Golly, gee. Why do we keep losing?

[Cyrano]

Conservatives have been playing the game of "by any and all means" politics for 40 or 50 years, while we've been playing with ourselves.

They have funded institutions such as the Heritage Foundation, the Federalist Society, and many other "think tanks" to establish their goals, lay out their plans for achieving them, and getting like-minded people into office, from local school boards, to city commissioners, to state officials, on up to the U.S. house and senate. They've succeeded brilliantly.

Control of local and federal courts has always been one of their objectives and, at that level, they are succeeding beyond their wildest dreams. Owning the Supreme Court has been their wet dream forever. Now they've got it.

We Democrats don't think this way. We've always relied on people "doing the right thing," and we've always believed that democracy would somehow, "magically" triumph over any evil that tried to attack it. We've had faith in the innate decency and goodness of human beings, while the enemies of democracy have spun their very effective webs to ensnare the minds of millions.

Well, here we are. We're on the right side of history, morality and humanity. So why are we being crushed? Because we underestimated the enemies of freedom.

They've got a 40 or 50 year head start. We've got a lot of catching up to do and not much time to do it.

If this year's congressional elections are stolen (yes, Republicans steal elections), we're going to need a Plan B pretty damn quick.

[Guy Whitey Corngood]

1. I can't imagine what "Plan B" would even be....... And I'm pretty imaginative. nt

[Wwcd]

2. We're in Plan B right now with midterms.

Plan A was 2016.
Who dropped the fking ball?
We knew all that about the Repubs.


There are only two plans availible to save ourselves.
We wasted plan A on smear campaigns & believing MSM & RU bots.

2016 was Plan A
2018 is Plan B

The ONLY ones anybody should be condemning for 2018 is the Republicans.

Yet....every day, right here on this site we read the opposite and wonder who the fks side are they on.

Vote for Repubs or Vote against Repubs
Vote like its the last vote you'll ever cast.

[Crunchy Frog]

3. Respectfully disagree.

Last edited Tue Jul 10, 2018, 05:53 PM - Edit history (1)

They're nothing if not patient. Had they lost in 2016, they would have blocked and sabotaged as much as they could, and then proceeded once they were finally in power.

One of our side's major failings is not seeing past the next election cycle.

We need our own decades long plan, and I think we're probably too late.

[Cyrano]

11. We're not necessarily too late

I know I'm going to sound like a stupid optimist here, but:

European fascism, and Japanese expansionism, were in full swing for many years before we got drawn into WWII. We were pretty much caught flat-footed. But we caught up pretty damn quick. And then, we rebuilt our previous enemies's countries and brought about, for the most part, a prosperous alliance of democracies that has lasted until now.

At the moment, the outlook is bleak, given Trump, a criminal political party holding all the levers of power, and a Supreme Court that ... well, you know.

Our predecessors fought a world war, literally, a war that was waged on virtually all the continents of this planet. Ex-NBC newsman, Tom Brokaw, wrote a book titled, "The Greatest Generation." This was a generation of Americans that got fucked by the Great Depression, and then had to go out and save the world. And they did.

They were fighting foreign enemies. We are fighting domestic ones and that may be a far more difficult task. (How do you have a "civil war" with no geographical boundaries?) Nonetheless, what would you prefer? A vision of the world that the uber-rich, the Christo-fascists, and the Trumpites have in mind for you? Or a free democracy?

Our "war" may be, in some ways, more difficult than that fought by "The Greatest Generation." It will be a war, not of weapons of death, but of ideas, concepts, ideologies and basic human values. And it's one that we must win.

The alternative is unacceptable.

[FakeNoose]

16. It's their deep pockets, and their extremely low scruples

The GOP can afford to wait as long as necessary, we can't.
They don't care who they have to play ball with to win, and we do care.

I'm not necessarily disagreeing with you, but those are the realities we have to work with.

