Greece, A Victim of Capitalism

[blindpig]

Greece, A Victim of Capitalism

Greece, cradle of slave-owning democracy, seems fated to be among the countries digging the upcoming grave of capitalist democracy.

"To understand what the future has in store for the people of Greece, you need to imagine an intruder breaking into your home, pointing a gun at your head and demanding you give him your salary, your savings, your car, your TV set and your refrigerator."

That's how US writer and journalist Zoltan Zigedy sees the situation in his web site ZZ's Blog where, under the title Capitalism Mugs Greece. Who is Next?, he explains that the Greek people did not benefit at all from the orgiastic profits of international banking nor did it promote its irresponsible behavior, but now it is forced to pay the price for the damage which caused the collapse of the global capitalist system. "And if invasion, armed robbery and extortion are crimes, Greece is undoubtedly a crime victim. And the European Union, the European Central Bank and the International Monetary Fund are the criminals with the PASOK leaders and parliamentarians who attempt to legitimize the crime". The recovery-from-recession prescription — presented by capitalist economists as a universal law – stemmed from the concept that deficit and debt-promoting expenses stimulated growth and inflation which, in turn, increased tax incomes and made the debt cheaper allowing the reduction of public debt vis-a-vis the economic product.

Today, according to Zigedy, two factors have changed this dynamic. Firstly, the almost total domination of the neoliberal ideology which has generated in public opinion a great fear of any degree of public debt.

more...

http://mltoday.com/subject-areas/commentary/greece-a-victim-of-capitalism-eng.-esp.-1222.html?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+ml2day-recent+%28Welcome+to+MLToday.com+%7C+Recently+Added+Content+%7C+Please+Subscribe+to+Our+Feed%29

[xchrom]

1. recommend

[Ikonoklast]

2. Greece was borrowing money they knew they could not repay

to finance their government.

They refuse to pay taxes to support their own state, instead they borrowed billions and kept kicking the can down the road by continuously re-financing that debt.

Well, the day of reckoning came, and now they want German taxpayers to foot the bill for Greeks whom avoiding paying income tax is a national past-time.

They willingly slipped the noose of debt over their own necks, and are now shocked, shocked I say that they are being asked to repay what they borrowed.

Playing the victim isn't working.

[blindpig]

3. Luv you some bankers, huh?

The Greek people have not been on easy street despite the claims of capitalist propaganda.

If the Germans had any sense they'd tell the bankers to fuck off too.

[Ikonoklast]

7. No one held a gun to the head of the Greek government.

They borrowed the money to buy the gun and bullets, held it to their own head, and are begging the Eurozone to pull the trigger.

The Greeks have a lot in common with Teabaggers; they want what they want, but don't want to pay for it.

They refuse to pay taxes to support their own nation, but would gladly let you foot the bill for them.

Teabagger Economics.

[blindpig]

13. Don't confuse the government with the people.

I wouldn't do that for this country either, governments in capitalist societies are the tools of their ruling classes. The ruling party of Greece, PASOK, is very similar to the Democratic Party despite the socialist appellation.

The only Greeks who might be comparable to the TP's are the petit bourgeoisie, it's a class thing.

[socialist_n_TN]

4. This reminds me of "The Shock Doctrine"

story of how Pinochet (? or one of the LA countries and dictators) borrowed money for the tools to oppress and torture their citizens and then were expected to repay it after they overthrew the dictator.

Fuck it. Not one dime for the banks and bankers.

[blindpig]

6. Yeah, but some consider this some sort of abberation....

whereas it is business as usual.

As I recall the British made the Chinese pay their cost for the Opium War.

Business as usual.

[socialist_n_TN]

9. Yep. Business as usual

This IS the system in all of it's unchained glory.

[Starry Messenger]

5. k&r

[TBF]

8. This quote -

"the Greek people did not benefit at all from the orgiastic profits of international banking nor did it promote its irresponsible behavior, but now it is forced to pay the price for the damage which caused the collapse of the global capitalist system" sorta reminds me of another country ...

[Ikonoklast]

10. The Greek Government bribed Goldman Sachs to lie about their debt

to the Euorozone, back in 2001.

