My father was a cop. Riot duty was one of his favorite gigs.

[Taverner]

I love my dad, but he, like pretty much all of his generation wearing blue, used gestapo tactics.

He was a cop in the bay area during the 60s. The first order of business during any protest was to stir up the protestors. They would taunt the protestors, call them racist names, etc. If that didn't work, they would plain out lie. "They were trying to burn down the building!" "They were throwing rocks." Those who have been in protests should know this already.

Once they are using force, there are no rules. The policemen wear body armor and helmets. They go for heads, necks, knees and stomachs with their batons. Pregnant women are targets. The elderly, the handicapped, targets. Women are targets. You'd be surprised how many cops get a hard on after beating up some "hippie bitches." Don't believe anyone who will tell you they try to protect the weakest - this is a bald faced lie.

They also use tactics to inflict the most bodily damage. Force them into an alley where they can be bludgeoned, and not run away. Fire tear gas at the heads of protestors, not at the ground. If you have the luck to find someone curled up in fetal position, keep hitting until they stop moving altogether. Bodies can be moved. Back then, they ended up over the state line. And since they were just "dirty hippies" they would be written off as runaways.

Media must be prevented access. With reporters, aim for the cameras. Make them non-functioning. Scare them away with any intimidation tactics possible.

--------------------------------------

I do not believe the police have changed. They are still using the same tactics. They still send the most roided-up, angry muscleheads to riot duty. They just have become better at covering this up. Don't be surprised if a few Occupy Oaklanders end up "missing."

Take care.

[Dawson Leery]

1. If that is so, then why bother protecting their collective bargaining rights?

For teachers and firefighters, of course I support their right to collectively bargain. For police, that is a different matter.

[Taverner]

2. Police Unions rarely support Democrats

And they make more than teachers or firefighters

Like I said in another post, they need to lose some skin

That "skin" could be cold hard cash

[Dawson Leery]

7. Then we agree to a certain extent.

The FOP is the one union I oppose. I am for breaking it up and taking away the bargaining rights for LEO's.

[Taverner]

8. If cops actually "protected and served" I'd be all for it

But there needs to be some punitive action

[HDPaulG]

65. Appears to "to protect and serve" the 1%

[Bjorn Against]

43. While I am a big supporter of labor in general, the police unions piss me off frequently

I am sick of seeing them stand up for these violent thugs, police violence needs to be treated even more seriously than civilian violence. These are the people who are supposed to protect us, when they turn their guns and batons on non-violent people it should be a severe penalty that goes beyond what a non-law enforcement officer would receive. I support the rights of any union to engage in collective bargaining including police, but I will not stick up for anyone who supports unprovoked police violence and I get furious when I see a union defending these bastards.

[defendandprotect]

67. Agree -- too often they rush to the "blue line" -- protecting officers who should be in jail--!!

[kayakjohnny]

93. That "skin" should be real skin.

[virgogal]

9. So you think that police should lose their collective bargaining

rights because of one post on DU that has nothing to back up the allegations that were stated.

Astonishing.

[Dawson Leery]

11. Until the system of policing changing, only then can

the discussion of collective bargaining rights exist.

[virgogal]

18. In other words you believe the accusations in the OP,like

making pregnant women targets.

The internet is quite a place.

[Taverner]

20. You can pretend that's not the case. You can lie to yourself and convince yourself of anything.

Go right ahead.

Have fun with that now!

[defendandprotect]

69. Thought it very courageous .....

of you to tell us all of this ---

certainly a meaningful part of your private life you're revealing --

and obviously it had to have effected you, as well!


So -- again -- thank you!

[Generic Other]

140. I agree...a tough thing to have to acknowledge about your father's chosen profession

Family members are insiders. We all of us have secrets who remember that time and place. This is just one look behind the blue line somewhere back then. Maybe it was not like that everywhere. But I remember the footage of protests during the war. I was a kid. There were violent encounters. The old guard did not like the hippies or care if they hurt them a little. Go find footage of the '68 Democratic Convention. Nixon probably won the election because of it. The Bob Hope generation had nothing but disdain for the Peace Movement. They didn't defend the students who were killed at Kent State. They cheered the Ohio National Guard. I remember how they teargassed kids, beat them with billy clubs, absolutely brutalized them. Big beefy wellfed cops in full armor attacking kids making peace signs and singing "Give PeaCE a Chance." Lots of documentary evidence of this time period.

Nothing the OP says lacks the ring of truth to me. I watched it all unfold on my TV set. Some people don't forget their history, America.