[KY_EnviroGuy]

38. Agreed. They have access to unlimited funding.

Republican would be nowhere without the billions from corporations and oligarchs over the last 40-50 years that funded the institutions mentioned in the OP. Plus, they have billionaire-funded right-wing media saturating the airwaves and internet nationwide. And, it's international in scope.

........

[Wwcd]

24. I am sick of hearing this excuse.

Had they lost in 2016, they would have blocked and sabotaged as much as they could, and then proceeded once

Wtf does that even tell us.

"Oh well, since they'll block everything anyway..may as well just campaign & vote for somebody other than the one person who warned us every step of the way."

"Its probably a good thing HRC lost cuz she'd have never gotten anything passed anyway"
Oh well..


B.S.
We would have had more with HER than with what we sit here staring in horror at today.

We'd have had an AG, a VP, a SC & abouut 100 Fed judges appointed around the country that weren't hardcore RW.
We would have our Allies.
Women's Rights ARE Human Rights..this too.

[Boomerproud]

46. Her husband (a pretty good politico) couldn't get Fed judges appointed.

Congress, the media and Wall Street barons would have made her life a living hell.

[dbackjon]

39. One of Obama's greatest failings was this

Dismantling the 50-state strategy, picking Democratic Red State Governors for Cabinet positions (If I ever meet him, I want to be like Dorn in Major League - punch him for stealing my governor, then give him a hug).

[Horse with no Name]

50. it's what they did with Obama

much of what he was able to accomplish had to be done through executive order--all of which have been completely undone by trump.

Our mistake was not fully prosecuting all of the republican crimes (starting with Watergate)....looking the other way and generally judging them kindly when they should have been dealt with harshly.

Our Washington pols have overlooked many crimes and given the benefit of the doubt. The repiggies have kidnapped, raped and murdered our better angels. The only lessons they have learned is how to get away with their next heinous crime.

[Squinch]

5. That right there!: "Vote for Repubs or Vote against Repubs." And a vote against Repubs HAS

to be a vote FOR Democrats.

It really is that simple.

[NY_20th]

36. Exactly. We are in plan B right now.

2018 is now the most significant midterms of our lives.

GOTV.

[Hawaii Hiker]

47. The 2018 midterms

are basically a presidential election in terms of their importance.....

[NY_20th]

49. Very much so.

There is so much at stake.

[murielm99]

7. Oh, yeah.

Let's all just bash Democrats on a Democratic website.

[Tarc]

22. Because liberals aren't people with 2 teeth and a wife-beater shirt

listening to Rush in their rusty pickup in the side yard. "Liberal radio", outside of NPR, should never have been a venture invested in. We're a bit more modernized than that.

[CrispyQ]

6. You're right. They have a huge head start.

The GOP funded think tanks to craft their message & bought up radio stations to broadcast it. All the while, the democrats were running as fast as they could from the word liberal because a two-bit actor poked fun at it & the media picked up the ball & ran with it. Once the GOP saw that the dems could be cowered, that they couldn't stand up to a little ridicule, the GOP has been playing them ever since. They've been playing the long game, AND by their rules. The dems have been in reaction mode instead of fight mode. They've dropped the ball so badly I don't know if they can recover.

November is critical. If they don't gain control of at least one chamber, we won't recognize this country in another 2.5 years.

He's not even half way through his term!

[mythology]

8. Or this is melodramatic the sky is falling

ACA still standing, marriage equality is law, don't ask don't tell gone, student loan reform, Lilly Ledbetter, CFPB, the first two travel bans beaten (and the new one is much less shitty), Republicans have spent nearly 2 years and have passed effectively one consequential law, Republicans still have a major demographic issue.

Sorry but the reality is, we're not dead as a party.

[Proud Liberal Dem]

10. +1

I recall that, in 2006, there was talk of a permanent Republican majority. Trump is massively unpopular and divisive. Remember it took six SIX years of George W. Bush for Democrats to sweep in and take over Congress in response to his (mis-)Administration's incompetence and corruption. We are looking at a possible Blue Wave during just the first midterms of Trump's (mysteriously achieved) Presidency. A lot can still go wrong but a lot can go right too.