They are the Poster Child for irresponsible behavior.

[TBF]

12. Did I say "Greek government"? No, I said "greek people". nt

[Ikonoklast]

19. They are in on the scam.Complicit and accomplices in their own demise.

Tax cheating is endemic and systematic in Greece, top to bottom, borrowing other people's money in order to maintain their lifestyle instead of paying their own way is obliquely the same fight we have in this country with the 1% skating on their fair share, but wanting the rest of us to carry them.


Teabagger Economics in action; they want no responsibility put on them for the choices they made, blame everyone but those responsible...themselves.

[TBF]

24. You think the Greek workers are maintaining elaborate lifestyles?

Yet here in the US you recognize that the top 1% who own everything are ripping off everyone else?

I'm sensing a little cognitive dissonance here ...

[blindpig]

25. Will you say that about the American people.....

when they start cutting Social Security and Medicare? When schools and firehouses are closed?

[Yo_Mama]

17. Greece's problems have nothing whatsoever to do with international bad debts

They are based on their own bad debts.

They're the ones who did this to themselves. They can get out of it any time they want to, but it will require a very different way of life and the Greeks have not accepted what they have to do yet.

[Nye Bevan]

11. Greece, a victim of tax cheats

ATHENS — In the wealthy, northern suburbs of this city, where summer temperatures often hit the high 90s, just 324 residents checked the box on their tax returns admitting that they owned pools.

So tax investigators studied satellite photos of the area — a sprawling collection of expensive villas tucked behind tall gates — and came back with a decidedly different number: 16,974 pools.

That kind of wholesale lying about assets, and other eye-popping cases that are surfacing in the news media here, points to the staggering breadth of tax dodging that has long been a way of life here.

Such evasion has played a significant role in Greece’s debt crisis, and as the country struggles to get its financial house in order, it is going after tax cheats as never before.

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/05/02/world/europe/02evasion.html

Switzerland is a capitalist country too, but with 3% unemployment and universal health care. The difference? The Swiss pay their taxes.

[blindpig]

14. There it is, 'the wealthy'...

and yet it is the masses who are made to suffer.

Sound familiar?

[Nye Bevan]

18. Not just the wealthy

from the article:

To get more attentive care in the country’s national health system, Greeks routinely pay doctors cash on the side, a practice known as “fakelaki,” Greek for little envelope. And bribing government officials to grease the wheels of bureaucracy is so standard that people know the rates. They say, for instance, that 300 euros, about $400, will get you an emission inspection sticker.

Some of the most aggressive tax evaders, experts say, are the self-employed, a huge pool of people in this country of small businesses. It includes not just taxi drivers, restaurant owners and electricians, but engineers, architects, lawyers and doctors.

[blindpig]

20. So, I guess you blame the people for the housing crisis....

in this country too?

That is such a ruling class narrative.

[Nye Bevan]

21. Sorry, what does the housing crisis in the USA have to do with Greece running out of money

because so many Greeks won't pay their taxes?

Do you disagree with any of the facts in the New York Times article?

[blindpig]

22. In both cases it was the 'aggressive' loan policies of banks...

which was the origin of the problem. They do this because they know they can get away with it, their influence upon government assuring their repayment, they will be payed, regardless. This is no different than the 'austerity' now being shoved down our throats.

As per the NYT article, I will provide information from 'on the ground' asap.

[closeupready]

15. I'm not sure you want to draw a comparison with the Swiss when it comes to fair taxation.

nt

[Yo_Mama]

16. They certainly borrowed the money, though.

The money was borrowed to support an economy that wasn't producing enough to generate the jobs and lifestyles they wanted.

I don't think Greece is a victim of capitalism - I think it is a victim of its own bad choices. And while I don't agree with what is happening now to the people there, the reality is that it is a sovereign state. The only reason why it has chosen to go forward with the present agenda is because Greece doesn't want to default on its debt due to likely terrible economic consequences.

Greece is going to default. It will not pay much of the debt back. But defaulting on its debt will still force a massive restructuring of the Greek economy, because once they default, they won't be able to borrow, and they will still have to dismantle a lot of their economy because what they have built cannot work without constant borrowing.

