Here's a case where I wish "3 strikes" had worked.

[cali]

Police: Woman Who Murdered Jonathan Foster May Be Serial Killer

By: John Pape on Thu, Dec 30, 2010

News

During an afternoon news conference today, Houston Police investigators said Mona Yvette Nelson, the woman charged with capital murder in the death of 12-year-old Jonathan Foster, may be a child serial killer.

MONA YVETTE NELSON

Officers said they are investigating whether Nelson may be involved in the deaths of other children.

HPD Homicide Detective Michael Miller described the 44-year-old Nelson as “soulless,” and said the woman had shown an “absolute lack of remorse” for the killing.

“I was one of the detectives to interview Mona Nelson, and I can tell you that she is a cold, soulless murderer who showed an absolute lack of remorse in taking the life of Jonathan Foster,” Miller said. “There are few cases that impact homicide detectives in this manner, but this is one of them.”

Miller also said Nelson had admitted to dumping the boy’s burned body in the drainage ditch, but continues to insist she did not kill him.

Detectives said their investigation suggested Nelson abducted Foster from his mother’s apartment last Friday afternoon. Witnesses reported seeing Nelson talking to the boy around 12:30 p.m. Miller described Nelson’s actions as “methodical” in the way she stalked the child before kidnapping him.

<snip>

Authorities have also revealed Nelson has an extensive criminal record dating back almost 25 years. That record includes:

* 1986: Nelson was convicted of aggravated robbery in Harris County and sentenced to 10 years on prison.
* 1991: Nelson was arrested by the Border Patrol at a checkpoint in Kenedy County for attempting to smuggle five illegal aliens from Mexico.
* 1997: Nelson was convicted of theft by check in Daingerfield. That same year, she was also found guilty of theft in Mount Vernon, and served 30 days in jail.
* 1998: Nelson was arrested for operating a stolen vehicle.
* 2001: Nelson pleaded guilty to possession of marijuana and served 29 days of a 30-day sentence
* 2002: Nelson was convicted of possession of marijuana in Collin County.
* 2004: Nelson was convicted of making a terroristic threat in Mount Vernon, Va.
* 2005: Nelson was convicted of criminal mischief in Mount Vernon, Va.
* 2006: Nelson was arrested on a battery charge in St. Charles Parish, La.
* 2008: Nelson was arrested on a charge of assault on a family member in Mount Pleasant.
<snip>

http://www.fortbendnow.com/2010/12/30/49726

[Taverner]

1. Life is the true ultimate punishment, not the DP

DP, you're put down, easily and painlessly

Life in prison = no appeals, no special circumstances

You sit with yourself

The ultimate punishment

[cali]

2. I think it depends. Some people don't feel the way you do.

[Taverner]

4. Yes but let's take a sociopath

Your garden variety sociopath

Treat them like Pfc Brad Manning

No books, no blankets, no contact - except for that 1 hr walk in the prison lot.

Do that for the rest of said sociopath's life and you see what I mean.

[Statistical]

6. Explain why 99.9% of killers on death row appeal to the very end.

Nobody wants to die, they certainly don't want to die young.
If you truly are a sociopath you can always find ways to keep yourself entertained.

Throw urine/blood/feces at guards, attack them, attack other prisoners, get sent to medical wing to try and attack/terrorize medical staff, think of ways to maim guards/staff/inmates, maybe even try to permanently scar (or blind) them. Even if you only get a chance once in a blue moon you can spend the rest of the time, watching, thinking, planning.

What is the deterrent when you are facing life without possibility of parole. Nothing.

[Taverner]

7. OK then, consider that life sentences almost never appeal, and DP cases almost always appeal

Go Life

Not Death

And there is punishment

[Statistical]

8. Hardly. Sociopath will always have a source of victims and thus enjoyment.

The only good sociopath is a dead sociopath.

They can't be reformed, they can't be controlled, they will always be a danger to others.

Not just guards & staff but other prisoners. Prisoners who shouldn't be subject to the added dangers of being around sociopaths.

[Taverner]

9. That's where you and I are different - we can be the one that chooses to not be them

Look, maybe some asshole did this to you or a friend of your;s - doesn't matter

If you give a prisoner 23 hours of solitary: no books, no TV, no internet, no nuthin' - and then one measly hour to walk the yard, alone.

