Every time an idiot votes Green Party, they're voting for oil, gas, and asbestos

[scheming daemons]

What kind of an idiot takes the time to go vote in a special election and chooses to vote Green Party?

That's a special kind of stupid.

[Squinch]

1. Ah, but the purity in their souls demands they do it! We just don't understand what they go through.

I hate them.

[DemocracyMouse]

12. Being pissed at the Greens is not going to work.

Reach out to them and show them Democrats' current environmental policies. Be honest with them and explain that the Dems have made mistakes in the past, but with Greens joining they can help reform the larger party. Show the Greens the Dems are waking up.

You will turn them away if you act superior.

[Squinch]

21. .

[DemocracyMouse]

27. Also... you play into Putin/troll politics of division.

[Fred Sanders]

31. Why does Putin have to sow discord and division, as two indictments allege (and an arrest

warrant), when Americans do that just fine for themselves - ergo the over the the top and beneath factual attacks on the Green Party?

[gtar100]

40. You are right. Hate just breeds hate.

I understand the frustration and feelings. I vent my frustrations with republicans all the time here. But I can't join in on the hate-fest. Indulging my anger into hate is self-destructive, for me anyway.

[DemocracyMouse]

60. Yes, hate breeds hate. But my point is also this: Dems need to reach out to the Greens...

We need to do some deep listening, discuss, and point out that the Democratic party is trending more environmental (and anti-monopoly/1%) every day. We need the best Green party members in our ranks to increase the brain pool (and the collective voting power.

[DemocracyMouse]

76. Patronizing Greens will get you nowhere.

I used to be one and last time I checked I hadn't lost all my marbles! I have a Master of Science degree from a major university. I've had numerous peer reviewed articles published and my work cited in respected journals and books. So why did people like me become independent and Green voters in the last 30 years? Because the Democrats swerved to the right after Reagan. Now that the Dems have regained their guts, its bringing millions like me back into the system. Believe me, you can still fire up millions more. Reach out. Stop patronizing.

[still_one]

79. The greens are NOT Democrats and do not want to be. In 2000 when the Democrats reached

out to them, Nader completely rejected the Democratic Party, and went out of their way with their false equivalency bullshit, and encouraged their voters to reject both parties

While their defense was that they learned from that experience, I would argue no they didn’t, and 2016 was evidence for that

When the stakes were high in 2000, and even higher in 2016, to reach out to a group who believes in either their way or they will take their marbles and go home, demonstrates that you can’t depend on them, even if the Supreme Court, healthcare, and civil rights etc are at stake

If we have to reach out to explain that to someone who self-identifies as a progressive, they are a lost cause

Every Democrat running for Senate in thos critical swing states lost to the establishment, incumbent, Republican, and those Democrats were progressive by any standard. The 1% who voted Green could have made a difference, but choose not to in spite of being aware that the SC was at stake

[tiredtoo]

41. yes

[Hortensis]

48. No. There are many different things that go into

the sort who'd throw their votes away on the questionable characters in that dysfunctional party, and many different sorts wander in there for whatever reason or no reason beyond a need to belong to something. Whatever, the passion is rejection, not action.

Telling them about the Democratic Party's environmental policies is far more likely to get an ignorant lecture about the evils of GMOs or how the famine in Yemen is a global capitalist conspiracy than conversion. Or a promise to consider, quickly forgotten, from someone who was just grateful for the attention.

You might try bribery. On the whole, these are not among society's higher achievers. The trick would of course be verification. They are also not among society's most dependable, and most have serious problems with honesty and self awareness.

Personally, I think a far better investment would be in taking some feckless but fairly sensible friend to breakfast after a short stop at the polls. Or maybe a post-poll pizza party for as many as you can gather. Our local Democratic Party divisions normally need drivers on election day also.

[mcar]

63. They can't do the research themselves?

Please stop with the threats. "They won't vote Democrat if we don't kowtow to them" is tired and old.

Anyone who would vote Green in that close a race, which everyone with a functioning brain knew was a close race, is too dimwitted or "pure" to care. Or maybe they never will vote D anyway.

They are Republican enablers.

[Squinch]

65. Everyone who comes up with this, "we must understand their souls and gently

lead them to enlightenment," seems to think they are the first who ever thought of it, and if others would just do it, it would totally work.

Where have they been?

[mcar]

66. And they assume that these voters are so shallow

and self-absorbed that a little attention will set them on the right path...

Hmmm.

