Is putting a toddler on a leash a life saving act?

[Liberal_in_LA]

I recently recalled this when reading SFGate readers' comments on the tragic story about the toddler who fell in the fountain inside San Francisco's Hyatt Regency and died.

Many readers feel this was a freak incident and could happen to any parent who turns her back on her child for a few minutes. Others think the mother (as well as the nanny who was present) acted irresponsibly. And then there's a reader who suggests that parents of curious toddlers put their children on leashes.

jimswife writes:

When I was 18 months old in 1958 my grandmother my caregiver had me on a leash for reasons like this. People use to ask her why she leashed me like a dog and her response was " to keep her where I can see her" I thank her every day for not listening to the fools who said it was cruel to be leashed like a dog. My condolences to the family, it only takes a minute of taking your eyes off your child and they are out and running about.

werefox444 chimes in:

Yes, definitely leashes!!! I have twins and when they were toddlers (6 years ago) I always had them on a leash in public places. They sell them everywhere, babiesRus, Lullaby lane. Holding hands didn't work for me, I had to bend down to tie a shoe for one of the babies, 2 seconds later, I looked up and the other one was gone! Leashes were the perfect solution! Some one once yelled at me: "Your children aren't animals!" To which I replied, "that they aren't, BUT THEY ARE ALIVE!!!!" Poor mother, no one could have known! I hope she finds some peace!


Read more: http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/blogs/sfmoms/detail?entry_id=78976#ixzz182tooqFo


here is the story of the toddler who died

Toddler found in San Francisco hotel fountain dies

Associated Press December 13, 2010

A toddler who wandered away from his mother and was later found unconscious in a San Francisco hotel fountain has died in the hospital.

The medical examiner's office said Monday that 18-month-old Olivier Matera died Saturday.

Police told the San Francisco Chronicle that Olivier was with his mother, nanny and 18-month-old twin sister at the Hyatt Regency last Wednesday when he went missing.


Read more: http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/n/a/2010/12/13/state/n145503S79.DTL#ixzz182uXSTzM

[Skittles]

1. when I see toddlers on leashes

I figure there's a damn good reason for it, and who am I to second-guess the parents?

[hlthe2b]

6. Toddlers have no more sense of danger than puppies...

Using a leash to protect either one from that danger is not cruel. It may well be common sense, in certain settings and circumstances.

[HuckleB]

122. The toddlers I've known, and I've known plenty the past ten years...

... were all taught basic danger matters without any big issues.

Supervision was necessary, sure. The kids kept in strollers or on leashes? No, they didn't learn jack, and they struggled to learn basic safety until much later.

[hlthe2b]

124. You obviously have not traveled through crowded international

airports with them as many single parent friends of mine have been forced to do on a fairly regular basis. Using a common sense measure like this in such settings as an extra precaution is hardly advocating for not teaching children lessons on danger. Straw man argument, that one.

[HuckleB]

125. Yes, I have.

My kid spent his first birthday in Paris. He's been to Taiwan, Argentina, NYC, and several other locations.

Many of our friends have gone similar distances, with no leashes.

BTW, it's not a strawman argument, it's an observation. The kids I've known who get restrained struggled to learn boundaries in regard to safety. I get I should just ignore that, and pretend that things aren't as they are?

Imagine that.

[hlthe2b]

133. Imagine arguing against an extra measure of protection...

for highly vulnerable toddlers in highly vulnerable and even chaotic settings. Imagine..... :crazy:

[HuckleB]

135. Imagine putting words in the mouths of others, before responding.

Why has this practice become the norm at DU, and why do feel the need to employ it?

[hlthe2b]

142. Actually you did so with me-- suggesting I was arguing for

use of a leash rather than to supervise and teach a child about danger. Pot meet kettle.

[HuckleB]

143. And you continue to put words in my mouth.

Can you respond to the actual content of my posts? If not, please don't bother.

[hlthe2b]

146. I am responding to your written words...

And, don't worry, I have had enough of your rudeness. Good night.

[HuckleB]

149. You have responded to your own creation, not what I posted.

That's as rude as it gets, as is pretending that you've done otherwise.

Cut the crap, please.

[hlthe2b]

150. You, sir...

need to go back and read what you wrote. And back at ya.

[HuckleB]

154. I have, and I know what I wrote.

You failed to the respond to the content of my actual posts. Your insistence that you've done otherwise does not change that reality.

[snooper2]

204. that's actually not true at all...

For example, my daughter at 13 months is pretty aware that gravity works....

When we are playing on the couch or bed, and she wants to get down, she gets on her belly and slides with her arms out holding on, ever so slowly. When her feet hit the floor she stands up, shows her huge smile, look what I did!

She also knows when the oven is on not to touch the door, "hot"!...Actually she kind of says "hat" but we know what she means :)

[hlthe2b]

226. Your 13 month old equates to a dog aged 7 years in maturity...

Not a young puppy. I would certainly hope that she has learned about falling (gravity) and "hot"... That is normal development and something a 4-6 month old puppy would have learned as well. Given puppies begin walking within the first week or so of being born, they learn the lesson of gravity very early as well. Just saying, the age timeline is not a linear comparison between the two....

On the other hand, your 13 month old child and that puppy are equally likely to run out into the street, despite car traffic. At six months, a pup is amenable to being trained not to run out into the street, but only with training. Yes, some dogs never learn that lesson, until it is too late. Granted one could say the same about the distracted teen or adult listening on their ipods, who do the same. :shrug:

[Name removed]

229. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[hlthe2b]

230. I did not set out to insult you..

I kindly ask you to refrain from the same. If you do some reading about comparative animal behavior and social development, you would see the points I am trying to make. It doesn't mean humans are less intelligent (as you seem to think I am implying), but rather they are on a different developmental trajectory. Common sense, if you look at the difference in life spans, as well as gestation periods (humans 9 months, dogs, 60 days or so) and the very different period to independence between human and nonhuman primates--and other mammals...

While your second comment was clearly meant to insult, I will simply choose to ignore it. :shrug:

Good night. I will end discussion here.

[Gaedel]

11. Right you are

Some kids are perfect angels and will never leave your side. Others are holy terrors and need wrist leashes or the harness and leashes. My younger brother would always stay with my grandmother while I went downtown shopping with my mother because if my mother dropped my hand, I would grab a hold of her skirt. My brother would disappear in a flash.

Every kid is different and if I see a kid on a leash, I assume he or she needs to be on a leash.

[ZombieHorde]

30. I completely agree. Different families have different challenges. nt

[Eddie Haskell]

112. Challenges like twins

Ours would take off in opposite directions and even at two they could run like the wind.

[TheDebbieDee]

127. I agree.........If you think you need to keep your child on a leash to keep

him or her safe, then by all means, keep your child SAFE.

