Occupy Chicago is marching and has effectively stalled rush hour traffic . . .

[wndycty]

. . .its getting a ton of press. Will share pics/vids/reports as they come in.

Hundreds of protesters march through the Loop

Hundreds of people marched through the Loop this evening, snarling traffic as they converged at the Art Institute to protest against issues ranging from high unemployment and foreclosures to lack of school funding.

Processions of demonstrators from five downtown locations gathered around 5 p.m. at the museum at Monroe and Michigan avenues, where there was a reception for members of the Futures Industry Association and the Mortgage Bankers Association. Traffic was closed on Michigan as the protesters spilled into the street.

Pablo Tinajero, 24, said he was marching because he "cannot afford to work another 90 minutes" as a Chicago public school teacher -- referring to a controversial push to lengthen the school day.

He and others in the crowd chanted, "The people united will never be defeated" and "We are the 99 percent."
-snip-

http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/local/breaking/chi-groups-hope-to-draw-thousands-to-loop-protest-today-20111010,0,263482.story

[Rhiannon12866]

1. K&R! Bookmarking!

:kick:

[snappyturtle]

2. YES!

:woohoo:

[FirstLight]

3. Isn't it cool...?

we are having at LEAST one big news event per day per major city! :bounce: W00T!

[wndycty]

4. Kick for update

:kick:

[greytdemocrat]

5. Nothing like pissing people off

on their way home.

[slackmaster]

6. It's surely one of the most effective ways of winning over hearts and minds

:grouphug:

[csziggy]

8. It's probably the only way many people will hear about the protests

Or see how many people are actually involved given the news blackout in many areas.

[valerief]

10. Or soliciting their support on their way home. Just about everyone we stopped

in the Saturday march in Boston were supportive.

[Joe the Revelator]

12. There's a difference from Saturday joy riders and Monday commuters....

...trying to get home to their families.

[valerief]

16. Not much. All people aren't that shallow. And most of the people were in trucks, working. nt

[Joe the Revelator]

24. First, what's shallow about wanting to get home after a day of work?

Second, have you ever been to Chicago? What makes you think that this was a log jam of truck drivers during rush hour?

[Occulus]

127. .

In reaction to a recent protest by street cleaners in Brussels, the bosses complained that, ‘If every reform provokes such a strong opposition, we will never be able to move forward.” In response to this one of the workers involved in the protest, speaking on TV, said, “What else are we supposed to do? Do you want us to go for a nice walk through the city or organise a little picnic? We have to show that we are angry. Those on the streets today are not kids. They are angry workers and they are damned right to be doing what they have done.”

[girl gone mad]

72. Have you guys ever been in downtown Chicago?

"snarled traffic" = regular occurrence. I doubt very much that it was the big deal you're trying to make it out to be.

[nadinbrzezinski]

121. What will be amusing is when traffic report sounds like mexico city's

traffic on Avenida de los Insurgentes due to a demonstration taking the right lane... no I am not kidding

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

75. Taking people out of their comfort zone is the point of demonstrations.

You don't wake people up by telling them that everything's just peachy and they can count on the bosses to keep things that way.

[me b zola]

107. Here in Portland when we took our streets

...the motorists who were impeded cheered for us. Many got out of their cars and flew the peace sign, honked, whooped and hollered for us.

Sure, their was likely a person or two with a stick up their butt, but most people get it and support us.

[nadinbrzezinski]

122. My I just have to ask

what side are you on?

Every demo I have been at, even the ones that snarl traffic, for the middle class, get a lot of possitive honks

[OneTenthofOnePercent]

7. What better way to win the minds and hearts of productive society...

than making them sit in a traffic jam that you caused! :crazy:

[girl gone mad]

88. These things happen, it is a part of life.

Have you ever heard of critical mass? I have been caught in the midst of it a couple of times, once I had to wait over an hour for them to pass before I could leave my building. I almost missed my flight.

I still support their cause.

Living as a member of a society means being occasionally inconvenienced. When it is for the greater good, then you should probably take it in stride.

[EdMaven]

98. Obama's motorcade inconveniences people. So do parades. Big deal.

Do people swear off parades & presidents because they're sometimes inconvenient?

Protest is *supposed to* inconvenience people.

[sabrina 1]

108. In NYC, people waved and honked their support to the protesters.

Why do you assume the people in their cars do not support the protesters? Why do you care about the kind of people who would be upset over this? They are exactly the ones we want to upset. Everyone else is on our side.

