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Could this explain the loyalty of Trump supporters? (Original Post) Arkansas Granny Feb 2018 OP
For some of them, yes....for others? Pure morons is sufficient. (n/t) Moostache Feb 2018 #1
What does he say about... Cracklin Charlie Feb 2018 #2
Im still holding out for the subliminal advertising during The Apprentice..... samnsara Feb 2018 #3
Trump supporters are idiots and racists Gothmog Feb 2018 #4
Its a one to one process to open them up to reality. BSdetect Feb 2018 #5
Like reprogramming a cultist - is that called confirmation bias? erronis Feb 2018 #9
Was it the Stanford experiments? robbob Feb 2018 #19
Not sure, but I'll take a look at the Stanford experiments. A simpler metaphor is "Once a Ford erronis Feb 2018 #21
Found the article robbob Feb 2018 #26
Wonderful, thank you. I get the New Yorker but don't always have time to read it all, erronis Feb 2018 #33
What were we talking about? robbob Feb 2018 #35
I endorse that remark. . . . nt Bernardo de La Paz Feb 2018 #6
Trump supporters are afraid of the future. ginnyinWI Feb 2018 #7
I agree that's a huge part of their problem PJMcK Feb 2018 #14
I read this when it was written. murielm99 Feb 2018 #18
Cool that you read it back in the day, too! PJMcK Feb 2018 #20
Fool Me Once Fool Me Again Fool Me......GWB Old Enough 2 Feb 2018 #8
Oh, how I miss W. Just please don't bring back the henchmen! erronis Feb 2018 #10
For the last 80 or so years Stardust1 Feb 2018 #11
And the public school system has and most religions seek to limit critical thinking Texin Feb 2018 #15
Yup Stardust1 Feb 2018 #24
I take exception to your painting Lifelong Protester Feb 2018 #31
I first saw the difference from just a decade before, when I began teaching at the end of maddiemom Feb 2018 #16
True dat! nt TwistOneUp Feb 2018 #12
He's my favorite sage. maddiemom Feb 2018 #13
The biggest problem we face is with respect to education PJMcK Feb 2018 #17
Republicans Need A Large Dumbed Down Base colsohlibgal Feb 2018 #22
3 Reasons Why So Many People Still Support Trump Poiuyt Feb 2018 #23
Partly. moondust Feb 2018 #25
Anger and fear. Anger and fear. Anger and fear. Anger and fear. VOX Feb 2018 #27
Yes. And the propaganda outlets also provide talking points. american_ideals Feb 2018 #29
Precisely. On some boards like the Washington Post... VOX Feb 2018 #34
Fox and Limbaugh explain it. Propaganda works. That's why GOP billionaires pay for it. american_ideals Feb 2018 #28
wow, what a good observation! liberalla Feb 2018 #30
Timeless.. It never changes.. there Cha Feb 2018 #32

erronis

(15,981 posts)
9. Like reprogramming a cultist - is that called confirmation bias?
Tue Feb 6, 2018, 12:38 PM
Feb 2018

And I do think it is true to some degree for liberals, just much more for mental conservatives.

I'm really a computer/logic geek but I think trying to codify our biases is a great effort:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Cognitive_Bias_Codex_With_Definitions,_an_Extension_of_the_work_of_John_Manoogian_by_Brian_Morrissette.jpg

robbob

(3,567 posts)
19. Was it the Stanford experiments?
Tue Feb 6, 2018, 01:33 PM
Feb 2018

My memory is a bit foggy, but I believe there was a psychological experiment where participants were shown “studies” on an issue like whether the death penalty helped deter crime (for example) and then asked to formulated an opinion either for or against the issue.

They took the participants who arrived at an opinion in line with what they had read, and then revealed to them that the studies they had been shown were complete works of fiction, and were told that existing studies showed the exact opposite conclusions to the one they had been shown. An astonishingly high percentage of the people clung to the conclusion they had arrived at and would not change their opinion, even after being shown evidence that they were wrong. The mind, once made up, is hard to change.

erronis

(15,981 posts)
21. Not sure, but I'll take a look at the Stanford experiments. A simpler metaphor is "Once a Ford
Tue Feb 6, 2018, 01:48 PM
Feb 2018

Always a Ford".

