Do you really think Halter would vote differently from Lincoln if he were AR Senator?

[ClarkUSA]

I don't. According to Nate Silver, Arkansas is a deeply red state where Democrats like Blanche Lincoln are in a "no-win situation":
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=433x288764

Halter is not exactly a dyed-in-the-wool progressive. He worked under former DLC chairman President Clinton, after all.

Bill Halter is NOT A True Progressive
by ProgressiveArkDemocrat

In the General Election in 2006, Bill Halter supported a gay parent foster ban and opposed marriage equality.

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2010/3/3/842635/-Bill-Halter-is-NOT-A-True-Progressive

By the way, Nate Silver rates the odds of a Republican winning this Senate seat at 92% no matter who wins the primary so that should tell you something about the current political climate in Arkansas.

:(

[ClarkUSA]

1. Why the unrecs? Guess there are Halter fans here who don't like the truth about him.

For all the backbiting here, it's evident that no real liberal could ever be elected to a national seat in Arkansas. Halter, for all his primary posturing, is another ConservaDem.

[Lord Helmet]

2. interesting point about being conserva-dems

Come to think of it so is Joe Sestak and so was Kristin Gillibrand while she was in the House. I think some people here will come down against Obama no matter what, including rooting for people they normally would tear apart here.

[ClarkUSA]

5. You're 100% correct.

<<I think some people here will come down against Obama no matter what, including rooting for people they normally would tear apart here.>>

I've noticed that, too. Their agenda is in full display here everyday.

Here's what a wise friend said to me just today regarding 24/7 Obama critics that I know you'll appreciate:

"Just remember what Obama said: "We know the battle ahead will be long, but always remember that no matter what obstacles stand in our way, nothing can withstand the power of millions of voices calling for change.

We have been told we cannot do this by a chorus of cynics who will only grow louder and more dissonant in the weeks to come. We've been asked to pause for a reality check. We've been warned against offering the people of this nation false hope.

But in the unlikely story that is America, there has never been anything false about hope. For when we have faced down impossible odds; when we've been told that we're not ready, or that we shouldn't try, or that we can't, generations of Americans have responded with a simple creed that sums up the spirit of a people.

Yes we can.

Hey, fuck 'em. They got nothing."

:fistbump:

[Lord Helmet]

10. I think this is Gibbs son.

[flpoljunkie]

3. Halter was running better against the Republican challengers. Has that now changed?

[ClarkUSA]

7. Currently, Nate Silver doesn't think there's much of a chance of us retaining this Senate seat.

He's the only analyst I trust to call races because of his stellar record and clinical, unbiased approach to predicting race outcomes.

Send an email to Nate Silver and ask him if you have any questions. I'd be interested in his answer to you, if any. He's the one who has rated this Senate race as an almost sure-loss for Democrats, no matter who wins the primary.

[Radical Activist]

14. Even if that were true, there's a benefit to the party by defeating Lincoln.

It will change the national political landscape by informing Senators that there's no political safety in being a conservative Democrat.

Arkansas has a very long tradition of sending strong populist progressives to the Senate. It could be done again with the right approach and right candidate. It won't be the DLC approach of being a liberal on social issues and conservative on economic issues. That's just the opposite of what works there.

[freddie mertz]

4. Halter is a new face, and deserves a chance.

Lincoln has already had her time and has failed us miserably.

I have no problem supporting changing of the guard in this case.

[Name removed]

13. Deleted sub-thread

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[ClarkUSA]

18. So you're giving an homophobic ConservaDem who supported a gay parent foster ban "a chance"?

But time and again you've loudly decried President Obama for not repealing DADT, agreeing with those here who say he is anti-LGBT rights.


:eyes:

[freddie mertz]

20. You are calling him that.

Blanche had her chance.

[ClarkUSA]

22. What would you call a Democrat who supported a gay parents foster ban? n/t

[freddie mertz]

23. I looked into your link on this one.

The anonymous KOS poster is someone with a personal and political grudge against the man, and he is catching a ton of shit from the audience over there.

I am not going to jump to any conclusions for now based on your link, that is fer sure.

Your hit job is DOA for now, at least so far as I am concerned.

Sorry Blanche.

[ClarkUSA]

26. Take a gander at "Bill Halter’s Gay Adoption Problem" (plus video) via gay activist Oliver Willis

http://www.oliverwillis.com/2010/03/03/bill-halters-gay-adoption-problem

That "anonymous KOS poster" is correct.

[freddie mertz]

30. This link here seems to contradict your claim.

http://irregulartimes.com/index.php/archives/2010/03/02/fact-check-bill-halter-resisted-the-arkansas-anti-gay-tide-of-2008/

And so it goes on.

[freddie mertz]

29. That was pretty ambiguous..the video shows him on one side...

The quote on the other.

I found it cryptic and confusing.

Seems the best case you make is that he might be almost as bad as Blanche.

I still think Blanche should be fired, however.

[quiller4]

28. There is nothing new about Halter. If I lived in the state I'd vote

for Lincoln. She has seniority and a slightly better chance but this state is getting redder and chances are slim for any D

[jenmito]

6. K&R. IF he won and voted like Nate says, you'd see post after post here saying,

"Meet the new boss, same as the old boss," even being warned he's no liberal.

[freddie mertz]

16. And that would be legitimate.

Getting into office does not mean the person should be free from criticism.

