Harry Reid wisely dumps Ron Paul's ridiculous Audit the Fed bill

[banned from Kos]

http://news.yahoo.com/blogs/ticket/ron-paul-audit-fed-bill-passes-house-185936757.html

"This bill would ... jeopardize the Fed's independence by subjecting its decisions on interest rates and monetary policy to GAO audit," said House Minority Whip Steny Hoyer, a Democrat from Maryland. "I agree with Chairman Bernanke that congressional review of the Fed's monetary policy decisions would be a 'nightmare scenario,' especially judging by the track record of this Congress when it comes to governing effectively."

While Wednesday's passage in the lower chamber is a victory for Paul and his supporters, the bill is considered dead on arrival in the Senate. Harry Reid, the Senate majority leader and a Nevada Democrat, has vowed not to put it to a vote.

Thanks, Senator Reid.

1- the Fed is audited by Deloitte and the GAO annually
2- Congress wants to meddle in monetary policy when they can't agree on anything
3- Congress is too stupid to meddle in monetary policy
4- The Fed is filled with Obama appointees - we don't want to let the GOP in there.

[MannyGoldstein]

1. And we all know what the Fed does, anyway

Anything humanly possible to transfer cash to bankers.

[banned from Kos]

3. You're mistaken. But I have learned that trying to explain the Fed to bank griefers

is like trying to explain calculus to a canine.

[MannyGoldstein]

10. Good point. I really am pretty stupid.

If only I was smart, that would be nice.

[banned from Kos]

11. The Fed LOANS to bankers so technically you are correct when you say

"transfer".

But mostly banks loan to each other out of the federal "reserve" - a pool of their own money.

We, the taxpayers, profit. But I know you meant everyone is stealing your money.

[MannyGoldstein]

22. Does it loan against garbage assets, 100 cents on

the dollar, no questions asked?

[R. Daneel Olivaw]

26. How have the taxpayers profited so far? n/t

[rhett o rick]

31. Ah the Fed. And only you understand. A private company that has the power to use our treasury to

help out the crooked-assed banksters. I am no libertarian, but fuck the FEd.

[Fumesucker]

8. Oh, I don't think they limit themselves to mere human possibility..

I'm pretty sure computers have something to do with it and even lizard alien overlords wouldn't stretch my credulity all that far any more..

[NashvilleLefty]

59. Way to compeletely ignore history!

Perhaps you think Regan and "supply side economics" really did save our economy and end stagflation in the '80's.

*hint* it was the Fed.

[MannyGoldstein]

60. That was Volcker's fed

Last edited Fri Jul 27, 2012, 07:57 AM - Edit history (1)

This ain't.

A chainsaw can efficiently cut down trees or take off an arm. It's how you use it, of course.

[freshwest]

2. So, they've been audited already? Baggers still fighting the 16th Amendment?

Thanks for this information. See how powerful the disinfo is?

1- the Fed is audited by Deloitte and the GAO annually

Never heard about this, it's not as exciting as conspiracy talk, huh?

2- Congress wants to meddle in monetary policy when they can't agree on anything

They want to dismantle the government and bring it down, no level of trust there, and most people don't know a thing about it.

3- Congress is too stupid to meddle in monetary policy

Congress, is in charge of the purse strings, though. What would they do, put us back on the gold standard or silver, as the Baggers have tried to set up state currencies on?

4- The Fed is filled with Obama appointees - we don't want to let the GOP in there.

No, they've got their ropes tied in nooses to take us all down now. Thanks for this, I wasn't sure if Reid was right, but now I feel better about his shutting them down.


EDIT: Typo, should have been 16th, not 18th Amendment

[banned from Kos]

5. Here is a pdf of their latest audit - if you need a sleeping aid it works well

http://www.federalreserve.gov/boarddocs/rptcongress/annual08/pdf/audits.pdf

[freshwest]

7. I downloaded it. I hope it puts me under. I get tired of the gotcha's from people about this who

Don't know the business, instead, they just jump to the conclusion at whatever point the data runs before their eyes, or statements are made, that match their own prejudices.

Many of which are being sold to them by Koch and GOP owned media.

They know not what they think...

[PoliticAverse]

14. Read this from Bernie Sanders...

http://www.sanders.senate.gov/newsroom/news/?id=9e2a4ea8-6e73-4be2-a753-62060dcbb3c3

[think]

17. Thank you /nt

[freshwest]

21. I have read it. Is this the same bill?

[PoliticAverse]

23. That was from a previous full GAO audit done due Sanders adding text to a bill

that was passed.