[slackmaster]

200. I agree completely

There's no point in trying to second-guess people.

[CaliforniaPeggy]

2. I believe they have their place.

Keeping children safe is paramount.

But when the kids are in a safe environment, then they need to explore and investigate. They need to do this for their best growth and development.

Out in public, or in a place that is risky, then leashes can be, and indeed are, lifesaving.

[virgogal]

3. I have no problem with it at all. Keeping them safe is what counts and

I heard (I have no documentation) that it is more common in Europe.

[MineralMan]

4. Back in 1947, my mom put me on a harness and leash in public.

I would be off like a shot, starting at age 2. Something would catch my eye, and I'd be headed in that direction. I'm still like that, but more in my head than on my feet these days. They sold them at Sears. I'm sure it kept me from under the wheels of many a car.

Nothing at all wrong with it. I have a photo in an album somewhere of me, my grandmother, and my harness and leash. I'm smiling from ear to ear.

[Rosa Luxemburg]

74. me too, it was accepted then

[eridani]

106. Likewise. I was very curious, and in city sidewalk traffic I could have easily gotten lost n/t

[KittyWampus]

157. My grandmother put my Dad on a leash tied to the clothesline. He took off his clothes and ran naked

down the street!

[Luciferous]

5. I have a leash for my son. It's attached to a puppy backpack.

We have used it when we are at very busy places and have never had anyone say anything rude about it. Yeah, I feel a little silly putting a leash on my son, but he likes to run off and has even run out into the street a couple of times, so I would rather look silly and keep him safe.

[Liberal_in_LA]

8. I've seen those animal type backpack leashes. n/t

[tigereye]

131. those are cute

I never used one with my son when he was small, but I can totally understand other parent's reasoning for em, particularly with twins. Better to keep em safe in busy and dangerous areas...


Instead of leashes (almost typed leaches!), my mom had me and my sister to ride herd on the littler ones.

[TBF]

209. I used those for both my children when they first started running -

and would love to just dart off in one direction or another. They didn't put up with them long, but it was definitely helpful for about 6 mos. or so - especially if we went to the zoo or somewhere like that.

[blondeatlast]

7. Here in AZ, dozens of kids die each year in swimming pool accidents. It literally takes seconds for

a kiddle to wander away even when a parent/guardian is even slightly distracted. I more or less had a sort of handcuff thing for my kid; I could hold his hand but if something happened he couldn't wander off--but yes, after the first time he wandered off, I found a way to keep him close and I couldn't care less what busybodies thought about it.

[Liberal_in_LA]

13. I remember the handcuff things. n/t

[MrScorpio]

9. With my own eyes, I saw a woman with her kid on a leash while she was carrying a dog

I don't get toddlers on leashes, I do get keeping an eye on them every freaking minute

[blondeatlast]

16. Are you a parent? nt

[Raine]

18. Maybe the kid was too heavy to carry or fought being carried

and there is no way you can watch and control a kid every "freaking" moment. Better a leash than run over dead or injuried.

[Skittles]

25. I don't have kids but

I remember when I was a teenager being astounded at how quickly my toddler brother could disappear - and when he saw how frantic it made me, he made a game of it. If I'd have known about leashes back then, I would have had him on one when we were in busy places.

[blondeatlast]

37. I was in a bathroom stall at LAX, had just dropped my jeans and was bending down when my son

(2 yo) decided he was bored, slipped the lever--and WHOOSH!

The restroom was pretty much deserted except for me and him but luckily, just as he reached the main door, a woman walked inand stopped him, apologizing profusely for "scooping him up like that."

He's still a sprinter (competitively now!) :rofl:

I wanted to kiss her, myself--and I told her so. If she hadn't been there at that very moment--who knows? :scared:

[Skittles]

57. I found a small boy wandering away from a mall

I had parked and was walking towards the mall and was like, er, wtf, are you with anyone? The little chap said he was with his daddy, but daddy didn't appear to be in the vicinity. I took him back to the mall and there was a frantic search going on. The dad said his son was playing peek-a-boo through clothes racks and then....nothing. That dad DID kiss me. :D

[tigereye]

134. my son hid in the racks at Macy's one time- not fun.

Good on ya, Skittles!

[gkhouston]

60. LOL, when my daughter was small we had a game we played in the restroom to keep her attention.

I'd lift my top and say "bellybutton" (usually in a silly voice) and she'd mimic me. It was sort of like peek-a-boo and she'd have to keep an eye on me, trying to predict the next "bellybutton" rather than go "exploring". She never got tired of it, but I sometimes wondered what the other people in the restroom thought was going on with the intermittent cries of "bellybutton!", followed by mad giggling.

on edit: I had a harness when she was small and the only comments I got were inquiries as to where one could be purchased. She much preferred the harness over holding hands because that way she had both hands free. I wouldn't want to walk around with my arm over my head all the time, either, and she was definitely a wanderer.

[blondeatlast]

169. LOL! nt

[babydollhead]

217. I have put in my time in bathroom stalls

a baby on my lap, the 2 and 3 year old touching everything, sliding on the floor, unlocking the stall door as I tried to wipe myself. I remember thinking, "i can't wait for this time to be over."I' also, hold their hands between my knees while I tried to unlock the car door and not have them running in the street. In Stephen Kings, Pet Cemetery" the father tries to stop the toddler from going out in the street and only catches the boys hat, and the boy is killed. From them on I just would yank my kids back from harms way by their coller. You cannot relax for one split second!

[madinmaryland]

81. You didn't give him an ass-kicking? That would have set him straight!

:hi:

[Skittles]

82. oh, he's still afraid of me now

here we are:

[MilesColtrane]

161. Everybody (with sense) is afraid of you.

:hi:

[blondeatlast]

177. The look on your face--I LOVE it! That look is an ass-kicking in and of itself!

:rofl:

BTW, he looks like he'd be a handful; my son still gets that look at 13!

[Xithras]

29. Kids don't always want to be carried.

It's not healthy for them anyway. A parent who constantly holds their child to keep them away from "danger" is doing them a grave disservice that will haunt them later in life. Curiosity, exploration, and physical activity are good things in children.

The leash merely allows the parent to set the boundaries of that exploration; To keep the kid from running off wildly when a glance is averted for just a moment.

[Codeine]

41. But you CANNOT keep an eye on them every minute.

Even the best parent is dealing with the world around them.

[uncommon]

222. You don't "get" it?

It's a little hard to keep your eyes on a kid at the same time you are paying for something in a store. Unless you are suggesting that parents of young children should simply stay home rather than attempt to navigate the public sphere.

[LostInAnomie]

10. I've never gotten the vehement objection to child leashes

Parents know their kids. If they know their child has a tendency to dart off or try to get away, then I can see no reason to fault them for using a leash.

