Democratic Underground Latest Greatest Lobby Journals Search Options Help Login
Google

The abject ignorance of calling nationalized health care 'socialism'

Printer-friendly format Printer-friendly format
Printer-friendly format Email this thread to a friend
Printer-friendly format Bookmark this thread
This topic is archived.
Home » Discuss » General Discussion Donate to DU
 
ProfessionalLeftist Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-24-10 09:12 PM
Original message
The abject ignorance of calling nationalized health care 'socialism'
This is an excerpt from Wendell Potter's book "Deadly Spin" which I am reading over the holidays. Highly recommended by the way:

Page 83:

World health care changed abruptly and forever in 1883 when one of history's most unlikely people, Otto von Bismarck, founder of the German Empire and known as the Iron Chancellor, ordained the world's first "compulsory sickness insurance" as part of this political effort to develop a strong working class as the foundation of a strong Germany. Although he is remembered in this country mostly as the strong militarist and nationalist that he was, Bismarck also went on to create the world's first social security retirement system in 1889 -- arguing that "people who know they are cared for are the best building blocks for a strong nation."

The irony today of detractors calling national health care 'socialist' must certainly have Bismarck spinning in his grave. It is no paradox that he and those who followed in his footsteps established European health systems as extremely conservative anti-socialists--they were catering to the working classes as leverage AGAINST their joining true socialist and labor movements of the day. Strong conservative governments in Europe called this "turning benevolence into power" -- a strategy generally credited with creating the social welfare measures that actually KEPT Communism from becoming a dominant force.


Thus, the propaganda against national health care or a public option or government-run healthcare as 'socialist' is effing ignorant. But people buy the paranoia, fearmongering and propaganda anyway. The advent of terming it 'Un-American' started in 1917 when WWI ensued, when opponents started calling it an "German plot" - and those monikers have stuck ever since. Fearmongering works. Too bad it's all bullshit and people are too ignorant and complacent - and too busy dragging their knuckles and beating their chests, joining mobs and jumping on bandwagons - to learn otherwise. It would be nice if human ability to comprehend and retain information and facts matched their ability to forget or ignore it.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
BrklynLiberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-24-10 09:13 PM
Response to Original message
1. Abject ignorance is something the repukes do everything possible to encourage.
Sadly, there are a lot of willing adherents in the US.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
hlthe2b Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-24-10 09:20 PM
Response to Reply #1
2. How incredulous the world must be watching Americans ....
allow themselves to be manipulated into 3rd world status. It is painful to see the disconnect, especially at this time of year. What a paradox that Republicans have claimed the mantle of Christianity, given that "compassionate conservatism" is anything but.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
BrklynLiberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-24-10 09:51 PM
Response to Reply #2
5. FASCISM ANYONE? Check out # 8
http://www.secularhumanism.org/library/fi/britt_23_2.htm


<snip>

Analysis of these seven regimes reveals fourteen common threads that link them in recognizable patterns of national behavior and abuse of power. These basic characteristics are more prevalent and intense in some regimes than in others, but they all share at least some level of similarity.

1. Powerful and continuing expressions of nationalism. From the prominent displays of flags and bunting to the ubiquitous lapel pins, the fervor to show patriotic nationalism, both on the part of the regime itself and of citizens caught up in its frenzy, was always obvious. Catchy slogans, pride in the military, and demands for unity were common themes in expressing this nationalism. It was usually coupled with a suspicion of things foreign that often bordered on xenophobia.

2. Disdain for the importance of human rights. The regimes themselves viewed human rights as of little value and a hindrance to realizing the objectives of the ruling elite. Through clever use of propaganda, the population was brought to accept these human rights abuses by marginalizing, even demonizing, those being targeted. When abuse was egregious, the tactic was to use secrecy, denial, and disinformation.

3. Identification of enemies/scapegoats as a unifying cause. The most significant common thread among these regimes was the use of scapegoating as a means to divert the people’s attention from other problems, to shift blame for failures, and to channel frustration in controlled directions. The methods of choice—relentless propaganda and disinformation—were usually effective. Often the regimes would incite “spontaneous” acts against the target scapegoats, usually communists, socialists, liberals, Jews, ethnic and racial minorities, traditional national enemies, members of other religions, secularists, homosexuals, and “terrorists.” Active opponents of these regimes were inevitably labeled as terrorists and dealt with accordingly.