[LanternWaste]

109. I imagine many people wish that civil disobedience and social change

I imagine many people wish that civil disobedience and social change was convenient, simple, packaged in a pretty box and made for ages 8 and up.

[OneTenthofOnePercent]

131. It doen't need to be simple & convenient... but certainly not aimed at the wrong demographic.

I think a little more foresight could have been used to prevent so negatively impacting the working masses while only targeting the 1%

Poor planning.

[truedelphi]

138. We have exactly that Pretty Box - every four years, with slogans

Like "Change" and nice looking people wearing smiles, high-fiving the average person and carefully avoiding any mention of how they were chosen by the Ones above them.

We had all those pretty lil boxes elections, and after thirty years of Republicans and Republicans-Lite, there came a day when something else had to happen.

Like you say, some people dislike the inconvenience and wish it was "nicer" and prettier.

But there sure hasn't been anything nice or pretty about the homelessness, and the joblessness, the lack of ability to pay health insurance, even after "reform," or the dead and wounded from our ongoing wars.

[valerief]

9. Fabulous! nt

[Joe the Revelator]

11. This seems counter productive.

[Cali_Democrat]

13. I'll tell you what's counterproductive

Giving tax breaks to wealthy oil companies and other corporations.

[Joe the Revelator]

14. And keeping people from their families illustrates this point?

[Cali_Democrat]

15. The blame lies with the 1% and their enablers

Their policies have caused people to rise up and these are the consequences.

Blame them.

[Abin Sur]

19. So when a mob...who have chosen to be there...blocks traffic

it's not their fault that traffic's being blocked.

Got it. :eyes:

[Cali_Democrat]

21. Eric Cantor recently called the protesters a mob

You're channeling Cantor.

[Abin Sur]

And that assertion takes away from my point...how, exactly?

[Joe the Revelator]

23. And you're channeling someone who is thinking only with their heart and not with your mind

This is how you lose the battle of public opinion.

[EdMaven]

100. You think protests are OK, as long as they don't inconvenience anyone, which means actually you

don't think they should be allowed.

Got it.

"A mob"

yeah, right.

[Abin Sur]

124. Certainly they should be allowed

as long as they follow the law...which does not, as per the story, include illegally blocking streets.

Get it?

Got it.

Good.

[Joe the Revelator]

22. That's just wrong,...it's poor optics and only hurts the cause.

This is why there needs to be leaders of movements.

[LoZoccolo]

65. And that's why civil disobedience against the general populace is a ridiculous strategy here.

Civil disobedience is the kind of thing you do when you're in the minority and the majority has no reason to treat you fairly, so you give them a reason to not treat you unfairly. This action today basically targets the 99% way more than the 1%.

And yeah, of course people will use dramatic terms and make it sound bold and disruptive and some kind of scary emergent threat blah blah. It's just alienating. And stupid, confusing boldness with effectiveness.

[pipi_k]

130. That actually makes as little sense

as a group of people blaming an outside influence for MAKING them destroy their own homes and businesses.

Like after the Rodney King trial.

African Americans in the South Central LA area targeted businesses of their own people, and at the end of it all, the damages totaled nearly $ 1,000,000.

They hurt themselves. I would venture to say that maybe many of those businesses could never open again.

And it was all the fault of the police and jury and anyone else involved in the whole Rodney King incident and aftermath.

They all MADE those people riot...

yeah. OK.

:eyes:

[cwydro]

25. Good luck Joe...

Some people will never get it.

[EdMaven]

99. yes.

[OneTenthofOnePercent]

17. "Wealthy oil companies" and "corporations" make up what % of people stuck in the traffic jams?

Just because people are disgruntled, that does not justify their treating other undersrving people rudely.

[LanternWaste]

110. I think you confuse "counter-productive" and "convenient."

I think you confuse "counter-productive" and "convenient."

[cwydro]

18. I'd be really annoyed if on my way home

I was delayed because of people blocking traffic.

Some of us need to be home by a certain time, because of responsibilities...

[pipi_k]

28. Exactly...

or maybe people are rushing from one part time job to another that they really really need.

Or trying to get to the daycare center to pick up their kid(s) and avoid getting charged for extra time.


ugh.

Protests...OK.

Inconsiderate assholes...not OK.

[socialist_n_TN]

143. So would you be so mad at a little inconvienence

that you side with the bankers?