It's one of those things where people get hung up more on the image of something than its actual purpose.

[Liberal_in_LA]

32. When I first saw them when I was young, I thought they were awful. Cribs also - lil jails

for kids. Now, of course, I understand why they are needed.

[uppityperson]

148. Sounds familiar. I loathed them, then had a speedy toddle and wished I had one

Parents do the best they can (though some that may be very little). But I well understand the uses of many things like this. Just because they can be abused does not mean they are inherently evil.

[Raine]

12. My brother wore one

it saved him from falling off a pier ... nothing wrong with it.

[Liberal_in_LA]

15. but not you?

[Raine]

28. LOL I probably did

but he was 4 years younger and I remember seeing him ... can't remember whether I did or not and never thought to ask my mother. I do know he was really curious and wanted to always check things out. :-)

[whistler162]

51. Are you sure you weren't trying to use him as bait like

Tom did with Jerry in the cartoons?

[Raine]

76. LOL I swear I wasn't anywhere near him!

;-) Actually we were very close buddies so I must have been pretty horrified. :scared:

[nc4bo]

14. My daughter was a clinger no worries about her running off but my son....

was a greyhound and completely unafraid of any one or any thing. He thought it funny one day to take off while I was trying to mail some packages at one of those mail centers. Out the door, around the corner, about 2 blocks total in a parking lot he ran until some kind stranger snagged him and brought him to me.

Thanked God, cursed myself for not thinking ahead of him.

Found leashes not long after that incident in the Toys R Us, I think - it's been so long ago. Bought one and attached to the wrist of roaming son. Took alot of shit from hubby's family and more than a few strangers because my kid was walking around like a pet but I didn't care and neither did my husband.

My son is 21 years old. I'd do it again a million times and will tell my children that some nasty looks and words are so much easier to endure than taking your child to the ER or worse, having to bury your child.

[Kali]

17. only at the Olive Garden

[Greybnk48]

19. We put a harness and leash on my grandson when we're

in high risk areas like nearby traffic or near water. We also use it at the mall. He loves to walk and doesn't want to sit in the stroller forever, so this works just great! I was embarrassed at first, but no more. He's a "darter" and this keeps him safe.

[seabeyond]

20. i dont mind the toddler on leash. i never took my eyes off the little ones.

i never had a problem keeping track of them. shit happens, as horribly sad as it is. some parents restrict kids with strollers. i never liked them. i let my little ones walk and wander, and that was my existence.

but i dont have a problem with leashes either

[flvegan]

21. Microchip them.

If they get lost, just a simple scan and...okay, even I can't make this joke.

[tigereye]

137. frankly, I think people have actually talked about this!

You are terrible, though. :D

[Name removed]

22. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[JackBeck]

26. Cages are a much better idea. Don't have to worry about the leash breaking.

[Raine]

70. Fail nt

[JackBeck]

72. Sarcasm fail. n/t

[Raine]

84. Sorry

I'll give myself a :spank: sometimes I get a pissy attitude. :hi:

[blondeatlast]

27. Are you a parent? nt

[joshcryer]

46. I've seen this all too often.

Three times in the past few months alone, I think child leashes are making a comeback.

[TygrBright]

23. In Britain they are called "leading strings" and no one bats an eye.

I assume kids who are on leading strings are the kind of wander-off-and-explore-in-total-oblivion types who NEED to be on leading strings for their own safety.

That said, I've no use for parents who give their kids no opportunity to wander around and explore in safe environments and/or with appropriate supervision on a regular basis.

indifferently,
Bright

[jannyk]

42. We always called them 'Reins'.

Here they are all listed as 'Reins' - Mothercare, John Lewis, Bebe etc..

http://www.google.com/search?sourceid=mozclient&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&q=baby+reins

[niyad]

24. many years ago, down in mesa verde, a couple was with their young daughter, who was on a harness.

the child slipped and fell into a fairly deep hole. as bystanders gasped, the father simply hauled the child back up on that harness that had gotten the evil eye from so many. I don't have a problem with children on harnesses for their safety.

[Motown_Johnny]

31. did we already forget the story of the 2 year old raped in a store?

It was just a week or so ago


I think the "leash" is reasonable

[jannyk]

33. Myself. my two sisters and every toddler I ever knew/met wore...

'Reins' - which is what they are called in the UK (sometimes a harness, but never a 'leash').

I don't see the problem. The child gets the experience of independent 'walking' without being glued to mummy's hand, slung on mummy's back or stuck in a pushchair. Yet they stay 'safe' and 'safe' is of primo importance. Here's a really cute selection from England:

http://www.smalldudes.co.uk/epages/smalldudes.sf/en_GB/epages/smalldudes.sf/en_GB/?ObjectPath=/Shops/Small-Dudes/Categories/Out_About/Harness/Toddler_Animal_Daysacks

[KittyWampus]

158. Those are adorable. I WANT ONE!

:D

[Sonoman]

34. My sons knew better than to stray.

A little early stern parenting goes a long way.

I would be mortified to be seen with a child on a leash, even if the kid belonged to someone I was with.

Sonoman

[pipi_k]

198. "stern parenting" doesn't work...

when the kid is 18 months old and doesn't understand a whole lot.


Also, parents who intimidate their kids into behaving are setting them up to behave only when someone is watching them. They're not instilling an inner "watchdog" for the kids to follow based on what's right, even when nobody is around.

[Sonoman]

228. I never had a problem.

My sons were treated like adults from Day One. When a kid strays on a ranch, bad things happen. They spent their late childhood, teens and adult-hood in major metropolitan areas (I had to get off that damned ranch), and have never had so much as a parking ticket.

I also taught them how not to have to work, and they live in Texas and make their living on Humboldt's finest.

I also do not allow leashed kids into my stores. Or kids that throw fits for the hell of it, either.

Sonoman

[joshcryer]

35. Only if you're a bad parent.

[blondeatlast]

38. Really? Are you a parent? nt

[joshcryer]

40. I'm an uncle.

My nephew and nieces know to listen when they are with me.

Bad parenting leads to misbehavior.

When I see a kid on a leash I know that the parent failed to teach the child a certain level of respect and obedience from an early age.

[Liberal_in_LA]

43. you sound like a harsh disciplinarian.

[blondeatlast]

45. Note the avatar, too.

:shrug:

[Liberal_in_LA]

49. uh oh

[joshcryer]

54. Yes, an anarchist avatar finding that child bondage is a result of bad parenting.

Very unusual, that.

(FYI I consider myself ideologically aligned with anarchist philosophy and I see no contradiction here, it's the assumptions being made by people who think they're better than me.)

[blondeatlast]

63. Oh, your last sentence (the assumptions..." is making me HOWL.

You, the non-parent, judging actual parents.