[Dawson Leery]

25. The Oakland PD should lose their collective bargaining rights.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=QngE6kKk8Lg

....as well as their bloated paychecks.

http://www.esquire.com/blogs/politics/occupy-oakland-6530274

[Enthusiast]

88. No one should lose their collective bargaining rights.

Bloated pay checks? Damn you sound a John Kascish boy. Or maybe a Koch Brother's boy. Divide and conquer.

[Dawson Leery]

135. Either the cops stand with the working class, or they sink.

They are choosing to sink themselves. When the Koch brothers come after them, there will be no one left to fight for their rights.

[Turbineguy]

100. Maybe they should keep

their bargaining rights and bloated paychecks but be reminded what the laws of the land are and how important it is that they of all people, accept them.

[fasttense]

101. Bloated paychecks? Really?

My father was a police officer and he had to work a second job, and have my mother go to work, so the five of us could eat.

So, exactly where are these bloated paychecks?

Do not let the idle rich convince you of lies with their propaganda.

Believe it or not, but these cops are NOT being paid much to beat up protesters and protect the idle rich.

You would think the 1% would pay their protectors a living wage, but they don't. The idle rich are far too greedy to even pay for decent protection.

[greiner3]

91. The attitude of the FOP in Columbus OH;

Is to make paperwork of civilians injured by police is to go missing. It takes more than a FOI request to get 'unmissing' paperwork reach the light of day and even then reporters complain it is seriously redacted.

A lot of Columbus cops are thugs. I know one of the sergeants and even he admits this and has told a few stories to back this up.

Believe this or not. The first is public record and the second is second hand.

[SharonAnn]

111. I was shocked at what I found when I installed a dispatching and arrest database for a police dept.

Up until then, I had supported police and generally trusted them.

After working in that environment for over a year, I got a whole new view of them. Though some seemed to be good guys, it was amazing how many authoritarian thugs there were.

Frightening! And this was 30 years ago. I doubt that it has improved.

[defendandprotect]

141. kr

[Taverner]

19. I think a more effective method would be to regulate them so hard

That they can't take a shit without filling a form in triplicate

[Dawson Leery]

22. +1

[quakerboy]

73. Nah.

what I want is constant video surveillance of the police. They should be decked out with video and audio recordings whenever in uniform, so that if there is any question as to their actions, hard proof can be provided. And the penalties for harming others, particularly with the use of violence, should be scaled upwards for police officers, given the power that we vest in them. They get more power, they take a harder punishment if they chose to abuse it.

At least that's my initial take on that.

[Laelth]

92. +1 n/t

-Laelth

[jwirr]

120. Exactly. Incident reports. We in Social Work do that with incidents to

our clients in order to stop abuse. It is quite strict - my daughter has seizures and sometimes cuts her chin. It is not anyones fault but it is reported to us and the parents none the less.

[Modern_Matthew]

68. Yeah, I only believe in collective bargaining for human beings. nt

[olegramps]

103. That is not the case:

In our metropolitan city, the Police Union has repeatedly resisted any discipline for even the most grievous cases of police brutality. I do not know of even one case in which they agreed with the authorities attempts to discipline a rouge cop. The only cases that come to the public's attention is when someone captures the violence on their video equipment. I can reasonably conclude that the violence must be far more prevalent than the cases that are known. I can't help from wondering just what type of person wants to be a police officer. Even if they aren't violent why do they tolerate such behavior by their fellow officers and even go to the extent of covering up for them by filing false police reports?

[whathehell]

107. I've known a couple of cops in my day....I had the chance to meet an ex-cop

who told me straight up that "being a cop is a power trip".

I do think they're are some good cops, but they need to be

heavily supervised.

[RoccoR5955]

110. I've seen them use these tactics in the distant future.

No allegations here. I believe the post from PERSONAL EXPERIENCE!

[jwirr]

118. Allegation without back up? There are plenty of people from the

60s who can testify to that. None of it surprised me and my grandfather was a cop. A nice one in a small town - non-union - who never had to deal with a riot.

[Starry Messenger]

14. Because hiring free-agent mercenaries would actually be kind of worse.

Think about it.

[jwirr]

121. Blackwater/Ze anyone?

[Salviati]

34. Because of who we are, not because of who they are.

The same reason that torturing terrorism suspects is wrong. The same reason that protecting neo-nazi's rights to free speech is right.

All workers should be able to collectively bargain with their employer. This is something that should be fundamental to the Democratic party, and to split people off and to isolate them weakens who we are.

[rpannier]

63. +1

Good call

[defendandprotect]

70. +1 --

[tomg]

81. Sorry, but like free speech,

collective bargaining rights are - or should be - human rights. Take away their rights and you threaten everyone's. My wife is a teacher and a union rep, and thanks for supporting those rights. I am a college teacher and under the Yeshiva decision, my institution does not have to collectively bargain with faculty (although they do, but it is still different). With the police, investigate, regulate, reform. Their basic right to collectively bargain is a different matter.