[Imajika]

20. Blocking traffic = fasted way possible to alienate people

People undecided about the protests who were suddenly made late picking up their kids from pre-school or getting dinner on table, now have a reason to hate the entire movement.

I remember living in a conservative area and the anti-abortion freaks started blocking traffic, never seen red-state Republicans turn against the anti-abortion cause so fast in my life.

Never, ever block traffic unless you want people to oppose everything you stand for.

[pipi_k]

26. God help them if

their idiotic actions end up blocking someone from getting to a sick or dying relative.

Or blocking a fire truck from getting to a burning house where people end up dying.

Or an ambulance rushing a crash victim to the ER.

God help them. They will deserve all the scorn heaped upon their sorry asses.

[Texasgal]

27. Sorry asses?

REALLY?

[pipi_k]

30. Yes, sorry asses

People want to protest? Great. I have no problem.

But they do NOT have the right to impede others. None at all.


If their actions cause anyone...even one person...to be hurt in any way...they are sorry-assed idiots and deserve whatever contempt may find them.

[Texasgal]

33. Oh please.

I would assume that firetrucks and ambulances etc. would be allowed to pass by, otherwise your minor inconvenience can kiss my butt.

[wndycty]

35. "your minor inconvenience can kiss my butt"

That is the same attitude that my bank, Bank of America, has taken when it comes to charging me $5 a month to use my debit card. While I am contemplating leaving the bank, and I support the Occupy Wall Street movement I find you saying "your minor inconvenience can kiss my butt" ironic.

Maybe if we cared about everyone's minor inconveniences we might be a little better off.

[cwydro]

39. Perfect post

thank you.

[pipi_k]

48. Thank you...

One man's "minor inconvenience" could very well be another man's survive-or-not situation.

Too bad more people don't realize that.

Many don't care as long as they're getting what THEY want.

[wndycty]

50. Which is not different than the assholes on Wall Street. . .

. . .but the irony is lost on most.

I actually support the OWS movement, but since I dare to criticize it many feel I am the enemy.

[EdMaven]

101. You actually support it so long as it doesn't inconvenience anyone. Which means

you don't support it.

Protest isn't possible without inconveniencing someone.

[pipi_k]

116. Oh, here's an idea....

How about inconveniencing the people you're protesting AGAINST???

Not the people who are stuck in the same damned boat with you...

[LanternWaste]

113. Plasticine priorities are very important to our flaccid contentment...

"Many don't care as long as they're getting what THEY want..."

True. Social movements and cultural change should always take a back seat to convenience, getting home before kick-off, and prior to our micro-wave mac and cheese getting cold.

Plasticine priorities are very important to our flaccid contentment, and we righteously damn anything that prevents it.

Because that's what "they" want... :shrug:

[pipi_k]

118. Lack of forethought and the refusal to acknowledge

that people may have things going on in their lives OTHER than football, microwaved dinners, and other trivialities...it's not attractive.

And it's very sad that people who are supposed to be so much better than those selfish RW ogres end up acting in concert with them.


As I've said a few times already, people do have other things going on in their lives. People may have someone at home who depends on them. Maybe a sick parent. A sick child. Maybe they need to rush to a second job. There are all sorts of important reasons why people need to get to where they're going.

Their wants and needs are just as valid to them as are those to the protesters. Only those people trapped in traffic are minding their own business, not screwing up the day for others.

[Texasgal]

51. weird... I am on your side

I find the five dollar thing atrocious! Shocked you used that analogy to counter mine. I am incensed over the five dollar charge!

[wndycty]

53. I countered you because you showed the same indifference to other peoples' inconvenience . . .

. . .that Bank of America showed, or can't you see that?

[Texasgal]

57. No. I don't see it.

how are we supposed to heard if we are just hanging out?

The five dollar charge obviously got our attention, did it not? People got pissed and closed their accounts.

[Joe the Revelator]

59. You don't get heard by acting out and pissing off those whose support you need

That's what a child does.

[Occulus]

128. .

In reaction to a recent protest by street cleaners in Brussels, the bosses complained that, ‘If every reform provokes such a strong opposition, we will never be able to move forward.” In response to this one of the workers involved in the protest, speaking on TV, said, “What else are we supposed to do? Do you want us to go for a nice walk through the city or organise a little picnic? We have to show that we are angry. Those on the streets today are not kids. They are angry workers and they are damned right to be doing what they have done.”

