Ladies and Gentlemen: It's Time to Name Names.

[MineralMan]

If you're disappointed in President Obama and want someone else to run on the Democratic ticket in 2012, it's time to start naming names. Who do you want? Who will meet your goals and have a chance of being elected? If you're serious about putting forward a primary candidate against President Obama, it's time to start talking up your choice.

It's time to fish or cut bait. Let's hear some names, along with your reasons for choosing that individual. Provide some links to show that the person supports the progressive goals you support, and offer some reasons why your choice can actually prevail, both in the primary and general election in 2012. Show us. Tell us. Make it clear that you have a suggestion for a candidate who can not only win in the 2012 Democratic Convention, but also in the election in November, 2012.

Let's discuss possible candidates. Let's look at their record of success in elections. Let's look a their statements about issues that are important. Let's assess their popularity amongst the electorate. It does no good to name a candidate who cannot possible win in November, 2012. If you want to primary President Obama, it's time to get started pumping up your candidate so he or she will have a real chance.

So, who will it be. Who's your choice? You don't like President Obama? Who do you want? It is that simple.

[Lucian]

1. Dennis Kucinich.

If I have to list why, you've been sleeping under a rock for ten years.

[OregonBlue]

7. You are supposed to name a "serious" candidate. One who could actually win. As much as we may love

Kucinich, he doesn't have any better chance now than he had last time. Not to mention that many here on DU consider him a traitor for his healthcare vote.

[Lucian]

23. He had a good reason for his healthcare vote.

And I agree with him.

And he is a serious candidate. If people quit listening to the nonsense from the MSM that's said about him, then people will vote for him.

[OregonBlue]

31. So do I but many here at DU were ready to drum him out of the party as a traitor.

And while I love Kuch, people are NOT going to quit listening to the nonsense from the MSM. He will not get any more votes that he got last time. Sad but true.

[Skittles]

176. people vote glamor over substance

THAT is for sure

[treestar]

184. How can there be any excuse for voting for that gift to the corporations?

:sarcasm: And what if he had been President? Why would Nelson and Lieberman have voted differently?

[Skittles]

175. he refused to vote for a piece of SHIT "healthcare reform" bill

oh dear; heaven forbid a TRUE PROGRESSIVE weigh in

[MineralMan]

8. I know who Kucinich is. I like him as a congressman.

He's tried a couple of times for the Presidency. He has failed miserably both times, not even coming close to winning a single primary. What makes you think he'll do any better in 2012? You see, you named a name, but you didn't offer any information on why you think he could possible win either the nomination or the General Election.

He's a nice guy, and a good progressive. He doesn't seem able to muster much support amongst the electorate though. That's an absolute necessity for any candidate who runs against President Obama, who still holds a good popularity with Democratic voters. Remember, a candidate who cannot win is a losing candidate. So, tell my why Kucinich has the real potential to win. If you can't, I'm going to dismiss him as a candidate, as he's been dismissed before.

[Lucian]

25. You've already dismissed him before I even replied to your nonsensical OP.

[MineralMan]

40. That's true. His history in the primaries for that office is

something that must be considered. He has done abysmally. He's a great congressman. Perhaps that's the highest office he's capable of winning. Reality is reality.

Finally, what's nonsensical about proposing a candidate for the Presidency. Lots of people are saying that President Obama should be primaried. If that's the sentiment, then doesn't it make sense that people would have someone in mind to oppose him in the primaries?

[Raksha]

156. I noticed that, which is why is why I didn't take the OP seriously and still don't.

It's just one MORE variation on the old song: "Who you gonna vote for? The Democratic sellout or the Repuke nutcase?" The only choice we've EVER had or ever will have, according to the conventional wisdom. Well, I am NOT resigned to that.

[Lucian]

163. I'm not either.

We can do a helluva lot better.

[Arkana]

192. Then who's your choice? Shit or get off the pot.

[Name removed]

70. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[ProSense]

9. He

would fall out of favor faster than blue dogs.

[NorthCarolina]

86. I seriously doubt that. nt

[stray cat]

53. Santa Claus!

[johnaries]

152. Although I like Kuch's principle's, the GOP would eat him alive.

I'm sorry, but he just doesn't have what it takes to be President.

Remember his poor performance in the last primary?

[Radical Activist]

195. He won't run and he won't do what it takes to win.

Dennis doesn't like to do things like pick up the phone to raise money. Ultimately, Dennis is his own biggest obstacle to being elected President, even if he did run, which he wont.

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

201. I love Dennis and supported him. He was my #1 choice in the primaries. However, the Corporate

Media takes glee in turning him into a nut. And sadly, many Democrats themselves have bought into the meme and narrative about Dennis. It's wrong. It's not fair, but it's the same. They treated Howard Dean like shit as well. So Dean won't work. And contrary to popular belief Howard Dean is pretty much a centrist. He's slightly to the left of Obama, but he is no tree-hugging liberal, that's for sure.

[bemildred]

2. I'm a lot more interested in Congress, to be honest.

That's where the power lies.

[MineralMan]

10. Yes. And there's lots of potential there. Fortunately, my

representative is very progressive, and one of my Senators is Al Franken. Amy Klobuchar is less than progressive in some areas, but she's a good, solid Democrat, and has voted progressively almost all of the time. She'll probably be running against Michele Bachmann in 2012. She'll have my vote and support.

[jerseygal]

3. Bruce Springsteen

After all he was Born in The USA

[MineralMan]

14. Right. But, you're a Jersey gal, so he's your hometown fave.

I don't think he has any political potential, though.

[namahage]

75. I certainly hope you're not insinuating that the current President is not. n/t

[jpgray]

4. I'd like to run candidate Obama against president Obama

They hate each other's guts, so that should be pretty easy to arrange. Also, the former is a proven winner while the latter looks increasingly vulnerable.

[MineralMan]

15. So, you have no suggestions for a candidate.

Never mind.

[jpgray]

30. Edit for dickishness on my part

Apologies if you read the reply before the edit.

[leveymg]

18. Best answer.

It's candidate Obama, by a landslide. From the Left. Too bad he forgot who elected him, and what all of us were voting for.