He would face the same legitimate evaluation by voters and donors in six years time.

[ClarkUSA]

19. I'm also amused by the support for a homophobic ConservaDem by those who consistently attack...

... President Obama for not supporting LGBT rights because he hasn't repealed DADT yet.

But we know what's up, don't we, Jen?

No matter. As someone said to me today, "Hey, fuck 'em. They got nothing."

:rofl:

[Enrique]

8. I think he'll vote different

yes, Halter is conservative, yes, he's business friendly. Of course he's not a progressive. It's Arkansas.

But Lincoln wasn't just conservative, she wasn't just business friendly, she was 100% owned by corporations.

[WeDidIt]

9. He'd be more progressive than Lincoln on occasion

just like he'd be more conservative on occasion.

Mostly, he'd be pretty much the same.

[KingFlorez]

11. Most Arkansas Democrats are not that progressive

With the exception of Vic Snyder, there haven't been that many progressives elected here. The point of getting Halter in the primary was to try and salvage the seat for the Democrats, not necessarily get someone more progressive.

[ClarkUSA]

17. According to Nate Silver, there's almost no chance of salvaging the seat for Democrats...

... no matter who wins the primary. Given his record of prognosticative success, I'm not inclined to disagree with him.

[Radical Activist]

12. Her failture to vote like a liberal economic populist is why she's in such trouble.

1) The issue is bigger than just Lincoln. Defeating her would send a message to Senate Democrats from every state. It's important.

2) Arkansas is not a conservative DLC state. It has a long history of economic populism. The kind that got Clinton elected in the '92 campaign.

Frankly, Lincoln is pursuing a dumb political strategy for her state. She could rail against insurers and Wall Street like a socialist and that's why the ads are making her sound like a populist. If she had voted that way then she wouldn't be in such trouble.

[freddie mertz]

15. + 1000. Thanks for common sense.

I mean, we are talking about Blanche Lincoln here.

The alternative may not be perfect from all standpoints.

But Lincoln has done real, tangible, national harm to the party and the country.

There needs to be an accounting for that.

[ClarkUSA]

21. Arkansas is indeed a conservative DLC state. DLC founder & former chairman Gov. Bill Clinton...

... rose to fame there for good reason. Every single Democrat has followed in his footsteps since then.

<<1) The issue is bigger than just Lincoln. Defeating her would send a message to Senate Democrats from every state. It's important.>>

I see what you're saying, but Halter is another ConservaDem who is homophobic to boot, for all his primary posturing.

<<Frankly, Lincoln is pursuing a dumb political strategy for her state. She could rail against insurers and Wall Street like a socialist and that's why the ads are making her sound like a populist. If she had voted that way then she wouldn't be in such trouble.>>

In a blue state, I'd agree with you. I'm not so sure that strategy or any Democratic strategy would have made Lincoln a winner in the Arkansas Senate race this year because of the success of the Faux News/RNC spin about HCR.

[Radical Activist]

24. Misleading portrayal.

I already responded to this.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=433&topic_id=288764&mesg_id=289102

The fact that Lincoln is running ads portraying her as an economic populist is a good indication of what the winning strategy would be. The problem is that voters aren't going to believe it after years of her being a corporate tool. The problem isn't that Arkansas isn't liberal enough. The problem is that Arkansas voters aren't too stupid to see through Blanche Lincoln.

[ClarkUSA]

27. How so? What I said is factual re: Arkansas DLC Democratic caucus, then and now.

<<I already responded to this.>>

Ah. I hadn't read your reply on another OP thread before I replied to you here on this one. Well, I have replied now:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=433&topic_id=288764&mesg_id=289139

This back-and-forth is making me dizzy. :P

[rpannier]

33. Arkansas is a blue state. In fact it's a very blue state

Arkansas Senate is 27 Democrats and 8 Republicans
House 75 Democrats 25 Republicans

Governor Mike Bebee Democrat
Previous 9 Governors 7 Democrats and 2 Republicans

Blanche Lincoln's seat has been held by a Democrat for more than 125 years
And Pryors seat has been held by a Democrat for as long, except for one-termer Hutchinson
Arkansas elected the first woman to the Senate Hattie Caraway who was in the Senate for nearly 14 years and voted for every New Deal legislation the came up.

[CTLawGuy]

34. it last voted for a Dem president

14 years ago (its former governor to boot). It's hardly a blue state. just because conservatives decide to call themselves democrats doesn't make their state blue.

[WI_DEM]

25. Maybe he will or maybe he won't but let this be an example for other Dems that if they vote with GOP

they will be challenged in the primaries and may even lose.

[depakid]

31. Yep- and you'd think so too if Obama was campaigning for him!

[ClarkUSA]

35. What do you mean, dear? I don't have a dog in this race. Both candidates are ConservaDems...

... and both are unlikely to win against the Republican in the race.

[depakid]

36. Sure looks like you have a (surrogate) dog in the race to me....

[ClarkUSA]

37. Whom are you speaking of?

Hmmm?

[tekisui]

38. !

:rofl:

Right, you have no dog.

[ClarkUSA]

39. Why should I? It's a no-win situation between two ConservaDems. n/t

[rpannier]

32. I have donated to his campaign Will donate again

And if I were an Arkansas voter, I would vote for him

[TheKentuckian]

40. Keep firing them til you get one who does if he isn't

but we KNOW she isn't it so it is time to at least try to upgrade the roster spot.