I have a very smart partner who acts like s/he makes decisions rationally. However when it comes down to choosing a new product, the prior product/line will win out. Unless it is determined totally crap in which case it will never be selected again.

I think there are so many biases, but "buy-in" to a philosophy seems to be hard to combat. Especially if the philosophy doesn't really have any bases to describe it or to argue against.

Who could be against dump's Momma's Apple Pie? (Have you seen a picture of her? OMG)
Who could be against dumps slogans?
Who could be against dump?
Treasonous!

erronis

(15,981 posts)
33. Wonderful, thank you. I get the New Yorker but don't always have time to read it all,
Wed Feb 7, 2018, 08:22 AM
Feb 2018

Or to remember what I've read.

ginnyinWI

(17,276 posts)
7. Trump supporters are afraid of the future.
Tue Feb 6, 2018, 12:28 PM
Feb 2018

Too many changes in our society make them scared. They want to go back to the familiar old days and old ways. Even the young ones!

Trump speaks to that. If he has any gift or talent, it is his ability to make the "sale" by speaking to just what his target most wants.

PJMcK

(22,235 posts)
14. I agree that's a huge part of their problem
Tue Feb 6, 2018, 01:11 PM
Feb 2018

Are you familiar with a book from the 1970's titled, "Future Shock," by Alvin Toffler? He defines future shock as a psychological condition where an individual is unable to cope with the accelerating rate of change in society. It's a fascinating and complex idea that he articulates effectively.

In 2016, during the presidential campaign, I re-read the book because much of what Trump was saying reminded me of this idea. While some of it feels a bit dated, his hypothesis has proven true and as you wrote, "Too many changes in our society make them scared."

If you enjoy reading books, try finding a copy. It's informative, wise and often quite funny.

murielm99

(30,995 posts)
18. I read this when it was written.
Tue Feb 6, 2018, 01:27 PM
Feb 2018

I think I still have a copy.

This is much like culture shock. I think many Americans are experiencing culture shock within their own culture. They don't understand the new technology and social media. Their jobs have become obsolete and they don't know how to retrain. They don't like the browning of the population. It is a scary and lost feeling, like being forced to live in a culture that is not one's own.

PJMcK

(22,235 posts)
20. Cool that you read it back in the day, too!
Tue Feb 6, 2018, 01:35 PM
Feb 2018

I still have my paperback copy and there's a funny little story about the books publication.

When it was released in paperback, they printed the covers in four or five different colors as if to reflect the idea of change. My copy has a pink cover but a new friend has it in his bookshelf with a green cover.

In my very personal opinion, it's not too difficult to address change if you don't take some things too seriously. And there are organic things that can keep you mellow, (wink).

Stardust1

(123 posts)
11. For the last 80 or so years
Tue Feb 6, 2018, 12:42 PM
Feb 2018

we have been conditioned to be anti-education/anti-science. Also we have been taught that 'might makes right' meaning that the truth is seen as something that is dictated by the 'winners' rather then an objective constant. To the majority the only way their views can be wrong is if they admit they're wrong.

Texin

(2,620 posts)
15. And the public school system has and most religions seek to limit critical thinking
Tue Feb 6, 2018, 01:14 PM
Feb 2018

Then there's the cult of personality that exists today, when people like the Kardashians can command attention and become famous for not being famous. It's a perfect storm of idiocy.

Stardust1

(123 posts)
24. Yup
Tue Feb 6, 2018, 09:19 PM
Feb 2018

Think about how much of our societies money goes to Kim Kardashian compared to, say, a doctor that saves lives on a regular basis.

maddiemom

(5,106 posts)
16. I first saw the difference from just a decade before, when I began teaching at the end of
Tue Feb 6, 2018, 01:17 PM
Feb 2018

the Sixties/early Seventies. Although the Sixties did usher in major strides in civil rights and critical thinking, there was quite a backlash in the areas you mention: just hybernating in wait for a Trump.

maddiemom

(5,106 posts)
13. He's my favorite sage.
Tue Feb 6, 2018, 01:09 PM
Feb 2018

You're right! Twain nails it exactly. I especially love "The Mysterious Stranger." Although dark, due his family tragedies,it's sadly on the mark.