Hard to believe this was just two years ago.

[WCGreen]

103. Good one!

[treestar]

185. One knows what it is to be President and the other does not

All candidates are different from the person in office.

[BrklynLiberal]

5. My dream would be a Dean/Franken ticket..,

[MineralMan]

16. OK. Let's hear how Dean would do something different from

Obama and why you think he could win. He's already stated that he's not going to run against President Obama. He's voted with the President on every issue. Let's hear some details.

[Capn Sunshine]

36. This is reflective of the disconnect at DU

Howard Dean? A centrist who counsels reasonable compromise and straight talk. Sure he's a favorite here. I worked for him for three years, trying to get his campaign off the ground. I spoke with him often. I can tell you for a FACT he would govern exactly as Obama has.

Al Franken. Where to start. He's DLC. He hosted the initial soirees to get Kerry nominated , to defeat the Dean juggernaut. He's a centrist. He too would govern almost exactly like President Obama.

Bottom line, DUers create these magic unicorn pony dreams out of candidates who are in favor at the moment, but when they govern, the inability to be pure left is seen as a big ass liability if not a betrayal. These days, Duers are as in the dark about how things actually work as the Teabaggers, and have become just as annoying.

[Codeine]

41. Damn. That's a great post.

I wish we could rec individual posts.

[MineralMan]

42. That's an interesting post. I tend to agree with you.

[Capn Sunshine]

48. Thank You.

Reality bites, doesn't it?

[MineralMan]

52. Sometimes it does bite. Yes.

However, reality persists, despite my wishes. :rofl:

[OZark Dem]

51. Are you calling Duers the same as DLCers ?

[Imajika]

63. Well said...

"These days, Duers are as in the dark about how things actually work as the Teabaggers, and have become just as annoying."

Exactly correct. I would only add the word "some" before DUers.

There are quite a few smart cookies here who understand political realities very well.

[swilton]

90. I don't believe that Dean would have discarded the public option

the way that Obama did.

[tavalon]

170. Voted with the President on every issue?

A: Dean wasn't in the Congress and

B: Obama doesn't vote now. His job is to lead.

Dean has said he won't run against Obama. Parse that for a moment.


Now, if President Obama chooses to run for a second term, I will not support any primary contender. As poor as Obama's leadership skills and even moral compass have turned out to be, he is still better than any Republican out there now. So, the only way I would support anyone other than Obama in 2012 is if he chooses to step aside. If he chooses to step aside, Dean would be my choice and in that situation, I believe Dean would run. He will have all of the supporters who supported Obama and none of us will fall for the Dean Scream nonsense ever again.

[kickysnana]

102. +1

[spartan61]

6. I love Obama and worked my butt off on his campaign.

Sometimes I think he is much too nice to be President. We need someone who will stnad up to the repukes and tell it like it is instead of always trying to "make nice." I would like to see Howard Dean run again. Or Bernie Sanders (I know, he isn't a Dem, but I would vote for him in a heartbeat.)

[sarcasmo]

11. It doesn't matter who runs or wins they will do what is best for the Corporations and Bankers

While screwing the average American.

[MineralMan]

17. Ah, I see. So why are you even bothering to participate?

Seriously. If all is lost, what's the point?

[sendero]

12. Howard Dean..

... duh.

Although just about any actual Democrat would be better than Obama.

[MineralMan]

19. He doesn't seem that interested in the prospect.

He also supports President Obama in almost everything. Let's read some details about why you think he'd run and why you think he'd win.

[PassingFair]

55. How about Feingold/Dean or Elizabeth Warren/Feingold?

I can think of lots of Progressives I'd like
to see run, but I don't think any of them
would even THINK about it if the candidate
from the Republican side had a ghost of a chance
of winning an election.

If they put up Palin, then we should primary
Obama with an outspoken Progressive.

If they put up somebody like Lincoln Chaffee,
we'd better play it aloof.

[sendero]

131. I would be...

.. happy with either of those!

[OregonBlue]

150. The 50 state strategy was Howard Dean's baby. It got us a bunch of blue dogs so no, I don't think

Dean would be any different than the president. Love Howard Dean and I was a big time Deaniac but he is a centrist through and through.

[madfloridian]

174. That is not a true statement. Read this.

Dean's 50 state plan was not about left or right, but about moving power out of DC.

He may be a centrist, but he believes in standing up and speaking out, not being mealy-mouthed on issues.

It was not Dean who hand-picked the Blue Dogs...it was Rahm and Schumer.

[sendero]

196. At this point..

... I would relish the though of a true centrist. Obama is far to the right of center.

[veganlush]

13. Thom Hartmann/Bernie Sanders 2012

[MineralMan]

24. Uh...do you want to flesh that suggestion out with some

information? Tell us why you made the suggestion and why you think that ticket has a chance. This is not about a "dream" candidate, you know. Whoever is the candidate must be viable, or it's Romney/Palin or some other such nonsense. If you're going to propose someone, let's see some details about why.

[veganlush]

80. but a balance must be struck.

viability is important obviously, and sadly in involves everything from looks to money, but it can't be the only factor. Palin is the perfect example of someone who COULD make it to the oval office, but who would be useless if not dangerous in that capacity. Obama had viability, obviously, but he dropped the ball at exactly the wrong time and may not recover. By the way, I sincerely hope that he DOES recover, of course. I voted for him , donated to his campaign, foot and phone canvassed for him. Going by his demeanor and style in the campaign,in which he fought hard, I had no idea he would be so reluctant to fight once he achieved the oval office. With regard to Hartmann and Sanders, I have no idea if they would even be interested in running, and I really doubt that they would, but they are two people who see the big picture and are intelligent enough for the job. That's all I really know about them, but I know that much. They know that if you have a pet lion and a pet antelope, and you value both of them and wish to keep both of them, some rules, regulations and boundaries must be put into place to protect the antelope. This doesn't mean you hate the lion. We don't hate the rich, we simply know that we can't co-exist with them if all of the advantages go to them. Greedy people can't stop themselves and that is what we're seeing after eight years of the republicans led by Bush putting muzzles on the antelopes instead of on the lions.