4. The supremacy of the military/avid militarism. Ruling elites always identified closely with the military and the industrial infrastructure that supported it. A disproportionate share of national resources was allocated to the military, even when domestic needs were acute. The military was seen as an expression of nationalism, and was used whenever possible to assert national goals, intimidate other nations, and increase the power and prestige of the ruling elite.

5. Rampant sexism. Beyond the simple fact that the political elite and the national culture were male-dominated, these regimes inevitably viewed women as second-class citizens. They were adamantly anti-abortion and also homophobic. These attitudes were usually codified in Draconian laws that enjoyed strong support by the orthodox religion of the country, thus lending the regime cover for its abuses.

6. A controlled mass media. Under some of the regimes, the mass media were under strict direct control and could be relied upon never to stray from the party line. Other regimes exercised more subtle power to ensure media orthodoxy. Methods included the control of licensing and access to resources, economic pressure, appeals to patriotism, and implied threats. The leaders of the mass media were often politically compatible with the power elite. The result was usually success in keeping the general public unaware of the regimes’ excesses.

7. Obsession with national security. Inevitably, a national security apparatus was under direct control of the ruling elite. It was usually an instrument of oppression, operating in secret and beyond any constraints. Its actions were justified under the rubric of protecting “national security,” and questioning its activities was portrayed as unpatriotic or even treasonous.

8. Religion and ruling elite tied together. Unlike communist regimes, the fascist and protofascist regimes were never proclaimed as godless by their opponents. In fact, most of the regimes attached themselves to the predominant religion of the country and chose to portray themselves as militant defenders of that religion. The fact that the ruling elite’s behavior was incompatible with the precepts of the religion was generally swept under the rug. Propaganda kept up the illusion that the ruling elites were defenders of the faith and opponents of the “godless.” A perception was manufactured that opposing the power elite was tantamount to an attack on religion.

9. Power of corporations protected. Although the personal life of ordinary citizens was under strict control, the ability of large corporations to operate in relative freedom was not compromised. The ruling elite saw the corporate structure as a way to not only ensure military production (in developed states), but also as an additional means of social control. Members of the economic elite were often pampered by the political elite to ensure a continued mutuality of interests, especially in the repression of “have-not” citizens.

10. Power of labor suppressed or eliminated. Since organized labor was seen as the one power center that could challenge the political hegemony of the ruling elite and its corporate allies, it was inevitably crushed or made powerless. The poor formed an underclass, viewed with suspicion or outright contempt. Under some regimes, being poor was considered akin to a vice.

11. Disdain and suppression of intellectuals and the arts. Intellectuals and the inherent freedom of ideas and expression associated with them were anathema to these regimes. Intellectual and academic freedom were considered subversive to national security and the patriotic ideal. Universities were tightly controlled; politically unreliable faculty harassed or eliminated. Unorthodox ideas or expressions of dissent were strongly attacked, silenced, or crushed. To these regimes, art and literature should serve the national interest or they had no right to exist.

12. Obsession with crime and punishment. Most of these regimes maintained Draconian systems of criminal justice with huge prison populations. The police were often glorified and had almost unchecked power, leading to rampant abuse. “Normal” and political crime were often merged into trumped-up criminal charges and sometimes used against political opponents of the regime. Fear, and hatred, of criminals or “traitors” was often promoted among the population as an excuse for more police power.

13. Rampant cronyism and corruption. Those in business circles and close to the power elite often used their position to enrich themselves. This corruption worked both ways; the power elite would receive financial gifts and property from the economic elite, who in turn would gain the benefit of government favoritism. Members of the power elite were in a position to obtain vast wealth from other sources as well: for example, by stealing national resources. With the national security apparatus under control and the media muzzled, this corruption was largely unconstrained and not well understood by the general population.

14. Fraudulent elections. Elections in the form of plebiscites or public opinion polls were usually bogus. When actual elections with candidates were held, they would usually be perverted by the power elite to get the desired result. Common methods included maintaining control of the election machinery, intimidating and disenfranchising opposition voters, destroying or disallowing legal votes, and, as a last resort, turning to a judiciary beholden to the power elite.