[pipi_k]

56. Well see, there you go...

For me, it would be a "minor inconvenience" because I can afford it.

But I would have no right to insist that you just suck it up because I don't think it's a huge deal.

This is what my issue is with blocking traffic. For some, it's a "minor inconvenience". For others, it's truly a big deal.

[cwydro]

38. And what if you have to get home to take care

of someone who depends on you?

There are actually people who have REAL responsibilites living in this world you know.

[pipi_k]

42. Yeah, Oh please...

How the hell could an emergency vehicle "be allowed to pass" if traffic is backed up for blocks and blocks and the people up front don't even know the emergency vehicle is back there?

What do they do, tell the ambulance to fly over the other cars?

Demand that everyone pull up onto the sidewalks?

and what if there's a guy bringing his wife to the hospital because she's in labor? Yeah...cool. Birthing in the middle of the road. Everyone should try it.

As far as people experiencing inconvenience kissing your ass, well, that's exactly the type of attitude that turns people off from things like this.

Innocent people who have NOTHING to do with the 1% are being kept from their daily business. For some it could be more than just an "inconvenience". For some it could be a lost job when they can't get to work on time. But hey...fuck them, right?

As long as the mob in the street gets to exercise some power. And really, you know what's ironic about that?

It's the same attitude the top 1% has, only on a different level.

Whooooweee!!! We got the power now, baby!!!


good lord, it's the same shit with a whole new crowd...

[Texasgal]

47. how do you think

emergency vehicles get around regular backed up traffic?

They turn their lights on and backed up people move over to allow the vehicles to go through!

You act like ER vehicles have never been stuck in traffic... geezuz! Drama is right!

[pipi_k]

54. You're talking about a situation involving

people who obviously CARE about letting the emergency vehicles through.

How are you going to convince a bunch of people...some of whom wouldn't give a shit...to get out of the way?

And even if they did get out of the way...there are other situations not involving emergency vehicles. People who HAVE to get home or to another job. People who have appointments. People who might be on their way to visit a parent dying in the hospital or a nursing home. A parent who has to get a kid from daycare by a certain time or end up paying extra that perhaps s/he cannot afford.

It's not just the emergency vehicles. It's a whole host of situations and it's disturbing to see the uncaring attitudes on display here toward people who are guilty of nothing other than having the misfortune to be on that road at that time.

[Texasgal]

58. Whatever, I disgree.

I've been stuck in traffic over the dumbest things as well. Football games? Sales at local stores? Free tacos at taco bell? I mean really.

You act like there has never been a traffic backup because of something going on ever.

I won't argue though, your posting style tends to shout down people like me. So, whatever, I disagree. carry on. I have nothing left to say.

[Joe the Revelator]

60. The point is, if the idea is to get people on your side, ruining their evening isn't the way to do

it. It's why this movement needs some leadership.

[pipi_k]

62. I'm not trying to "shout down people like you".

What I'm trying to do is get you to see a point.

People going to football games don't purposefully block traffic.

Nor do sales at local stores.


Those protesters knowingly and willfully blocked traffic, which they do not have a right to do.

But whatever.

I suppose if it were, say, a bunch of teabaggers out there protesting for something they wanted, it would all just be dandy, right?

Let them block traffic. Let them keep people from conducting their business. How else are they going to be heard?

Does any group with which you do not agree have the right to purposefully block your free movement?

If they don't, then that means the OWS protesters don't, either.

[Texasgal]

70. I see your point.

You don't see mine.

your posting style effectively tends to shut conversation down. I hear you, I get what you are saying. All I am saying is I simply do not agree.

I will not be your punching bag. I'm sorry. I will move on now. Thank you.

[pipi_k]

81. I didn't ask you to agree.

And really, I'm not purposely trying to misunderstand your point.

I actually am trying very hard to understand why it's OK for a group of people...any group...to make something miserable...rush hour traffic...even MORE miserable for a bunch of innocent people.

I don't understand that at all.

In any case, I'm sorry you feel like a "punching bag". Unless I'm wrong, I don't recall being the first one to initiate contact between us. You were somewhat snotty to me in your first or second reply, acting as if my "sorry asses" comment was directed toward you personally, which it most definitely was NOT.

It was (and still is) how I felt about those protesters, and I didn't appreciate this comment:

"I would assume that firetrucks and ambulances etc. would be allowed to pass by, otherwise your minor inconvenience can kiss my butt. "

Really...don't jump on me with an insult like that, then claim you are the "punching bag".