Sanders supports the current bill for another full-audit.

Despite what the op claims the GAO doesn't perform full-audits on the Fed annually.

[freshwest]

25. Okay, yeah, that was news to me when I read that there. Kinda took the wind outta the sails...

[midnight]

34. So Bernie referes to the audit as the "First" top to bottom audit of the Federal Reserve....

[liberallibral]

18. Not COMPLETELY audited...

Taken from reason.com's site...

"The Fed's financial statements are audited annually, but the Fed's monetary policy operations are exempt from audit. Congress’ investigative arm, the Government Accountability Office (GAO), currently is prohibited by law from examining discount window and open market operations; agreements with foreign governments and central banks; and Federal Open Market Committee (FOMC) directives. It is precisely this information that should be made public.....H.R. 459 allows GAO to audit the Fed’s monetary policy operations and directs GAO to report the audit results to Congress."

It's time for a thorough audit of the Federal Reserve!

[freshwest]

24. That would bring the foreign aspect into it.. And there goes Romney borrowing money abroad... Making

Deals which the Baggers want.. I'll go with the premise that BFK may be off base, but coming from a political angle, would you answer the points he states are the problem?

How much do we want the Bagger involved in monetary policy? WE can't even trust to not shut down the government and default because of, well, take your pick:

End SS, end Medicare, Medicaid, no UEB, no PP, personhood laws, the Ryan Budget.

While my assumptions may have been off base, and please forgive as I am working on 8-10 things at once on my machine right now, not giving full attention, I can't believe anything that comes out of that filthy HoR is going to help anyone but the GOP. Yes, some Democrats did vote today with them, but what would they do with anything they got?

This is Darryl Issa's HoR there. And John Boehner and Paul Ryan is all part of that cabal. I can't see any reason to trust them. Sanders and Kucinich, yes. But Sanders is retiring and so is Kucinich. They won't be there to steer that bunch of maniacs.

But a a matter of principle, I want all these transactions out there to be seen.

[gopiscrap]

36. Welcome to DU!!!

[liberallibral]

41. Thanks!

[Deadunikorns]

62. Really?

Still fighting for the 18th amendment? In case you didn't know that amendment was repealed December 5,1933 by the 21st amendment.


Hmm then why did Harry Reid sponsor a bill back in 1995 to audit the fed? As you can see it is from a mainstream media website.
http://cnsnews.com/news/article/harry-reid-I've-sponsored-legislation-audit-federal-reserve
so he was for it before he was against it.

And wow' as for the rest of it maybe you should do a little research. As for a teabagger or a republican i am not. Cant stand them either.

[freshwest]

63. EDIT: Typo, should have been 16th, not 18th Amendment

And wow' as for the rest of it maybe you should do a little research. As for a teabagger or a republican i am not. Cant stand them either.

As for a teabagger or a republican i am not.

Must have hit a teabagger nerve there. I commented with regular DUers about Reid and revised my opinion.

Cant stand them either

You can't stand the Democratic Leader of the US Senate, or does that apply to Democrats in general?

Enjoy your stay at DU. Bye now.

[BumRushDaShow]

4. Hmm... this should be good

[GoCubsGo]

6. Meanwhile, STILL no job bill...

Time to audit Ron Paul, instead.

[freshwest]

9. Sounds good to me. Wonder if his cultists feel betrayed since grandpa decided to not speak in Tampa?

[Comrade_McKenzie]

12. I'll take your word for it. I'd rather move into the business of auditing corporations. nt

[PoliticAverse]

13. If the GAO truly audits the fed annually why would people object to this bill,

which calls for a 'full audit' by the Comptroller General of the United States (who is the director of the GAO) ?

Here is the text of the bill: http://www.govtrack.us/congress/bills/112/hr459/text

One of the Senate supporters of the bill is Bernie Sanders, here is why:

http://www.sanders.senate.gov/newsroom/news/?id=9e2a4ea8-6e73-4be2-a753-62060dcbb3c3

I guess he's one of the 'progressives' you're defending the banks from:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=914317

[freshwest]

20. Except that was 1995, 17 years ago. Why change his mind now?

Except that the Baggers wanted it.

[EmeraldCityGrl]

16. Over 5000 comments on the

Yahoo newstory many calling to vote out those "vowing not to put it to a vote."
Could Reid been a little more tactful or discreet? We really don't need this BS
now especially when there are plenty of Dems and Independents also calling
for an audit of the Fed. Reid needs to SFU!