My son's aunts know that the aunt/nephew relationship means you get all the fun--and can pass the kid off to mom wghen s/he acts up.

good luck parenting, if you choose to do so.

[joshcryer]

75. Wrong. My newphews and nieces act up around the parents but not me.

The parents don't do jack shit because they have earned absolutely no respect with these children. One of my nephews loves to break limbs off of bushes and trees. A simple disciplinarian tactic, that wouldn't have hurt him the least, was to have him carry a broken off limb into his room and hang it on the wall. I asked his mother if I could do this, and she finally agreed when it got out of hand when he broke off a very large branch from a sapling. We put it up in his room and he absolutely hated it. Hated it! But he didn't hate me because I explained to him in a clear, mature, tone why we were doing it. "You don't break things in nature unless you plan to use it, so we'll just use it as a decoration for now, and maybe we'll make something out of it later."

I later learned that my brother (his father) removed the limb from the room later that night, at the protest of a small child (ie, a child telling the father what to do, and subverting the act of the mother and his guardian). He still breaks off limbs around them.

Since then he has never broken a limb off of a tree or bush around me. Not once. Period. The very idea of me going through parental consent to discipline him (in a very harmless, educational way, I do not advocate corporal punishment but his mother and father have smacked him on the butt before) is enough to dissuade him from ever doing that around me. Ever. Kids are smart. He'll test the waters occasionally. Once he slapped a bush while we were about to get into the car. I went "Ahem." Once. He apologized. I asked why, we talked about it. We were on the same page. And he remembered the lesson I taught him months prior.

5 year old kid!

[Odin2005]

140. My Nephew is 4 and is a handful of BRAT!!!

But when I go "Airasen Bjorgan, you get over here right this minute" he KNOWS to listen to me. :-)

[yawnmaster]

68. So you are saying that the mental bondage that you are applying to the children...

is more effective than the physical bond of a lease.
I think I understand.

[joshcryer]

80. I think that my values are certainly worth sharing.

As a parent teaching ones values is far more important than brute force. This applies even to guardians.

[yawnmaster]

86. key word parent. non-key word, uncle. eom

[joshcryer]

87. Works for me.

There's nothing unique about being an uncle that magically makes kids behave. I assure you that these children misbehaved around me in the beginning.

[joshcryer]

53. Nah, two ways to get kids to respect you:

1) Treat them intelligently, baby talk is fucking horrible and studies have shown that it even retards their development.
2) Expect to be treated with respect, and you'll get it.

My nephew and nieces adore me because I'm the fun loving uncle who plays with them and they know if they don't obey me when we go out (to the theater, baseball games, mall, etc), I will be unsatisfied with them, and play time is over.

Kids are a shitload smarter than people give them credit for.

[blondeatlast]

58. Get back to us when you're a parent. Really.

When you take YOUR OWN 2 year old to the street festival and don't want her/him stuck in the stroller, you let us know how it goes.

[joshcryer]

66. I like the deflection. Stroller = leash.

Strollers are not the same as leashes. And in some cases, yes, people keeping their children confined to strollers is just another example of bad parenting.

You appear to be a leash advocate, and you appear insulted that I am calling you a bad parent. But really, I'd prefer a bad parent to leash their child rather than to allow it to run loose. There are probably some exceptions where the best parenting in the world isn't enough, but I have yet to encounter such situations.

[blondeatlast]

73. Am I a bad parent? Put up or shut up. nt

[blondeatlast]

166. I see you chose to shut up. Very wise. nt

[joshcryer]

191. My statements support my position.

It needn't be spelled out.

[blondeatlast]

203. I'm a bad mom, check. Thatnks for clearing that up. does it make you feel better to say so

on a very busy public message board?

[Gaedel]

195. If you do put your child in a leash

You also have the responsibility to use it as a light restraint and not as a "come along" so that the kid doesn't inconvenience you. You owe it to the kid to be allowed to "tow" you over to something the kid wants to see or explore. I never had to leash my kids or grandkids (though I came close with youngest daughter now 47 yrs old).

[cleanhippie]

208. I have to agree with you on those two points.

Not sure I agree with you on others, though.

[Kali]

121. meh

sounds like somebody with very LITTLE experience

[blondeatlast]

44. An uncle--and you "know."

Mmm-hmm...

[joshcryer]

50. Yes, I know.

[blondeatlast]

52. Riiight--your attitude and your avatar--interesting. nt

[proud2BlibKansan]

104. Do you listen to Michael Savage?

[joshcryer]

190. No.

[proud2BlibKansan]

216. He said the same thing about autism

[Odin2005]

136. This uncle agrees with you.

:hi:

[blondeatlast]

165. "Uncle." all the bennies, none of the pain. nt

[Warren DeMontague]

182. Yeah, I remember when I, too, thought being an uncle qualified me as a parenting expert.

That was a looooooong time ago. :rofl:

[joshcryer]

192. Oh, I'm by no means an expert.

But there is a point where it's really easy to recognize bad parenting behavior. Really easy. Here's one for you. I saw a kid on a leash at a crosswalk (I was in my car at a red light). The kid started running and the mom pulled back hard on the leash. It fell flat on its face because the mom was running too (this is a really long crosswalk). The kids hands were scratched up and it started wailing.

In this instance yes, the leash likely saved the kids life.

However, two other kids were not on leashes and had run completely across the street and were starting to cross the other way, while the mother was screaming for them to stop, pleading, picking up the kid because he was obviously injured to the point of at least being stunned (sorry, falling on pavement is going to hurt even if you weigh next to nothing).

I'm all for leashes.

And condoms. ;)

And planned pregnancies with lots of ridiculous research and practice with my nephews and nieces. ;)

[tigereye]

139. not necessarily...

really depends on the kid.

[Warren DeMontague]

183. Okay. Take care of them for a month, straight. By yourself. Just you.

Then, come back and offer your opinion.

[joshcryer]

189. Once I have a house they are more than welcome to stay.

[Warren DeMontague]

218. It's sort of like the difference between sitting in the cockpit and actually flying the plane.

Not to denigrate the very useful experience of being an uncle; as you allude to, it's particularly handy in giving an idea of what you might, eventually, be getting into (my older sister used to joke that she was going to loan her kids out for birth control lectures to my high school friends)



...but, honestly? Having been in both places, now-- you can be the most devoted, present, involved uncle in the world, but unless you're actually in that full-time, primary caregiver role, it's not the same thing. Not even close.

And the only other thing I will say- pertaining to the example of the toddler you gave upthread; my experience is that kids- particularly when they're that little- come with a great deal of their personality right out of the box. Some kids are just difficult, and "bad parenting" has nothing to do with it. It's the luck of the draw. Getting an out of control 2 year old to "listen" is not always a matter of disciple or what-have-you.

I've never needed a leash for my kids, but I am not going to second-guess parents who feel they do.