[Jim__]

20. I don't believe it is time yet to choose the lesser evil.

We still have time to work on the democrats to act like progressives. Support Social Security, medicare and a public option health care. End the fucking wars. Stop the support of Wall Street and the banksters. If they can't do that, why would I ever vote democratic again. Republican lite is not an alternative.

[MineralMan]

26. OK. You're not interested in this exercise.

I feel you.

[zorahopkins]

21. Bernie Sanders?

Would Bernie Sanders run?

I like his ideas.

[MineralMan]

29. I don't know if he'd run. I do know that he would do even more

poorly in the primaries than Kucinich, though. Remember, the candidate must be viable. Bernie Sanders is not viable in any way as a Presidential candidate. No way. No how. I like Bernie very, very much, but he'd be gone in Iowa.

[johnaries]

154. Uh, Bernie's not a (D), he's an (I). He only caucuses with the Dems.

He would have to become a Dem first, and I doubt he would do that.

[patrice]

22. Isn't this pointless unless "we" also make the case for what/how our pick CAN DELIVER.

[MineralMan]

32. That's exactly what I asked people to do. So far, nobody's

stepped up. Some people have named the usual suspects. None have offered a single bit of evidence that their choice wants to run, could win in the primaries or in the general election. I was hoping some of those who have been saying that President Obama shouldn't be the candidate to offer some information that might be helpful. Crickets.

[patrice]

46. I do feel for them. No one likes being without options. But there is one option that makes sense AND

could deliver eventually: we MUST figure out how to stick together better to have at least some sort of chance of getting SOMETHING that we want out of Obama. And even if we don't succeed at that goal, at least we will have built something for ourselves out of the effort.

Personally, I believe it will damage EVERYONE left of center, if we just say something like "Write this one/Obama off" and walk away from the process. All that does is PROVE that we are NOTHING (but a bunch of splinter groups waiting for some TPB to adopt us) and we DESERVE to be ignored (until someone DEIGNS to validate who/what-ever it is that we think we are - for THEIR OWN reasons of course).

If we can't do this, it's just more of the same divide and conquer bullshit for our kids and grandkids and theirs and their . . . !

[MineralMan]

54. Yup. I agree. Either we come up with something or don't

If we don't, then we either support President Obama in 2012 or give the country to the Republicans. I'm just asking those people who want Obama replaced to step up and propose an alternative who can win. So far, I've not seen a name I can get behind.

[patrice]

77. The President NEEDS to take Howard Dean into his administration. If Dean will do it that is.

I would prefer that Dean run himself, because he has an organization and was DNC chair and because of his expertise on health care, but I don't imagine he's Left enough for a bunch of people who are splintering right now. He might be Right enough for some Republicans, but they don't break ranks against whomever their party picks.

Plus, I just don't think Dean'd do that unless there was a major draft and Obama just pretty much says he won't run.

[Union Scribe]

82. People have spoken, you weren't interested in listening.

What's it called when someone poses a question, pretending to be interested in replies, but everyone knows it's just to lazily dismiss the opinions of others? I'd say disingenuous, but maybe in the future they'll name it after you.

[MineralMan]

110. I have said what I think about the names that have been mentioned.

If you disagree with my assessment, you have the opportunity to make your case. I'm not lazily dismissing anything. I have specific reasons, and have stated them. I'm listening. Give me your ideas.

[Arkana]

193. We keep hearing the same completely non-viable names.

Dean, who has said he's not running. Grayson, who just got spanked in his reelection bid for Congress. Kucinich, who has two hilariously unsuccessful bids for the Presidency under his belt. Feingold, who has ALSO said he's not running. Sanders, who is an Independent.

Seems to me people are more intent on criticizing the OP than actually replying to it.

[EmeraldCityGrl]

155. Wish we could pull a Reagan...

Wonder what George Clooney's detailed politics are?

Point being, we need to look outside of the political arena
or we're just going to get more of the same.

[Bluenorthwest]

27. Your title is, shall we say, not my taste

That phrase has a terrible history. It is from the McCarthy era. Because of that, I'll skip this conversation, thanks.

[MineralMan]

34. OK. And yet you posted in the thread to tell us that you

have nobody to suggest. Whoever might run has a name. That's all I meant by naming names. The phrase has meaning in itself, and I'm not alluding to anything at all.

[Bluenorthwest]

58. No, I did not say I had no

suggestions, I said I do not like the tone of the title of the thread, I assumed you either used the phrase intentionally or that you were unaware of the history of that phrase.
No where did I say that I had nobody to suggest, that is your revision, your own flight of fancy. I said nothing about the subject of your OP at all. I commented on the title.

[MineralMan]

65. OK. I did not use the phrase to do anything but to ask for

names people wanted to propose. If you read something else into it, then that came from your head, not mine. You don't have to participate in the thread, of course. That's your choice. Thanks for commenting. Truly. You've misread my intentions. I can tell you that for sure.

[tabatha]

28. Sheldon Whitehouse or Sherrod Brown.

[MineralMan]

35. Why? Give us a reason to think about these two.

[FrancisTreptoe]

206. Sherrod Brown has been a great Senator for Ohio

I really agree with him on Election Reform and here are some more of his Viewpoints

I don't think he should run in 2012, but he is for sure a candidate to consider in future elections.

[xchrom]

33. i think obama is a bad president. a good man -- and a bad president.

but i also think he is the most popular guy in that office since reagan.

there won't be a primary. few people want to run against popular -- right or wrong.

[MineralMan]

37. If that is the case, then should we not be supporting him to avoid

a loss to the Republicans? I mean, if he will be the candidate, as you suggest, why would we try to ruin his chances. Will the alternative be a better President? I don't think so.

[xchrom]

50. i am indifferent to obama.

i pick and choose now. and nothing more than that.

i am as opposed to neo-liberals -- which can appear progressive -- in the democratic party as i am to republicans.

my sense of you is that you do not oppose neo-liberals -- and a candidate like obama or a bill clinton would suit you.

please do not be mistaken -- even though i vote dem -- work and donate to specific dem campaigns -- when in a more liberal part of the country went to democratic party meetings, built block organizations, etc --
you and i are not on the same side.