[Ruby the Liberal]

19. By all means - lets not EVER let the public know what they did with taxpayer money

You are becoming a cartoon. Seriously. How many times do you genuflect to Wall Street every morning before you even coffee and shower?

[tritsofme]

29. The Fed returned $77 billion to taxpayers last year.

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/01/11/business/economy/fed-returns-77-billion-in-profits-to-treasury.html

[Blanks]

27. Ron Paul is always whining about the FED...

...I suppose he figures if he can convince people that they are the bad guys; congress approval rating will rise out of the teens.

I remember when the economy was humming a little more smoothly in the 90's it was all "Alan Greenspan is the genius behind this economic expansion".

It's all a distraction. They need to raise taxes on the big earners and all of these 'problems with the FED' will resolve over time.

When the debt wasn't climbing because of Dubya's wars; nobody had a problem with the FED.

[Kennah]

35. There are Paulbots who are just enthralled over his Fed position

Seems one helluva hill to die on, politically, but I encourage them to pursue it vigorously and vote Turd, I mean Third.

[sabrina 1]

37. How about Bernie Sanders and Alan Grayson, are they 'always whining also'?

The reason no one had a problem with the Fed is because no one knew what they were doing.

Thanks to a bill passed a short time ago, there was an audit of the Fed about a year ago. See the outrageous results of that audit here on Senator Bernie Sanders website:

http://www.sanders.senate.gov/newsroom/news/?id=9e2a4ea8-6e73-4be2-a753-62060dcbb3c3

The first top-to-bottom audit of the Federal Reserve uncovered eye-popping new details about how the U.S. provided a whopping $16 trillion in secret loans to bail out American and foreign banks and businesses during the worst economic crisis since the Great Depression. An amendment by Sen. Bernie Sanders to the Wall Street reform law passed one year ago this week directed the Government Accountability Office to conduct the study. "As a result of this audit, we now know that the Federal Reserve provided more than $16 trillion in total financial assistance to some of the largest financial institutions and corporations in the United States and throughout the world," said Sanders. "This is a clear case of socialism for the rich and rugged, you're-on-your-own individualism for everyone else."

Among the investigation's key findings is that the Fed unilaterally provided trillions of dollars in financial assistance to foreign banks and corporations from South Korea to Scotland, according to the GAO report. "No agency of the United States government should be allowed to bailout a foreign bank or corporation without the direct approval of Congress and the president," Sanders said.

The non-partisan, investigative arm of Congress also determined that the Fed lacks a comprehensive system to deal with conflicts of interest, despite the serious potential for abuse. In fact, according to the report, the Fed provided conflict of interest waivers to employees and private contractors so they could keep investments in the same financial institutions and corporations that were given emergency loans.

For example, the CEO of JP Morgan Chase served on the New York Fed's board of directors at the same time that his bank received more than $390 billion in financial assistance from the Fed. Moreover, JP Morgan Chase served as one of the clearing banks for the Fed's emergency lending programs.

So Reid is going to prevent any further oversight of the Federal Reserve? That makes no sense considering those findings. If anything Reid himself should have been the one calling for audits and a lot more oversight of the Fed.

What an outrage, no wonder people have totally lost faith in this government.

[Blanks]

40. It isn't that the FED shouldn't have oversight...

...it is that Ron Paul blames inflation, the deficit, the recession and the drought on the FED.

All the Ron Paul supporters think he has the solution. His solution: abolish the FED, abolish the EPA, abolish the Department of Education, abolish FEMA. Notice a pattern?

When something isn't perfect; you work to perfect it. You don't threaten to abolish things just because it makes you look tough.

We've had more economic stability since the creation of the FED than we had before the creation of the FED.

If we need to abolish anything it is Ron Paul's moronic rhetoric. The banking crisis was brought on by 8 years of presidential ineptitude. The FED is partly to blame, but the real blame lies with Ron Paul's party.

[sabrina 1]

45. Forget about Ron Paul. I asked about Sanders and Grayson. And this bill passed

the House with Democratic support also. Something does need to be done about our financial system and if Reid doesn't like this bill, then suggest how to get another bill passed because it looks like this has bi-partisan support right now.

[Blanks]

47. The thread title has Ron Paul in it.

I was talking about Ron Paul. I'm not familiar enough with these senators specific stance on this issue to take a position for or against them.

I hear Ron Paul and FED in the same sentence; I'm agin it. I have confidence that once we are rid of the 'tea party house' our representatives will deal with the FED, but a Ron Paul bill. Nah, toss it on the trash heap.