Thanks. I guess we're finished here, then.

[LanternWaste]

117. we each should weigh which is more important

I imagine that at the end of day, we each of us should weigh which is more important and what holds a higher priority-- social and cultural change, or a traffic jam.

Traffic jams which I readily admit rarely, if ever happen, unless predicated specifically on a civil protest-- thus our inexperience with them, and our inability to deal with them.

I admit to feeling very, very badly for the individuals who missed their daily lunches in the mid-sixties due to the sit-ins of diners in the south who cared nothing about winning the hearts and minds of the hungry noon crew of office workers. :shrug:

That guy who's pulled over to the side of the road with a flat tire during rush hour and holding things up? He should be fined... because as you so eloquently put it-- he's preventing us from our responsibilities of watching the kickoff on Monday Night Football, and checking our Facebook status. We have our priorities in the correct order, no doubt about it.

Quite certainly most uncaring... no other explanation exists. Thank goodness.

[pipi_k]

125. What's not important to you

may be very important to someone else.

Like getting home to care for a parent with dementia who lives with the person before the home care nurse leaves.

Or picking a child up from a babysitter's house before the babysitter has to leave for some appointment.

It's not just those people caught in the traffic jam who are being punished for the sins of others...the 1%. It's also others who are associated in some way with those trapped commuters.


Yes, people get stuck in traffic all the time, but it's usually not intentionally caused by a bunch of idiots who don't give a shit what trials or troubles other people might be experiencing in their lives at that moment. Let me tell you, in case you didn't know...there are some things that, at the moment, take precedence over spoiled brats blocking traffic to get attention.

[cwydro]

34. Lots of selfish people out there pipi

on both sides...sad to say.

[pipi_k]

45. I know...

A movement that could be worth a lot gets dragged down through the mud by a bunch of selfish assholes who think they have a right to block the movements of people who are probably no better off than they are just because they're pissed off at Wall Street and God knows what else.

Then they'll get all "poor me, I'm a victim of police brutality" when they get arrested.

Ugh.

It really just makes me ill.

[EdMaven]

102. Kafkaesque. Do you call Obama 'selfish' when his motorcade clears the entire fucking freeway?

Yeah, I bet you do.

[pipi_k]

126. he's not some asshole

out there blocking traffic in order to get attention.

He's getting from one place to another. Just like when a train goes across a road, blocking traffic.

When Obama moves around in his limo, or a train crosses a roadway, there's a known end. And it's not done from malice.

Protesters blocking a road are being assholes for attention, PLUS nobody knows exactly how long they'll be stuck there.

Big difference.

[EdMaven]

136. so it's not traffic jams that bother you, but protest. gotcha. that makes things clear.

"assholes"
"to get attention"

[pipi_k]

140. No, dear...you don't

GOT me.

I don't care about protests.

People can protest all they want.

As long as they do not restrict the free movement of others.

I don't have the God-given right to hinder anyone from going where he wants to go.

Same goes for someone else. Don't keep people from carrying on their daily lives, even for five minutes. Especially when those people being blocked are part of the population the protests are supposed to be FOR.

Go block the big banks or the big insurance companies. Stick it to the 1% at the top. Not the little guys trying to get home.

As far as traffic jams go, I don't like them under any circumstances, but I especially loathe them when they are willfully caused by people out to grab attention.

The intent makes all the difference.

[Name removed]

29. Deleted message

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[wndycty]

31. LInk to the HuffPo with pictures

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/10/10/take-back-chicago-rally-e_n_1003835.html

[TBF]

32. Solidarity my brothers and sisters in Chicago. nt

[Phentex]

36. Too bad they didn't block the marathon...

Too bad.

[cwydro]

37. Kinda hard to block runners lol.

I would just run around the blocker...

[wndycty]

40. I ran in that marathon and I would have run them over. . .I worked hard for 18 weeks. . .

. . .to finish that damn thing and no one was getting in my way.

[Phentex]

43. I know. You told us already...

It's all about you.

[wndycty]

46. Its not, not at all. I know there are many of you here at DU who can care less what I think . .

. . .the feeling is mutual.

[KoKo]

61. I figured you would be really pissed.......

[Name removed]

41. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Joe the Revelator]

44. Again, tell me how keeping working stiffs....

...from their families or responsibilities helps when gathering support from those on the sidelines.