[MineralMan]

56. I oppose Republicans.

That's the side I'm on. I'm not willing to see them win. That's the side I'm on.

[xchrom]

66. right. i get that. nt

[AndrewP]

91. You are correct. n/t

[AndrewP]

92. You are correct. n/t

[AndrewP]

93. You are correct. n/t

[leftstreet]

38. WAIT...WHAT? So we're NOT holding his feet to the fire anymore?

Fascinating how the talking point is to 'move forward' as it were....

hmmm

[MineralMan]

44. Uh, I have no idea. I like him. You don't, apparently, based

on the general tenor of what you write here. So, who do you want? Why can your choice win? That's all I'm asking.

Personally, I think President Obama will run and win in 2012. If you feel otherwise, this is as good a time as any to propose an alternative, don't you think?

[leftstreet]

61. I want him to do his job. What happened to IT'S ONLY BEEN TWO YEARS!!!111

fascinating

[MineralMan]

68. The discontent with Obama's presidency began just weeks after

he took office. I'm still hopeful for his Presidency. He's up against some high odds. I want him to succeed.

[RUMMYisFROSTED]

190. I wonder why?

[NightWatcher]

39. or why dont we accept legit criticism of Obama without freaking out like a three year old?

Regardless of what relevant points are raised about the things he does (or more to the point does not do), a group of people will immediately swoop in and call it "bashing" and question our cred as "real democrats" and suggest that we never really supported Obama, but are somehow a lurker troll or repuke supporter.

Why dont we hold Obama to the standards that won him an overwhelmingly impressive election based on "Hope" and "Change"?

More and more of us were Hoping there would be more Change and are just not seeing enough of it. And no, I dont want my pony or jetski.

I type this in vain because I'll only be called a name or have my cred questioned.

Signed, Whatever

[MineralMan]

45. I'm not criticizing anyone for criticizing the President.

I'm asking for names to be put forward by those who want a primary battle in 2012. It's that simple. If you think there should be a primary battle, you must be thinking of someone you'd like to run against him.

I said nothing about a pony or a jetski. I asked who people though would make a good, viable candidate in the 2012 primaries and for their reasoning on the matter. I've seen a couple of suggestions, but little information that would lead me to think they could win.

Have you a suggestion?

[Starbucks Anarchist]

62. Few posts rise to that standard.

Most of the anti-Obama posts are content-free and come from the "Obama's a corporatist DLC shill who hates poor people" school of so-called logic. Not to mention that any post that's halfway positive about him is dismissed as "cheerleading."

[RetroLounge]

43. Really none of your business

It's that simple.

:puke:

RL

[MineralMan]

49. It isn't? How so? I'm deeply involved in politics. I want to

win the Presidency for our party in 2012. Many people have said that someone should run against President Obama in the primaries. How is asking for suggestions not my business. Apparently, you do not have any suggestions. That's OK. I hope your stomach ailment improves and that your barfing ends.

This is Democratic Underground. I am a member here. I can post an OP asking a question. You can ignore that OP. Life's good.

[Little Star]

47. Anybody know anything about Gov. Bill Ritter of Colorado?

[MineralMan]

59. I'm afraid I don't. Can you tell us something?

It's hard to keep track of everyone. That's why I posted this. Maybe there's a candidate none of us know about who has the characteristics needed to win the Presidency. So far, it's just been the same old names who have lost before or who don't stand a chance. So, tell us about Ritter.

[Little Star]

69. I live in MA and don't know anything about him.

That's why I asked the question. ;)

[Jim__]

67. He appointed Bennet as Colorado's senator.

Does that tell you anything?

[glinda]

57. How is this going to matter if there are not enough good Dems surrounding anyone we support?

A president or governor or any higher position relies upon support around them to make it work and pass things.
IMHO you can have Bernie as President but without the support it serves only to diminish the person's power along with their self esteem and ability to fight lies.

[MineralMan]

60. I don't know, to tell you the truth.

We seem to be a party divided. I know that doesn't work. If we continue on this path, we're likely to suffer even worse losses than we just did. That's unacceptable.

[glinda]

166. The only way is to get enough real Dems elected to make a majority and with MN.

heading for redistricting, it will be an even bigger obstacle. They have someone who has studied "roadblocks" but I think if we found the best people who are willing to sacrifice their "other high profile careers" then we stand a chance.

[MineralMan]

180. Every state is headed for redistricting. It's the census that

triggers that.

[closeupready]

64. It's too early for this.

The time to name names will come, but not right now necessarily. Unrecced.

[MineralMan]

72. Is it too early. Certainly the calls for a primary opponent have

already begun. The criticism of President Obama is constant. When is the time, do you think?

As for your unrec, that's of no concern to me. This is a busy, active thread. It is getting all the attention it needs. I don't care about the Greatest Page at all. You're more than welcome to click buttons, though, if you think it's important.

[closeupready]

74. Maybe you're correct and it IS time to think about other candidates.

Bernie Sanders or Howard Dean, IMO. Any number of Democrats who aren't just about pompous talk and flowery rhetoric - backed by nothing but hot air. Sanders and Dean have proven they are willing to take heat from establishment party insiders.

Just for starters.

[verges]

167. Is it?

If there is going to be a challenger, he should announce in the next few months.

[NNN0LHI]

71. Simon & Garfunkel

They can sing Bridge Over Troubled Water for entertainment.

Good thread by the way. Its almost like you are administering a Rorschach Test here.

Don

[Vinnie From Indy]

76. Hall & Oats maybe?

It's always a naked woman in all the ink blots.

[NNN0LHI]

78. That is what I told the doctor. All naked women. Everyone damn of them

He said I sounded like a sex maniac. I told the doctor he was the one making all the pornographic images so maybe he might be the sex maniac.

Guess I told him, eh?

Don

[MineralMan]

94. Thanks. I'm just trying to open a dialog. Unsuccessfully,

though, it seems.