[sabrina 1]

48. Of course the OP only mentioned Ron Paul.

Very clever, this OP, although not enough to stop most of us from doing our own research.

Because most of us have a little more savvy when it comes to these kinds of OPs on DU and tend to do our own research when the source provides only their OWN opinion.

'These Senators'? Grayson is not a Senator, he is one of the current Democratic candidates for Congress trying to knock out one of the worst Republicans in Florida. He was a member of Congress and one of the best Democrats until the Repubs went after him in 2010.

Sen. Sanders is one of the best and most highly respected Senators on the issues. He is an Independent who supports Democratic principles and caucuses with the Dems.

When these people have something to say about issues, I cannot think of anyone with more credibility in elected office.

[Blanks]

52. I wasn't aware that you were the research hall monitor.

and that I would, by God, do the research you assigned me to do.

My post was a statement specifically about Ron Paul in a thread about Ron Paul sponsored legislation.

I read about Ron Paul and his fixation with the FED on facebook (and i know he has written a book about the FED) because one of my 'facebook friends' is a big Ron Paul supporter.

I apologize that I don't live up to your 'standards of DU research and intellect'. What can I say; I'm a lowly civil engineer living in Arkansas.

I also apologize because not only do I not know what the names are of all US senators, the state that they hail from, who their opponents are in the upcoming election and their positions on proposed banking regulations; I don't expect to know any time soon.

It just isn't what I look into regardless of who is ordering me to do so (unless it's my wife ordering me to look into it). Now that I've been informed of the race in Florida, in such a kind and courteous manner; I do hope that Grayson is successful in his bid for congress.

What can i say; I'm just a sorry person who doesn't care that much for Ron Paul. I just don't think he has the solution to this problem. I'm actually kind of surprised that you disagree with me so vehemently, but that is your right.

[sabrina 1]

54. Put it this way, I have never met anyone on DU who does not know who Bernie Sanders is

or Alan Grayson so forgive me if I assumed you did. Auditing the Fed, while the OP cleverly used Ron Paul to try to make his point, whatever it is this time, someone we are also familiar with here, the OP I mean, Paul is not the only person in Congress who has had serious concerns about the lack of oversight of the Fed and since most if not all of them are Democrats, I don't see where it is rude to point that out in a thread that is meant to divert attention away from that fact. The OP is about the Fed and Oversight, and left out some very important information for some reason.

Sorry if you are upset that I pointed out some of the missing facts from the OP. That was not a surprise, the missing facts in the OP I mean.

It is conceivable that if someone is new to politics, they might not be familiar with Bernie Sanders and/or Alan Grayson.

[Blanks]

58. Just because I don't accept your homework assignments...

...doesn't mean I'm upset, or don't know Bernie Sanders, or that I am new to politics.

As far as I'm concerned the OP contained all of the information that I need.

What I heard was Ron Paul isn't gonna get a feather in his cap before the convention; the minority whip gave a lame reason. However, it is a little more palatable to independents than "pass the president's jobs bill and we'll talk about it".

You're welcome to dig deeper into it if you want to. The fact that I don't really care to dig deeper into it; doesn't make me stupid.

[rhett o rick]

50. We understand your dislike of Paul, but was this a bad bill? nm

[Blanks]

53. I'll admit I don't know anything about the bill.

and I don't like to see political points made by 'not' passing a law.

The issue that I have with Ron Paul's assault on the FED is that any legislation takes a while to have an effect, but passing a law; immediately gives the impression that something was accomplished.

I know Ron Paul wants to go back to a gold or silver standard. I'm opposed to that.

I think that if the republicans can pass a 'FED regulation law' this close to the election; it will look like they're doing something to fix the economy or bring banks under control.

As I said before; it takes a while for the effects of a new law to take effect, but they are getting an immediate political benefit.

They need to pass the presidents jobs bill, and anything else coming out of the republican controlled house needs to be set aside until they've done that.

[limpyhobbler]

28. What are they hiding? The Senate Dems are to close to the big banks to regulate them properly.

[Nye Bevan]

30. Given the maturity and wisdom with which Congress has addressed fiscal and budgetary questions,

surely they have demonstrated that they deserve more influence over monetary policy?

OK there was that tiny little incident where they almost made the US default on its debt, and ended up losing the AAA rating. But it's still worth a try. I mean, what could possibly go wrong?