There will be no hero status - and if they don't give a shit they will turn into the animals they are, or they will feel pain.

Your pain. Their victims' pain.

And despite their fight against it, the reality will kick in.

Sure, all of their family might be fucked up, but what bonding that did occur will be washed away.

Look, this won't happen the first day, the first month, the first year or the first decade. But it will happen if you give them life in prison, at a miserable existence.

Maybe I'm just an optimist, but I don't want to be the cause of someone dying, no matter how evil they may be. That shouldn't be wished upon anyone.

[Puregonzo1188]

24. Can you cite an example of a violent crime committed by someone on serving Life Without Parole?

[Taverner]

28. I am not saying they are handling them right

[Statistical]

31. One or couple hundred?

http://www.piecp-violations.com/about.html
Lifer kills guard.
http://www.prisonoffenders.com/connally_unit_murder_rhonda_osborn.html
Lifer kills staff

http://www.prodeathpenalty.com/LWOP.htm
third story down. Life w/o parole inmate escapes. While escaped kills a new victim before being caught. Honestly what did he really have to lose?

Here is an inmate who asked for the death penalty. He ended up killing his cellmate
http://www.aolnews.com/2010/08/01/inmate-who-wanted-death-penalty-linked-to-prison-slaying/

Here is a guy while serving life w/o possibility of parole, attacked two guards.
His possible sentence for the assaults..... a second life sentence
http://www.timesleader.com/news/New_life_sentence_is_possible_12-02-2010.html

This charmer is serving life in prison and becomes convinced he "must" kill his cellmate. Feels he shouldn't be punished for killing someone who "needed killing".
http://www.tcoasttalk.com/2010/01/29/ricky-silva-cellmate-needed-to-be-killed/

[Stinky The Clown]

16. I agree with you

[oneshooter]

30. Weld the door shut and walk away. n/t

[Luminous Animal]

40. So, you advocate torture?

[madinmaryland]

3. Perfect answer. Thank you. nt

[Taverner]

10. You get it

I've known true sociopaths - and despite their amoral,anti-ethical stances behind the scenes - they do feel a certain pain for previous actions

Let's turn up the volume on said pain

That's justice

[Statistical]

21. True sociopaths DON'T feel pain/remorse/guilt for what they did.

You still keep confusing them with someone having human emotions/empathy/humanity.

That is what makes them truly dangerous. They don't need a reason to kill you. You don't need to set them off to illicit a violent response. They could cut your throat and let you die in front of your kids and then get some stuff out of your fridge and make a sandwich.

A key characteristic of sociopath or more technically "Antisocial personality disorder" is a clearly defined lack of empathy.

In prison that manifests as attacks on others. They don't attack/terrorize/maim/kill for power or influence they do it because they simply don't give a shit.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sociopath

[Taverner]

23. Given enough time they do

Besides, by your wish the Sociopaths are removed from society. Put in solitary.

They will never harm another person again. Even if they make a shank.

Chances are, they'll die if anyone does.

[Statistical]

25. The idea they can't hurt someone in solitary is false.

They will still have minimal contact with guards. When injured (even self injured) they will have contact with medical staff. Assaults on guards/staff occur even in the most secure prison wing on the planet; supermax.

Given unlimited time and no empathy they will wait, methodically, patiently for that one chance to strike. A guard a little too slow, or too sleepy, or distracted. Pretty easy to injure someone if you don't care about what happens to yourself. Teeth can permanently maim, even a headbut can break a nose or jaw.

[Taverner]

26. Perhaps that is the way to deal with them

But killing them makes us them

[Statistical]

5. Horrible that it happened but she lives in Texas. n/t

[MicaelS]

12. And precisely WTF is that supposed to mean?

More Texas bashing?

[Statistical]

15. Nope. If convicted it is highly likely she will get a needle in the arm and that will be that. n/t

[MicaelS]

18. Very true and I apologize...I'm just getting tired of Texas bashing n/t

[Statistical]

20. You won't get any from me.

There are idiots and champions in every State.