[standingtall]

12. What is the total number of years Democrats have had the congress sense 94

I think it's like 4 from 2006 to 2010. We can take back the congress in this midterm, but we need to get aggressive and go on the offensive instead doing the same old thing. We have been way to passive the last 30 or 40 years and it is costing us now. The ACA and marriage equality are hanging on by a thread and after republicans get their a Supreme court nominee through we can pretty much kiss them both goodbye.

[Proud Liberal Dem]

13. What do you suggest in terms of being more aggressive?

[standingtall]

15. We need to seriously consider reforming the Supreme court once we get back the White House

the Senate and the congress by stacking the numbers for starters. We cannot sit back wait for a generation or a lifetime for the system to work itself out. We shouldn't just count on shifting demographics to save us when the Supreme Court has some say over which demographics get to vote or have their votes counted.

[Sophia4]

14. For how long will all the good things we have done remain in place?

We need to win this November. The Fascist clock is ticking really fast.

Democrats need to wake up and find their voices.

[AlexSFCA]

23. All of the above can be undone

[Bernardo de La Paz]

40. Yeah some melodrama, but also some points. Never forget Obama is a winner. And Hillary.

So the title of the thread "keep losing" forgets 8 years of history and the fact that Hillary won the election but had the Electoral College stolen.

[dbackjon]

41. ACA is teetering

Marriage equality is only the law because of SCOTUS, which is now in jeopardy.

You are thinking short-term, which is exactly the point of the article.

[Initech]

9. We've been doing the right thing. If only we could get churches to do the right thing.

Churches are the reason why we keep losing. And they've been consistently doing the wrong thing since the Southern Strategy was implemented. If only we could get them to start doing the right thing and kicking these criminals to the curb, then this country might get back on track. It's like they are in an abusive relationship.

[cpamomfromtexas]

51. You are so right! It's EXACTLY like an abusive relationship

[Initech]

53. And it's the churches who are the abusers.

They are the ones who, year after year, trick their congregations into voting against their best interests because, Jesus. We need to kick these abusers to the curb.

[cpamomfromtexas]

56. You are correct. I was abused because they taught that God hates divorce

And my mother didnt have the guts to leave.

[Honeycombe8]

17. Cyrano speaks truth. Reminds me of what Loni Anderson said.

Yes, THAT Loni Anderson. When answering critics of her selling out to get ahead career-wise, by bleaching her hair platinum blonde and emphasizing her bosom, she said, "Well, I was ethnic looking, I was told. With my olive skin, dark eyes, and dark hair. I couldn't get a job. I could have been the best actress that ever was...looking into my bedroom mirror at home. Or I could have bleached my hair and gotten a job. So I got a job."

[Vilis Veritas]

18. the oligarchs began their plan the day we beat the british/corporations

our constitution was strong, but they knew that there would come a time when a reset was needed.

we are talking generational money, plans within plans...

old money has old desires

i feel like crying

the problem is how do we organize and become strong without becoming corrupt in the process as the money required for coordinated endeavors is what ruins peoples souls

[Cyrano]

26. I hear you, Vilis Veritas

It's a problem that has been with us for thousands for years.

How do you fight them without becoming them?

Let me get back to you on that. Some day

[Demsrule86]

30. You vote in every election and don't have purity tests. And you don't primary sitting Democrats whe

you have no power. You go after Republicans with the money and time.

[ancianita]

19. We need the VOTE Plan A and, unify around it and stick to it. No doubts, purity tests. Nada.

[BeyondGeography]

20. The arc of the universe is a pretzel

and it bends all over the place.

[Cary]

21. So many here fail to see the obvious, which is:

THEY WANT US TO BE DEMORALIZED!

That's their plan. It's their only plan.

All we have to do is vote.

[FakeNoose]

45. We're not demoralized, far from it

One of the big problems the Repukes have, is they see this as a zero-sum gain. In order for them to win, we have to lose. If we win something then it means they lost something. That's how Cheeto's brain is wired and he's trained them all to see it this way.