[DiverDave]

73. Grayson

if he would govern as he has he would be a great prez.
I am so pissed off at Edwards, his words rang true to me and
working for the middle class HAS to be a central theme for the person
I vote for next time.

[MineralMan]

95. Grayson lost the race in his own district.

Why do you think he could win the Presidency? Seriously.

[PassingFair]

151. He's in FLORIDA. He pulled off a coup winning it in the first place.

Seriously.

Most politicians win some and lose some.

What's your point?

[Number23]

79. And the moral of this thread is...

"we got nothing." Anyone surprised?? :shrug:

For all of the wailing and screaming about how horrible this President is and how he's failed the entire solar system, I'd love if this board can put forth a SINGLE feasible name as a primary challenger. Someone who is more "left" than Obama but can win over moderate dems and conservative dems let alone independents and Republicans.

And more importantly, someone that black voters (who support this president around 88%), liberal voters (who support this president around 85%) and other groups will also support.

[Safetykitten]

81. It's 2010, we want names NOW! See, they got nothing!

[Union Scribe]

84. Surprised by what? The standard dismissive arrogance demonstrated?

No, I don't think anyone is surprised by that.

[Number23]

88. Even the replies to my post confirm it. They got absolutely NOTHING.

[MineralMan]

96. Well, the thread is open. If there's a valid suggestion, though,

I haven't heard it yet.

[Number23]

121. And you won't either. Anyone who thinks that black and other minority voters (as a whole)

will stand for a primary opponent to this president is too dumb to even be listened to, let alone taken seriously. And I'm lmao at the very THOUGHT of a Dem candidate winning an election without the black vote.

[MineralMan]

123. You could be correct. But, there appears to be some strong

support for a primary challenge to President Obama, at least in some circles. I'm just trying to get a feel for whether this is a serious thing, with actual people involved who want to run and who might be real contenders. I'm getting the feeling that there aren't those potential candidates, at least from the replies in the thread. Just some names with nothing else to indicate that they want to run or that they have any chance to win.

[closeupready]

183. Patronizing of you. And Ms. "I'm exhausted of defending you" who was laid off recently

would likely disagree with you.

[Number23]

191. An absolutely idiotic statement. Beyond stupid.

[paulk]

83. Al Franken

[MineralMan]

97. Al Franken isn't interested in running for President in 2012.

I know. I asked him the last time I saw him. He's a big supporter of President Obama, by the way.

[paulk]

104. I guess we're stuck with Obama then...

btw - I really don't understand these constant threads worrying about the 2012 elections, and especially worrying about Obama's reelection.

I, like many millions of other Americans, are focusing on how to keep a roof over my head for the next two years far more than I'm worrying about the political fortunes of a President who hasn't done much, quite frankly, to alleviate the situation I find myself in.

[MineralMan]

106. Yes, many people have immediate concerns that take

precedence over elections that are 2 years away. I certainly understand that. I'm not actually asking the question of people who are in that situation, of course. I hope your fortunes improve soon.

[Caretha]

112. What was the date

that you asked Franken?

[MineralMan]

115. He was in town here a few months ago. I talked to him then.

I don't remember the exact date.

[Caretha]

129. Why did you ask him?

[MineralMan]

132. Why would I not. I admire him a great deal, and worked on his

campaign for Senate. It seemed a natural enough question. Why do you ask?

[Caretha]

142. Since you admire him so much

and worked on his campaign were you advocating that he primary Obama?

[MineralMan]

179. No. I was just asking him a question. It's that simple.

I'm not advocating that anyone primary President Obama. That's something others are doing, not me.

[L0oniX]

85. Satan 2012 ...at least you'd know what your getting.

[MineralMan]

98. Unresponsive. Do you have a real, living person you can

name?

[NorthCarolina]

87. Bernie Sanders & Jan Shakowski

[NNN0LHI]

89. Hey MM. Do you have anyone in mind?

[MineralMan]

99. No, I don't. But I'm not calling for President Obama to be

primaried. Lost of people seem to be, so I'm asking them. How about you? Do you have someone in mind?

[NNN0LHI]

108. You don't have to be calling for President Obama to be primaried to give your opinion on who ...

... would have the best success at doing it. Unless you don't want to give an opinion and thats alright.

I am not calling for a primary and know there will not be one but I still have an opinion on who the best possible candidate would be if there were one.

That person is, drum roll please ... U.S. Congresswoman Sheila Jackson Lee - Texas(D).

She would do about the best in my estimation.

Don

[MineralMan]

113. OK. I'll have to go look her up. I don't follow Texas politics.

I don't have anyone in mind. I've seen some suggestions, but I don't believe any are capable of winning, even in the primaries. I'll check out Congresswoman Lee. Thanks. Can you offer any information? I confess that I'm ignorant of her accomplishments and positions. That's the reason for this thread. If you can offer some information, that would be helpful.

[NNN0LHI]

117. Here is her Biography

http://jacksonlee.house.gov/Biography/

Congresswoman Sheila Jackson Lee is serving her seventh term as a member of the United States House of Representatives. She represents the 18th Congressional District of Texas, centered in Houston, which is the energy capital of the world.

Congresswoman Jackson Lee earned a B.A. in Political Science from Yale University with honors, followed by a J.D. from the University of Virginia Law School. In the 110th Congress, Congresswoman Jackson Lee was named the new Chairwoman of the Homeland Security Subcommittee on Transportation Security and Infrastructure Protection.

She sits on three Congressional Committees — the House Committees on the Judiciary, Homeland Security, and Foreign Affairs. The Congresswoman has authored several immigration bills, such as H.R. 750, the "Save America Comprehensive Immigration Act of 2007", which sets forth a comprehensive and humane solution to the immigration problem. Rep. Jackson Lee introduced legislation to enhance federal enforcement of hate crimes with H.R. 254, the David Ray Hate Crimes Prevention of 2007. Rep. Jackson Lee also played a significant role in the recent renewal and reauthorization of the Voting Rights Act. Congresswoman Jackson Lee contributed an amendment to the NASA reauthorization bill this year that will ensure equal access for minority and economically disadvantaged students to NASA’s education programs.