[Gman]

137. I've always had mixed emotions about supporting cops in their negotiations.

When I was in the labor movement. They were. Ever there for anyone else. They were worse than Teamsters or the Farm Workers in expecting you to support them but expecting they took a walk when anyone else's issues came up.

[PearliePoo2]

3. Your Dad did all that.....

and you LOVE him?
Holy cow.

[Taverner]

5. I am not a black and white thinker

Sorry :shrug:

[Nye Bevan]

10. He must have had some great redeeming qualities

to make up for the whole batoning pregnant women and the handicapped thing.

[Taverner]

12. I don't know if *he* did that specifically, but he told me other cops did

And yes, they thought it was funny

Funny

You don't get to choose your family, and you don't get to choose who raises you

To me, my love hate relationship with my dad is just proof positive that things are not a simple "yes" or "no" in this world

[crazyjoe]

102. how do you love a man who watched pregnant woman beat with a stick

and did nothing about it?

[JuniperLea]

24. Ever heard of unconditional love?

My dog peed on the floor and I still love her. My mother neglected me because she was ill, and I still love her. My grandfather was a raging racist most of his life, but I loved him dearly.

Love the sinner, hate the sin... and above all, if you don't know how to love unconditionally, you have never really loved anyone.

[Taverner]

26. Pretty much.

Even if my own son tried to kill me, I would still love him

[JuniperLea]

50. Yep... me too...

That is what love is. I'm not sure what that poster thinks love is all about.

[whathehell]

106. Um....One can "love" without it being "unconditional"

Sorry, but I don't think nazis deserve "unconditional love".:eyes:

[JuniperLea]

114. As if to illustrate...

You just proved you don't have a clue as to what unconditional love is... you just put a condition on it.

Unconditional love is when you love someone anyway, even if they don't "deserve" it.

If my brother were a Nazi, I would still love him... I'd hate what he did and what he stood for, but I would love my brother regardles... THAT is unconditional love.

Please, get thyself to a dictionary.

[whathehell]

134. Oh my

fools do rush in, don't they?

Get yourself a dictionary, dear...The truth is, YOU don't realize what

"unconditional love" is, if you think it's the ONLY type.

Unconditional love is is the highest and best kind of love,

but not the "only" kind.

Hint: That's why it's prefaced by a descriptive word..:eyes:

[JuniperLea]

142. Look it up...

I never said it was the only type... but it is, however, the only type we are discussing right now.

Yes, fools do rush in... don't let them trample you from behind.


Main Entry:

unconditional love



Part of Speech:

n



Definition:

affection with no limits or conditions; complete love

[whathehell]

145. You look it up, dear

my post, that is.

I never disagreed with your dictionary defintion..duh.

What was disputed was your equation of "love" with

"unconditional love", though you'd now prefer to deny it,

and btw, "What we are discussing" is anything "we" want to discuss.

Better luck next time!

[PearliePoo2]

29. A dog peeing on the floor..

an ill mother or a racist grandfather IMO does not equate to:

"someone curled up in fetal position, keep hitting until they stop moving altogether. Bodies can be moved."

Killing someone? Or fucking them up so bad they will never be the same?
If any relative of mine did all these horrible things, I would report their CRIMINAL behavior to someone who COULD DO something about it.
Nope, I can't "unconditionally" love someone who's behavior I tolerate only because they are a blood relation.
I have, in fact, alerted the police and assisted in the arrest of my own nephew after he burglarized and set fires to several residences. It agonized me to do it, but I live with my decision.

[apocalypsehow]

31. So why are you still here, posting, instead of downtown filling out a police report?

:shrug:

Seriously: we get it. If it had been your Dad you'd run right to IA, or something. The larger point, I think, is that the OP is sharing his personal knowledge of the kinds of attitudes that go with what happened in that Oakland park the other night. At least that's what I took from it: the OP is free to speak for himself and correct me if I'm wrong.

[JuniperLea]

48. Please show me where the poster said his father did any such thing!

Please... what the fuck?

[PearliePoo2]

54. The original post said this:

"someone curled up in fetal position, keep hitting until they stop moving altogether. Bodies can be moved. Back then, they ended up over the state line."
Then the OP said this:
"I don't know if *he* did that specifically, but he told me other cops did."

I NEVER said OP's father did these things, the OP said his father said "other cops" did.
What I said was if I was aware of criminal behavior of a relative of mine, I would turn them in. Period.
So...what the FUCK back at you. Please...

edit spelling

[defendandprotect]

75. While I understand your point -- and you have acted on your beliefs vs a nephew -- I think ....

it has to be understood that you would have to have proof/evidence of this

and unlikely that a young boy would have it. Would he try to force his father

to testify against others?