We're smarter than that, and I know you know it!

[Trust Buster]

25. You can take the first stop by NOT respecting these animals by classifying them as conservative.

[Ponietz]

52. I use "Illiberal"

[Caliman73]

27. And what is your plan B Cyrano?

There is always a great deal of hand wringing about how "we" "The Democrats" are weak and behind and all of this, but there are never any suggestions as to what it is going to be that will help us catch up.

We see things like, "We have to beat them at their own game", which is what exactly? A suggestion that we cheat and steal elections? Try to rig the system like they are?


What is the plan then? Millions have marched to protest and we are working to mobilize that into registering and voting to gain seats back at all levels of government. Grass roots efforts like the Parkland students and other groups are trying to mobilize.

The difficulty is that we do no have an overarching goal. The goal of the conservative movement is to have the wealthiest people in charge. that is a straightforward goal. All they need to do is trick the religious fools that the are "doing it for God" and the racist people that they are "doing it for the White people".

We have a very broad coalition of people that we have to rally and band together and we are trying to do that. We do not "magically" think that people will do the right thing. We try to encourage it and get the message out. Sometimes our leaders are not good at that but there are a great many grass roots groups that try.

So, what is the suggestion for plan B?

[Cyrano]

37. If the "Blue Wave" doesn't happen, and if

after the November election, Republicans continue to control the entire congress, the White House, and now, the Supreme Court, we will be well beyond a "slippery slope."

We will be well down a a high-speed fall into fascism.

Were that to happen, I, personally, don't know whether I'd try to get out of the country, or try to find some effective way to oppose the forces of oppression, while trying to survive.

And, yes, I know that there are millions out there, daily, fighting in every way possible, this travesty of a "government." I respect, appreciate and love the idea that they're fighting the good fight.

So all I can say in reply to your question is, what would your plan B be?

[dumbcat]

42. So, that's an "I don't know"?

That’s it?

[Perseus]

28. 'We've always relied on people "doing the right thing"'

That is the problem right there...from "The Art of War"
"It is only one who is thoroughly acquainted with the evils of war that can thoroughly understand the profitable way of carrying it on."

And to continue expecting that republicans will change is a futile exercise. "If you continue to do what you have been doing, don't expect a different outcome."

It is time for democrats to fight hard, I don't mean democrats need to stoop low and become grotesque, but the fight has to be hard, find ways to convince everyone of the evil way of republicans, show through historical data the misdeeds the republicans continually subject the country to, show that their rhetoric is just that, empty lies.

Until democrats don't begin to fight hard the republicans will continue doing what they do, if it works for them, why change the tactic?

[Demsrule86]

29. We have been crushed because the GOP,Trump and the Russians targeted our voters with lies and it

worked...and let's not forget Stein and Sarandon ET AL. Republicans win because they have loyal voters who do not send message votes or believe the parties are the same and value the courts.

[wryter2000]

31. Could it also be

They have bazillions of dollars to fund those think tanks and start Faux News. Until we have that kind of money, we're not going to be able to play the game the way they do. What we do have is lots and lots of people who don't vote. If we can mobilize them, we can fight the bazillions of dollars.

[groundloop]

32. Something that's always overlooked - the right has far deeper pockets than we do

Sadly (and especially after Citizens United) financial resources are a prerequisite for political success. For every wealthy liberal there are 10 wealthy right wingers who are more than happy to invest in buying the government for their personal gain. It's going to take one hell of a groundswell of energized voters to overcome that inherent disadvantage.

[NCTraveler]

33. Bezo's can be a huge force.

As can a number of others.

[Tatiana]

34. Cyrano, I'm right with you. We were discussing this at our Indivisible meeting last week.

People kept asking, after so much progress... how did we let things get so bad? How did we go from someone like Obama to a man history will recognize as America's shame?

You said it in your post. We inherently rely on people to "do the right thing." Which is crazy, because history teaches us that people don't do the right thing. But there you have it.

