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Earth_First Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-01-11 10:50 AM
Original message
2011 Person of the Year: Julian Assange
Yup. It's still relevant.
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MineralMan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-01-11 10:55 AM
Response to Original message
1. Feh!
Unrec.
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BeFree Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-01-11 11:21 AM
Response to Reply #1
10. I know what you mean...
...this hurricane hitting the establishment is making a lot of people very, very uncomfortable.

Too bad. They need to be shook to their core. Besides, they've been just begging for exposure.
Wikileaks and Julian are dishing it back into their faces. For some, that hurts, eh?
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MineralMan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-01-11 11:29 AM
Response to Reply #10
16. Assange will be forgotten in a matter of weeks.
His 15 minutes of fame are done. Maybe he can go on Dancing with The Stars to lengthen that time.

Next story, please...
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BeFree Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-01-11 11:33 AM
Response to Reply #16
23. Really?
Is that what you hope for?

There is so much more to come. The wind is just starting to blow.

Assange is a hated man, but only by those who wish to keep secrets. I call them vampires, these
creatures that in a democracy are willing to destroy us and our freedom to be informed.
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xiamiam Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-01-11 11:36 AM
Response to Reply #16
28. lol..nt
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fascisthunter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-01-11 11:36 AM
Response to Reply #16
29. LOL... you wish
I love it!!!!
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sabrina 1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-01-11 01:34 PM
Response to Reply #16
42. That could be, but then he isn't the story despite the attempt
to make it seem that way.

The war crimes revealed by Wikileaks will never go away and for the victims, just as it has been for the victims of the 'dirty war' in South and Central America who never stopped until they finally got justice, the same applies to the victims of these war crimes. They will continue to demand justice, and thanks to Wikileaks, they now have more evidence of the cover-ups and the refusal of the U.S. to stop them.

Otoh, since around the world Assange himself has been and is a respected human rights activist and journalist when both were hard to find in this nation, it is very likely that he will achieve the status of people like Daniel Ellsberg over time, in fact he has already.

We need more Wikileaks and it looks like others are following their example already. Imagine, as Coleen Rowley and others have stated, if Wikileaks had existed before 9/11, she and the other Federal Agents who could not get anyone to listen to them, would have had a way to get their warnings to the public, and they say, 9/11 could have been prevented.

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Kaleko Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-01-11 03:02 PM
Response to Reply #16
50. MineralMan, didn't you work as an investigative journalist yourself at one time?
Or am I confusing you with another poster, someone with a similar name who was so well-respected on DU that many sent him donations to help out when he lost his home -- including me, actually.

If that's not you, I wonder what became of that guy...
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-01-11 04:18 PM
Response to Reply #50
54. That was symbolman and he was a film maker. n/t
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Kaleko Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-01-11 04:24 PM
Response to Reply #54
56. Thanks for untangling that puzzle for me.
:hi:
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-01-11 04:21 PM
Response to Reply #50
55. Deleted message
Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
tavalon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-01-11 11:45 AM
Response to Reply #1
34. I recced, so that makes zero
I would like to share that honor with Bradley Manning and Julian Assange and Wikileaks.
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HCE SuiGeneris Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-01-11 01:42 PM
Response to Reply #1
46. Oh, FFS.
What an asinine first response. :thumbsdown:
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sabrina 1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-03-11 01:25 AM
Response to Reply #1
72. Rec'd for a man who actually does something for the betterment
of the human race.
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xchrom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-01-11 10:57 AM
Response to Original message
2. recommend -- you cannot have a relevant democracy without informed consent. nt
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davidinalameda Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-01-11 11:10 AM
Response to Original message
3. bullshit
nothing has been released that wasn't already common knowledge

so far, it's all confirmation of gossip

maybe he should hook up with the tabloids instead of the NY Times

about the same material

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Earth_First Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-01-11 11:16 AM
Response to Reply #3
4. So if all this truth has been known without validation...
Why aren't you publishing your information?

By your logic, without the validation of Wikileaks; all this 'common knowledge' is tabloid rumor...
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davidinalameda Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-01-11 02:49 PM
Response to Reply #4
49. my information?
what-my mother's maiden name?

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BeFree Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-01-11 11:17 AM
Response to Reply #3
5. eh?
It really rankles you that Julian is so popular?