And is it likely that either the son or the father wouldn't recognize that their

own family and well being would be wholly destroyed by such attempts to reveal

this truth?

However, much a child might like to have seen justice done, most of us understand

that it wouldn't have been possible for the child to accomplish any such thing.


Perhaps another family member could have persuaded the father to leave the force?

We also know that many of these police officers are involved in domestic violence

at home. There is no way any man can be doing these things and not be haunted by

the memories -- perhaps some day when they are ill and in need of medical care and

have none?


Adults can make decisions that children can't -- but they will always have consequences.

Sometimes very painful ones, even with the best of intentions.

We know many innocents have been been jailed for decades for doing nothing.

We know many police are still planting evidence and charging people with crimes they

haven't committed.

It's up to society to face this issue and do something about it-- !!

Meanwhile, we have elites selecting the most brutal of men to serve in police enforcement --

and whatever evidence of these crimes might even exist -- it isn't likely that justice would

be done!




Edited to add that -- btw, many police officers and many Police Commissions have investigated

and hoped to bring police corruption and violence to an end -- only to come to naught.

The people who control this also control organized crime -- they are elites who require these

services and their money speaks very loudly!!

[JuniperLea]

130. So you agree with me...

The poster never said that, yet you equated his father to those actions.

The what the fuck is still firmly in your court.

[backscatter712]

64. No offense, but if any members of my family commited such atrocities, I would disown them. n/t

[whathehell]

109. Same here...Unconditional love, my ass. n/t

[Hanks]

90. My thoughts exactly

And interesting that later on the writer begins back peddling claiming that he/she didn't know if the father actually did those things described. Oh really? A cop is a cop is a cop.. etc.

[zalinda]

113. No, not all cops are this way.

Many, many people go into police work, because they want to help. There is a reason that suicide is a great worry among the cops families. They see a lot of things that we don't see, and deal with people we don't deal with. Not every cop loves the power trip. A good cop can do bad things, under stressful circumstances. Some get rage so bottled up inside them that they take it out on family members, or 'perps' or, yes, protesters. And why his dad probably liked the protests, was that he could get rid of some of that bottled up rage.

Yes, something has to change in the police force. There has to be a productive way for cops to get rid of the rage they feel toward the evil they see, without it culminating into violence. This, though has to come from the top, the foot soldiers sometimes can't see the forest, for the trees.

And, yes, there are bad cops, those who love the power. Did they join the police force because of it, or did they find out later that they loved it? Again, it's the police leaders who need to change, change who gets in and who stays in.

zalinda

[WilliamPitt]

132. Oh good Lord...

(facepalm)

People really enjoy massaging their judgmentalism here.

Gad zooks.

[whathehell]

146. Oh good lord yourself...You've been known to cast a judgement or two here as well.

"Facepalm" my ass.:eyes:

[RKP5637]

4. Exactly! It's the Same Old Shit all over again. I learned years ago this is

not a democracy, it's only something you learn in school, and you have no right to peaceful protests in the US, especially if people start listening. And today they have better weapons, better tactics and even better media suppression. Plus, despite the past 50 years or so, I think we have more lambs and citizens that walk in ruts than ever. And, I have no doubt that more and more information will be filtered/suppressed/removed on the Internet. TPTB don't like the peasants communicating.

I just can't get too excited anymore about how great America is ... what a shame.

[dotymed]

28. I agree. I watch OWS protests and think of the teabggers who

are openly armed at their protests. They are left alone...

[RKP5637]

39. That, outrages me, teabaggers carry weapons, push RW fascist crap, and they

get a free pass. That, tells me what America is all about.

[pacalo]

61. That is so well said. And I fear as you do that there will be curb after curb put on the internet.

[sarcasmo]

6. Think that comes in the cadet handbook.

[Hassin Bin Sober]

21. No doubt about it. I've know plenty of cops in my days and they were all the same.

Of course, the DU cop defenders will be along shortly to say my husband, or cousin, or father would never break the rules. Ignorant, deluded or lying is my only guess.

My best friend's little brother has been a chicago cop for going on ten years now. It didn't take him long before he was "tuning people up" or writing bogus citations for people who "lipped off to him."

He's become such a right-wing stooge I can't stand to see or talk to him anymore. He called me the night before the 2008 election to tell me to stay away from Grant Park because the "mules" were going to riot whether they win or lose. Mules are black people, btw. When I spoke with him after the election I called him on his bull-shit and he was like "dude, you don't know because the news didn't report it."

[apocalypsehow]

13. Wasn't just the ones wearing blue - My Dad, Uncles, hell, even my aunts, all good Democrats and

Union men (and at that time it was all just the men who worked and were in the Union) whooped and hollered and cheered when they showed Chicago's finest putting nightsticks upside the heads of protesters in 1968 on television. I wasn't quite ten years old, and I remember it well.