[StarsInHerHair]

232. there are some kids-both genders-who are very strong-willed high spirited

and NOTHING will stop them them except being physically stopped; it's during the "terrible twos" stage, lasts as long as into 4 yo. Spanking doesn't work, reasoning doesn't work, rewards don't work-they're just too young and not able to think ahead. Some adults have problems with thinking ahead too, so......

[Luciferous]

48. Really? So is a parent who puts their child in a stroller a bad parent?

It's the same principle. You are restraining the child for their own safety, but at least with the leash they have the freedom to walk around and not be confined to a stroller.

[joshcryer]

61. Possibly. I've seen kids stuck in baby seats for the duration of a shopping trip.

We're talking seeing the same parents walking around the store as their kid is crying, wanting to get out, for up to an hour or more. You remember that shit because you keep bumping into that same family.

Note that I did not say I am against leashes, nor am I against parents who restrain their children (who can walk) to strollers.

I merely reserve calling them bad parents for it.

[Bunny]

67. Strollers are horrible and only bad parents use them. Hell, crib's are terrible, too.

I mean, my nieces and nephews would know damn well not to roll out of their beds at night. And if they did fall and get hurt, well that'll learn 'em. That's just good parenting.

:sarcasm: , in case it wasn't obvious.

As someone who actually has kids, I have no problems with leashes. I love reading comments from folks who have never raised a kid but know all about good parenting.

[joshcryer]

77. Oh yes, hyperbole is certainly necessary.

This overprotective bullshit treating kids like they're idiots is what's bugging me. It's everywhere.

[Bunny]

79. Uh huh.

[yawnmaster]

83. don't forget diapers. They are a crutch for bad parents. When I was visiting my brothers house...

One of his kids did his business in his diaper.
Well I took that turd from the diaper and put it on the wall in his room.
And told him it will be there until he uses the toilet as I've told him (in a very mature tone of course).
My brother took it down, I understand, and now the kid is using his diaper as a toilet again.
Well, let me tell you, when that kid visits me, he doesn't soil himself.
Once he farted and I gave him a look and he apologized - his diaper still clean though!

[joshcryer]

85. Ah, why try to reason with unreasonable people who want to justifiy their bad parenting.

It's pointless. I see a lot of threads like this but usually I keep out.

[yawnmaster]

89. you shouldn't reason from such a narrow position, for one thing...

from a limited range of experience and on a subject that has a scope beyond single solutions.

[joshcryer]

93. I've yet to see a leashed child whose parent I admired.

That narrow enough for you?

[yawnmaster]

94. of course it is; that's what I'm saying. eom

[tigereye]

144. dude. You have no right to call people bad parents- walk a mile in their

moccasins and then get back to us. Trust me, I have seen loads of bad parenting in my work, and leashes ain't it.

[uppityperson]

153. Oh yes, hyperbole is certainly necessary.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=439&topic_id=3364&mesg_id=3771

[Bunny]

88. Hahahaha!

You're the perfect uncle, alright! :thumbsup:

[yawnmaster]

92. Hey their kids have never pooped their pants around me again!!!

Of course, they didn't let them visit again for over 5 years after they disagreed with my diaper methods.




(of course, I'm kidding)

[joshcryer]

96. Eh, potty training methods are much easier than teaching kids good behavior.

Kids really don't want you wiping their ass for them. My niece in particular was embarrassed that she couldn't wipe her butt, and it really was, for me, the worst thing ever. Kids are smart though and she did her best and finally was able to do it sufficiently, after a few times having to ask me to do it. Kids can read emotions and she knew it wasn't something that her uncle wanted to do.

Parents these days, they'll wipe their kids asses until they're 20! :evilgrin:

edit: funny story about "respect," my brother (her dad) took her to the bathroom one time and she was all telling him to wipe her butt, I was in the other stall and went "hey, I thought you had that figured out!" She was so embarrassed and admitted that she "got it."

[yawnmaster]

98. Now that is odd. eom

[joshcryer]

99. What's odd?

[yawnmaster]

115. and with the added edit, it somehow gets even stranger. eom

[proud2BlibKansan]

109. ROFLMAO!!

[uppityperson]

152. Good.

:rofl:

[HuckleB]

123. IMO, there's far too much use of strollers as restraining devices.

Further, too many kids remain in strollers at a far too advanced age.

Parents can do what they want, of course, but they're not helping their kids in the long run, IMO.

[slackmaster]

201. There's one in every crowd

:rofl:

[cleanhippie]

207. Yeah, thats not flamebait. No, not at all.

[cali]

36. I used one with my son

a few times when I was traveling with him or on busy city streets. He was a dasher.

[KT2000]

39. OK by me

Whatever it takes to keep kids safe. I think my brother and I wore one at times back in the 50's.
A mother is expected to do so many things at the same time that it is impossible to keep an eye on them 100% of the time.

[noamnety]

47. I used one with my daughter

We did a lot of traveling, and I couldn't manage dragging my luggage, her luggage, diaper bags, etc though an airport and holding her nonstop at the same time.

Once I got one, I realized it looks restrictive but actually gave her a lot more freedom to explore than holding my hand nonstop. I don't know why some people focus on the restraint like it's a bad thing for a two year old, but every other method they approve of involves even more restraint.

[liberal N proud]

55. When our youngest was small, we used one as a threat

She would never stay with us and we went on vacation and took a child harness and told her that if she didn't stay with us, we would use.

Never had to.

[madrchsod]

56. my wife and i lost our daughter in a mall...

we were not paying attention and within a minute she was gone. she wandered into a store about 15 ft from us. we could have used a leash.

leaches are a good idea in crowded or dangerous places.

[abelenkpe]

111. Shopping is scary with toddlers

I took my four year old with me to the store to buy a new pair of jeans. I could barely look at anything as she was wandering around hiding in clothes racks or putting her bubbles doll in the display shoes and flying them around the store. After about 15 minutes of that I just picked up a pair I thought might fit, bought them and got out of there as fast as possible. Every time she would disappear for a second around a rack my heart starting racing. She thought it was funny, tho.

Glad you little one was OK. Was she scared?

[madrchsod]

126. no....!

[Mojeoux]

59. They kept me on a leash in my uncle's sailboat.

My mom knew by then that I was a darter !!

A friend of ours has three boys. The youngest could climb up on anything, he was amazing. The other two could have cared less.

[Lucian]

62. Kids aren't dogs.

They don't belong on leashes. Just like clothes don't belong on dogs (but that's a different discussion). Kids get away from their parents. It's up to the parents to keep an eye on them so bad shit doesn't happen.

[cali]

90. oh garbage.

if the kid doesn't mind- and my mine preferred the halter than holding my hand when he 2 and 3 to holding my hand. He was a country kid and when we went to the city I used it. Oh, and I hooked him up to it at 27 months to teach him how to ski- At 24 he's an amazing skier.