In addition, the Congresswoman launched the Dr. Mae C. Jemison Grant Program to work with institutions serving minorities to bring more women of color in the field of space and aeronautics. As Chairwoman of the Transportation Security and Infrastructure Subcommittee of the Homeland Security Committee, Congresswoman Jackson Lee has supported enhanced technology, better intelligence, increased airplane cargo inspections, increased security for railroads, and implementation of the 9/11 Commission report.

In addition, Congresswoman Jackson Lee is a founder, member, and co-chair of the Congressional Children's Caucus, the Pakistan Caucus, Afghan Caucus, and newly formed Algerian Caucus. Congresswoman Jackson Lee has been actively engaged in addressing and resolving the genocide in Darfur. Accordingly, she met with Sudanese refugees in Chad, for whom she secured additional funding, and African Union soldiers in Sudan.

Congresswoman Jackson Lee has been hailed by Ebony magazine as one of the "100 Most Fascinating Black Women of the 20th Century." "Congressional Quarterly" named Congresswoman Sheila Jackson Lee as one of the 50 most effective Members of Congress. "U.S. News and World Report" named her as one of the 10 most influential legislators in the House of Representatives. And the "Houston Chronicle" named Congresswoman Sheila Jackson Lee as one of the most influential and prolific legislators on Capitol Hill.

Rep. Jackson Lee recently received the 2006 Award for Policy at the 16th Annual Phillip Burton Immigration & Civil Rights Awards. In 2005, Congresswoman Jackson Lee was awarded the Drum Major Award for Public Service by the Revelation Urban Development Institute. In recognition of her outstanding contributions to Science, the National Technical Association (NTA) of Scientists and Engineers honored the Congresswoman with its Top Women in the Sciences Award. Congresswoman Jackson Lee was also awarded the "Legislator of the Year" by the National Mental Health Association for her outstanding work on mental health legislation.

Before her election to Congress, Congresswoman Jackson Lee served two terms as one of the first African American women At-Large members of the Houston City Council, where she chaired the first Human Relations Committee, along with the Airport and Cable Committees. Prior to her Council service, she was an Associate Municipal Court Judge for the City of Houston.

Congresswoman Jackson Lee is married to Dr. Elwyn C. Lee, who holds a dual position of Vice Chancellor and Vice President for Student Affairs at the University of Houston System and the University of Houston, respectively. They have two children Erica, who is a graduate of the University of North Carolina and Duke University, and Jason, who is a graduate Harvard University.

[MineralMan]

120. She sounds like a remarkable legislator. Is she in any way

interested in seeking higher office? I ask because I had not heard of her before, so she's apparently not actively seeking nationwide attention. Many Congress members do not seek higher office. They see their congressional seat as more than sufficient a platform, and they're right to consider that position as a high honor.

Could you check and see if she has any interest in a Presidential run? If not, then she probably wouldn't welcome being put forward for that position. I simply don't know. She sounds like someone who is doing an excellent job in Congress, though.

[Number23]

141. She sounds remarkable. Thanks for posting that.

She sounds like a hell of a woman. Of course, if she ever did run for president, Repubs would eat her alive for her membership in the Pakistan and Afghan Caucuses and liberals would tar and feather her for her work on immigration and homeland security.

Congresswoman Jackson Lee contributed an amendment to the NASA reauthorization bill this year that will ensure equal access for minority and economically disadvantaged students to NASA’s education programs.

...the Congresswoman launched the Dr. Mae C. Jemison Grant Program to work with institutions serving minorities to bring more women of color in the field of space and aeronautics

*swoon* Oh, she sounds wonderful. I really, really like these.

[Caretha]

146. Where you concerned that

Al Franken might primary Obama? Is that why you asked him or were you thinking that perhaps you would work on his campaign if he did, since you worked on his Senatorial campaign?

[Xenotime]

100. This thread is boarderline against the rules of the forum.

[MineralMan]

101. How so? It simply asks people to suggest names of people

they think would be suitable to run against President Obama in the primaries. It's already been established that it's OK to say that someone should run against President Obama. I'm asking people who feel that way to suggest people. I can't imagine how that violates any rules here. It's an open thread, where people can post their suggestions.

Do you have a suggestion, or do you think President Obama would be the best available candidate for President in 2012?

[LoZoccolo]

107. Not anymore. Apparently you can post that you're not even voting Democratic now.

I'm not happy about that, but there have been a couple threads to that effect which, as far as I know, are still not locked.

[Biker13]

105. MM...

your posts usually drive me nuts! But here, you have a point, and it saddens me.

We have no candidate that is a true progressive that has a chance in hell of winning, either in the primaries or in the general election. What does that say about us and our nation? How am I supposed to vote in the future? Cast my ballot for "The lesser of two evils"? If I do, am I not sending my party the message that I will take whatever I can get, and expect no more?

I have struggled with this for years now...and have no answer.

Thanks for asking the hard questions.

Biker's Old Lady

[MineralMan]

109. Thanks. It seems like an important question. Certainly the

Republicans are already staging for the 2012 election. If anyone has an idea that someone should run against President Obama, it's time to start working toward that goal. Without a candidate, though, there is nothing to do. For those who believe that President Obama should be replaced in 2012, I'm pretty sure it's time to start working for a specific candidate. It would take a candidate who captured the imagination of the Democratic voters to achieve that goal. So far, I've not heard of such a candidate who has the nationwide recognition and popularity needed for such a run.

If that can't be achieved, and people don't support President Obama in 2012, I foresee a Republican winning the presidency. That possibility is completely unacceptable. So, if there's to be a contender against President Obama from the Democratic side, time's a'wasting, I think. It's far from too early.

Personally, I doubt that any such candidate will appear, so I'll be supporting the President, and trying very, very hard to elect more Democrats to Congress. What I won't be doing is attempting to detract from President Obama with no alternative in sight.

I will say this: If a viable candidate appears and is capable of making a serious challenge to President Obama in 2012, I will look closely at that candidate. So far, I've seen none put forward who meet those requirements.