That the ton of secrets yet to come is gonna mess up the PTB?
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fascisthunter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-01-11 11:18 AM
Response to Reply #3
8. get over it... he's popular
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seabeyond Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-01-11 11:27 AM
Response to Reply #8
14. on du. nt
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fascisthunter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-01-11 11:28 AM
Response to Reply #14
15. no... on the internet and around the World... but you go with that
if it gives you comfort.
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seabeyond Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-01-11 11:31 AM
Response to Reply #15
19. right.
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Earth_First Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-01-11 11:32 AM
Response to Reply #19
20. lmfao! n/t
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fascisthunter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-01-11 11:33 AM
Response to Reply #19
24. sorry, I have that person on ignore
Edited on Sat Jan-01-11 12:15 PM by fascisthunter
had to log out to see who it was. Not who I assumed it was...
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seabeyond Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-01-11 11:38 AM
Response to Reply #24
30. ? nt
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fascisthunter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-01-11 11:42 AM
Response to Reply #30
32. wrong poster
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treestar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-01-11 11:48 AM
Response to Reply #24
35. It's a poll
ignorance is what happens to one who shields themselves from facts they don't like.
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sabrina 1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-01-11 02:35 PM
Response to Reply #14
48. Sorry, long before the U.S. ever heard of Wikileaks, the rest of the
world was fully aware of them. They have won awards for their investigative journalism and in many dark corners of the world they have helped expose corruption and actually saved many lives. Amnesty International gave them their 'New Media Award' for 2009 because of their very courageous exposure of the corrupt government of Kenya and its brutality towards its own people. That exposure led to a change in that government

The organization itself was started by many people sick of the secrecy that allowed corrupt and brutal governments, like the Chinese eg, to abuse their citizens without any ramifications.

It was started by Chinese dissidents, (have we forgotten Tiananmen Sq.?) among others and since its inception has given a voice to the oppressed from countries who until then, had now safe way to expose corruption in their countries.

They did not go after any government, including this one. They made themselves available for whistle-blowers to find a safe way to communicate with the outside world and when they received material that checked out as authentic, they published it, bringing hope to those people that they could get the attention of the world to their plight.

They made no special effort to get material on the U.S. but when they did, as they have with ever other country, they published it exposing war crimes and providing answers to some of the victims of those crimes.

What is remarkable to me is the reaction of democrats to this much needed type of journalism. If Bush were in power, I know that Wikileaks' exposures about these wars would be lauded by progressive democrats. It is a very sad thing to see that many democrats were not opposed to Bush because of principles, but it was after all, only about politics for many of them. THAT has been one of the most important revelations to me from the Wikileaks story.



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seabeyond Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-01-11 05:24 PM
Response to Reply #48
60. they introduced themselves poorly to the u.s. then by putting out garbage in the second
spamming of contents. they should have chosen better, because they failed on getting public support, putting out gossip for titillation instead of forgoing grandeur for substance.
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sabrina 1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-01-11 06:13 PM
Response to Reply #60
63. What 'spamming' have they done?
They have not 'dumped' hundreds of thousands of docs. They have provided them to five major news organizations who are publishing them after reviewing them for months. That is a distortion being promoted by the rightwing media in this country.

Have you seen any of the Iraq and Afghanistan War logs eg? The Bush administration has much to fear from this 'garbage' as you call it. Every American citizen is responsible for informing themselves about what was done in our name by that administration and Wikileaks has done the job we were begging our media to do while Bush in office. Why are progressives slamming them for that now, when all I ever heard back then was 'where is the media'?

Wikileaks is an award-winning News Organization. They are not interested in being popular. In fact, they understand that when you reveal lies and war crimes about corrupt governments you are not going to be popular.

It is not THEIR job as a news organiztion to do PR work for themselves, is it? THEIR job is to publish FACTS, which is what they have done. What 'garbage' are you talking about? Even their worst enemies don't deny that everything they publish is legitimate information.

Their job is to simply provide news. It is the job of the citizens of any country whose governments' corruption and war crimes are revealed, to decide what they want to do about that.

Do you still care that the Bush Administration committed war crimes? That people were tortured in our name and no one was held accountable? That we were lied into two wars and are expanding those wars, secretly, like Vietnam?

Did you think that the Pentagon Papers was 'garbage'? Because if the answer is that you still feel the same way you did when Bush was in power, then your antagonism towards Wikileaks makes no sense.

As for being popular in the U.S., the U.S. is isolated from the rest of the world. Informed people here DID know the work of Wikileaks and supported it fully especially during the Bush administration. But around the world, Wikileaks is highly respected and supported and as usual here in the U.S. the average American is only aware of them SINCE they received leaks about the U.S.