[Zanzoobar]

49. It works like this

To gain support, you anger two of the largest metropolitan communities in the country by keeping them from their dinner and soccer games. After they're on your side, it's a cake walk.

[yawnmaster]

52. Then why not go farther? Jump on the hood of my car while I'm stuck in traffic...

then I will definitely not be alienated!
I'll definitely look up what the fuss is about...
pee on my tire even! then I'll find out what the goals of the movement are...
and talking about movement...

[joshcryer]

66. Indeed.

Sometimes a law is just on its face and unjust in its application. For instance, I have been arrested on a charge of parading without a permit. Now, there is nothing wrong in having an ordinance which requires a permit for a parade. But such an ordinance becomes unjust when it is used to maintain segregation and to deny citizens the First-Amendment privilege of peaceful assembly and protest.

[Odin2005]

55. That's idiotic. I bet it was an Agent Provocateur who got them to do that.

:banghead:

[joshcryer]

64. Don't underestimate the wisdom of the crowd. They did it on their own.

[Joe the Revelator]

69. There was no wisdom in this choice...at all....

.

[Codeine]

68. Please. Protesters can be idiotic without help from Agents Provocateur. nt

[joshcryer]

63. African American people are marching against segregation, effectively stalling rush hour traffic.

I'm really dismayed at many of the replies denigrating the occupy protesters.

[Joe the Revelator]

67. African Americans were marching against the majority....

....the entire point of the OSS is that we ARE the majority. We néed to draw people to the cause, not piss them off.

[joshcryer]

73. A majority with the level of representation of a minority.

I suppose we all supported the Brooklin bridge arrests, too.

[Joe the Revelator]

74. So again, how does pissing off your 'brothers in arms' effective...what they should have done...

....is tie up private jet traffic at an executive airport.

[joshcryer]

80. The purpose is to get noticed.

Note I don't think the tactic overall is very useful, but I refuse to deny that it has an effect.

[LoZoccolo]

82. People say that about my posts.

Have they made me, or my views, more popular?

[pipi_k]

90. You have a real good point, there...

Mostly all it's gotten you is lots of contempt, which I totally don't understand, since nobody is ever forced to read your posts.


Unlike being stuck in the middle of a traffic shutdown with no escape till one's "jailers" let everyone pass.

[Joe the Revelator]

83. You're right, it has an effect, it makes the people taking party look like pithy children.

[EdMaven]

103. Are "we"? If "we" are in the majority why do "we" need to "win people to our cause"

as they are already on our side?

And if they are, why would they care about being inconvenienced & why aren't they in the streets?

[pipi_k]

76. Or maybe...

Conservatives and other Teabagger sorts are out there marching against same sex marriage, effectively blocking traffic.

We don't agree with them, but it's what THEY believe is right.

You are stuck in the middle of this idiocy...blocked traffic...and trying desperately to get home in time to change and then rush off to see your kid in a school play.

You've missed others in the past. You PROMISED you would be there this time.

But there are the Teabagger protesters, blocking your way.

How do you feel about them now?

I suppose the "rightness" of any act depends wholly on which side of the issue one is on...

[TBF]

77. What if it is POTUS coming through in his limo ... traffic is blocked. You can't get to that

poor ill child or grandmother or whatever other drama you've been cooking up in every other thread. Does he get a pass?

[pipi_k]

84. Is that usually a spur of the moment thing?

Does the general public not have a clue as to when it may happen?

I would imagine that enough notice goes out to give people a chance to take a detour until the President passes through.


That is NOT the same as a group of people maliciously blocking traffic for their own ends...without notice.

[TBF]

85. You "imagine" notice goes out? Have you ever lived in Washington DC? nt

[pipi_k]

87. No. But anyone who has

must know that the Presidential limo might be out and about at any time.

Right?

I mean, it's no surprise, so people expect it. And any blockages aren't done with malice or to "make a point".


It's not like a group of people blocking rush hour traffic when and where it would not be expected.

[TBF]

89. Well now that the 99% are protesting in every city you will similarly expect them

to be out and about at any time. Right? I mean, it's no surprise, so people expect it.

[pipi_k]

94. Actually they are NOT "protesting in every city"

And certainly not in any city I ever go to.

I don't even NEED to go into the city.

But I will say this...on the very limited occasions when I do go into the city, if there are protesters, fine and dandy. Let them protest. I won't care unless and until they block my freedom to move.

Then I WILL call the police, whom I hope will arrest every one of them who is a public nuisance.

