George H. W. Bush, thank you for your service.

[cornball 24]

[gopiscrap]

1. fuck that

he was knee deep involved in the Iran-Contra-gate scandal, the Keating 5, mining of the harbours of Central American nations, the racist Willie Horton ad, numerous corrupt financial issues, fondling of women and quite probably the Kennedy assassination. May the worms eat his ugly maggot face and may he rot in hell.

[guillaumeb]

3. This sounds a bit harsh,

but reality can be that way.

The US corporate media will be filled with nonsense about what a wonderful father he was and totally ignore the great harm that he did.

[gopiscrap]

5. exactly

[question everything]

9. Would you have done better? Have you tried to run for office?

Why can't you let the man rest in peace?

[edhopper]

11. Yes I could have

I wouln't have given arms to Iran or invaded Iraq. I would have understood the problems of the middle class. I wouldn't have campaigned on making people afraid of the bad black man. Should I go on?

And compared to his idiot son I woulld have looked like Roosevelt.

[gopiscrap]

22. yes I ran for US Congress from the left

[question everything]

24. Thank you. Too often people just sit at their keyboard

passing judgment. So I am glad that you put your boots where your mouth was, is.

[gopiscrap]

25. it was a wild campaign our dino rep

kept on voting for funding for the School of the America's finally after Jesuits were killed in El Salvador we decided to run some one against him if he wouldn't quit for voting for funding. I got 42% of the vote, and right after the election he quit voting for that funding. I also won an electoral yard sign at the State Supreme Court level that is used even today as part of case law on that issue. It is Collier-vs-Tacoma 1993

[dflprincess]

29. The damage he did continues even though he is gone

There are asylum seekers at our southern border today because of the harm Reagan and Bush policies did to their countries.

Gloating about his death is wrong but it is also wrong to ignore history. If a person was rotten in life, death does not change that nor does it make them above criticism.

[m-lekktor]

12. exactly.

[cwydro]

13. We can always count on you.

In times like this.

[guillaumeb]

2. What I wrote:

George H. W. Bush has died.
It is appropriate to feel sympathy for the family's loss. And he was a President.

But in all of what will be endless recounting of his WW II service, it is good to remember the entire reality of the man.

First, while a candidate in 1980, he called supply side economic theory voodoo economics. But after he was picked by Reagan, or Reagan's handlers, for the job of Vice President, he supported the concept that he had called voodoo economics. And he said nothing when Reagan played the race card in his campaign.

So he was a political opportunist who supported something that he knew was a bad idea, but an idea that profited his family at the expense of the 99%.

And during the campaign, he committed treason by dealing with the Iranian Government to keep Americans hostage so Reagan could win.

And during his own campaign for President, one of his advisers, Lee Atwater, devised the Willie Horton ad, a shameful bit of racist hate that was a direct appeal to racist voters.

So to me, Bush Sr. was simply one more racist, lying, GOP rich man.

https://www.democraticunderground.com/100211497619

[cornball 24]

4. Clarification. Thank you for your service in WW II.

[Awsi Dooger]

6. I only watched a minute or two of the related programming

But it was infinitely preferable to what was being posted here, and what continues to be posted here.

[Coventina]

7. There were millions who served in WW2 bravely who didn't abandon their buddies. n/t

[cwydro]

14. He abandoned his buddies?

Clarification?

[Coventina]

16. He was the only one who managed to escape his plane.

He didn't follow the escape procedures that had been practiced, and if he had, all three would have had a better chance to have survived.

[Coventina]

19. All I said, was that many heros didn't abandon their buddies. He did.

And I have "looked it up."

I seem to take up a lot of space in your head.

I can't help but wonder why?

[cwydro]

20. Why did he get the Distinguished Flying Cross Coventina?

Why do you have such hate for him?

My uncle served in WWII, and your posts are completely devoid of knowledge. Both my parents survived the bombing in England. They’d be sickened by your judgemental posts.

I sense envy, and many other things. See ya. You’ll be the first in all my years to go on the ignore list.

A shame really, since I’ll not get to hear more stories of your bravery lol. Nah, I won’t link, but I remember well... if the shit hit the fan, I’d be happy to have hw by my side...thinking you’d be looking for a place to hide.

[Coventina]

21. Um...OK

I've explained my issues with HW with you in several threads, so I don't know what more I can say to explain why I think the guy was scum.

My family fought in WWII as well, my Grandfather was at Pearl Harbor. Don't know what that has to do with anything, really.

As for the rest,

OK bye!



edit: dumb typo

[BannonsLiver]

26. +1

When folks go the completely irrational route you just gotta put them on mute. Not unlike one would a Trumpian deplorable.

[GulfCoast66]

27. What bullshit.

Escape procedures!

My uncle flew tail gunner on an Avenger. He was my hero and in his later years showed me all his photos, awards and opened up to me about his service and how bad it was. He told me that if his plane had been hit the pilot would have been the only member of the crew to make it out. He did not even bother with his parachute. It was difficult getting into his position as it was for the turret gunner and navigator. Getting out of a burning plane going down, no chance.