[Biker13]

116. You're right...

as someone up thread said, congress is our only hope.

And you know Chris Christie is waiting in the wings for 2016. Now that's scary.

The whole system is rigged, and we're not even a cog in the wheel.

Biker's Old Lady

Edit for spelling

[LoZoccolo]

111. Recommended, but I wonder why someone would unrecommend this.

You are asking a question, basically, and letting people respond. You do some of your own editorializing but that's not really the focus of the thread. It looks like some people do not like being given a chance to voice their opinion on certain topics.

[MineralMan]

118. I do not care about recommendations in the least.

As you say, I asked a question. I'd think people would be eager to talk up the candidate they thing would be the best one to challenge President Obama. Instead, the only suggestions have just been a name, with no supporting information. Others have simply dismissed the question. That, I do not understand at all.

Recommendations and unrecommendations are irrelevant in an active thread, in my opinion. It is the discussion that is important.

[krabigirl]

114. I think the Democratic party itself needs to be purged of the corporatist crap tbh.

[MineralMan]

122. That doesn't seem responsive to my question. It seems like

a topic for another thread. I'm being very specific in this one. Thanks, though, for replying.

[superduperfarleft]

119. I think you may have made a point you didn't intend to make.

Both with the OP and the resulting thread.

That there may be serious limits as to what's possible within the confines of the Democratic Party.

[MineralMan]

125. Well, I wasn't really trying to make any point at all.

You could be right, though. That's of great concern to me. If a third party candidate appears and runs strongly, that would pretty much guarantee a win by whomever runs for the Republicans. That possibility is very, very disturbing to me, given the goals of the Republican party.

I hope that is not the case, and that people will actively support whoever is the Democratic candidate for President in 2012. Even more importantly, since our President has little power to create actual programs, we desperately need to regain control of both houses of Congress, and not just minimal majorities, but massive ones. Then, a Democratic President will be able to achieve his or her goals. That has not been the case since the 2008 election. More's the pity.

[Catshrink]

124. Al Franken & Barbara Boxer

[MineralMan]

126. Can you elaborate on how the two could form a reasonable

challenge? Are they even interested in such a challenge. Al Franken isn't. He's made that clear. He may be a factor after his first term in the Senate, but I don't think a presidential run is in his plans right now. Barbara Boxer is a favorite of mine, and has been for many years. I lived in California most of my life, and have always admired her. But, I'm not sure she's seeking national office. I don't know, but I don't think so.

[Kitsune]

127. Brian Schweitzer.

Admittedly, not too many positions taken on national-level issues, so I'd want to hear more from him on that, but at least the man has a spine. I could vote for him on that alone. I think he'd be a promising candidate, and considering he's got the highest gubernatorial approval rating in the country he can't be completely ineffective as an executive either.

[MineralMan]

133. Do you have a link to some page where he states positions on

important issues. I'm afraid I've not heard of him.

[Kitsune]

149. He's the Democratic governor of Montana.

I looked myself, and there isn't a lot. Google will serve to show what there is, but I didn't see anything too objectionable. Some might think him a little too anti-gun-control, but frankly I've never understood why that's an issue of the progressive left anyway, considering our anti-authoritarian streak. And anyway, him not having a record of it will mean moderates concerned about the issue won't automatically vote against him, and there's a lot of people like that.

[verges]

169. I seem to recall his name being bandied about for VP in 08. nt

[lib2DaBone]

128. Kucinich/Grayson& Bernie Sanders as Secy of Treasury....

Now there is a kick ass team that WILL NOT roll over.

[MineralMan]

135. I'm sorry. I can't see that ticket as viable.

Can you give some idea of why you do think it's a viable ticket?

[undeterred]

130. Al Gore

[MineralMan]

134. That's the first suggestion I've seen that makes any sense.

Gore certainly has the national prominence required. Is he interested in running again? I haven't heard him mention it.

[undeterred]

140. I think he might run out of a sense of duty.

Thats what we need now. We don't need someone who grew up dreaming of wanting to be president. We need someone who is truly capable and visionary. There are only a handful of people that could possibly fit the bill. Gore, maybe Howard Dean, Russ Feingold. But the fundraising problem is massive.

[Bonobo]

136. No, it's not.

It is most pointedly NOT the time to start naming names.

Furthermore, why do you want people to?

Your motives are questionable. Highly.

[verges]

171. Why not?

It's certainly been suggested many times that a challenge happen. If a challenger is to run, he needs to come forward soon. We already have a decent idea of who will be trying for the R nomination. If there's a challenger, we should become aware of him(her) also. The clock is ticking.

[MineralMan]

181. You don't know what my motives are, so how do you form the

judgment that they are questionable? The reason that it is the time now to name potential candidates, if there are to be candidates, is because the Republicans are already staging for 2012. Many people are calling for a primary opponent. I'm just asking who that would be, and asking those who want that to happen. That is my motive. How is that questionable? I was pretty clear about it, I think.

[SidDithers]

188. You should start a thread about MM's motives...

:rofl:

Sid

[WhaTHellsgoingonhere]

137. #1 Kucinich

#2 Dean

At least these two have run before.

I'm also interested to see what Grayson has in mind. He could always be on the ticket.

[U4ikLefty]

138. Ralph Nader

:hide:

[WhaTHellsgoingonhere]

139. Here here!!!

Cheers!

Beers!

:toast:

[WhaTHellsgoingonhere]

143. What an awesome list!

Here are the nominees :thumbsup:

Boxer
Brown
Dean
Feingold
Franken
Grayson
Kucinich
Nader
Sanders
Schakowsky
Warren
Whitehouse

[madinmaryland]

144. MineralMan...

I couldn't think of anyone else.

:shrug:

[jaxx]

145. Having read through this entire thread, I'll give my 2 cents.

There is no viable candidate to primary President Obama. When someone does good on any given day, that person is lauded here with the usual thread entitled "Joe Blow for President". They get a few threads and then they're dead news.