PJMcK

(22,235 posts)
17. The biggest problem we face is with respect to education
Tue Feb 6, 2018, 01:25 PM
Feb 2018

Mandatory public or private education is critical for an informed society to function. Our predecessors saw the need for a robust public education system to ensure that our populace would be able to function, contribute, consider issues intelligently and critically and to help advance our country.

Over the last three decades or more, the Republicans have chiseled away at our education systems. They've done this at the federal, state and local levels. They've been unrelenting and ruthless in their pursuit of diminishing the education of our children.

The results have been catastrophic!

This is why people watch Fox News or get lost in tabloids or turn away from their civic responsibilities. Far too many Americans have been forced into lives of ignorance. This is the result that the GOP and the 1% have been after for these last years. With the assistance of the ignorant, these "masters of the universe" can advance their own financial and personal interests at the expense of the rest of us.

While I agree with the quote, Samuel Clemens was far too smart and wise for our time.

colsohlibgal

(5,276 posts)
22. Republicans Need A Large Dumbed Down Base
Tue Feb 6, 2018, 06:22 PM
Feb 2018

And they hate public anything which is why they have gone after public schooling.

Add Fox News and it’s cable clones and you have a steady supply of people lacking critical thinking.

PT Barnum was right on with his thought that you should never underestimate the stupitidy of the American people.....at least among enough of us to allow a crass rich bumpkin to get enough votes to lose by only 3 million votes but to win the uniquely American creation the Electoral College, where you can win despite losing....if you are a Republican.

Maybe we can come back to some kind of equitable normalcy, time will tell.

Poiuyt

(18,163 posts)
23. 3 Reasons Why So Many People Still Support Trump
Tue Feb 6, 2018, 07:17 PM
Feb 2018
http://www.smirkingchimp.com/thread/paul-buchheit/77587/3-reasons-why-so-many-people-still-support-trump

1. Trump's Followers Believe They're Better Than Other People

2. They're Driven by Hatred for Their Perceived Enemies

3. They Refuse to Admit They Were Wrong

--------------

Full explanation at the link.

moondust

(20,197 posts)
25. Partly.
Tue Feb 6, 2018, 09:38 PM
Feb 2018

I'd say much of it is the tribalist bigotry and hatred common in "flyover" states that is far less prevalent in coastal states that have much more diverse populations. That tribal hatred trumps everything else. It's a cult.

VOX

(22,976 posts)
27. Anger and fear. Anger and fear. Anger and fear. Anger and fear.
Tue Feb 6, 2018, 10:00 PM
Feb 2018

They have two primary emotional settings: Anger and fear. And an unwillingness (or incapacity) to think critically, which opens the door to these powerful negative emotions.

EVERY right wing “news” outlet figuratively applies electrodes to zap those two brain areas (anger and fear), dispensing “information” about what their audiences should be afraid of (socialism, immigrants, POC, gays, empowered women, government, Islam, liberals, etc.).

Furthermore, audiences are taught to be enraged at what they fear (empowered woman = BENGHAZI!!!, “feminazis”; POC = the Muslim-Kenyan Obama, any African American gunned down by police; liberals = flag burning!, etc.)

It’s a deceptively simple formula, and as all can see, it’s very effective.

american_ideals

(613 posts)
29. Yes. And the propaganda outlets also provide talking points.
Tue Feb 6, 2018, 11:15 PM
Feb 2018

"Trump colluded with the Russians? Well UraniumOneHillaryObamaDemsWorkedWithUkraine...."

Whataboutism is a very effective propaganda technique. Fox and Limbaugh give their audience plausible talking points to allow viewers to hang on to their false ideas.

g

VOX

(22,976 posts)
34. Precisely. On some boards like the Washington Post...
Wed Feb 7, 2018, 08:26 AM
Feb 2018

It’s difficult to distinguish between bots/trolls and “actual” right-wingers, because as you point out, the talking points have been repeated enough, and/or have been widely distributed on any particular day. They ALL stay on-message. It’s kind of uncanny. I actually admire their discipline (while utterly loathing their message).

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