrets Act and the stifling of all leaks. I am disgusted by the way the Obama Administration has dealt with this. Obama is no civil libertarian - he's taken the process further than Bush.

[uponit7771]

136. The coordinated reaction is BEYOND discusting

[kgnu_fan]

140. Which side are you on? That is what Wikileaks reveals

Are you for the powerful? Or are you for the people of the world?

[Celtic Raven]

143. Well said tblue37!

K&R for the OP

:yourock:

[Enthusiast]

153. K&R

Great post! :fistbump:

[colbertforpresident]

155. Call your rep and ask

what are you doing to help stop the waste and corruption that has been found out since the release from wikileaks?

[rhett o rick]

157. His response: "The same damn thing I did about previously known corruption. Enjoy it." nm

[defendandprotect]

159. Wiklileaks website .... HERE

Evidently, you can get thru it via Bing -- but here it is ....

http://wikileaks.ch/support.html

with all info on donating if anyone wishes to do so -- free of Pay Pal!!

[90-percent]

160. Wikileaks

My wife has been on a Good Morning America and ABC evening news kick the last few weeks. I get the impression they are painting Assange as this years version of Osama Bin Laden!

she seems to have the impression that these leaks have caused a lot of good USA supporting people in our war Zones have been killed as a result of the leaks. (Like the people killed by Scooter's leaks about Plame)

Being a DU reader, that strikes me as ABSOLUTE MSM BULLSHIT PRO CORPORATE PROPAGANDA! Wikileaks has gone about these releases in a professional responsible manner to insure such things would not happen. their stuff has been ultra-vetted by other journalists to prevent such tragedies.

I like what Noam said on Democracy Now, that was linked at DU this week; paraphrasing; "The leaks show the contempt governments have to the concept of DEMOCRACY"

Nice to see the people that took a vow to uphold the American Constitution have so much contempt for what the Constitution stands for, huh?

Clearly, the Constitution is just some appeasement to the Little People to maintain the illusion that we are a free nation.

-90% Jimmy

[bertman]

161. REC to the highest degree. You nailed it tblue37. nt

[WillyT]

162. HUGE K & R !!!

:kick:

[tblue37]

163. I think I hit a nerve with this post! nt

[Quantess]

164. Go, Assange!