[Blue_true]

67. Or something rolling around loose in their fucking heads. nt

[Squinch]

68. Maybe hamsters.

[Blue_true]

71. Something, but certainly not a properly working brain. nt

[workinclasszero]

70. That's right

Purity above all until we choke to death in the insane heat and asbestos fibers and coal dust.

But fuck it the greens will die with their precious purity intact.

[DemocracyMouse]

72. Everyone above sounds a lot like the people you're criticizing

[Squinch]

73. Have you ever actually done what you are proposing with a Green voter?

Clearly not, because you don't seem to understand that the vote of the average Green voter has little to do with the environment.

But give it a try and let us know how it goes.

[DemocracyMouse]

75. I used to be a Green voter and an independent.

Last time I checked I hadn't lost all my marbles! I have a Master of Science degree from a major university. I've had numerous peer reviewed articles published and my work cited in respected joirnals and books. So why did people like me become independent and Green voters in the last 30 years? Because the Democrats swerved to the right after Reagan. Now that the Dems have regained their guts, its bringing millions like me back into the system. Believe me, you can still fire up millions more. Reach out. Stop patronizing.

[Squinch]

77. I'll take that as a no and assume you haven't tried it. And you telling others to stop

patronizing is pretty funny.

[Glamrock]

2. The same kind of idiot

that would never vote Democratic party. These are anti-establishment purists who are one step away from being anarchists. Why people here think that if the Green party went away we would get the majority of those votes is beyond me.

[klook]

13. Yep.

Reaching potential Democratic voters who didn't vote would be more productive.

[dalton99a]

16. Absolutely.

[DinahMoeHum]

3. GREEN - Getting Republicans Elected Every November

[dalton99a]

18. No truer words

[TheBlackAdder]

49. I used to think the Green Party became co-opted by Republicans, now I think the Russians own it.

[oasis]

4. 💵Green💵 Party💵Has💵It's 💵Virtues💵If💵You're💵At💵The💵Top💵

💵💵💵💵💵💵💵💵💵💵💵💵💵💵💵💵💵💵💵💵💵💵💵💵💵💵💵💵💵

[Cha]

5. Yep! stein's LIES enabled the Russians to get a Climate

Change Denier and Stupid Racist Fascist Asshole in the wh

[octoberlib]

6. Jill Stein's a fraud

Green Party presidential nominee Jill Stein has largely based her campaign on her uncompromising positions on the environment, opposition to big banks and Wall Street, defense contractors, and the pharmaceutical industry. But an analysis of her financial disclosures, which she was required to file as a presidential candidate, show she is heavily invested in the very industries that she maligns the most and as a result of her investments, she has built significant wealth.


She has made purity a central pillar of her presidential candidacy, and she has held that the Green Party reigns above all others with respect to moral and ethical supremacy. In an interview with CNN last April, she said, “I have long since thrown in the towel on the Democratic and Republican parties because they are really a front group for the 1 percent, for predatory banks, fossil-fuel giants, and war profiteers.”


Stein’s controversial investments include:

Big Carbon. On Oct. 26, 2015, Stein’s campaign sent out a statement calling for Exxon to get the death penalty for its “climate-change fraud.” (it should be noted that Stein has called for the abolition of the death penalty for human beings). She has also repeatedly called for public pension funds to divest from companies in the fossil-fuel industry.

Yet Stein has invested $995,011 to $2.2 million in funds such as the Vanguard 500 fund that maintain significant stakes in Exxon and other energy companies like Chevron, Duke Energy, Conoco Phillips, and Toho Gas, a Japanese company that engages in the sale of natural gas, tar, and coke, a fuel made from coal.

https://www.thedailybeast.com/jill-steins-ideology-says-one-thingher-investment-portfolio-says-another



She also has investments in Big Pharma, the financial industry, and defense contractors. For someone who demands purity , she's not so pure herself.

[debsy]

14. The unfortunate fact of the matter is...

...if you have a 401K through your employer, it is very difficult to divest from the offerings given by the company's fund manager. That's how most of us have our "retirement" packages structured. We really have very little to say about how our money is used. I'm not stumping for Jill Stein or anything - I wish she had bowed out and supported Hillary rather than the dumpster/Putang ticket and RT.

[MrsCoffee]

23. Who is Jill Stein's employer?

I don’t see this as a valid excuse for her.

[Quemado]

51. Putin

Putin

[MrsCoffee]

52. Exactly.

[ehrnst]

7. "Action is for mass salvation and not for the individual's personal salvation."