[Lucian]

102. You have your views, I have mine.

[yawnmaster]

110. This particular view, or to be precise, your argument for your particular view, is illogical. eom

[yawnmaster]

95. Why do you equate leashes with dogs? Think about it.

And then make the (il)logical jump...

Dogs wear leashes.
Kids are not dogs.

Therefore kids should not wear leashes.

huh?

Then how about...

Dogs love attention.
Kids are not dogs.

Therefore kids should not love attention.

[Name removed]

103. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[yawnmaster]

108. more illogic. I point out your logical fallacy and I'm now an idiot. eom

[Name removed]

113. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[yawnmaster]

116. its best not to waste your time with logical arguments. Its better to focus on...

sarcasm.

[yawnmaster]

64. I have no problem at all with it. Unless...

The parents are wearing rollers and using the kids to pull them around.
That is terrible, absolutely terrible.

[NNN0LHI]

65. I think I still have the one my mother used on my brother and I somewhere around here

[somone]

69. I hate them things, but...

I personally witnessed a toddler running towards a large window in an office building. He probably would have crashed through the glass if it hadn't been for a leash - since the bar was too high to stop him.

[asdjrocky]

71. Only if it's to keep them away from me. nt

[MilesColtrane]

168. asdjrocky FTW

:thumbsup:

[enlightenment]

78. I leashed my toddler -

He had no fear and after the second time he almost made it over the second floor barrier in a shopping mall, I leashed him. He's 30 and alive today - and I'm not sorry for one instant that I 'treated him like a dog'.

[MissB]

91. Only if you're breastfeeding him in Olive Garden.

[abelenkpe]

97. Tragic

That poor baby!

I must admit whenever I am out with my kids I watch them like a hawk. Seems that most tragedies like this happen when adults are together and talking and one thinks the other is paying attention. At family gatherings and parties it is always me and the kids, as all the other adults know I won't leave them alone for a second because of worry and well, I'm just a big kid anyway.

The leash thing, might help when they are just learning to walk but won't stop the tragedies that can occur once your kid is say three or four. One of our co-workers had a four year old that went out at nite to check out the new fish pond her parents had finished putting together in their backyard. They had added the fish just that day. She wanted to see the fish. Her parents found her in the pond the next morning. They never got over that.

A few months ago I was driving down Crescent Heights in LA. I saw a little girl maybe a little over a year old wandering down the street alone. I slammed on the brakes and made a U turn. There were lots of cars whizzing by. I pulled into a drive and got out to ask her where her parents were. She walked over to a door to a backyard and pushed. So I went over and knocked. Her mother opened the door, and flipped out. They were having a party out back with several adults and she hadn't noticed her daughter had gotten out.

It takes only a second. It can happen to the best of parents. A leash, well it's a personal decision. But I worry as I've seen many parents with their tiny one on a leash not paying attention to them cause they've got them on a leash. What will happen when they stop using it? Will they pay better attention knowing the safeguard is gone? I never used one, but I think about micro chipping them all the time. I write their name and number in all their clothing, leave index cards with their info in their backpacks, made them memorize all the important numbers... Is that very different?

RIP little one.

[somone]

105. Surveillance video shows a baby sitting in a busy street in the middle of the night in San Antonio:

http://abclocal.go.com/kabc/video?id=7451667

[abelenkpe]

114. Wow.

Good thing the bus driver saw her!

[proud2BlibKansan]

117. A friend of mine was driving down a busy street on a snowy day

and saw two little balls of pink moving through the snow on the sidewalk. She pulled over and found two little twin girls - about 18 months old - playing in the snow. They lived in a nearby apartment building and had gone outside to play in the snow.

[Toucano]

100. I am learning to recognize your threads just by reading the title

That's pretty rare for me. There are only about 4 DUers I can say that about.

Feel special, do ya'?

:-)

[proud2BlibKansan]

101. I used one with my youngest

It was a godsend.

Unless you have a hyper toddler . . .

[kimi]

107. Usually I read through all responses before I reply

Not this time.

One of my kids, when he was younger, would wander off in a split second, caused us many heartbreaking searches and panic. Finally his father and I settled on a leash for him - he was about 3 years old. Out of 5 boys, he is the only one who's ever required that level of supervision as a youngster, and I will never regret it.

Today he's still here, living with me while saving money for grad school, and is a fantastic kid who graduated university last summer with a degree in biology. Yeah, I'd get looks from other people in the mall or grocery for using a leash when he was a kid (and it only had to be used in certain circumstances in public), but I didn't care. I'd rather have gotten those looks of disgust and contempt, than the looks of pity and sadness for the alternative of losing track of him, or worse.

[Chan790]

118. I'm a fierce advocate for their banning.

Never was before I started to work with the public.

Most people I encounter who have a child-leash are observably too stupid or irresponsible to be allowed to leash their kids. I spent more time when I was with Starbucks dealing with parents too busy gabbing away on the phone or gossiping to be paying attention to their kids using the leash inappropriately than you can imagine.

Child-tethers are for assholes. The ones attached to backpacks are marginally better.

[yawnmaster]

119. I disagree. please people child-tethers are NOT for assholes...

they are for specially made harnesses.

[Chan790]

128. Your point?

Mine is that anybody who would use one, is too irresponsible to be ALLOWED to use one.

[tigereye]

151. oh, please.

talk about a broad brush. Seriously.

[Chan790]

163. It's not a broad brush if it's true.

And it's demonstrably-true.

[tigereye]

167. arguing that all parents who use leashes are irresposible is patently absurd.

C'mon. Plenty of responsible, caring parents use 'em. I didn't, but my kid was not really a wanderer or a bolter for the most part. I suspect there are some folks who still don't pay good attention when using em, but assuming that about the majority?

[Chan790]

171. ...

Like I said, I think they should be banned. All of them. Not the majority...actually all of them.

[tigereye]

174. curious - have you raised kids? Don't remember.

Just seems like a really strong, generalized statement that doesn't make sense to me. But so be it.

[Chan790]

179. Kinda, but not young ones.

My parents had my youngest brother to save their marriage, when he didn't save their marriage they both basically abdicated on parenting from the time he was about 4 on. So functionally I can say I raised him since I'm the one that made sure he went school, did his homework, ate, went to bed, got home from little league practice. I'm the one that met with his teachers on conference day.

My parents (married as teens) were both too busy acting like 15 year olds to parent. Mind you, I'm only 8 years older than Jacey is. Who the fuck leaves a small child with a 12 and 10 year old to take a weekend trip to AC with their new boyfriend? (The boyfriend is now the stepfather and he's the only decent parent out of the three of them.)