[blindpig]

33. Do you see a difference between government and the people?

Will it be the American people's fault when Social Security is cut in the name of 'austerity'?

[Yo_Mama]

34. It isn't necessary to cut SS NOW

And if it does happen, yes, it will collectively be the people's fault because we let the idiot politicians get away with not dealing with the problem for so long. If that does happen, I will be most upset and will fight to protect the poorest among us.

Greece isn't a dictatorship. We are not a dictatorship. And if we let those who just don't care about the fate of the average man a decade down the road prevail, I won't be blaming capitalism.

[blindpig]

35. As though the people control the politicians....

We and the Greeks live in a dictatorship of Capital.

[Yo_Mama]

36. Capital does not vote

Really, it does not.

Any democracy in which the citizens show enough apathy toward good government will develop problems.

[blindpig]

37. It votes with it's checkbook. n/t

[PETRUS]

38. In the US...

...9 of 10 people to win office have outspent their opponents. And legislature is drafted by a network of foundations, think tanks, and lobbyists, funded primarily by the very upper end of the wealth spectrum (a fraction of the 1%) - NOT by the people or their elected representatives.

[blindpig]

23. Greek debt crisis hits small businesses in Athens

Greek debt crisis hits small businesses in Athens

snip

The WSWS spoke to Sotiria, who has a textile shop specialising in making and repairing company uniforms. She said: “My business has fallen 50 percent since the crisis. First of all, many souvlaki or kebab shops have closed due to the crisis. Also, there is competition from Chinese shops. Due to the recession, people buy fewer clothes, and also they use their sewing machines to repair their clothes and to work as individual seamstresses. Last year, work was going well and I was preparing to hire three people. But that changed.”

She explained, “Most of the shops in the area have closed down for lack of work. Many shops go to countries north of Greece for cheaper labour.” She said many operations were moving to Bulgaria, in particular.



She said that her industry was being transformed by big businesses’ relentless search for profit: “Big companies come here, have us cut the fabric, and say we’ll make the clothes in Bulgaria because it’s cheaper. Now people often work for cleaning companies. Those cleaning companies get contracts with the public sector for €300,000, but they only pay €100,000 as wages; they have huge margins.”

She underlined the lack of financial support from the banks and the government: “We don’t have support as small businesses, we need more support from the OAF . It’s very hard to get loans from the banks. I make a 20 percent margin, but the bank wants 14 percent of that. So we need more support. If I received a subsidy, it would be better for the economy; I could do more work and there would be more tax revenue, because I don’t evade my taxes.”

much more.....

http://www.wsws.org/articles/2010/may2010/peri-m18.shtml

[FLPanhandle]

26. Greece can't blame Capitalism; they can blame their governments decisions

Capitalism didn't force Greece to abandon their currency, join the Eurozone, borrow tons of money they would never be able to repay, and ignore their tax revenue.

That's not the fault of Capitalism. That's just plain stupidity by the government. Even the old Soviet bloc countries did the same thing by borrowing more than they could ever repay.

[blindpig]

29. Their government, like ours, exists for the capitalists.

You gonna be saying that when Social Security and Medicare are on the block?

[FLPanhandle]

31. Their government like ours has lost it's role as the control and steward

However, that's not unique to capitalist societies. It's happened over and over regardless of the economic model of the country.

When a government makes decisions for the benefit of those in power only, this is the result. It matters not if that is a socialist, communist, or capitalist government.

The point is the Greeks should be blaming those they put in charge for this mess. It was their greed and short term thinking that did this. Same as here.

[blindpig]

32. Be assured, they are.

PASOK will almost surely not survive the next election and KKE is nipping at their tail. As we speak four government ministries, those from where the EU bankers would direct the spoilation of the Greek working class, are occupied by workers. If the army is called out anything can happen, including revolution.

[leftstreet]

27. Greek citizens shouldn't have let their wages get so low, or their unemployment get so high

I shouldn't need this but
:sarcasm:

[Rex]

28. Corporatism is here to stay.

Our new kings.

[blindpig]

30. Oh no it ain't....

they create the conditions of their own demise.