They didn't go after the U.S. or any other country. They can only publish what they receive. Are you for suppressing information that exposes the Bush administration's war crimes now? I am truly puzzled by the reaction of some Democrats to all of this. It is completely contrary to everything we were supposedly begging for for so long.
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snot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-02-11 01:57 AM
Response to Reply #48
68. Agreed! We're lynching the messenger, instead of thanking it for the info that empowers us.
Something wrong with that picture.
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sabrina 1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-03-11 01:24 AM
Response to Reply #14
71. He was popular around the globe long before DU ever heard of him.
The world doesn't revolve around DU. There is a big world out there where people like Assange have been very busy doing things that many here apparently were not aware of, like actually saving lives, getting awards for their work on human rights, affecting the course of history in some places simply by doing what real journalists are supposed to. These things make people popular in other parts of the world, and with DUers who share the view that human rights is a very important issue.

You seem to be very misinformed on the subject of Wikileaks.
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MineralMan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-01-11 11:29 AM
Response to Reply #8
18. So's Snooki.
So what? He's done.
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fascisthunter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-01-11 11:32 AM
Response to Reply #18
22. so he shouldn't even be an issue for you right? Try being more honest
lying to yourself just makes you more transparent.
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MineralMan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-01-11 12:15 PM
Response to Reply #22
37. He's an issue, but that issue has run its course now.
The world's attention has drifted into new areas, you see. Any story or situation gets a brief time to make whatever impact it will make. Wikileaks has used up that time. While it caught the attention of some, they were only a tiny minority. It's no longer even on the periphery of the news, as far as the vast majority of the population is concerned.

Just because a group thinks something is crucially important is no sign that it will have a major impact. Just today, I read something that made me laugh. Someone was deeply concerned about Japanese whaling, and said that the boycotts of Japanese products by those who were also concerned would turn the Japanese around and cause them to stop whaling. Now, I think whaling should stop, and I abhor it, but it's a fantasy to believe that enough people care about that issue to alter Japanese decisions regarding whaling.

Same with Wikileaks. It doesn't appear that any truly earthshaking revelations will come from the information. Fewer and fewer stories are appearing about new releases from the documents, and that number will decrease steadily and quickly. There are new issues to catch the public's attention.

Wikileaks is over, in terms of influencing anything. Assange had his shot. He took it. He's out of ammo.
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fascisthunter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-01-11 12:18 PM
Response to Reply #37
38. oh, ok
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snot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-02-11 02:09 AM
Response to Reply #37
69. The furor has died down only to the extent that the newspaper partners have
Edited on Sun Jan-02-11 02:09 AM by snot
stopped publishing so many stories about what's in the cables. The NYT was first to throttle down its coverage--no surprise there. Now El Pais seems to be the main one still publishing.

This may be bec. most of these papers are subject to pressure from their corporate owners or governments, or bec. most of juiciest stories from the cables have been identified and published, or because of the holidays and bad weather--we'll know better soon.

The important thing is, efforts like Wikileaks present one of the few prospects we have for salvaging our democracy, and I for one hope to help make sure it doesn't go to waste.
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crikkett Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-01-11 11:22 AM
Response to Reply #3
12. if so, it's confirmation of gossip that was grossly underreported.
You have to agree that it's a good thing the "common knowledge" info in those cables is being reported on so that it's Even More Common.



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sabrina 1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-01-11 01:44 PM
Response to Reply #3
47. So you knew President Obama was interfering in the prosecution
of Bush's torture team? I have to say, I was unaware of how active a part the WH was playing in protecting Bush war criminals. I thought they were just 'moving on'.

Did you know how those two Reuters journalists were murdered? Reuters did not and they are a major news organization who for two years had tried to get the truth about those deaths.

Now they know. Did you know that the U.S. was handing over Iraqis to the 'new Iraqi forces' trained by the U.S. and lauded as the hope for the future Democracy of Iraq, knowing full well that they were torturing those people? That is cause to wonder what was so bad about Saddam Hussein after all?

Or that the U.S. was trashing the European Human Rights Court's most respected judges for their work trying to hold torturers around the world, accountable?

Did you know that both Condi Rice and Hillary Clinton broke the law by using our State Department for espionage purposes?