He who sacrifices the mass good for his personal conscience has a peculiar conception of “personal salvation,” he doesn’t care enough for people to be “corrupted” for them." -Saul Alinsky

[beachbum bob]

8. 3rd party, especially green party really don't care about the the destruction their votes cause,

they are the essence of evil in that they know what will happen and still do it

[Nitram]

26. That's right. Just ask Ralph Nader.

[Fred Sanders]

34. Not being one of the two major parties is "the essence of evil"?

Essence wants its' definition back.

Don't facts have a liberal bias, or is that not a thing anymore?

[dembotoz]

9. Does the gop feel the same way about libertarian clowns

Third party is only bad if they draw votes from ur candidate???

[scheming daemons]

38. There was no libertarian candidate in Ohio 12

And yes, the GOP feels the same way about Libertarians as we do about Greens.

[dembotoz]

39. greens are just part of the process...like cleaning a litter box is part of having a cat

you hate it but you like the cat

[Kurt V.]

10. a 242 year old argument

about the excess of democracy

[Adrahil]

56. It's not about the "excess of democracy"

It's about an absolute failure of reason in recognizing the consequences of certain actions within our electoral system.

[Kurt V.]

74. my reference to 1776 was too cryptic I'm afraid.

Hamilton's argument about an excess of democracy is what you've described.

[NurseJackie]

11. But... but... THE REVOLUTION... or something.

FUCK SUSAN SARANDON!

[dalton99a]

19. Fucking idiot

[DinahMoeHum]

32. Planet Schmanet, Janet.

n/t

[lancelyons]

15. I personally think this is a GOP ploy

The entire Green Party is another attempt to take votes away from Democrats. Maybe we should do the same thing. Run a Candidate as a libertarian.

If the GOP will do this underhanded ruthless tactic (see Scott Taylor in VA) then we should fight back. Stop being so nice.

[NCTraveler]

17. The GP is not what it onece was.

I fully believe the Democratic Party would be more conservative in nature if it weren’t for the GP of decades past.

The GP of today is garbage.

[The Wizard]

20. The Greens are funded by Russia

The Greens, the Russians and the Republicans are working hand in hand to destroy democracy. The next fool to tell me they're voting green will get a Jersey style verbal blast. And it won't be the first time I "ripped one of these fools a new asshole" (That's Jersey style for excoriating).

[Magoo48]

22. Perhaps,

if we Democrats were more willing to include green and further left ideals we would envelope more of these outliers. If the “centerists” and corporate friendly must be included, so must the other end of the spectrum.

[Squinch]

24. What "further left" ideal would you like to see that is not included in our platform?

[Magoo48]

81. Well, this one comes to mind off the top...

A strong push with a definitive outline to create smaller, latterly structured, bodys’ politic, with real power, to influence policy and implement change within small individual communities. This would necessitate new division and redistribution models of in-place, ancient centralized funding apparatuses on federal, state, county, city, and community levels. Ideas like this are often passed around for discussion where groups of concerned young folks are gathered. Although, I’m 70-years-old, I find them quite exciting....

[Squinch]

82. That is stucture. That is not policy. What policy do you want to see changed that is not

addressed in the platform?

Also, a bunch of committees running their own shows at the local level - because let's face it, that's what you are talking about, though you do seem to need to wildly over-complicate your verbiage - isn't very likely to be a practical approach for a political party.

[Magoo48]

83. Easy enough to simply, give it a name , make it a plank.

[Squinch]

84. Why? It's a silly idea. And frankly, that's not what young people talk about when

they get together to talk about politics. I don't know where you trotted it out from or why, but it doesn't make your case. I suspect you thought its convoluted verbiage would seem intelligent and shut up any opposition, but it's really just nonsense.

And you still haven't come up with any policy that you would like to see that isn't in our platform, so why not just admit that there is none, and your demand that we listen to people "further left" is just a knee jerk demand and it is not based on any lack in our platform?

[LiberalLovinLug]

33. The voice of reason. Thanks

This seething vitriol against a party that believes in environmental protection and reigning in of big money influence.... But just a little TOO much, is misdirected.
Will the GOP and Russia use the Greens to split the liberal vote? Is water wet?

But it's the height of stupidity to help the GOP widen that rift, by spending time demonizing those with much the same values only more extreme and/or frustrated with lack of progress instead of simply reaching out and also help promote action on those issues by the Democratic party

[ehrnst]

25. The Hoarse Whisperer said it best

Link to tweet

If you want people to think you’re a little selfish, take up two parking spaces at the mall.

If you want people to think you’re unbearably, mind-numbingly selfish, vote Green Party in a close election.

[mcar]

64. This!

[ejbr]

28. Now THIS

is how you attract people to your cause! Well done.