[blondeatlast]

205. Two year olds are quite another matter than four year olds.

But keep on judging other people, it's so, so, so... "values voter" of y'all.

[Name removed]

227. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[blondeatlast]

176. So demonstrate this truth. nt

[yawnmaster]

225. If its true it is still a broad brush, but you haven't given any argument for the premise that it...

is true.

[cherokeeprogressive]

185. How do you feel about banning Kids Meals? n/t

[Chan790]

187. You mean like Happy Meals?

On the fence, the toy ban isn't the solution...forcing them to only serve healthy solutions in package meal deals (whether kid-aimed or adult-aimed) is. If you want the bad shit, pay full price.

Die! Die Burger/fries/Coke combo! (McD's oatmeal is awesome. I'd pay $1 more to sub it for the fried potato brick in the breakfast meals.)

[newcriminal]

120. Noway would I allow my child to be on a leash.

And before you ask I have had 5 toddlers, all wonderful young adults now.

[HEyHEY]

129. Who gives a shit? What's the difference between that and holding the kid in your arms?

[Odin2005]

130. I think putting kids on leashes is disgusting.

If the kid has some developmental disability that makes it hard to control him/her I would have less of a problem, but this crap is annoying and feeds into the culture of fear that is turning our country into a police state.

[cali]

156. what bullshit

my kid had one of the freest childhoods imaginable. A lot of folks would probably consider it too free- but it worked for him. But between the ages of 2 and 3, when he went to the city, he acted the way he did at home and it just wasn't safe. He didn't like the stroller and he didn't like holding my hand. He was perfectly happy with the halter/leash thing. You know it's not like he wore a collar around his neck.

Tom is 24 now. He's one of the least fearful people I know- and I don't mean just physically.

[noamnety]

196. Do you think it's disgusting to buckle kids into a stroller?

Which is more restrictive?

[TwilightGardener]

132. Have no problem with restraining kids in big public areas.

I had a very hyperactive child who would dart off as soon as he could walk independently--many, many scares. The parents who use a harness probably lived through some bad experiences and I wouldn't question them--they know what they need to do for safety and peace of mind.

[SheilaT]

138. It seems as though most of those

who oppose leashes/harnesses for kids either don't have kids, or had the kind of kids who never wandered.

I SHOULD have used one with my youngest, but didn't. He'd get away from me with amazing swiftness, and I spent a lot of time searching for him in malls and stores. His older brother NEVER wandered. If I'd only had the one kid, I'd probably look down on those who harness their kids. Now I see it as a very sensible thing.

It simply is not possible to watch a child every single second. Bad things can happen with heart-breaking swiftness. And don't judge others so easily.

I did have an ironclad rule, once they were walking, that they had to hold my hand in a parking lot or crossing a street. I carried a screaming child plenty of times until they understood that I meant it. Eventually, I could let the toddler run ahead of me, knowing he would stop at the next street and wait for me. And hold my hand while we crossed. The younger one was still grabbing my hand at those times at age 10.

[customerserviceguy]

141. I used to think that leashes were strange

then I had kids of my own.

Nowadays, I think of them as a mark of responsible parenthood, which seems to be in awfully short supply.

[blondeatlast]

170. Same here. My son was always a sprinter--now he wins awards for it; but back in the day...

:rofl:

[jberryhill]

145. There's a very short time window where it may be a good idea

Somewhere between the end of "cruising the furniture" and "listening when you say 'hey, stop'", there is a span of something like two months where they can be funny little critters.

It's right when they learn to almost run, walking very fast, and enjoy the heck out of it.

I always get a kick out of watching them take off like a shot with that happy smile on their face, totally oblivious to anything but the sheer joy of zooming along, and having no idea where their parents are and basking in the blissful ignorance of a world larger than they could ever explore on their two furiously working little feet.

It's maybe both the cutest and most dangerous time of all.

[HuckleB]

147. On the other end of the spectrum: Dad Faces Legal Action for Not Walking 7 y.o. to Bus Stop

http://freerangekids.wordpress.com/2010/09/14/outrage-of-the-day-dad-faces-legal-action-for-not-walking-7-y-o-to-bus-stop/

The world is going nuts, if you ask me.

[Odin2005]

159. when I was 7 I was walking to school by myself, this was 1993.

[HuckleB]

172. I walked to kindergarten alone.

That was in a small town, but when we moved to a big city, I walked to school, as well, starting in 2nd grade.

Fear is taking over parenthood, IMO.

[cherokeeprogressive]

186. I walked to kindergarten in 1966, and kept walking to school until 1977 when I got my license.

This wasn't some "small town", it was a city in Southeast Los Angeles County.

Fear is definitely taking over, if it hasn't already. Case in point: I got my license and car at 16 in 1977. I'd NEVER have thought that MY daughter was ready for a car on her 16th birthday.

[MilesColtrane]

155. When I was little I got smacked for wandering off.

After a couple of times, I learned that that was not a thing I should do.

Mom was old school.

[Odin2005]

162. My mom grabbed me by the ear when she caught me running off!

OW! OW! OW!!! But it worked! :rofl:

[MilesColtrane]

164. I'm just glad they didn't have Triskelion shock collars back then.

[whistler162]

194. hopefully she alternate ears or does one drag on the ground?

[w8liftinglady]

160. my mom had to put my sister on a "leash" when she was 2-3

which was actually a harness that didn't go around the neck.

my sister literally would run at record speed into traffic,bushes,stores.My mom is a saint and an excellent mother.she did this while trying to hold me,push a basket or take down clothes.My sister was an expert at climbing out of every device known to man(in the 60's).my mom had a harness that was not binding,but kept my sister within reach(while my dad was in VietNam multiple times).
try having a few kids in tow....without a nanny or family.It's a bitch.My sister turned out OK.

[begin_within]

173. Prolly depends on the toddler.

There are likely some toddlers who do need the leash, at least for a while.

[MrSlayer]

175. I find the concept appalling for a few seconds.

Whenever I see this I think to myself "Man, that's fucked up." and then I instantly forget about it and go about my business because at the end of the day I really couldn't care less about what other people do.

[Boudica the Lyoness]

178. They are wonderful and encourage a good body and mind.

A toddler gets bored in his pushchair or stroller and wants to walk and explore his world. A toddler harness and reins are a wonderful and safe way to let him get some exercise by walking with the 'big' people and lets him look up close and touch his new discoveries. Soon as his little legs get tired he can be put back into his pushchair for a well deserved rest.

Toddlers sometimes, in their eagerness to explore their new surroundings, will make a mad dash into danger, such as a busy street or dive onto a dog turd. A mum that has the little tyke in a harness and reins can stop him from becoming very stinky or maybe dead.

Let them explore their world safely. Don't keep them in a pushchair all the time or expect them to walk along at your pace, holding your hand.