And, most unfortunately, on top of the whole thing, the cause will have lost the support of one more person on account of a bunch of assholes who couldn't act like human beings and treated me like their enemy.

[EdMaven]

105. they are in chicago, & now people know to expect it. so why are you complaining?

[pipi_k]

115. So that's the way it is now?

We're to assume that anybody out there protesting will, at a moment's notice, act like a bunch of spoiled children?

Hey, I saw the posts here a few weeks ago...people whining because the MSM wasn't paying attention to the peaceful protests.

Boo hoo...they have to do something to attract attention!!!

Oooh...here's a great idea... make life miserable for other people...part of that 99% they're depending on for support. yeah! fantastic idea!!!


It's really a sad state of affairs when it gets to this point...where we actually EXPECT people to act like spoiled brats when mommy and daddy won't pay attention to them.

[EdMaven]

135. lol. yeah, it's *traffic jams* that really make life "miserable" for people. oh my, oh my.

[pipi_k]

139. If you are

a single mom who's been scrubbing someone else's toilets all day and all you want to do is get home to your kids who are home alone, then yeah...a traffic jam caused by idiots IS miserable.

If you have bladder or bowel issues, then a traffic jam caused by idiots IS miserable.

If you have an anxiety disorder, getting stuck in traffic tied up by idiots IS miserable. In fact, it can be downright terrifying. Look up panic disorder, dearie...

If you're someone trying to get to the hospital to visit a dying friend or relative, then being in a traffic jam caused by idiots IS miserable.


If you are someone trying to make ends meet by having two jobs and you absolutely cannot be late to your second job or risk losing it, then being stuck in a traffic jam caused by idiots IS miserable.


Shall I go on?

I hear traffic in that area is bad enough without throwing in a bunch of jackasses who think they're so cool for holding up the lives of people who haven't done a damned thing to them. The 99 percenters...remember?


Honestly, I really shouldn't be surprised that there are people out there without the ability to see life from someone else's point of view.

[EdMaven]

104. lol. so funny.

[pipi_k]

120. Please explain

what is "so funny" and why it's "so funny" instead of leaving a two word reply that doesn't mean shit.

thanks.

[girl gone mad]

92. There is often no warning!

I have been stuck waiting on the Presidential caravan. The cops kept me from leaving the parking lot for 30 minutes and then the caravan went in the other direction so the entire thing was stupid and pointless.

I'm positive that the ones kvetching about these protestors would give the President a complete pass.

[pipi_k]

96. As one of the kvetchers...

if that's the case, then I wouldn't even consider living/working in that area.

But it's still not the same as a bunch of people intending to disrupt traffic for their own ends.

I call that malice...

[girl gone mad]

97. You wouldn't consider living/working in what area?

This was in Dallas. The President was attending a fundraiser. The routes and travel times are not announced in advance.

I was late to pick up my kiddo because the President was attending one of those $20K/person dinners. How is that any better than a disruption or delay caused by protestors?

[Mariana]

111. LOL, I guess you deserve it for living in that area.

It's your own bloody fault - why did you decide to live where the President would be attending a fundraiser?

:sarcasm: , obviously. A very similar thing happened to me in Atlanta some years ago. I suppose that was MY own fault.

[pipi_k]

114. Someone mentioned DC

and when you chimed in with tales of being stuck in the presidential caravan, that's where I thought you meant. DC.

[joshcryer]

79. No, I support civil disobedience, even if I disagree with the purpose.

The difference is that I will sympathize with those I agree with for being jailed, but I will otherwise laugh at those I disagree with. Birmingham 's black population in the 60s was almost equal to that of whites. Now Birmingham has a black majority. They weren't some small niche group, they were a very very large and disenfranchised group. The 99% are a majority whose overall representation is highly skewed by the business-like structure of our political environment.

[pipi_k]

86. Yeah, well, it's easy enough

to say that, I suppose.

It's quite another thing to be stuck right in the middle of something you may not have the inclination to be stuck in at that particular time.

I have to ruefully admit that I am not the Saintly type.

My thought on it is that your right to exercise civil disobedience ends at the exact spot where my right to free and unimpeded movement begins.

Just the same way that I respect the rights of others to move freely no matter what my cause may be.

[EdMaven]

106. I imagine the owners of that British tea felt just as you do. Protest should never annoy,

inconvenience or offend anyone.

i.e. protest should always be completely impotent and invisible.