[charlyvi]

44. Charlotte Clymer encapsulates my thoughts about this.

Link to tweet

[ejbr]

47. And those voting Green

will still say “whatever”

[charlyvi]

53. That is the problem I have with them.

Catastrophe to them is "whatever". Practical politics is "whatever". Splitting the vote is "whatever". Their nonchalance about the real pain experienced by real people in the real world while they dither about who is pure enough to represent them is staggeringly short sighted, not to mention arrogant and self centered. If their my way or the highway approach to politics actually worked, Greens would be in office throughout the Republic, but they aren't and they lay the blame for this failure at everyone's feet but their own. They are indeed a vanity party that will tell you that you're holding the hose wrong as you work your ass off to put out the fire. Full of sound and fury, signifying nothing.

[ejbr]

58. Oh well

It’s a democracy and they get to vote how they want. They’ve experienced the same Trump and Republican Congress as we have and still they are not inspired to vote for the Democrats.

All I believe/know is that castigating people for exercising their rights as they see fit will not encourage them to change. Another tactic may work, but I don’t see how attacking them does.

[charlyvi]

61. "Oh Well"

You illustrate my point perfectly.

[LanternWaste]

57. Hence, "attracting them to your cause" is an exercise in absurdity.

And criticizing anyone for not attracting them would be even more absurd... despite our own desire to call it "well done."

[ejbr]

59. Then we agree

That you are just venting and not actually trying to affect change. That’s good.

[SCVDem]

29. When you see dump rescind so many enviromental laws.....

Thank a Green!

Democrats are the party of better living.

Don't be nice to a green. Tell them to suck on dumps tailpipe, now with added pollution!

[Sancho]

30. The greens have been hijacked by the Russians...just like the NRA

[Gothmog]

35. The Greenies gavie us W and Trump

[dalton99a]

43. Never forget.

[Cassidy]

36. I understand your frustration, but denigrating and insulting people won't help.

2016 population of Ohio CD12 758,600
Assuming half are adults eligible to vote, that means 379,300

Current results rounded to nearest hundred:
Balderson (R) - 101,600
O'Connor (D) - 99,800
Manchik (G) - 1,100

Total voters in Ohio CD12 special election = 202,500

379,300 - 202,500 = 176,800
So maybe half of eligible people voted. And there were 160 times as many non-voters as there were Green voters.
In U.S. elections, the non-voters are usually the most powerful party.

Neither the Greens, nor anyone else will be convinced by being yelled at.

Knocking on doors and sharing personal truth is hard work, but it works best at convincing people to vote. We need to put our energy there.

[DownriverDem]

37. Ignorant for sure

No matter how many times we tell folks not to vote 3rd party, some still don't get it. We are a two party system. If you vote 3rd party, you are just helping the party you really don't want to win. Just ask H W Bush how he feels about Ross Perot?

[jalan48]

42. I'm more concerned about the millions of registered Democrats who don't even bother to vote.

The question we should be asking is why isn't our message reaching them? These are the folks we should be worrying about, not the extremely small percentage that votes third party.

[SharonClark]

46. Agree 100%

[Ezior]

54. If they need a message to reach them before they bother to vote, they don't understand democracy eom

[jalan48]

55. Great message to the voters, I wonder why it may not be effective.

[SharonClark]

45. Forget the Greens - concentrate on getting Dems to the polls.

[Squinch]

50. This.

[mcar]

62. K&R!

[VOX]

69. As long as it doesn't drip directly on those "pure" votes...

Then their “shopping choice” was THE best, right there in the basket with the arugula and tofu.

[Wwcd]

78. Maybe Stein has shares in asbestos since RU is the only supplier to the US.

Maybe that was why she sat at Putin's table.

Asbestos!

How do we find out if Jill Stein holds investments in asbestos?

Know your enemy...

https://www.democraticunderground.com/1016213131

Russia is the Only Country That Exports Asbestos to the US

Guess who just loves Trump more today than yesterday?
https://www.google.com/amp/s/qz.com/1351489/trumps-asbestos-move-thrills-one-russian-company/amp/

[Doodley]

80. "They're voting for oil, gas, and asbestos." Comment:

The oil is the snake oil that Trump has been selling his whole life. He says it is of high value, but those who taste it soon learn that it is worthless.


The gas is from the bullshit that comes out of the old gasbag's mouth. It is foul. It is putrid. It is hateful. It is nothing but the demented ramblings of a bigot with an ego the size of Russia--a bigot who doesn't know how stupid he is.


And the asbestos is the toxic irritant that causes a cancer on society. It is something that should be banned, but because it is so insidious and destructive, he will fight for it until his last breath.