Bush is not the worst president we've ever had...

[Hugabear]

Just watched a documentary on Reconstruction after the Civil War, and right now I'd have to say that Andrew Johnson might be the worst we've had. Had Lincoln not been assassinated, I think it's pretty clear that the post-war period would have been much smoother.

But Bush is definitely in the Top 3, along with Johnson and Harding. If you're looking for an "Axis of Evil" for US presidents, there you have it.

If Palin were to somehow become President, I'm fairly confident that she could easily eclipse all three.

[Pirate Smile]

1. I've wondered about how different the Country would be today if Lincoln had lived to deal with

Reconstruction.

I think things would have played out much better.

It is sad to think how profound an impact on the Country one bullet can have.

:(

Edit to add - We learned from the mistakes following WW I and dealt with Germany & Japan in a wise way following WW II so we weren't just setting ourselves up for WW III with them.

I wonder how differently the aftermath of 9/11 would have been if we had a wise President at that time. We truly did have the entire world on our side. How different things would have been right now.

[Art_from_Ark]

4. I don't think Reconstruction would have been much better

when all was said and done. There were very vocal elements in the Republican Party who wanted to punish the South severely. Lincoln would have had a very hard time dealing with them. Also, if Lincoln had served two full terms, he probably would have not sought a third term, as was the custom in those days. It would be safe to say that Grant probably would have been elected in 1868 regardless. And the worst period of Reconstruction occurred under Grant.

[TheWraith]

17. Doubtful, actually. Johnson followed more or less Lincoln's plan for reconstruction.

I.e. a much milder version than the extreme measures insisted on by the "Radical Republicans."

[RaleighNCDUer]

20. For which he was hated by everybody -

The south considered him a turncoat, as a southerner who sided with the Federals; the radical republicans thought he was too soft on the defeated enemy, and tried to impeach him for following Lincoln's agenda for reconstruction.

Kinda feel sorry for the guy.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

19. Johnson pulled back on Reconstruction and let the south off the hook.

The south would have been forced to accept defeat and the freedom of the slaves. Instead, he went against congress and the much needed reconstruction to appease his southern pals.

His collaboration with the whites to oppress the freed slaves has repercussions to this day.

He should have been convicted and removed from office.

[BillyJack]

25. No, with regard to 9/11 at least. The PTB wanted it/it was supremely important

to THEM that the aftermath of 9/11 play out the way it did. The 'patriot act', homeland security, TSA, etc.

I wonder how differently the aftermath of 9/11 would have been if we had a wise President at that time. We truly did have the entire world on our side. How different things would have been right now.

The PTB are in a place now where they would NEVER allow a 'wise' and autonomous president to be in place to affect the proper measures for "the good of the people". Almost EVERYTHING that happens with legislation these days is COUNTER-INTUITIVE to the "welfare of the general public".

Bush was just a tool. Any other tool in his place would have done the same. Taken ORDERS. The advantage with bush (for the PTB) was that he didn't mind being thought of as a 50 y/o+ Frat boy that never grew up! In fact, he seemed to like that image very much.

[Auggie]

2. Add Reagan and you have the Four Horsemen of the Apocalypse

[izquierdista]

6. I'd say he was singularly the worst.

He set the engine of State on a crash course, of which Dubya played with the throttle for 8 years. If you look at any economic statistic for the country over the last century, things went to shit until 1933, turned up for 47 years, and then headed back for the crapper. Reagan put a smiling, vacant face on the worst of fascist governing principles, ones which have oppressed the mass of humanity since Sneferu decided that thousands of men should work for decades to build him a tomb.

[Diclotican]

12. izquierdista

izquierdista

Its true that Sneferu desided he wanted a tomb, like no others... And even today, what is left of it, is ayeimspeering... To look at the pyramides in the early morning, when the sun is coming up.. WOW

But Sneferu, was at least a leader, who desided it was a smart move to give the workers of the day, the food, the shelter, and even some luxeries on the States bill.. It is maybe not that common knowlegde, that one of the first written strikes, happend under Sneferu or one of his closest ancestors, becouse the workers had not their fair share of luxeries.. Under one of the great Faharoers it was desided that it was little to costly to give the workers all the luxery item they had been used to have.. And the end of it, was a 8 month strike, who ended first when the goverment caved into the fair needs of the workers.. And the building of the pyramids and the tombs, and the tempels startet again, after a break of 8 month...

If the leaders of today, at least desided it to be a smart move, to give the workers, food, shelter and some luxieres (like a decent sallary) they might get happy workers. And not be in the danger of maybe ending everything in a blow up.. ?

Sometimes, I belive the Farahoes of old was smarter than many leaders of today...

Diclotican

[Hardrada]

22. And they had wise advisors. Joseph, for instance.

[Diclotican]

35. Hardrada

Hardrada

Indeed, even tho the historic and the biblical story sometimes are not in alligment all the times, but for the most part, the history behind Joseph is sound.. And it is proven without doubt that the ancestors for the jewish peopole emigrated to Egypt, and then from Egypt..

Diclotican

[Auggie]

33. I agree

[CaliforniaPeggy]

3. K&R for your thoughtful post...nt

[NYC Liberal]

5. Yes, but at least Johnson had an active opposition party with supermajorities in Congress

to keep him in check. That doesn't change how he acted as president, it's just that he was able to do less damage.

Bush had a rubberstamp Congress for most of his presidency and thus was able to do a lot worse.

[Hardrada]

7. James Buchanan is oddly not mentioned.

His wretched presidency was almost treasonous because of his sympathy for the South and how he did very little while they seized federal forts and arsenals.

[TheDebbieDee]

9. Isn't James Buchanan W's great-grandfather?

Wasn't he an ancestor of Barbara "Quaker Oats Man" Bush?