Some people just need labels. Kinda sad actually.

[Taverner]

29. I am not Texas bashing, but I think the DP is unfair to the Victim's Family

Bastard should have been made to suffer...

[Statistical]

32. Suffer = torture. Cruel and unusual punishment is prohibited by the Constitution.

On one hand you claim killing people makes us like murderers (there is a difference between a homicide and murder).

On the other hand you believe torturing (made to suffer) prisoners is ok.

[Taverner]

39. Different kind of torture really

Leaving you alone with yourself is in itself justice- it makes the prisoner reflect, and hopefully empathize

Waterboarding on the other hand, just makes you confess to anything

[Luminous Animal]

41. You are 100% wrong. Leaving a person alone with themselves often makes them more violent.

And, yes, solitary confinement is regarded as torture.

[cherokeeprogressive]

19. I don't think so. I think it means if found guilty, she won't be hurting any more innocent children

[howaboutme]

11. There are truly evil people that don't deserve to be tortured

I'm not for torturing, either mentally or otherwise, the really tormented killers and sociopaths. They are the ones who are guilty of multiple heinous crimes.

They arethe ones who have been absolutely proven guilty and need to be pumped up with mind altering drugs that put them in a state of euphoria and then we need to give them a shot that stops their heart in its tracks and the subsequent many year costly burden on society. I have no problem taking them off of our dole. BUT it must be about proven guilt beyond any doubt, regardless of their mental illness or sociopath nature. The dudes in Connecticut that tortured and killed the wife and children come to mind. There are truly a few evil people and they need eliminated.

[cali]

13. I'm not for torturing anyone either. I am for putting people who do this kind of heinous

shit, behind bars. I am not for the dp under any circumstance.

[lonestarnot]

14. Do we have a pic of this freak?

[Statistical]

17. From the article.

[Puregonzo1188]

22. What exactly is your point? There's no connection between possession of marijuana or car theft with

her being a serial killer. I can't believe you're seriously using this situation in order to push for three strikes laws.

[cherokeeprogressive]

27. Maybe you should be asking the Houston PD that. Did you read the article?

It's in the first paragraph.

[Puregonzo1188]

33. Excuse me? The first paragraph mentions they suspect she's a child serial killer. I gathered that.

What I don't gather is the op's poor attempt to try to link this case with the three strikes law.


Yes, she had a criminal record, but it was all petty stuff. So if you she had been locked away for life for marijuana possession, which is essentially what the OP is celebrating, she wouldn't have been able to kill children. However, I see no connection between her past of marijuana possession and auto theft and her being a child serial killer, so I fail to see how this is a case for 3 strikes.

[cherokeeprogressive]

36. You are correct. Now that I look at her offenses more thoroughly, I don't see three violent

felonies.

My mistake and I apologize.

[cali]

37. two assaults and battery, car theft

not just pot.

[RaleighNCDUer]

34. I noticed that. The one crime she seems to have NO prior for

involves attacking children. This guy, while righteously disturbed by this murder, is making shit up.

[TexasObserver]

35. Three Strikes remains a nuke used to kill a ground squirrel.

Unless the cases are very serious felonies and indicate a truly malevolent person, Three Strikes is a ridiculous concept.

Her criminal history doesn't indicate anything suggestive of child murder.

Three Strikes is overkill. A person should be punished only for crimes of which they're convicted, with punishments commensurate with the crime.

Here is her record of convictions for crimes of violence only, and even it includes two that are of dubious value in today's world of arrest and prosecution:

* 1986: Nelson was convicted of aggravated robbery in Harris County and sentenced to 10 years in prison.
* 2004: Nelson was convicted of making a terroristic threat in Mount Vernon, Va.
* 2008: Nelson was arrested on a charge of assault on a family member in Mount Pleasant.

[Tsiyu]

38. I'm not getting the connection

But I can say this: Spending our money chasing pot smokers means less money for departments to investigate true child abuse.

Maybe she did hurt some kids prior to this and would be in jail if crimes against juveniles were taken seriously..

But there was no outrage, no investigation, no follow-through because there was no money for - or in - investigating crimes against children, especially of the poor.

All the money's going to the War on Drugs.