General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsHas anyone in DU actually read 'Atlas Shrugged' by Ayn Rand?
Just wondering. It's discussed so much but I'm the only one I know who's read it from cover to cover. It was required reading for some Econ class I took decades ago.
once a decade, I'll see a "who is John Galt" bumber sticker.
71 votes, 0 passes | Time left: Unlimited | |
Yes, I've read it from cover to cover | |
30 (42%) |
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kinda read it, skipped over the long boring speeches | |
11 (15%) |
|
skimmed it | |
1 (1%) |
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haven't read it but aware of the contents | |
9 (13%) |
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haven't read it at all | |
15 (21%) |
|
Other | |
2 (3%) |
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haven't read 'Atlas Shrugged' but read 'the fountainhead' or other Rand book | |
3 (4%) |
|
0 DU members did not wish to select any of the options provided. | |
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Xipe Totec
(44,072 posts)Outgrew it by the time I graduated.
Hoyt
(54,770 posts)except as a reminder of what the greedy are like.
Xipe Totec
(44,072 posts)She was (is) an architect, so she identified with the main character, Howard Roark, personally.
I was (is) left of center. So we clashed.
She's turned out to be a very nice human being, now that we've bumped int each other again after all these years.
I haven't asked her how she feels about the book now.
Perhaps I should.
Warpy
(113,131 posts)Outgrew it probably 20 pages in.
datasuspect
(26,591 posts)the same reason i don't read trade paperbacks.
nothing useful to obtain.
Liberal_in_LA
(44,397 posts)being familiar with the Bible even though one isn't religious.
datasuspect
(26,591 posts)and having ammunition/understanding to be better "philosophically" grounded in having arguments with morons doesn't fall into any priority category.
put it like this, the only useful thing to be obtained from reading Ayn Rand is to understand where vile, stupid people are coming from.
there's no payoff in it.
you can't reason with them. there is no conversation to be had. they need to be marginalized the way buckley and mainstream conservatives used to marginalize them.
again, it's the same reason why i don't read romance novels: i have virtually nothing in common with people who read these books.
mrs_p
(3,078 posts)who reads romance novels, including a number of hardcore scientists I know. I (also a scientist) even pick up one or two a year. After being immersed in journal articles and experiments all day, sometimes it helps to unwind the exhausted mind before bed.
Not that you should read them, just that I bet you have more in common with other people than you think.
Hoyt
(54,770 posts)Shankapotomus
(4,840 posts)I've read most of Ayn Rand's titles as well as works about her (being a voracious reader through most of my 20's) and I feel better equipped to counter Objectivist philosophy in a debate than maybe I would have been otherwise. Part of the perniciousness of Objectivist philosophy is that it can throw people off balance who have never encountered it before because it makes these weird pronouncements (like selfishness is a virtue) and its practitioners emit this false, pseudo confidence. One of Objectivisms' first founders, Barbara Branden (who was later excommunicated), touched upon this in her autobiography about the Ayn Rand cult.
ProudToBeBlueInRhody
(16,399 posts)Sex and violence....shit happens. Unlike Atlas Passed Gas.
gkhouston
(21,642 posts)I took my opinion of the recommenders into account and somehow never found the time to read any of Rand's work.
catbyte
(35,856 posts)It sucked. Hard. I grew up tribal so Rand's social Darwinism was an alien and completely repulsive world view. But they say mine is an inferior culture so what do I matter?
Diane
Anishinaabe in MI
OriginalGeek
(12,132 posts)I don't remember it being terrible as far as stories go but hindsight being better educated I see now what a crock it was. I flirted with being a Libertarian when I was in my teens but I got better.
trof
(54,273 posts)I was in college and read ANYTHING.
OriginalGeek
(12,132 posts)I am probably lucky in that I've forgotten a lot of what I read back then.
kestrel91316
(51,666 posts)and never could. I eventually decided it was dreck.
xmas74
(29,777 posts)It was also for preparation for an essay contest where the winner was awarded a college scholarship. In the end, I opted out of the contest. I couldn't find an original thought to write an essay about that didn't bash the book.
cbayer
(146,218 posts)Reread it as an adult and had a totally different take.