Does any of this ring alarm bells? Of course not. After all, this is America, officially a democracy with the rule of law, a constitution, a free press, honest elections, and a well-informed public constantly being put on guard against evils. Historical comparisons like these are just exercises in verbal gymnastics. Maybe, maybe not.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
hlthe2b Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-24-10 09:53 PM
Response to Reply #5
6. Wow.... it certainly shoul dring alarm bells.
How damned depressing....
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ShockediSay Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-24-10 10:14 PM
Response to Reply #5
7. So their Propaganda has us as socialists; Why not counter this spelling out their Fascism?
It is what it is, and with the two most recent crypto-fascist SCOTUS Bush appointees,

corporations and corporate money really are taking over

IMHO

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
BrklynLiberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-24-10 10:20 PM
Response to Reply #7
8. Sadly , when it comes to messaging and framing the issues, the repukes lie better than the Dems tell
Edited on Fri Dec-24-10 10:21 PM by BrklynLiberal
the truth. The Dems just seem to be unable to get out a coherent, meaningful message..even when it is what the people really want to hear.

The repuke stranglehold on the media is also a big impediment to getting the actual facts out there.
One can find a more accurate and dispassionate accounting of what is happening in this country if one has access to the media from other countries..
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
COLGATE4 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-25-10 10:13 AM
Response to Reply #8
21. You're absolutely right. But there's a second part to the problem -
Edited on Sat Dec-25-10 10:14 AM by COLGATE4
we just don't have it in us to 'call a spade a spade'. Liberal messaging is essentially Alan Colmes - "You have a point, and many people feel that way, but I think, if you consider all the facts... (at this point whatever RWer whose opposite Colmes overtalks him loudly and we never hear the rest). I completely agree with the other poster that every time they call us "socialists" we call them "facists". We still bring a water pistol to a knife fight, and then look surprised when we're bloodied.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
BrklynLiberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-25-10 11:29 AM
Response to Reply #21
26. 100% correct....We do not have the stomach for the type of brawl the repukes have no qualms
Edited on Sat Dec-25-10 11:32 AM by BrklynLiberal
about.

Too much complacency...but that is fading as people are losing jobs, homes, and the ability to feed and clothe their children.

The Dems must get the message out there that EVERYONE has a duty to contribute to the welfate of the nation as a whole. If ANYONE is suffering, then we are all suffering. This repuke concept of "I've got mine. Screw you." has been spreading like a fungus.

I am at a loss to figure out what it will take for the middle and the left to get pissed off enough to really get out there and fight the good fight.

Torches and pitchforks coming down the road should scare the hell out of the repukes...
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ShockediSay Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-25-10 09:35 PM
Response to Reply #26
31. Propaganda v counter propaganda - it's not 'welfare of the nation'
it's well-being or of the nation IMHO

we use the word welfare and they beat our brains in with their constant repetitive Propaganda
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ShockediSay Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-25-10 09:21 PM
Response to Reply #8
30. They have their lying Propaganda; no reason we can't counter w/
effective messaging of the more truthful, short, sweet and just as repetitive.

e.g. Billionaire Millionaire tax cuts caused the Recession

Billionaire Millionaire tax cuts didn't create jobs except for politicians in their pay

This is not about covering all bases in an essay exam or some rocket science project. This is about short punchy counter propaganda effective messages.

As for MSM, the Crypto-Fascists don't own all of it, though they try. We have to counter their Propaganda Machine, which I believe Hillary Clinton had in mind when she spoke of the vast right wing conspiracy. These guys stick to their talking points Propaganda and march in lockstep goose step, well funded by the corporate money Billionaires and Millionaires that don't want to be at all regulated or pay their taxes.

They are 2%, we are 98%, or would you prefer to roll over for the fascists?







Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ProfessionalLeftist Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-25-10 12:34 AM
Response to Reply #5
12. Another book on my list...
...The Nazi Hydra in America
Suppressed History of a Century

by Glen Yeadon & John Hawkins

Haven't started on that one yet.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
BrklynLiberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-25-10 11:33 AM
Response to Reply #12
27. Thanks for the recommendation. Am going to check it out.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
HughBeaumont Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-25-10 10:10 AM
Response to Reply #5
18. Points 9 and 10 have been the rule of thumb for about . . . . oh . . . 30 YEARS now . . .
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
me b zola Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-24-10 09:27 PM
Original message
Wendell Potter has a very special place in my heart
I believe that the bible would refer to him as the prodigal son. None so greater than the one who was lead off the path to come back against all of the voices who would condemn him.