I truly think it was a generational thing - these folks weren't early-onset Freepers, but Harry Truman Democrats (being from KC and all). So I kinda know what you mean with some of the attitudes you describe in the OP.

[Fumesucker]

30. Oh yes, I remember that..

And then they wonder why some of us on the left are wary of unions and union members.. We remember the sixties all too well.

[apocalypsehow]

32. I think a lot of the "Reagan Democrats" meme that got going in the '80s was based on some of the

attitudes I saw on display that night...lunch-bucket Democrats, economic liberals, but with deeply conservative social views. Voting against their economic interests because they got mad that someone from somewhere displayed a VC flag in Grant Park. That sort of thing.

I still believe we have some of that sort of thing going on today, the whole "what's wrong with Kansas?" thing.

Edit: typo.

[Fumesucker]

35. I'm not sure there's that many unions in Kansas but I catch your drift..

And the Republicans have been pumping that division for all it's worth, that is what right wing talk radio is all about.

[Taverner]

37. Divide and conquer. It's been working well since 1776.

[arbusto_baboso]

15. No they haven't changed. I worked with cops a few years back.

As a non-sworn employee in law enforcement. They are all very aggressive and love to be able to get violent. They'll use any excuse to do so.

[blindpig]

16. This is entirely true.

When the police attack the people they are agents of the ruling class.

The ruling class will not budge an inch, they must be pushed and when pushed they behave like rabid animals. Be prepared.

[tularetom]

17. Must not have been with the Berkeley PD

I can tell you from first hand experience that was not the case with them.

[Taverner]

23. Just like in Oakland, the police would respond with officers from all cities.

So chances are, at Berkeley it was the same cops who worked a Stanford protest

Maybe you didn't see it, but that doesn't mean it didn't happen

Let's go back in time a little - to the March 20 protests in SF. These were protests against the war in Iraq.

The media was very quick to report they found a bunch of bombs, nails and other weapons. They blamed it on anarchists. The cops used this as justification for use of force. Only, all that stuff was planted by the cops. Youtube showed a video of plain-clothes policemen leaving these items right where they later "discovered" them.

Funny how the media didn't report that part of the story.

[enough]

27. I know several people who had their consciousness raised by police batons to the skull

in Berkeley, CA. Maybe these were not Berkeley police, but they certainly were police in Berkeley.

[FloridaJudy]

47. All police departments have an Asshole Quotient

Growing up in Berkeley, I found that that of the Berkeley police was very low. They recruited the smart ones, and paid them very well.

The Oakland police were a different story. During the anti-war demonstrations of the sixties, if the Berkeley cops showed up, you could be fairly sure that everyone would go home at the end and have a nice meal. If the Oakland police did, someone - and probably a lot of someones - were going to get hurt badly.

The Oakland police were brutal thugs then, and it looks as if that hasn't changed in 35 years.

[hfojvt]

33. as always

anecdotal evidence is completely worthless - UNLESS it confirms the things we already believe.

I've been in four protests and witnessed two others, and never seen any violence from the police. Which is, of course, not to say that it never happens. It probably helps, though, if the organizers are cooperative rather than defiant towards the police.

[Taverner]

36. I'm sorry - I didn't know I was supposed to provide evidence. I was just sharing my observation.

Yeah, if we were in a court of law I'd want evidence.

But every time I say "the sky is blue" do I have to post pictures, and diagrams and note cards detailing everything?

[hfojvt]

42. it is, however, one of the problems of communication

You are presenting some information "X is true". You, having experienced it, can know this with a certain amount of certainty. Although if your dad is like my brother, then his stories need to be taken with a large grain of salt. Even you are getting your information second-hand. But I, not knowing you that well, do not have the same assurance. You might be telling the truth as you know it, or you might be blowing smoke. Most people, though, are going to be far more skeptical of stories that tell them things they do not believe.

If, for example, I posted a story about my friend Jimbo whose life ambition was to get a mental disability check, and who lived for years on section8 housing and working odd jobs until he finally got on disability, I would not get forty or fifty knrs, I would get many more replies, if any, questioning my integrity, pointing out the uselessness of anecdotal evidence, etc. (In fact, I just posted anecdotes about unemployment.) People need to be reminded though, that even though it tells you something you already believe, anecdotal evidence is not like solid proof.

My own experience with rallies is that they passed without incident. In fact, I should add one more that I went to at the state capitol in Topeka. (I was going to add the rally for Nancy Boyda, but that's a rally and not a protest, although we were sorta protesting the incumbent Ryun.) That's more anecdotal evidnece, except for myself, who actually experienced it.