Response to cbayer (Reply #8)
seaglass This message was self-deleted by its author.
tibbiit
(1,601 posts)I read them all, Hesse, Casteneda, Rand, and had friends who were the above too. Are you me? lol I loved all those books then (1970's). Havent reread them but I dont feel the need.
they were for the past when I was young.
tib
Walk away
(9,494 posts)And everything Swedenborg ever wrote!!! I even went to Swedenborg's church on Riverside Ave when I was a teenager.
Panasonic
(2,921 posts)it made for a very interesting read.
I must download it again to read it.
cbayer
(146,218 posts)I also read all kinds of things and was open to just about anything.
Don't regret it one bit and should probably do more of it now.
cilla4progress
(25,958 posts)I read Shrugged, Fountainhead, and I think Anthem, in high school. My grrrl group was into them. This was circa 1970.
I found that I adopted Rand's philosophy to maximize my talents, "be all I can be," while not having it turn me libertarian or cold-hearted toward others. Was raised by very liberal - almost socialist - parents, so maybe it balanced out.
Or maybe I didn't "get" Rand as much as I might have!
dogknob
(2,431 posts)Then I noticed puberty had ended.
cbayer
(146,218 posts)seduced me.
It was late 60's and there weren't that many role models.
I read them as pure fiction, never really getting the *big message*, but I think for adolescents, the idea of absolute selfishness has a lot of appeal.
The Velveteen Ocelot
(121,130 posts)but it was so boring and badly written that I gave up before I got very far.
Skittles
(159,655 posts)I thought it was garbage
madamesilverspurs
(16,058 posts)Tried in the 1970s so that I could converse with SIL who was in a Rand book club. Really don't remember any details, just that it was tediously strained and boring. Never found any reason to try again. Tom Robbins' books, on the other hand. . .
-
hifiguy
(33,688 posts)got through about 200 pages and couldn't stand anymore. That is not writing, it's barely typing.
Lone_Star_Dem
(28,158 posts)I have read a cliff notes type version. It was all I could get through.
I should retry it again, since it's so often mentioned. It's just value my reading time. It's when I feed my brain and imagination, not when I poison it.
hay rick
(8,244 posts)Anything that badly written can not possibly be interesting or important.
Heddi
(18,312 posts)Not because I'm necessarily interested in the book, but because it's one of "those" books that people always talk about, good or bad. God help me, he knows I've tried, but I just can't get into it. It still sits on my shelf...it's great for those times where I have insomnia. I get about 15 pages in and zzzzzzzz
riverbendviewgal
(4,322 posts)about 30 years ago....The last one was the virtue of selfishness.. I had to read what
some people were talking about....Not my way of thinking but you know in the Art of War
you got to know they way others who don't think like you think like.
My own mother (born to shop) told me I was weird because I used to go to my room and read.
Reading gave me the keys to doors that lead to many ideas and people and countries.
One of those forever embedded memories I have is at 8 years old walking up the steps of the library.
My father read the sports pages and my mother read the ads. I grew up in the USA.
Liberal_in_LA
(44,397 posts)Walk away
(9,494 posts)Hoyt
(54,770 posts)frazzled
(18,402 posts)Can't even remember it. One grows out of that kind of thing.
MrSlayer
(22,143 posts)And I'm pretty well read. For some reason it never crossed my radar. I have no intention to read it now.
dipsydoodle
(42,239 posts)Progressive dog
(7,245 posts)Also read 'The Fountainhead' and 'The Virtue of Selfishness'. Thought that I would learn something since several friends claimed Rand was a great author. Fantasies from a sick mind.
Retrograde
(10,685 posts)I was in high school, and still young and foolish. Also read The Fountainhead. I don't remember much of the details of either.
lunatica
(53,410 posts)Boring piece of crap that made no sense and had the driest, dreariest characters imaginable. Not a bit interesting. Why anyone would think there's some vastly brilliant message there is a real puzzle to me.
Curtland1015
(4,404 posts)...and I do not give up on books.