I could go on but what is remarkable is how the U.S. has reacted to the revelations as opposed to the rest of the world. Many sovereign countries have now been made aware of how influenced THEIR governments are by the U.S. and not in a good way. This will most likely, hopefully, cause the defeat of many of Europe's leaders in their next elections. So many puppets all over the world. THAT was a revelation, the extent of it. And it explains how, over the objections of the people of these countries, their governments sided with the U.S.

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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-01-11 04:15 PM
Response to Reply #3
52. CBS seems to disagree with that.
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fascisthunter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-01-11 11:17 AM
Response to Original message
6. Rec to piss off the authoritarians
and those who hate transparency for a true democracy...
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Swamp Rat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-01-11 07:38 PM
Response to Reply #6
66. +1
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snot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-01-11 11:17 AM
Response to Original message
7. I have yet to see any persuasive argument, let alone evidence, supporting the anti-WL position
What I HAVE seen is a frightening number of DU'er's who seem to be swallowing corporate media propaganda about it. But if you can provide such evidence or authority, I'm interested.

Here's the pro-case (links to authority for the following can be found at http://www.c-cyte.com/The_Case_for_Wikileaks.html :

We are living in times of extraordinary incursions against the rightful entitlements, powers, and freedoms of ordinary citizens. The U.S. Congress and other authorities have acquiesced in, among other things:

* Routine secret service and police violations of First Amendment rights, including preemptive round-ups and detentions of legitimate, peaceful protesters (see various posts here, esp. here <"Police Prepare for RNC by Pre-Emptively Detaining 50 Potential Protestors, Journalists, & Lawyer"> and here <"Mind-Boggling Pre- RNC Police State Action"> and sources cited therein);
* Wholesale NSA/AT&T violations of Fourth Amendment and privacy rights, including wire-tapping and mining of e-mails of U.S. citizens (see various posts here and sources cited therein);
* Gross TSA and other governmental or quasi-governmental violations of Fourth Amendment and privacy rights, including unreasonable, invasive searches without the least pretext of the Constitutionally-required probable cause (see posts here and sources cited therein);
* The institution of policies of kidnapping, torture, and assassination of U.S. citizens and others (see, e.g., here <"Confirmed: Obama authorizes assassination of U.S. citizen," Salon>, here <"Extraordinary rendition by the United States," Wikipedia>, and here <"Outsourcing Torture," The New Yorker>);
* The invasion of Iraq based on lies; the under-regulation and -enforcement of laws to protect human health and the environment, resulting in such disasters as the BP spill; the bail-outs of megabanks and misdirection of inordinate portions of the stimulus toward the top 2%, at the expense of the truly needy and deserving; etc.

The extent of these depredations is shocking; yet they're becoming the new norm. And apart from a few bit-part scapegoats, no one has been held to account; indeed, for the most part, they have not even been investigated by the media, let alone by Congress or other governmental agencies. Talk about the terrorists winning. And similar incursions are taking place in many other so-called democracies.

Knowledge is power, and a balance of power requires a balance of knowledge. The way things are now, governments and corporations know everything about us and we know almost nothing important about them.

There have been periods in the past when the traditional media did a better job of fulfilling their proper function as the "watchdog of democracy." But they haven't been doing that for some while (see, e.g., "leaked reports back up what Iraq vets have been telling journalists for years, only to be ignored" ).

I do not condemn individual journalists, most of whom probably act in good faith and certainly are over-extended and underpaid. But, leaving the internet aside for the moment, the vast majority of traditional media worldwide are directly or indirectly controlled by a handful of large corporations (see "Concentration of media ownership" at Wikipedia and sources cited therein). Resources for real reporting have been hollowed out, and most truly "liberal" journalists were driven out years ago. As a result, wittingly or not, much if not most of the traditional media functions mainly to "catapult the propaganda," as the second Pres. Bush put it, controlling the national agenda by echoing talking points originated by conservatively-funded think tanks and disseminated by Faux News et al.

As for the internet, the powers that be are already well on their way to controlling most of that, too; among other things, witness the latest proposed FCC regulations and this article about proposed legislation to give the U.S. President the legal power to "kill" the Internet; see also Lawrence Lessig re- the "iPatriot Act" and "Governments' moves to control the web."

Before publishing any portion of the U.S. Embassy cables or the Afghan War Diary, Wikileaks invited the State Dept. and the Pentagon, respectively, to review the leaked documents and recommend redactions of any identifying details that might put individuals in danger (see Glenn Greenwald at Salon here and here). Both invitations were categorically refused.