[pipi_k]

112. The owners of that British tea

were connected to the problem. They were PART OF the problem.


Holding up traffic in which the majority being "inconvenienced" are the innocent parties...not part of the problem...is disgusting.

[EdMaven]

134. "Oh, what will we have to drink? They've thrown all the tea in the bay! Pish posh, such an

inconvenience!! How disgusting!!!"

++Wrings hands++

[malaise]

71. Excellent

Rec

[Vidar]

78. Well done!

[white_wolf]

91. To everyone whining about traffic I'll just leave this article below:

http://www.marxist.com/belgium-street-cleaners-paralyse-brussels.htm

[lonestarnot]

93. Teachers want rid of Rahm!

[Tsiyu]

95. Some will undoubtedly complain about traffic

Back in 2003, they said the same thing about those protesting the Iraq Invasion. "What if an ambulance can't get through?"

AS I've said here on DU recently, there are far too many people who have lost their lives due to lack of health care because of economic injustice. Many more will die if we do not reform our system of health care delivery. In effect, Wall Street and Congress have blocked EVERY street in America when it comes to having our needs met.

Had HALF OF AMERICA shown up to protest the invasion of Iraq, the stalled traffic for a few days would have been like one raindrop compared to the blizzard of death, debt and misery that invasion cost this country.

If you can't be inconvenienced, you are too comfortable. Get used to being uncomfortable, because "you ain't seen nothing yet."

Or whine...while other people do the work of protesting on your behalf, no matter how crappily you talk about them.

[nadinbrzezinski]

119. This is why the 1% is getting worried

[nadinbrzezinski]

123. Curious, same crew was annoyed at the idea of blocking traffic

interesting to be exact... and far from surprising.

[Name removed]

129. Deleted message

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[JustABozoOnThisBus]

132. Stalled rush-hour traffic? OC is just taking credit

for a daily occurrance. Chicago rush-hour traffic is ALWAYS snarled, gridlocked.

Ok, maybe they made it a little bit worse.

:hi:

[deaniac21]

133. Wish they would stall the traffic between here and Afganistan.

[Withywindle]

137. I remember one of the giant anti-war marches in the early 00s did this too.

I was in that one, and I remember most of the people in cars being very thumbs-up and supportive.


Some people on this thread sound like they have no idea about what Chicago traffic is like. You know what snarls up Chicago traffic at rush hour?


EVERYTHING.


Weather's terrible? Traffic jam. Weather's too nice? Traffic jam. Street festival? Huge downtown concert/entertainment event? Parade? (We have dozens of these every year, it's a huge point of civic pride for us) Traffic jam. Accident? Traffic jam. Visiting dignitary? Traffic jam. Holiday weekend? You got it. Critical Mass pro-bike event? Yup. Stock market up? Traffic jam. Stock market down? Traffic jam. Trouble with the CTA? Oh yeah. An astrologist could possibly find some kind of celestial pattern to it.

At least these people weren't stranded on Lake Shore Drive for five hours in killer wind and snow, as happened last winter. I think an awful lot of Chicagoans are much more sanguine about this sort of thing than the panic brigade would have you believe. And the really smart ones park miles from the Loop and take the train anyway.

[LoZoccolo]

141. The anti-war protesters were the 30%, not the 99%. n/t

[Withywindle]

142. But a lot of us were the same people

...so how do the percentages work then?

[LoZoccolo]

144. There's a different dynamic in the two situations.

See my previous post upthread:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=439&topic_id=2092794&mesg_id=2093998

The same action has a different effect in two different contexts, as many actions do. I don't see how an action which will affect more people from the 99% adversely is supposed to be a blow against the 1%, especially when the OWS movement is gaining traction simply by creating awareness of these economic issues through basic, but widespread and well-organized demonstrations.

[pipi_k]

145. And from a purely moral point of view...

it makes as little sense as some guy getting bullied by his boss all day and then going home to take it out on his family...the people he depends on for love and support.

He won't tell his boss off...no...

he'll go home and yell at the kids or kick the dog. Or maybe he'll sit with his beer, stewing in his anger the rest of the evening, effectively punishing his own family for the wrongs of his boss.


If someone wants me on his side, he would be an idiot to piss me off.

[LadyInAZ]

146. yayyyy for them...

imagine doing this nation wide with all (underemployed, unemployed, and those fortunate to be still working) involved. throughout this recession everyone is affected may it be small or large. nice to see a common purpose/goal among us all...