But this one was bad. Just dreary, long winded garbage. Ugh.
krispos42
(49,445 posts)Liberal_in_LA
(44,397 posts)Scootaloo
(25,699 posts)End of the year report, we drew book titles out of a hat.
I got Atlas Shrugged. I remember little of what was in it, only that reading it was like eating a sandwich made of cardboard.
Faygo Kid
(21,484 posts)That's what we are facing.
bluestateguy
(44,173 posts)I have to like a book a lot to read something that long.
TexasTowelie
(117,079 posts)and there is no way that I would even think about reading that garbage.
gordianot
(15,525 posts)Butterbean
(1,014 posts)patrice
(47,992 posts)offensively poor writing, un-readable.
sendero
(28,552 posts)... "You are Not John Galt" bumper sticker better.
Downwinder
(12,869 posts)and never considered it anything more.
Speck Tater
(10,618 posts)Then I grew up.
unblock
(54,174 posts)why would i want to suffer through some crap like that?
give a man a fish and he'll eat for a day.
teach a man to fish and he'll eat for a lifetime.
tell a man true love requires me to tell you to fuck off and he'll magically figure out how to fish for himself and voila, you're a randian superhero.
yippee.
Journeyman
(15,151 posts)It was interesting, I imagine especially so from the perspective of a 'true believer.' There was one passage in particular, on the nature of money and its varied uses which I found somewhat enlightening, though not compelling enough to remember. On the whole, however, I found it both pedantic and idiosyncratic, a paean to selfishness much at odds with my personal philosophies.
I abandoned it when classes began. I was at most a quarter hour from finishing, but there were more important topics in which to immerse myself. And frankly, I didn't care how it ended.
graywarrior
(59,440 posts)I forced my way through it. I hated it--it made no sense to me. Of course, I was a stoner and a drunk back then.
MrMickeysMom
(20,453 posts)proud patriot
(101,169 posts)on her and her beliefs
Mutt22
(76 posts)I found it too tediously boring. I found some other books that I actually wanted to read, gave "Atlas Shrugged" to a friend and never looked back.
sammytko
(2,480 posts)The one book I can read over and over again is " Grapes of Wrath".
One of my fav authors. But for me, it is East of Eden.
MyshkinCommaPrince
(611 posts)Every single dreary, miserable one of them, fiction and non-fiction. And believed them, with all the desperation of someone using an ideology to escape from an emotionally unacceptable reality.
Thankfully I was just a dumb kid. I could still grow past it. I got over it, I got better. I guess not everyone who goes through the Randroid phase is so lucky.
eyeofnewt
(146 posts)Took a couple of years of philosophy and read all of Rand's writings. Atlas shrugged is the only one I remember well - wasn't influenced by Objectivism - but I do like knowing about it: man's moral purpose being his own happiness - to me explains a lot of how repubs/Tbaggers think, explains their real lack of compassion
flamingdem
(39,936 posts).. it's good for a laugh however, lots of laughs in fact
Tom Ripley
(4,945 posts)RZM
(8,556 posts)Thankfully 'Anthem' is very short.
klook
(12,898 posts)after he read this book. That was enough to make me steer clear.
Warren DeMontague
(80,708 posts)Starry Messenger
(32,375 posts)Shankapotomus
(4,840 posts)Guy Whitey Corngood
(26,748 posts)in 5 seconds.
HereSince1628
(36,063 posts)I generally enjoyed my brother's textbooks...not so with that one...after 1500 words or so and as many trips to the dictionary, I gave up.
thelordofhell
(4,569 posts)PDJane
(10,103 posts)I think I managed the first chapter, five pages in the middle, and two at the end. I found nothing redeeming in any of it.
zbdent
(35,392 posts)LeftishBrit
(41,306 posts)To be honest, I think I learned about the book from DU!
ellenfl
(8,660 posts)Liberal_in_LA
(44,397 posts)Rain Mcloud
(812 posts)Atlas Shrugged or Citizen Of The Galaxy.
Having recently discovered the magic of R.A.Heinlein,I read Troopers and returned Atlas Shrugged after the first paragraph.