With respect to the cables, Wikileaks is working with the major newspapers of the world to carefully vet and redact everything it publishes, and it has published nothing that has not been published by one or more of those newspapers. As of this writing, less than one percent of the entire cache of 251,287 cables have been pubished (Salon, CNN).

Since Wikileaks was founded in 2006, not a single person is known to have been physically harmed as a result of any Wikileaks disclosure, ever. (UPDATE: Per the BBC, even the Pentagon has reluctantly confirmed, "e have yet to see any harm come to anyone in Afghanistan that we can directly tie to exposure in the Wikileaks documents.")

In contrast, as of this writing, the number of Coalition soldiers who have died because of the lies used to justify invading Iraq, conservatively counted, are nearing 5,000 (see icasualties.org), Iraqi deaths are nearing 1.5 million (see Just Foreign Policy), and the U.S. has spent over $1 trillion (see the National Priorities Project here). And Wikileaks' publications have revealed many other actions by governments and corporations that have brought needless death and destruction.

I believe that too much information is better than too little. I have more faith in our ability as a species to collectively sort through the info and interpret it helpfully, than I have in the likelihood that any smaller group of individuals entrusted with the power to pick and choose what we should know, without meaningful oversight, will fail to abuse that power.

(As Assange once said, "hich country is suffering from too much freedom of speech? Name it. Is there one?").

Some have argued that Wikileaks' publication of State secrets is as bad as our governments' and big businesses' invasions of the privacy of U.S. citizens; but this is a false equivalency. I don't have the power to act on behalf of or make decisions affecting the welfare of millions of other people; and if I did, again, I should not also have the power to unilaterally decide what they get to know about it.

Some argue that Wikileaks' work is not REAL journalism and so should not be afforded the same First Amendment protection as other news media.

Prior to the U.S. invasion of Iraq, the corporate media in the U.S. FAILED to report the fact that the aluminum tubes claimed by the Bush admin to have been purchased for use in a nuclear weapons program were in fact ill-adapted for such use and were more likely purchased for other reasons (I heard that fact mentioned only on the BBC). Indeed, rather than verifying the Bush admin's claim, The NYT chose to publish Judith Miller's completely uncritical – if not complicit – story, "U.S. Says Hussein Intensifies Quest for A-Bomb Parts" – a story substantially based on the deliberate leaking of classified information by Scooter Libby, chief of staff of Vice President Dick Cheney. If what Wikileaks does isn't journalism, I only wish The NYT and other corporate media did more non-journalism.

The corporate media are also the "journalists" who failed to analyze Bush admin claims far enough to realize that a half-dozen specious reasons to invade Iraq did not add up to one good one – something obvious to the millions who demonstrated against the invasion in "the biggest global peace protests before a war actually started" ("Protests against the Iraq War," Wikipedia)

There simply is no principled basis for distinguishing Wikileaks' publications from those of The NYT and other newspapers.

In truth, we should ALL be journalists, helping to analyze the facts and to decide what warrants further investigation; but to do that, we must ALL have access to the truth.

Some argue the information published by Wikileaks isn't important enough to justify the breach of secrecy. What do they say to the U.S. agents who warned of the possibility of 9/11 but were ignored, who believe that that tragedy might have been prevented if there'd been something like Wikileaks to leak to (The Los Angeles Times)?

How about the needless gunning down by U.S. military forces of a Reuters cameraman and Iraqi innocents shown in the leaked "Collateral Murder" video? Or, limiting inquiry to the U.S. Embassy cables, what about the revelations that six months before the worldwide economic meltdown, the governor of the Bank of England was secretly proposing a bailout of the world's biggest banks funded by nations such as the U.S.; or that the British government secretly assured the U.S. that it had "put measures in place to protect your interest during the UK inquiry into the causes of the Iraq war"; or that the U.S. dismissed British objections about secret U.S. spy flights taking place from the UK, amid British officials' concerns that the UK would be deemed an accomplice to torture; or that, in response to U.S. pressure, the German government assured the U.S. that it would not follow through on its investigation of the CIA's abduction of a German citizen mistakenly identified as a terrorist, Khaled el-Masri; or that the U.S. threatened the Italian government in order to make sure that no international arrest warrants were issued for CIA agents accused of involvement in the abduction of cleric Abu Omar; or that the U.S. sought assurances from the Ugandan government that it would consult the U.S. before using American intelligence to commit war crimes; or that as of 2009, Shell Oil had infiltrated all the main ministries of the Nigerian government; or that pharmaceutical giant Pfizer paid investigators to unearth corruption links to Nigeria's attorney general so as to pressure him to drop legal action for harm to children from a drug trial; or that government corruption in Afghanistan is rampant (viz. an incident last year when then vice-president Ahmad Zia Massoud was stopped in Dubai while carrying $52m in cash); or that the U.S. seeks to manipulate nations opposed to its approach to global warming; or that the U.S. and China worked together to prevent European nations from reaching an agreement at last year's climate summit; or that the Vatican refused to cooperate with an official Irish inquiry into clerical child abuse; or that BP covered up a giant gas leak in Azerbaijan eighteen months before the Gulf of Mexico disaster? To mention just a few items revealed as of 2010-12-21. (UPDATE: See also Glenn Greenwald at Salon, "What Wikileaks revealed to the world in 2010.")