This Christmas Eve, I toast Wendell. Thank you for your strength and courage to correct course and become a light for goodness. Your courage is appreciated more than you know.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
MindandSoul Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-24-10 09:27 PM
Response to Original message
3. That is a great article. . .great information!
I almost wish the Republicans will "reopen" the health care debate. . .and this time I think we need to be very articulate in our efforts to provide the REAL information.

I hope that President Obama will also fight for this as hard as he is capable of doing. . .
Maybe, reopening the health care debate could be turned to our advantage. . .maybe the "public option" could be presented again, with more convincing (factual) arguments, and a "nothing to lose" attitude from the administration.

Wouldn't it be funny if the Reps reopened that debate to abolish Obama Care...and end up opening pandora's box of TRUTH!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
jwirr Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-24-10 09:43 PM
Response to Original message
4. Just got done reading a book on the Great Plague and government
funded health care is not new nor is it socialist. First plague was in 1347 and it did not take them long to know that they needed to confront it with every things they had. Government built hospitals, paid for personnel to care for the sick and even food so they would not starve when they were quarantined. Teabaggers just do not know their history.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
handmade34 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-24-10 10:35 PM
Response to Original message
9. the ignorance
is also in demonizing "socialism"
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Towlie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-24-10 11:55 PM
Response to Original message
10. Ya got trouble, Right here in River city!
With a capital "T"
And that rhymes with "P"
And that stands for Pool.

http://www.stlyrics.com/lyrics/themusicman/yagottrouble.htm
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
csziggy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-25-10 12:17 AM
Response to Original message
11. K&R
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Delphinus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-25-10 07:19 AM
Response to Original message
13. I am
waiting to get that from my local library. Thank you for posting this bit.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
old mark Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-25-10 08:57 AM
Response to Original message
14. I would not call it ignorance so much as manipulation by the right wing pols playing on
the ignorance, fears and hate of the prople. They have used "socialism" so much most people have no idea what that is, not why it is supposedly "evil".


mark
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ProfessionalLeftist Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-25-10 09:57 AM
Response to Reply #14
15. RW pols, corprat PR firms, Washington lobbyists, and astroturf
... front groups all manipulate the public by using fearmongering, paranoia and the ignorant 'socialism' moniker to scare people from government-run anything and from gov't regulation, playing on the ignorance of the masses. How many sheeple actually looked it up or researched what they're being told? Very few, probably. Heck teabaggers can hardly read. And they're so proud of their ignorance and illiteracy and so 'angry' at us 'elitist intellectuals' (and the RW has been since the early 1900s if not before that). 'Socialism' and 'government takeover' are buzzwords used to produce fear and paranoia of government and government services when the profits of the corporations that control the government are threatened. They want to control the gov't, NOT the gov't to control them. When they see that balance potentially shifting, out come the buzzwords and fearmongering.

No one notices that big gov't isn't the problem. Big corporations are the problem (they of course own and control the gov't). And a$$hole wingnuts are Big Business's Best Friends. Democrats are a close second, increasingly. No one represents working people or the middle/lower class. We have no voice. Obama is living proof of that. We elected him, then he put the earplugs in and hasn't heard us since.


Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
old mark Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-25-10 10:03 AM
Response to Reply #15
16. Candidate Obama was the recipiant of huge donations from the banks
and financial corporations - he led the list by a large margin, something I just found out last week...

http://www.opensecrets.org/pres08/contrib.php?cycle=2008&cid=n00009638

Financial groups, big universities, big corporations in general - all gave big bucks to Senator Obama...