[Hardrada]

21. Our 15th president was a bachelor. His niece, Harriet Lane,

was the WH hostess in those days.

[TheDebbieDee]

26. Uphhhhhhht! It was Pierce. Franklin Pierce. He was another

inept President that was an ancestor of Bar's.

[Maine-ah]

29. Pierce went through a lot of personal pain

he is also my husband's great, great (etc....) uncle. Yes, our last name is Pierce. I was born in the same town as Pierce, strange, as I moved to Maine and met my husband here as a child and that I would marry him.

All of Pierce's children died, Bennie, Pierce and his wife were in a train accident and he saw his own young son decapitated.

[donheld]

38. That was Franklin Pierce

[The Unawriter]

15. Truth

James Buchanan was the worst, beyond a shadow of a doubt.

[Art_from_Ark]

23. Nope

Bush 2 was the absolute worst, followed by Reagan. Or maybe the other way around.

[surrealAmerican]

32. I agree.

He lead this country into a civil war, you can't do much worse than that.


... and welcome to DU.

[Art_from_Ark]

24. Yeah, like when they seized the Federal arsenal at Harper's Ferry

No, wait a minute-- that wasn't Southerners who did that-- it was John Brown. And he was tried, convicted and hanged for that. And became a martyr for it.

[zeemike]

8. If Palin becomes president I think she will be the last.

After that they will just create the president in digital form for the TV....to keep us entertained....they will make it like a soap opera where we are glued to the tube to find out the next scandal or great triumph

[Warpy]

10. Polk, Buchanan and Reagan were also astonishingly bad

but what makes Stupid the worst of all of them was that he was the complete package, a corrupt and swaggering ignoramus who started wars he had no idea how to finish and without cause, wrecking what had been if not a robust economy at least a good economy, and attacking civil rights at home and abroad.

While all the past presidents we've both mentioned were awful, none has come close to being the perfect storm of ignorance, violence, corruption, and arrogance that were the hallmarks of the 2001-2009 presidency.

Plus, the little shit wasn't even elected. He was rigged into office both times, also giving him a leg up over men who had been elected.

[cutlassmama]

27. Have to agree with you.

[lazarus]

34. What's wrong with Polk?

I'm curious what made him "astonishingly bad". I always thought he was very underrated.

Or maybe we can blame him for the fact that Texas is part of the US? :D

[Warpy]

36. He started pre emptive war

and invaded what was then part of Mexico.

You have to agree that was not a good precedent to set.

And yes, it did stick us with Texas. And Arizona.

[Johonny]

11. Yeah but Johnson was coming off the Civil War

Bush was coming off one of the best economic era's in our nations history. The cold war was over, the nation was headed to a balance budget, we were the leaders of the free world. Bush ran the greatest country in the world into the ground in 8 years. Johnson simply took a nation eaten up by war and struggled with what to do while down. A lot of people might have failed in Johnson's place including the general that won the war (who is up there in terrible presidencies). It's unfucking believable to fail in Bushes place and yet his party learned nothing from their mistakes and are fighting tooth and nail not only to come back from them but to go even further.

[ChoppinBroccoli]

13. Where's Hoover?

Starting the Great Depression ought to earn you a place near the top of the list.

I'm sorry, though. Nobody can knock Bush out of the #1 spot. He earned it by having the Reverse Midas Touch: everything he touched turned to shit.

[struggle4progress]

14. Lincoln, frankly, was a brilliant politician and moral genius: he would have been a tough act

to follow. And the post war era must have been horrid: warm happy feelings were rare

[Rhiannon12866]

16. When Romney was bashing this president, I couldn't help thinking...

That he must have a very limited knowledge of history. I thought about Andrew Johnson, too, but you're certainly right about Harding, and Sarah Palin makes my blood run cold... Bush* goes without saying, but no Republican will admit that. x( :dunce: :scared:

[Major Hogwash]

18. I disagree. If George Bush would have been the President in 1865, he would have invaded

Iraq back then anyway. That was all Bush wanted to do, was invade Iraq. It didn't matter to him if he allowed the banks to run free and loose and create a housing crisis, or spend trillions of dollars that we didn't have, or add $7 Trillion dollars to our national debt, he still would have invaded Iraq.
Why?
Because "He tried to kill my daddy."

Tell me the last time that you heard a President of the United States refer to their own father as "daddy" before Bush did.
You can't!
Bush was the only one who talked like an 8 year old when he was the President!!

Here's another little known fact about Bush. On September 12, 2001 Bush asked his Chief of Staff Andrew Card how the book, "My Pet Goat", the one he was reading the day before, ended.
"I didn't get to finish reading it, Andy. How'd it end?"

[Name removed]

28. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Motown_Johnny]

30. Johnson had much greater challenges to face

After the assassination of Lincoln and the widespread destruction of our Civil War the country was already screwed.


Bush came into office in a time of peace and security as well as strong economic growth and turned the country into a post 9-11, perpetual war, crashed economy disaster that had institutionalized war crimes.



All Bush had to do was nothing and he would have been fine, Johnson didn't have that option.

[eppur_se_muova]

31. What, no room for Hayes on that list? He was the one who ended Reconstruction too early.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Compromise_of_1877

[FarLeftFist]

37. According to a poll of Presidential Scholars:

You are EXACTLY right. Andrew Johnson IS the WORST president in history. 3rd worst? BUSH! This is a poll of 235 presidential scholars. NUMBER 1? FDR!

Link: http://www.siena.edu/uploadedfiles/home/parents_and_community/community_page/sri/independent_research/Presidents%202010%20Rank%20by%20Category.pdf