[hlthe2b]

180. +1

[blondeatlast]

206. Thank you, Madame Lyoness, for the wisdom. Oddly enough, leashes are freeing

for curious (read intelligent) toddlers.

:applause:

[mwooldri]

231. +2

Child reins have their place and time. It's also dependent on the child in question. Some toddlers will not require them but others who will get into ANYTHING and EVERYTHING could benefit as a passive training tool to not run away. Especially those toddlers who you could turn your back on and at the next minute they are on top of the multimedia cabinet - 6 foot up in the air, screaming for mummy or daddy to get them back down.

Again, it has to be intelligent use, used only when absolutely necessary and as a desire to give your toddler room to explore whilst retaining parental control and reducing greatly parental panic when their child goes missing.

[FloridaJudy]

181. Medically speaking, a harness is a lot safer

Than holding a child's hand. Ask any pediatrician - or just Google "nursemaid's elbow". It's really easy to dislocate a toddler's elbow or shoulder by dragging on his or her arm. Traditionally, it's supposed to happen to kids who get dragged along where they don't want to go, but I've seen several kids this happened to when mom, dad or the babysitter suddenly had to yank them out of harm's way - like on a busy street.

My own kid was an Artful Dodger, and while I never put him in a harness, there were many frantic moments when I wished I had!

[cherokeeprogressive]

184. I'd say it's no less a "life saving act" than banning Kids Meals. n/t

[LWolf]

188. I never leashed my children.

The idea was, and is, kind of horrifying. I have to say, though, that I often thought about it when it comes to my ADHD mom. She lost my youngest son once at Venice beach when he was a toddler, and again at Disneyland, when he darted into a much taller crowd because he saw Mickey in the distance. He's one of the reasons for my premature gray.

Mom is a responsible, loving grandparent with the attention span of a gnat and a general outlook that didn't see potential problems in the environment.

[whistler162]

193. My mom hhad 2, me and my brother, 11 months apart

it was used and needed.

Now I do draw the line at giving dog biscuits to children.

True story my Grandmother once bought a box of People crackers for a snack for one of my cousins not realizing they here dog biscuits.

[lapislzi]

213. LOL, when I was a kid, I insisted on trying all the dog treats

Before I would "let" Mom give them to the dog. I didn't die. Some of them tasted like a mixture of graham cracker and sawdust. The meaty ones all tasted like beef jerky.

[LynneSin]

197. Maybe it's me, but just dont' understand the leash. And trust me I've been small and lost at a mall

Terrifying as hell to have that happen and even to this day I get a bit weirded when I lose my friends at a crowded location. Probably why I enjoy shopping by myself moreso with others.

Having said that though I think there are better options then a leash. Something like an 'extended hand-holder' that when you lose your child's hand it'll stretch a lil bit but you'll know he's within reach. And it doesn't look as humiliating as a leash. The hand holder would connect at the wrists and if your child lets go of your hand, perhaps they can wander 2-3 feet tops but they will be connected.

Maybe they have that out there already - who knows?

[TBF]

211. They do - I had one of those but they seemed to prefer the animal backpacks.

It velcros around your wrist and your child's to give them a little freedom with walking. I used the backpacks when we went to very busy areas, but practiced walking (and just calling them to come back) when we took our local walks around our subdivision (which is not very busy). Eventually they get it and start listening. =)

[lapislzi]

199. You don't get to choose for others.

After my 2-year-old daughter disappeared in a department store (she was playing "hide and seek" in a round fixture while I fished in my purse for my charge card), I gave the harness a go. Neither of us liked it, but it was better than those 120 seconds (felt like 120 years) of horror. We used it for maybe 6 months until she got the idea that wandering away from Mommy was not allowed.

If you think it's inhumane, don't do it. But please don't judge others.

[Skidmore]

202. I have no problem with parents using them when in large crowds.

When my son was 2, he became separated from his father in a crowd in a Middle Eastern bazaar. We were frantic to find him so lucky that we were able to within an hour of losing him. It was the most terrifying experience of my life.

[madmom]

210. I wonder....

do they make these for adults? I am always losing my husband in the store, he likes to wander off. I've taken to just calling his cell to find him.:rofl:

Seriously though, I have no problem with them if that is what it takes to keep kids safe. My son was a wanderer also, maybe he got it from his dad.:shrug:

[TBF]

212. lol

:rofl: mine tends to be pretty easy to find - you'll find him by the shiny things (appliances) in any given store.

[aikoaiko]

214. We occaisionally used one when in public.

And we knew our toddler would want to walk around and not hold our hands for a long period of time.


My kid loved it. The harness was a monkey and he liked to wear his monkey.

[rbixby]

215. I can't believe I survived childhood unleashed!

NT

[Roland99]

219. You should read the threads on these at parenting forums or even the disboards (disney-related)

grab the popcorn!

[uncommon]

220. My daughter had a little monkey backpack with a leash when she was small -

young children are irrational and tend to wander - I have no problem with leashing, as long as it isn't like a dog collar leash around the neck.

[Catbird]

221. Visiting the Grand Canyon

My parents got a leash for my younger brother when we went to visit the Grand Canyon. He was able to explore more with it than he would have without it since there would have been a lot of serious hand holding. Perhaps more importantly, my parents were able to relax a bit. He did not fall into the Grand Canyon, or any other canyons, and is a responsible adult today.

[hedgehog]

223. Forgive me for repeating this story, but I'm a mother of six -

when we went to a store , I led the way and the older kids walked behind to herd the stragglers. still,

one time we managed to leave my very quiet son at the grocery store

and

several times, walking through a mall I'd do a quick head count and come up with 7, not 6. We'd be walking along, and a toddler would see all the kids and decide to join us. Fortunately, we never got too far with the extra kid!

Most of my kids learned very early not to touch things in a store, one kid just had to handle stuff.

So, yeah, if a parent thinks a leash is needed, it probably is!

[HuckleB]

224. I dunno.

Your anecdote seems to argue that a leash is not needed.

[Lydia Leftcoast]

233. Having taken care of younger cousins, I know how

toddlers are at the age that my mother called, "All ambition and no sense."

It's like they have a magic beacon that seeks out hazards--fires, lakes, busy streets, strange dogs. They see something dangerous and they just dart off toward it. You look away for a second, and suddenly little cousin is at the end of the dock, ready to jump into the lake or at the campfire ready to touch the pretty flames.

[Lydia Leftcoast]

234. By the way, a leash is less confining than a stroller

Why is a stroller, which keeps the kid immobile, better than a leash, which lets the kid walk around and explore a bit?

[Pithlet]

235. The objection to them is completely illogical.

They look like a dog leash. Big deal. They're not. The rest of it is just the typical bullshit judgment that just about every decision a parent can makes receives. The dog leash appearance just seems to bring it out more. It's beyond silly.