mark
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ProfessionalLeftist Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-25-10 10:07 AM
Response to Reply #16
17. #1 Goldman Sachs
That explains why Goldman continued to run (and rob and ruin) the Fed after Obama was elected. Pfft. He appointed his 'friends' to run it.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
HughBeaumont Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-25-10 10:13 AM
Response to Original message
19. K & R. Yeah, that's called "Fox News".
TeaDipshits still don't seem to get that selfishness is actually a great reason FOR instituting Universal Health Care . . . so it can be there for you WHEN YOU MOST NEED IT.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
swilton Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-25-10 10:13 AM
Response to Original message
20. Same spin applied to global warming -
it became climate change.....Saddam Husseing had WMD....sadly I can expect little else from a population that denies evolution and believes in the literal interpretation of the Bible.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
lumberjack_jeff Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-25-10 10:16 AM
Response to Original message
22. What would a socialist do about health care?
Some people say "socialist" like it's a bad thing.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
CanSocDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-25-10 10:24 AM
Response to Original message
23. Simple truths...


..."people who know they are cared for are the best building blocks for a strong nation."





.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
xchrom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-25-10 10:28 AM
Response to Original message
24. Recommend
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Boojatta Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-25-10 10:30 AM
Response to Original message
25. "started in 1917 when WWI ensued"
Can you explain what you mean there? Other than that detail, the Original Post is clear and interesting. The above detail is unclear to me and for that reason interesting enough to prompt this reply.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ProfessionalLeftist Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-25-10 08:27 PM
Response to Reply #25
29. Page 86-87 of the same book
Edited on Sat Dec-25-10 08:27 PM by ProfessionalLeftist
" ...1917 saw the house of cards come tumbling down. Big labor, spearheaded by Samuel Gompers, denounced compulstory health insurance as an unnecessary, paternalistic reform. State and local medical societies objected to the AMA's support of the legislation, which led to the national group's denying that it had ever sponsored it in the first place. And - surprise surprise - joining the opposition were the for-profit life insurance companies, which vociferously objected to the legislation's "intrusion" into their market, despite the fact that none of them offered health insurance.

This sudden, unforeseen groundswell of opposition (to nationalized healthcare) probably would have been enough. But another major event, the U.S. entry into World War I in April 1917, engulfed the entire debate in a fierce anti-German fever. Opponents labeled the effort 'Un-American" and the "Prussian menace" and claimed it was part of a plot designed by German dictator Kaiser Wilhelm II....Prudential Insurance executive Frederick Hoffman called the reformers' proposal for a European-like compulsory insurance program a "German Plot.

California was the only state to go ahead with the public referendum in 1918, but it was vigorously opposed by the state's physicians, who were joined by the major life insurer's group, led by Prudential and Metropolitan, and the Pharmaceutical Manufacturer's Association, which financed a campaign to galvanize public opposition.

The referendum became the first overt effort by special interests in the US to defeat health care by using propaganda - and by then the Russian Revolution had occurred, so the by-now-familiar epithets "Bolshevik" and "Communist" joined "Hun" and "Prussian" in pamphlets as description of people who supported the plan, which lost overwhelmingly at the ballot box.


_ _ _

This was after AALL (American Association for Labor Legislation, which was very anti-socialist and whose members vigorously opposed Eugene Debs, leader of the Socialist Party) started advocating for national health insurance. The book states that this organization was "the first reform casualty of the same fearmongering propaganda that has been echoing ever since."

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
GeorgeGist Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-25-10 01:15 PM
Response to Original message
28. The abject ignorance of anti-socialists ...
is enlightening.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
DU AdBot (1000+ posts) Click to send private message to this author Click to view 
this author's profile Click to add 
this author to your buddy list Click to add 
this author to your Ignore list Fri Apr 26th 2024, 07:38 PM
Response to Original message
Advertisements [?]
 Top

Home » Discuss » General Discussion Donate to DU

Powered by DCForum+ Version 1.1 Copyright 1997-2002 DCScripts.com
Software has been extensively modified by the DU administrators


Important Notices: By participating on this discussion board, visitors agree to abide by the rules outlined on our Rules page. Messages posted on the Democratic Underground Discussion Forums are the opinions of the individuals who post them, and do not necessarily represent the opinions of Democratic Underground, LLC.

Home  |  Discussion Forums  |  Journals |  Store  |  Donate

About DU  |  Contact Us  |  Privacy Policy

Got a message for Democratic Underground? Click here to send us a message.

© 2001 - 2011 Democratic Underground, LLC