[Pacifist Patriot]

95. I would suspect the vast majority of protests and rallies do indeed pass without incident.

That's not what the OP is claiming. I understood the OP to simply be describing tactics used on those occasions when violence on the part of the police erupts.

[hfojvt]

119. the OP seemed to make a claim about all protests

"Those who have been in protests should know this already."

That implies that everyone who has protested would experience it. That it happens most of the time, as "those who have been in protests" have experienced.

I wonder if most people have been in protests. My parents haven't, and neither have any of my siblings. I didn't until I was 28 and the first Iraq war was looming. Then 13 years passed until my next protest, over the 2nd Iraq war. Not exactly a common experience, even for me.

[14thColony]

86. Yes, and make sure you provide a link to your personal opinions

That's probably my favorite conversation-killer at DU -- brought to you by the "link please?" crowd, as if even your personal anecdotes must be footnoted and sourced.

[virgogal]

38. + 1

[JBoy]

57. +2

[hobbit709]

40. Field Day by The Fraternity Of Man describes the attitude perfectly.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jtjajSfJz_U

[mike_c]

41. in those days we called them pigs....

Not much has changed.

[idiotgardener]

49. Well, our knowledge of pigs has changed.

We now know they are very smart, friendly creatures. So not really a good comparison to cops.

[olegramps]

104. It is evident that you have never confronted a Boar. They can be vicious.

[idiotgardener]

123. Why would I confront a boar?

[Hassin Bin Sober]

136. If he cuts in line at the salad bar.

[idiotgardener]

138. Good thinking.

No one gets between me and a salad bar!

[wildeyed]

44. But now we have YouTube.

So they are at least a bit accountable for some of there actions. They forget that someone, probably a whole lotta someones will be video taping on their cell phone and the clip will have 500k views by the end of the week. I gotta say, as a white middle class female, I am accustomed to seeing police as friends and protectors. But that is changing fast as I see more of this protest brutality. These are poorly trained thugs, used to doing what they please and no one saying boo to them.

[CoffeeCat]

62. About those views on You Tube...

I looked at the videos of Scott Olsen, and they only had 300 views, but thousands of
people "liked" the video.

I've seen this happen before with other OWS videos.

I don't know how they do it--but they're playing with the view counts. They low ball them. If
we saw the tens of thousands of views--it is powerful. They're attempting to take that power away.

It's pretty pathetic that they're trying so hard to quell this movement. They can't.

However, it's too bad that we can't see the true view count.

[Systematic Chaos]

82. Uh...no.

That view count thing happens all the time with videos which receive a lot of views, including comedy channels and video game channels.

Check back in a day or so and the views and likes should make more sense.

[wildeyed]

98. And they are attempting to censor.

"US cops tried to erase online evidence of brutality"

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kkUKW8NtJdE&feature=share

[Ilsa]

45. K&R. nt

[Matariki]

46. Police departments need serious psychological screening for applicants

perhaps even as an ongoing practice. And the people who do make it should be paid well enough to keep them professional and not tempted to corruption.

[Taverner]

55. They have that. They get exactly what they want. NT

[defendandprotect]

122. +1 -- In Dallas when JFK was killed, 50% were KKK... LAPD when RFK was killed 50% John Birchers-!!

NJ was also one of the states put under supervision of Federal government for

racial profiling which led to some outrageous killings on our highways, for one.

[whathehell]

108. Totally agree. n/t

[Odin2005]

51. All cops are either monsters or people who stick up for monsters.

[Scuba]

52. Too broad a brush. n/t

[Douglas Carpenter]

53. the strategy used with Anthony Bologna is brilliant and it works

This why it is extremely important to arm as many people as possible with video cameras and EXTREMELY DANGEROUS to have protesters around who are armed with guns.

Arm as many people as possible with video cameras - film what they are doing - post it all across the web - when police use violence publicize their names, work places, phone number and addresses.... That strategy turned the use of police violence into a tremendous advantage for the OWS movement and had a lot to do with its massive growth as well as creating a real deterrence against further use of police violence.

Anyone who does not understand the danger involved if there should become a presence of guns at OWS or any other left-wing gatherings is being utterly naive and are not living in the real world. The allies of the 1% have infinitely more guns than us and they WILL use them and the media WILL defend their use and the public WILL turn against the OWS movement. That is what WIll happen if we are not very careful about the presence of deadly weapons. That IS the real world.

The video camera is mightier than the AK-47.

[Taverner]

56. Yes, because GOD FORBID a cop lose 10 days of vacation pay....

:eyes:

[Douglas Carpenter]

58. it spurred the growth of the OWS and stopped most of the police violence in New York

It did not put Anthony Bologna is jail. The police lobby and their political supporters are simply too powerful. But it created a powerful deterrence. That is all what can be reasonably expected.