[rhett o rick]

32. I think the GOP would be happy with the Pres Obama appointees. nm

[rhett o rick]

33. So you are saying that no one should oversee the Fed? Bullshit. Just because Ron Paul said

it doesnt make it wrong.

[sabrina 1]

55. Why do you think he left out all the other people who said it?

Like Bernie Sanders and Alan Grayson and Dennis Kucinich among others. I think most people know the answer to that.

[rhett o rick]

61. Hi Sabrina. I hate to think why. nm

[Bonobo]

65. Logic is irrelevant to many.

Political positions are all that matter.

Like a hermaphroditic earthworm, they contort as they fuck themselves.

[woo me with science]

38. Of course he does. Every fucking day

there is a new one.

"We are screwed."
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10021005390


What predictable garbage this OP is.

[Ian62]

42. Harry Reid

Calls for an audit of the Fed in 1995

&feature=youtu.be

Claims to support Audit the Fed in 2010 to get re-elected
Watch from 6:20

&feature=results_video&playnext=1&list=PLC15A02F56D2EE0F4

The Fed is currently bailing out Europe.
Sending cheap dollars to the ECB from late November 2011.
Nobody knows how much, but it is probably over a $1 trillion dollars by now and Europe is on the verge of collapsing.
Only the ECB knows where it is going.
Should we not have a better idea of what the Fed is doing and how much it is sending to Europe?

Do you not think it is even more important now, than it was in 1995 when Harry Reid argued so FORCEFULLY for auditing the Fed?

[Odin2005]

43. The Libertarians are always spewing anti-Semitic paranoid tin-foil BS about the Fed.

They think its a cabal set up by "Jewish Bankers" to control America.

The Fed is a standard national central bank, nothing more.

[Ian62]

44. The Federal Reserve

is neither Federal, it is entirely privately owned, nor does it have any reserves.

As with any private company, it's activities are directed at maximising profits for it's owners.
The Federal Reserve's owners are principally private banks.

The Federal Reserve does NOT work for US taxpayers and it is not a government agency.
It's activities are backstopped by US taxpayers should things go wrong.

And Harry Reid has now changed his mind and does not even want to increase transparency?

[Odin2005]

46. That's like saying NASA is privately owned.

This is a perfect example of the tin foil BS I'm talking about.

The Fed is a TYPICAL CENTRAL BANK.

[sabrina 1]

49. Bernie Sanders and Grayson are tin foil CTs now too?

This OP knew how to distract from the issue. Where is the OP btw? Seems to have disappeared.

[banned from Kos]

51. Bernie got his piece of the "audit" in Dodd Frank where they revealed all the

loan counterparties from 2008. It was a big Ho-Hum despite all the bank griefers giddy anticipation. It was just a big list of loans and who got them.

What Ron Paul wants is to cripple the Fed by monkeying with interest rates - (the Fed Funds rate, or monetary polict). If Ron Paul could move interest rates up to say, 11% he would throw the economy into a "strong dollar" tailspin and create a huge boon for the wealthy. Ron Paul is the enemy of the middle class debtor folk.


(btw - I won't quit while you a GGW are here. You are both fun posters)

[Odin2005]

56. The Paulbots are against any central bank.

One on the BBC said that he wants to go back to the wildcat banks of the Jacksonian period.

[sabrina 1]

57. 'fun posters'. You mean not easily manipulated so more of a challenge, than say,

the few who resort to the non-thinking, primal scream level at the mere mention of Ron Paul.

Which is why you didn't mention all the others who agree that the Fed is badly in need of oversight.

What Bernie Sanders 'got' was even more proof that the Fed is badly in need of oversight.

The latest bill passed with 89 Democrats supporting it. That's close to half of Congressional Democrats and many of them are the most Progressive Dems.

So the Banks are getting scared, (I know this because YOU are scared) that Congress might be edging closer to taking a look at what they've been up to? Sounds like a good thing to me.

Rep. Conyers among other Demes sponsored the Bill I see. I trust him far more than Bernanke, who is scared to death that we the people are asking to look at what is being done with our money.

[hughee99]

64. They should handle the Fed the same way they handle any other issue...

1- Wait until everything is all F'd up and people are pissed
2- The committee in charge of oversight then holds hearings to try to find out what happened and who can be blamed
3- Obscure the fact that if the committee in charge of overseeing things had been doing their job, we might have addressed the issue BEFORE things got so fucked up.
4- Blame "the system" and pass legislation that will make people THINK they're doing something about the problem. All the better if it actually addresses some issues, but that's not the priority.