Planes on fire, had been for a while because Lt. Bush continued his bombing run even after being hit knowing he was condemning his crew and maybe himself to death. Why? Because had he not tried to make the run and order the crew to bail out earlier he would have been brought on charges. There lives were fucking expendable. The fact that the plane was a death trap for the crew did not matter. It was total war.

I don’t like the guy, but he flew 58 combat missions off an aircraft carrier in a primitive, underpowered plane. Won the DSC.

And where did you read about his killing the crew? The internet? That always reliable. You can read some interesting things about John Kerry’s service there as well. Both are bullshit.

[Coventina]

28. I refer you to the thread where this is discussed more fully.

I don't believe one word a Bush family member says.

They are all evil liars.

[GulfCoast66]

30. You got the hate bad!

Fortunately I don’t have to depend on some random internet thread to gain my facts about this situation. I got my information from a man who was in the exact situation Lt Bush was in.

My uncle was a hero who actually flew in the same kind of plane, in a tail/belly gunner position that George Bush piloted. The design of the plane made it almost impossible for anyone but the pilot to bail out of. Or to get out of in a sea landing. And that was not by accident. Pilots were valuable. Gunners not so much. Uncle Joe knew he was expendable. He knew the pilots were considered more valuable. And he was OK with that. It was total war. None of them expected to come home. My uncle was awarded the Purple Heart on a mission bombing and staffing islands like Bush was shot down doing. Hit by shrapnel.

So you keep believing info you get from the internet. I will choose to believe a much loved family member who has been dead for over 20 years but still affects my life. Because you know, he did not read it on the internet. He lived it.

I do not want to make this personal. But I am afraid the memes on the internet do not take into consideration the times. I have no doubt that had Lt. Bush, the minute the plane was hit, abandoned the mission and followed some type of procedure, some of his crew might have survived. But had he done so he would have been brought on charges for abandoning his mission. And his crew would have testified against him. In that war the mission was more important than the men’s lives. And they knew and approved.

I will not defend many of the mans later actions because they are indefensible, but attacking a war hero...well it seems popular these days.

My uncle was one of the few in my family who remained a staunch democrat when the south turned republican. He did not like Reagan nor Bush. But he would be apoplectic hearing democrats attach GHWB war service.

[Coventina]

32. meh, I don't see why we have to laud a BFEE member on DU

There are plenty of people who deserve far more admiration than Poppy Bush and his "heroics".

[GulfCoast66]

33. Good god!

All we are talking about here is recognizing a mans military service.

I dislike every thing political about John McCain, but can still recognize his service in the military to his country.

Both the attacks on McCain and Bush’s service were started by the hard right because they were not seen as right wing enough. They did the same thing to Kerry in 2004. There is no difference.

We should not participate in their slander.

[Coventina]

35. Well, I will point out that the "attacks" on Bush's service are coming from

other service members and have never been coordinated by any political party.

I happen to believe them because of what I know about the Bush family.

[GulfCoast66]

36. The attacks on John Kerry were by fellow veterans.

You believe them as well?

[Coventina]

37. I was definitely suspicious of them, because they WERE

coordinated by a political party AND did not fit the narrative of Kerry's life.

In Bush's case, the accusations DO fit the narrative of his life, and there does not seem to be any politics involved.

[GulfCoast66]

38. Got it. You want to believe only pure hearted liberals can be war hero's.

Obviously nothing is going to change your mind about that.

Have a nice day.

[Coventina]

39. Not what I said but if that's what you choose to believe....

Not my problem.

[question everything]

8. Thank you. And this is how each of us should react

I am having hard time seeing all the vitriol against him.

He fought in WWII - or are there people here who object to our intervention? He chose public service as a member of congress, ambassador, V.P.

How many here are willing to subject themselves to such a public life?

No, I did not vote for him but he was the President. Until two years ago we, the older ones, were taught to respect the office of the Presidency. We cannot expect the other side to do this when the president is ours, but not when he is "theirs."

Again, the current phenomenon is different.

But the man did serve the country and if one chooses not to say something as simple as this sentence, then just shut up.

[cwydro]

15. Thank you.

Some here really have so much hate in their hearts.

[Lordquinton]

23. Some people have a lot of hate in their hearts

HW Bush was one of those people.

[oasis]

10. Any friend of Barack Obama is a friend of mine. nt

[pecosbob]

17. I have no charity left in my soul for Republicans or other war criminals

[GulfCoast66]

31. I'm glad Barack and Michelle Obama do.

And Bill and Hillary Clinton.

I’m with them. Pretty good company.

[LeftInTX]

34. When a president dies, it is a right of passage

An era has gone by. This is why we feel emotional. The POTUS is our most public figure. Our parents are most private figures. For better or worse we have relationships with both. If an abusive parents dies, we still feel sad. If a former president dies, it is normal to feel sad, even if you didn't like him.

Heck, I cried when Nixon resigned. I knew he needed to leave, but I knew I was living in a moment like no other in US history. So I cried.