Which of these things did we have no right to know? Who should decide, and on what basis? I'm certainly curious about the expected publications re- the Guantanamo detainees and a major U.S. bank.

The powerful hope we'll believe that Wikileaks and Julian Assange are criminals, even terrorists. But the U.S. and other governments have struggled for months to find some legal violation to charge them with, without success.

To date, the U.S. law most discussed as a possible basis for charges is the Espionage Act, which was used to try to prosecute Daniel Ellsberg for leaking the Pentagon Papers – and in that case, the charges were dismissed by the U.S. Supreme Court. In Wikileaks' case, the argument for a violation of the Espionage Act is even weaker, since (1) Wikileaks has neither stolen nor leaked any information but merely published information others leaked to it, and (2) Wikileaks is not a U.S. citizen or resident.

U.S. officials' best remaining hope is to persuade Bradley Manning, the soldier alleged to have leaked the U.S. cables to Wikileaks, to "confess" something to suggest that Wikileaks actively conspired with him to bring about the leak. As of this writing, they've held Manning for more than seven months without bail and without a date set for any hearing, in solitary and under conditions so harsh that the United Nations' top anti-torture envoy is now investigating the situation (see reports at Salon and Firedoglake; so far, no confession; but such conditions often induce dementia, so maybe they'll get lucky.)

And as of this writing, notwithstanding Assange's stint on Interpol's "most wanted" list in connection with allegations of sex without a condom, he has yet to be charged with anything (not that such allegations would be relevant, even if the evidence warranted charging him).

The lack of any basis for legal charges has not stopped governments and big businesses from using all their might to try to crush Wikileaks and Assange anyway. They've tried to strangle Wikileaks' presence on the internet through their own cyberattacks (yes, someone did it to Wikileaks before “Anonymous” did it to any of them) and by pressuring Wikileaks' website hosts and domain name registrars to drop Wikileaks; they're trying to starve the organization financially (MC, Visa, PayPal, Bank of America and others have stopped processing donations to Wikileaks, although you can still donate to the KKK even though "a large majority of sources consider the Klan a 'subversive or terrorist organization.'"); and much of the traditional media, particularly in the U.S., are working to bury revelations that Wikileaks has published or to make it and/or Assange look bad enough to make you forget about the governmental and corporate crimes that Wikileaks' publications are revealing.

Some conservative leaders in the U.S. have even called for the assassination of Wikileaks' staff (see, e.g., PeopleOKwithMurderingAssange). One has to wonder what might have happened to Assange by now if he hadn't had his insurance file.

The inescapable inference is that governments and big businesses are indeed afraid; but what they fear most is not that we'll be harmed, but that they'll lose their power; not terrorism, but us.

They fear what we might do if we learn the truth.

Because the crimes committed by the powerful and revealed in Wikileaks' publications have resulted in massive and needless death and destruction, and are far, far worse than anything alleged against Wikileaks or Assange.

The Wikileaks people have worked hard for little or no compensation and taken real risks, in the service of bringing greater justice to the world. If Wikileaks survives intact, the power of governments and big businesses to loot and destroy with impunity will be curbed. If Wikileaks is crushed or rendered ineffectual, we are the ones who will lose. Are we such fools that we'll help lynch the messengers, while failing to act on the gifts they've risked so much to bring us?