We take votes for granted because we know voting for Hillary is the right thing and we assume Democrats and independents will just do it.

We don't engage in Congressional sit-ins and protests because it would be rude and uncivil.

We don't leave impeachment ON the table because we're afraid it might offend some people and cause us to lose the 3 dimensional political chess match we've BEEN LOSING FOR DECADES.

The only way to counter this hard-right fascist turn of the Republican party is with a HARD LEFT turn of our own party. Not centrist, polite, proper, dignified rule-following. We need to go big and bold.

These kids get it:



There were people who said... oh what about the people that just wanted to get their groceries? Why does he have to be so disruptive? This kid understands there won't be much of a decent country left for his generation if they don't engage in disrupting the regular order of things.

When our leadership starts behaving like they have nothing to lose (like the Republicans have been playing all along), I think we'll start to see some positive results.

[Tarc]

35. SPLC, ACLU? There are countless liberal and progressive organizations out there

Your premise is rather shaky.

[A HERETIC I AM]

43. "Golly, gee. Why do we keep losing?"....because they have to cheat to win and we don't like to cheat

I probably should have read through this entire thread, but fuckit, I don't want to !


Conservative political ideology has to fucking cheat to win, it is that simple. They have to tell untruths, they convince people to vote against their self interest and they have to make voting as difficult as they can for those that might vote against them. They demonize their opposition and proclaim they are the answer to every problem when in fact, they CREATE the problems.

Why would someone who makes $20 an hour bitch and moan about someone who makes $10 an hour (or 8 or 6 or 5 or whatever)?

Because people who make twenty dollars A FUCKING SECOND have convinced them that the eight buck an hour guy is the one to blame for screwing them.


Conservative political and economic ideology will KILL THE HUMAN RACE, it's that simple., It isn't necessarily the aim, but the fact is that if things continue the way they are headed, the world will be populated by a tiny group of large yacht owning assholes who have literally all the money, and the rest of humanity will be scraping by to merely survive.

This is going to be the result unless something is done.

[BlueSea]

44. Great post...and plan B? We got nuthin'

The analysis in this post is pitch perfect, and assesses our situation very well. "We've always relied on people 'doing the right thing'" - oh so true. It's why we are Democrats: we believe in the triumph of good over bad, of people doing the right thing. Republicans have devolved into the "anything at all costs" party, willing to embrace treason, lying, criminal behavior, threats and violence over goodness.

We will continue to lose, most likely the mid-terms (yes, we will probably lose) because we are playing against cheaters. We are playing against liars who believe that the end justifies the means. Lie, cheat, steal and get your goal, not matter what the cost...just win. Get in power any possible way you can, as long as you get in power.

Bottom line? They will win because they do nothing but lie and cheat their way to the end goal. Goodness just might not win out this time.

[Jakes Progress]

48. Because we are hampered by conscience.

We will always be at a disadvantage because there is nothing - nothing - the republicans will refrain from doing because it is wrong. They will do anything. We won't. We won't rip children from their mothers and put them in cages. We won't take food and medicine from the sick and hungry. We won't use the sick and handicapped as tools.

The republicans do any of these without a twinge.

I can't see how it can be any other way.

[Nitram]

54. The problem is, if you play by their rules we lose the whole shebang.

The ends do not justify the means. The means determine the end. Yes, you can stop being civil, you should stop giving them the benefit of the doubt. Go into int with eyes wide open. But don't violate the constitution, the rule of law, or the ethical rules that a democracy must hold sacred.

[MadDAsHell]

55. Agree. We assume way too much.

When you read some commentaries, I swear some progressives expect 100% of the female vote because of the abortion issue. Yet something like 40% of women are anti-choice.

We expect 100% of the Hispanic vote because of immigration. Yet 30% of the Hispanic vote went to Trump.

We’ve GOT to stop assuming every vote is based on what’s between someone’s legs, or what hue their skin is.

We’ve got to EARN every vote, not assume we’ve already won it because of some demographic characteristic.