[pacalo]

59. If that were my dad, this information would strictly be TMI.

/edited to add:

I'd be glad to get the information out about police tactics & attitudes toward the people they serve, but I'd attribute it to "some guy" rather than to my dad.

[Zanzoobar]

[Zanzoobar]

60. I would print this and send it to him on his birthday.

It will prove to him just how much you love him.

"You're a Nazi, Father. I love you."

[defendandprotect]

66. Thanks for telling us -- !! Sad -- but good to know -- !!!

Presume your Dad never woke up from this mind set?

Quite a macho profession -- !!! Beating up women, handicapped, pregnant women!


Wonder what he would have thought today with police layoffs, their salaries cut and

unions under attack -- in my town they've had legal union-busters working on them

for 20 years now!!


Pensions?

Maybe we have a better chance of waking up these "public servants" -- ??? !!!

Maybe they'll wake up on their own -- ???

Their families must certainly also do some thinking -- many families have relatives who

have lost jobs -- wives shop for groceries and often hold jobs -- kids need to be

educated -- obviously towns are very low on funds because of tax cuts for rich.

None of them have family members who lost 401K funds -- or investments in market?

Do they really think the rich guy is the good guy and deserves to be protected?


Guess we'll be finding out -- !!

[1StrongBlackMan]

71. My father ...

Also was a cop during the 60's. I recall, vividly, when the Hough riots broke out in Cleveland, OH. I was 8 years old.

My Dad came home, called my mother into their bedroom with the door closed. After a while, he called me into the room ... My mother had that "I'm trying real hard not to let you know I'm scared" look on her face.

My Dad sat me down, handed me a shotgun and told me, "all hell is breaking loose out there and it is moving this way. You are gonna have to be the man of the house and protect your mother and sister ... No one gets in this house, understand?"

He, then, left and we did not see or hear from him for three 3 days. He never said a word to me (or my mother or sister) where he had been or what he had been doing.

Many years later, at my Dad's funeral, I spoke with a man who told me that he had known, and had a great deal of respect for, my father.

This man related how he had been active in the Black Nationalist Movement and that several days before the riots, my father had met with their leadership because he knew something was going to happen ... he tried to talk them out of it because, just like he knew; so did his department. He told them that the CPD was going to use any protest as a reason to "kill as many N1@@ers as we can."

The man told me that when the riots popped off, he personally witnessed my DAD protecting the Nationalist leadership, while negotiating a peace where no one went to jail and none of the leadership died.

That evening I learned that one can be in the system; but not of the system.

[inna]

74. Wow. This is why I still love DU. Thank you so much for sharing, and welcome to DU!!

:hi:

[nini]

77. well said.. we need more like your dad

and the way mine was.. see below

[1StrongBlackMan]

144. Another story about the riots ...

that I also heard about at my father's funeral ...

Three Black businessmen, the owner of the largest Black Towing Operation, the owner of 5 McDonald franchises, and a Black architect, approached me and told me that but for my father, they would not be in business.

They told me that during the riots, the City via my father asked what the Nationalists wanted to end the burning ... in response my Dad negotiated the first major City contracts for a Black-owned Tow Company and Architect, and a franchise deal for the McDonald's owner.

Again ... This was something that my Dad never talked about and had these men not told me, I would have never known.

[inna]

72. don't you love the smell of fascism in the morning.

fasten up your belts, ladies & gentlemen!


:nuke:

[nini]

76. My dad was an LAPD homicide detective in the 60s who cried with shame over the Rodney King beating

He was old school and took pride in what he did. I will never forget his reaction to the Rodney King mess - it broke my heart to see him so upset to see cops acting like that. He also told the story of a rape suspect of a fellow officer's daughter being brought in and how they pulled that man off the suspect. I don't think too many of them would have he self control to do that these days.

I'm glad he was my dad and he is proof not all cops are assholes.. though unfortunately far too many are. It's disgusting.

[Name removed]

78. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[iamthebandfanman]

80. haha

yeah, all fathers are perfect..noway he could say that!

</sarcasm>


EDIT:

Welcome to DU!

[Pacifist Patriot]

96. Are you imagining a 30-something telling his 8 year old?

This totally sounds like something a man of retirement age might say to a grown son.

Way to start off at DU...by questioning someone's honesty.

[lonestarnot]

79. Nutfuckers.

[Capitalocracy]

83. We need people with live streaming cameras

with signs that say so. You are under surveillance. You cannot get away with it.