If Wikileaks can be crushed by the powers that be, we can ALL be crushed. There's just one thing that can stop them: US. If as little as five percent of the people travelling by air over Thanksgiving had refused to submit to invasive searches by TSA, it would have caused such a commotion that those searches would have been ended. If enough of us stand up for Wikileaks, it will be the end – at least for a time – of our governments' and big businesses' efforts to crush those who insist on the right to know what the powerful are doing to us and in our name.
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Earth_First Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-01-11 11:21 AM
Response to Reply #7
11. +1
This needs to be an OP of it's own!
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Voice for Peace Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-01-11 11:35 AM
Response to Reply #7
25. agree..
"What I HAVE seen is a frightening number of DU'er's who seem to be swallowing corporate media propaganda about it. But if you can provide such evidence or authority, I'm interested."

It's really surprising to me -- but I've also got good friends who are simply misinformed.

And I do wonder if some of the negativity here has to do with some kind of envy; or at best, projection of people's own egos on Assange.
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midnight Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-01-11 11:35 AM
Response to Reply #7
26. Thank you.
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fascisthunter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-01-11 11:35 AM
Response to Reply #7
27. they can't
pretty obvious as to why
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ljm2002 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-01-11 11:57 AM
Response to Reply #7
36. "If Wikileaks can be crushed by the powers that be, "...
..."we can ALL be crushed."

Yeah, right. And if we don't protect the rights of criminals, then ALL our rights are at risk.

Oh, wait...

Yours was a most excellent post!
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GliderGuider Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-01-11 12:31 PM
Response to Reply #7
39. +100 Bravo!!!!
Very well presented, and it should be its own OP.
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Kaleko Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-01-11 03:58 PM
Response to Reply #7
51. The mad scramble to silence WikiLeaks and smear Assange
is very telling. It bolsters confidence in the assumption that WLeaks is truly dangerous to the cabal and not just another front used by the CIA/NSA etc. to spread their craftily manipulated disinformation.

Fine post, btw.

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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-01-11 04:17 PM
Response to Reply #7
53. What you said.
:applause:
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WillyT Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-01-11 06:51 PM
Response to Reply #7
64. + 1,000,000,000... What You Said !!!
:kick:
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kgnu_fan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-01-11 11:20 AM
Response to Original message
9. Happy New Year!
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mmonk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-01-11 11:25 AM
Response to Original message
13. My 2010 Person of the Year wasn't Assange (though he came close).
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NorthCarolina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-01-11 11:29 AM
Response to Original message
17. Rec to counter the Big "R" Dem Unrecs. nt
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RetroLounge Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-01-11 11:32 AM
Response to Reply #17
21. +1000
:hi:

RL
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mmonk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-01-11 11:39 AM
Response to Reply #17
31. I did but it was countered.
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treestar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-01-11 11:45 AM
Response to Original message
33. It's just playing into his attention seeking hands
Why is he more important than the information? If it was right to leak it, then it should take first place.

No one deserves that title merely for leaking classified documents merely because it became possible to do so.
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snot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-01-11 12:53 PM
Response to Reply #33
40. I don't believe Assange cares about attn for his own sake; I think he's more concerned
to try to make sure the info isn't buried by the corp. media's frequent "nothing to see here; move along" tactic.

But Assange's personal foibles, whatever they may be, have no bearing on our need for the info he's brought us.

The very fact that he's accomplished as much as he has, with such meager resources, and has managed to escape assassination -- personally, I'm grateful.
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MineralMan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-01-11 01:11 PM
Response to Reply #40
41. Yabbut all that fame does attract the babes, you know.
It's working for him, I'm sure.
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The Midway Rebel Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-01-11 05:08 PM
Response to Reply #41
58. Yeah man, exclusive CNN photos of him running from the chicks.
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treestar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-01-11 05:21 PM
Response to Reply #40
59. What about that info do we "need?" What have we done with it?
What are we going to do with it?

What if someone is harmed by it?
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snot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-02-11 01:54 AM
Response to Reply #59
67. Um, actually, just today . . .
Edited on Sun Jan-02-11 01:55 AM by snot
Janet Napolitano announced a tripling of agents in Afghanistan -- to try to halt massive smuggling of cash out of the country revealed in the cables – billions of dollars have exited, which our gummint knew about but felt no need to prevent, prior to Wikileaks.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=439x104000

and pls see my reply above addressing your other questions (among other things, no one's been harmed in 4 years of wikileaks, as compared to 1.5 million dead for lack of any check on gov't and corp. lies).

At some point, what's irresponsible is to NOT publish leaks.
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sabrina 1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-01-11 04:28 PM
Response to Reply #33
57. He isn't more important than the information. But our government
Edited on Sat Jan-01-11 04:33 PM by sabrina 1
is working hard to make him the story. Are you aware that prior to his being threatened by U.S. officials with assassination along with the lives of his family, it was very, very difficult to even get an interview with him?