Then I rechecked out Troopers and read it again and again then Stranger In A Strange Land,i was smitten,you might say my first love.
Sorry Ginny.
After hearing the report on Atlas Shrugged,i knew i made the right call.
Ayn Rand's book reminded me of some weird offshoot of socialism where richest get all the spoils and the poor kill each other to get to the head of the bread line and the bitch denigrates the poor for being poor as deviant crumb snatchers as in Les Miserable'.
Fuck that Bitch!
I remember acting out parts and making Armored Combat Suit noises during my presentation,i got an A+ for exuberance and not so much for the text as i was writing with a trembling hand and waiting for the day when I could sign up to go fight on Klendathu.
Later in High School,i was accepted into the Marine Corps and it was the proudest day of my life.
That night,i waited with pounding heart and baited breath for my dad to return home from work so I could tell him the good news.
He said,'We need to go outside and talk' and he punched me in the nose.
He said 'no son of mine is going to serve in the military and go overseas to die for some raghead in afghanistan'.
I was bitterly confused at his reaction and heart broken,i needed him to be proud of me since i was a failure at math and violin and carpentry and he was displeased at my hot rods and guitars and girlfriends and drinking,i thought he would understand.
I remember every time he would talk about his service with Gen. McArthur twice in Phillipines and the Guadal Canal and Papua New Gunea and many more retaking islands and building runways,i thought my dad was Rudyard Kipling.
He continued that when he got home from the war things had changed for the worse,where once he was a hero now he was just a wood butcher and everything he did counted for nothing.
The Korean War,he felt was McArthur's attempt at an American Imperialist Renaissance with Douglas as the Supreme Commander of the World,McCarthy was re-instating the Red Scare where dad's friends in Hollywood were accused of communistic activities when in fact they were pacifist's and more apt to follow Ghandi,Eisenhower was derided openly for his views on the military and the para-military industrial combine and ridiculed for improving the highways and canals.
He told me that no son of his would ever give his life for silk pantied elitest's who were afraid of their own shadows but whom would gladly send anyone else's kids to go and die with inferior gummed up,50 year old weapons and ammunition from the lowest bid contractor for the upper-crust's to become even richer by using American children's blood to open up new markets.
That day,right there was the proudest day of my life until my son was born.
That was the day that my dad for the first time told me that he loved me and that:"Today,You are a Man,My Son."
From there I knew that I wanted to be a father,not just like my father.
mia
(8,420 posts)I learned so much from your sharing of these experiences with your father.
Blue_In_AK
(46,436 posts)I'm not too proud to admit it.
edit to add...It was many years ago.
sendero
(28,552 posts).... to know I fundamentally disagree with it's premise.
I'll pass on anything written by the twisted Ayn Rand.
treestar
(82,383 posts)It has a certain internal logic. But then one realizes there is nothing in human nature that would allow the world she claimed she wanted. People will have compassion. We can't make that into a vice, as she wanted to.
MadrasT
(7,237 posts)Thoroughly enjoyed them.
Doesn't mean I think it's a blueprint for how life should be.
Yavin4
(36,489 posts)Amazing how awful fiction writers have so much influence on people.
Never doubt the power of the pen.
malthaussen
(17,711 posts)... but I couldn't even finish it. Never was moved to try any of her other stuff. I am amazed at the extent of her following.
-- Mal
byeya
(2,842 posts)A HERETIC I AM
(24,592 posts)and devoured it, so to speak. I was young and idealistic. I thought it had a lot of good ideas at the time and still do, (very narrowly) but for the most part, "Objectivism" is a flawed philosophy.
Started reading "Atlas Shrugged" but after 25 or so pages, found it so damned tedious as to be boring as bugger all.
So it collects dust to this day.
Proles
(466 posts)Ayn Rand novels.
Honestly, as much as I would "like" to understand the mindset of the right-wingers, I just don't think I could bear the tedium of actually reading hundreds of page of poorly written drivel. It's not even the ideology... it's just not a very good read.