Next we have the former primary voters who never got over the fact that Barack Obama won. So we get the "so and so should primary him". Never mind that it didn't work before and it won't work now, by gawd he/she deserved to win because they're progressive left kick repub teeth and talk a lot. More dead news.

Then come the special interests. If only ________ had been fought for, Obama wouldn't be so weak pub loving corporatist centrist homophobic DLCer etc. If only hell would freeze over these people would have a good day now and then.

Bottom line is that we have an extraordinary President at the helm right now. He has championed more legislatively than anyone in the modern past. He has stuck to his agenda and has much more to accomplish before he leaves office. Bet on Barack Obama, he is the real thing.

[DFLforever]

147. +1000

Nice summation.

[Pisces]

148. I agree with you whole heartedly.

[JoePhilly]

153. +1000

[MineralMan]

182. Thank you. That's one of the best messages in this thread.

I appreciate your reply.

[Azathoth]

199. +1

:thumbsup:

[ZombieHorde]

157. Recommended. nt

[MrMickeysMom]

158. Has anyone forgotten Dr. Howard Dean?

Jesus, if he isn't the best candidate, I don't know who would be.

In terms of realistically understanding how the Democratic Party moves itself forward, after same party practically assisted in his being ousted from the 2004 race, he's proven himself over again.

I was a Deaniac and would be again. Who's with me?

[hedgetrimmer]

159. The concept here-in does not grasp the contention of disappointment

However, it may expand it. The fact that the Democrats have little if any primary contenders to do battle with Obama exasperates the fact that we have him, he's all we have and he's not doing what we want and he's teeter-tottering on campaign promises.
A sense of despair pervades this site leaving most in post Bush era feeling let down. Asking people to name names lets everyone know that their disappointment is only going to linger.
The only "Hope" we have is Obama himself and I don't feel hopeful with the lack of power coming from the White House nor the transition in the House. We are looking at two years of gridlock and a whole boat load of back room compromises that continue to swell deficits and screw the middle-class. Then after two years we have no one to pull in the votes to win the Presidency except the President with whom we are dissatisfied with.

[Honeycombe8]

160. No one but Obama has a chance of winning the nomination. No one will challenge him.

Dream on.

[PufPuf23]

161. Carter POTUS -- Dean VP

Obama should pull an LBJ and announce he will not run again for the good of the Democratic Brand.

I supported Obama in votes, lost personal relations, and money for his fraud.

Obama won't win in 2012 (and neither will Palin) but GOP is likely to win unless the grassroots has the opening and strength to identify and support a viable candidate that is extremly strong.

[MilesColtrane]

202. You think most people would vote for an 88 year old presidential candidate?

[PufPuf23]

204. No. But I do recognize that a figurehead POTUS does send a message.

An 88 year old would not need to be a celebrity and Dean is strong and ready to step in in any case.

Jerry Brown could replace Carter and have more personal energy but does not have the name recognition or international gravitas of Carter.

The Democratic party needs to push aside the neo-liberals and neo-conservatives to retain a viable democracy.

[BlueIris]

162. I will take anyone. That's right, anyone. Don't care about alleged or perceived "electability."

To me, the reason it has to and should be anyone else is that Obama is no longer a justifiable nominee, and not because I think it's obvious his own electability is in the toilet. I can't vote for him again, and I don't think the Party has a right to ask me to, because his credibility as a leader and decision maker who represents the will of the people is fried. So that'll be Anyone/Anyone 2012, if you please.

[Raksha]

165. Good for you! I can especially relate to what you said here:

"I can't vote for him again, and I don't think the Party has a right to ask me to, because his credibility as a leader and decision maker who represents the will of the people is fried. So that'll be Anyone/Anyone 2012, if you please."

You're absolutely right that the Democratic Party has NO right to expect us to support Obama again. And their perennial argument about "the lesser of two evils" rings increasingly hollow. When there is very little discernable difference between the alleged "lesser of two evils" and the greater one, how much of a threat can it be?

[SidDithers]

186. "Anyone But Obama"....

can't wait to see the bumperstickers...:eyes:

Sid

[Boudica the Lyoness]

164. Al Gore or Alan Grayson

I think Donald Trump will run for the Republican nomination.

[Swamp Rat]

168. Mickey Mouse

[Greyhound]

172. it's at least a year too early. President Obama's failure has to have time to ferment.

Names and factions will rise and fall as we suffer the consequences of the power vacuum.

Stay tuned...

[Arkana]

194. And the sky will open up and rain blood, right?

:eyes:

[verges]

173. For all those who are saying it's too soon to discuss this:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=433&topic_id=537762&mesg_id=537762

[CLANG]

177. George Clooney/Matt Damon 2012

[Imagevision]

178. It won't matter, the new world order has already kicked into play - Dem-Repug?

for your entertainment/distraction only...

[deaniac21]

187. Dean - Clinton

[HipChick]

189. I'm sticking with Obama...I don't see how 2yrs is enough

It's going to take at least a couple of terms, if not 3 from Dems..

I'm realistic about legislation is done...

and people are stupid about Bi-Partisan..

the same people I see bickering on the Hill during the day are the same ones I see having dinner at night in DC..it's theater folks

[JonLP24]

197. Whoever would close Bagram

[xiamiam]

198. any progressive with a true anti war message..even if they are not on the dc radar

you want names which you can say will not win because of one thing or another..the candidate could be no one..the message at this time must be the catalyst and the person must be a progressive..nothing else will unite young and old alike..anti war is the message and our only hope..true hope

[Individualist]

205. Agree. If people hadn't fallen for the "not electable" DLC meme, we could have had a progressive

president.

[blindpig]

200. Willie Nelson.

What the hell...

[Jeffersons Ghost]

203. This NOT the time to split the party and put Republicans solidly in power

[FrancisTreptoe]

207. Agreed. Lets just suck it up and go with Obama.

It is guaranteed he will be better then any shitstick the GOP endorses.

[meow mix]

208. ok im going with Boxer, Shakowski, Schweitzer and Brown

pair them up whichever way is best ty

[Time for change]

209. Feingold

http://journals.democraticunderground.com/Time%20for%20change/582