He chose carefully the people with whom he met and conducted interviews with, since agents of oppressive governments Wikileaks had exposed, were very interested in finding him. Now, the U.S. has joined such oppressive governments by threatening his and his family's lives and freedom.

He has never been an 'attention seeker' so where are you getting that from? But once his life was threatened the only way to protect himself was to remain in the public eye. What would you do if the world's most powerful superpower was threatening to kill you?

Fortunately for him, he has been a highly respected and award-winning journalist known to human rights organizations and others who work hard to stop the abuses taking place around this planet for some time. Apparently in typical isolated fashion, he was not generally known to most Americans. We really do live in a bubble, a Fox News bubble actually.

THIS government is the cause of the attention he is getting. He is responding to the lies and smears as he has a right to do while at the same time keeping himself visible so that any attempt on his life will not go unnoticed and the prime suspects will be those who have already, foolishly (Palin, Huckabee et al) threatened his life, an illegal act that should have had consequences in this country.

Blame the DOJ for all the attention he is getting and our wonderful former and current elected officials who have outraged the world by calling for his murder.

Anyone aligning themselves with Palin and Huckabee and their ilk doesn't have much credibility around the globe. So, ironically, in their deranged attacks Wikileaks they have only served to help garner more support for them.

So, I do agree with you, he is not the story. But it is in the interests of this government to distract from the story, which can be seen in their attempt on the one hand, to try to minimize the significance of the leaks, while at the same time to maximize the supposed 'harm' caused by Assange. Which is it, are the leaks insignificant, because if so, then why are they after Wikileaks and Assange? Or, is a real news organization publishing real facts such a threat to democracy that it must be silenced?
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treestar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-01-11 05:25 PM
Response to Reply #57
61. LOL. He's working very hard to make him the story.
He should be trying to make the information the story by backing off - not giving interviews which invariably bring up his escapades in Sweden. He's the one defending himself in the press regarding the Swedish charges - if he were so interested in the allegedly important information he so heroically leaked out, he'd be talking about that, not about the Swedish charges, saying how he likes the ladies, complaining that he's being persecuted and implying he had more information that he's going to release when it's to his benefit.
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sabrina 1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-01-11 06:01 PM
Response to Reply #61
62. So you haven't been watching the interviews he's been giving, or
reading them? Have you seen his recent interview with David Frost eg? Or read his Forbes interview with Andy Greenberg? Of course many of the interviews he's given are with real journalists, so not of interest to the Fox/CNN 'bobbleheads' here.

He walked away from two of those 'bobbleheads' when they tried to raise the issues you just mentioned proving the exact opposite of what you are claiming.

So I don't know where you are getting that he is NOT talking about the news releases and IS defending against the Swedish smears. He has refused to discuss the Swedish smears and as I said, walked out on two our 'tabloid schmucks' who tried to bring them up, being that he WANTED to keep the focus on the news. It was THEY who tried to get him to talk about the Swedish non-case, which has never been filed btw.

He has addressed the Swedish allegations briefly when asked by such credible journalists as Frost, but when the questions are framed in a Rovian/Kenneth Starr fashion as happened with Clinton, he rightly refuses to engage such people.

You seem to not be following this story at all and just offering opinion which is so completely wrong I really would suggest you inform yourself better. I can provide you with links if you wish which completely contradict your claims, or you could easily find them yourself. That's what I do. With everything. I certainly never repeat anything that is coming from the rightwing media in this country, which includes CNN btw. Not without checking first that it is accurate, which it often is not. I thought we all learned that during the Bush years.

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snot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-02-11 02:12 AM
Response to Reply #62
70. +1
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kgnu_fan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-01-11 07:02 PM
Response to Reply #61
65. You have not informed youself nothing since the last time I have asked you
Edited on Sat Jan-01-11 07:02 PM by kgnu_fan
Dropping same comments everywhere on DU. Who do you work for?
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stray cat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-01-11 01:36 PM
Response to Original message
43. Is that a positive or negative person or still undecided?
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stray cat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-01-11 01:36 PM
Response to Original message
44. Didn't all the information come from Bradley Manning?
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TorchTheWitch Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-01-11 01:42 PM
Response to Original message
45. I take it this is about Time magazine's Person of the Year?
Otherwise I have no idea what this is about or why.


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