I've read the synopsis and excerpts, so I believe I have a sufficient understanding of what it's about. The heroic "builders" of society clinging to dear life as moochers and looters (given cartoonish names and personalities), try to take everything away from them. It's basically a fantasy world with make believe protagonists, who have absolutely no flaws... they may as well be Gods. Not to mention no children in it either... hmm, I guess because they're weak -- but the book wouldn't be as popular if it was filled with helpless children clinging to survival at the expense of the wealthy.
Tom Ripley
(4,945 posts)I first read "We The Living" and thought it was an okay attempt at a Russian novel,
Then I read "Atlas Shrugged" and "The Fountainhead" and decided that she was just not a very writer. At the time I was more offended aesthetically than morally.
Kalidurga
(14,177 posts)I read about 10 pages maybe 100's no really it was probably just over 10 pages or so. It was the worst drek I have ever read. It's sort of the Shades of Grey for conservatives and libertarians. I hated it passionately. I have never thrown a book across the room, but in a rage after being numbed from the neck up I mustered up enough strength to heave the book across the room.
This was before I knew anything about the book other than people said it was a very good book and a classic. Well I generally like reading classics. Classics are often very good books with an uplifting message or a profound warning. Perhaps this book falls in the later category, that if you are a selfish prick, odious books like Atlas Shrugged with appeal to you.
SidDithers
(44,273 posts)Sid
LadyHawkAZ
(6,199 posts)just to understand the controversy. Once was enough, though.
eShirl
(18,816 posts)from the local video arcade owner (who was also a former police/ undercover narc)
I think I tried a couple times to read it, but it was so gawd-offal I gnawed off my eyeballs after a few pages
Generic Brad
(14,374 posts)How it has appeal to anyone who is not ultra-wealthy is beyond me.
ismnotwasm
(42,474 posts)Irritating dribble, but I read it
stevenleser
(32,886 posts)Vidar
(18,335 posts)(heavenly), followed by a year in Texas ( pure hell) showed me the error of my ways.
vaberella
(24,634 posts)I had issues with the book. The idea of the We as being zombie-like was super prevalent. It was a romance novel though with the ideas of the We versus the I. Basically individual prowess over socialist or communistic thoughts. Sad thing is...without the we the I could never be successful.
I read the book so much I even read the edits and had subscribed to the Rand newsletter.
McCamy Taylor
(19,240 posts)w8liftinglady
(23,278 posts)fortunately,I got over that.
I tried so hard to get worked up about John Galt...but it was a pathetic self-biography.
Poll_Blind
(23,864 posts)After reading other material about Rand and watching interviews with her, I already knew more than enough, IMO.
PB
Brigid
(17,621 posts)Read "The Fountainhead" too. Godawful stuff.
pansypoo53219
(21,758 posts)i have read trash, the dictionary + extra dry, but A S was TOO AWFUL., but then i was over 10 yrs old.
KT2000
(20,879 posts)by some Randian cult members to join their ranks. Listened to some of the Nathaniel Branden tapes at their behest. Found them people cold, heartless and mean. Found Branden to be a smug ass. All they really want is to feel superior to everyone else on earth and make others suffer because that confirms their feelings of inferior beings.
Can't wait to see the religious right justify this one.
Panasonic
(2,921 posts)when I can read the same thing that involves orcs - the Hobbit.
Tansy_Gold
(18,056 posts)burrowowl
(18,047 posts)Aweful style to go along with lousy content
Zorra
(27,670 posts)that I gave up.
What an absolutely awful excuse for a novel.
Marr
(20,317 posts)You'll get the point before you're out of the preface.
It's just a horribly written, piece of shit book. One character has a monologue that's... I think it's 40-some pages...? Truly ridiculous, self-indulgent garbage.
AnnieBW
(11,289 posts)It was so poorly written that I wound up throwing it across my dorm room.
eShirl
(18,816 posts)Liberal_in_LA
(44,397 posts)would be in freeperland.
HappyMe
(20,277 posts)way back in high school. Just awful, boring tripe. A couple of months ago I was at the library and plowed through 10 pages. Again, awful, boring tripe.
hobbit709
(41,694 posts)Only book that ever did that to me. It made reading Marx exciting.