[OneBlueSky]

84. brings to mind the 1968 Democratic Convention in Chicago . . .

when Mayor Daley's cops staged a "police riot" (according to the report that followed much later) and beat the shit out of anyone and everyone in Grant Park, on the streets, or anywhere else they could find protesters, or even innocent bystanders . . . I remember watching the mayhem on tv, live and in color, and watching Daley have a fit on the convention floor when one of the speakers mentioned "what's happening in the streets right now" . . .

that was over 40 years ago . . . guess some things never change, huh? . . .

[14thColony]

85. My father was a cop in the late 1960s as well, in Florida

I now realize from his stories about combatting anti-war protests during that era that he and his buddies did at least some of the same things that you relate here.

[defendandprotect]

124. Thank you for letting us know -- !!

[TheeHazelnut]

87. Your dad confessed to murdering people to you?

"If you have the luck to find someone curled up in fetal position, keep hitting until they stop moving altogether. Bodies can be moved. Back then, they ended up over the state line. And since they were just 'dirty hippies' they would be written off as runaways."

Sounds a little over-the-top... Are you reading this thought process into what you observed happening, or did he actually tell you that he liked to kill people?

[Pacifist Patriot]

97. Two things

1. I don't think the OP was talking about dropping dead bodies across state lines, but injured ones. Maybe I'm wrong, but that's how I interpreted it.

2. Also the OP was sharing what his dad told him about police tactics in general. We can't really tell which activities his dad participated in, observed or simply heard about from other cops. Could be swagger, who knows?

[The Wizard]

89. Police in general

have an us against them mentality, a kind of paranoia that fosters immoral, illegal behavior. They carry guns and have badges and are presumed truthful in a court of law, especially when wearing the blue suit festooned with a badge and other ornaments of invented valor. Unfortunately we live in a country that worships uniforms out of some media promoted shame for the events surrounding the Vietnam War and the protests associated with it. Unfortunately for normal society, the highly paid police see normal society as the enemy. No one said you had to be smart to carry a gun.

[whathehell]

147. Higly paid?....You must be kidding.

40 to 50K a year is hardly "highly paid" for what they do.

Do you know what kind of RISKS they take, how many are killed in the line of duty?

Don't misunderstand -- I despise bad cops, but I very much appreciate the good ones.

[OneGrassRoot]

94. Thanks for sharing. This enlightened me quite a bit. :( n/t

[valerief]

99. Why don't those sympathetic 1%ers send helmets and body armor for the protesters to sleep in.

That way when they get illegally bludgeoned, they'll have some protection. Hey, 1%ers, put your money where your mouth is!

[whathehell]

105. Jeebus.

What city did your dad work in?

[Beavker]

112. I semi-regularly donate to the Omaha FOP.

Not large sums, but at least something. Especially considering that I am outside the Omaha City Limits and can't even vote on Omaha City issues.

But, I might have to tell them next time that I am refraining until they can get their brothers over in Oalkland and accross the country to follow the NYPD's lead and quit their Mubarek like tactics on the citizens they were sworn to protect, pay their salaries via their taxes, and are likely the sole supporters of the Unions that they are a part of.

Send a letter to the Oakland chapter, or chief signed by all OPD officers.

[DaveJ]

115. Nothing has changed. We just have more cameras now. nt

[polichick]

116. That's some sick shit - thanks for illuminating us.

[jwirr]

117. Thank you for this. And isn't it a sad commentary on how far we have

come from then to now. I wonder if any real progress is ever lasting?

[bongbong]

125. A story

Long time ago, I had a GF whose father had been a NY cop in the 1970s. He quit because of the abuse he got from his fellow cops. What was his crime? A few times he tried to stop a "frisk-n-beat", which was typically how a cop handled a suspicious (or for that matter completely innocent) person in Harlem. After he pulled a gun on one fellow officer who was giving a Black man a particularly severe beating, he started getting death threats posted on his locker - that's when he quit.

[Dont call me Shirley]

126. I'm so sorry for you, your mother and brothers/sisters that your father was a violent man.

These violent men (and to a lesser extent, women) must learn that their attack thinking is wrong, wrong and wrong.

[Lorien]

127. ....

[Hubert Flottz]

128. Why do you think Poppy Bush owns all them donut stores?

The 1% are dumb, but they ain't stupid.

Edit to add link...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carlyle_Group

[comtec]

129. That must have been a very .... interesting upbringing you had

my sympathies.

[russspeakeasy]

131. My son in law was a cop...he's not a cop anymore,

but he's still a prick.

[yawnmaster]

133. Any link or data regarding hard ons and beatings? I'm willing to be surprised. eom

[pintobean]

139. Dad's reputation - 237 recs

Broad brushed attack on law enforcement - priceless.

[Cid_B]

143. Same ol thing... Hate em til you need em or can use em...

Then its "Solidarity" and fist bumps for everyone.

See the case of the Scott Olsen.