You want to see illegal immigration dry up?

[SHRED]

Place those who hire illegally into prison for a 5 year mandatory minimum.

Not that I would necessarily support something that draconian but right now there is little to no consequence for the employer who hires illegally.

[phylny]

1. I've said this for a long time. Once, I said this to a Trump supporter, and he was

incredulous. "You'd rather jail an American citizen than an illegal?" (his word, not mine). I said, "Absolutely. Americans ought to know better. And if they need that many employees, they need to pay them correctly to add taxes and Social Security benefits into the pot."

[Ferrets are Cool]

15. I, too, have been reciting this mantra for about 8 years.

Put the EMPLOYERS in prison and the shit will stop.

[Luz]

48. The top guy, too. Not some h/r peon, but the big guy. Owners

or CEO.

I once worked for a company that relied on undocumented workers, but got away with it because they hired as contractors. Scum owners made millions on their backs.

[Ferrets are Cool]

57. Yup

[scarytomcat]

62. I also have been saying it for a long time. It is the easiest solution.

I meet a guy who hires undocumented workers for his business and supports dump and immigration rounding them up. Just wants them to leave his guys alone because they are good workers.

[Ferrets are Cool]

66. Typical deplorable hypocrite. nt

[paleotn]

35. "You'd rather jail an American citizen than an illegal?" I've heard that too...

My response is why not? They're breaking the law by hiring undocumented workers. That's no different than the undocumented "breaking the law" by entering the US illegally. I can hear them now...but, but, but... No buts. It's the same damn thing.

And I agree with you. US overall birth rates are at an all time low. For those of us not on social security yet, we need them. We need them desperately.

[Ligyron]

40. Exactly!

We need a bunch of young blood entering the workforce and paying into SS.

[cannabis_flower]

68. And ..

If he thinks he needs to hire foreigners, he needs to go about it legally. Try to hire Americans. If he can't find Americans will, then he needs to do the paperwork and sponsor them. I'm not sure if that is even possible for lower paying construction, farming and service jobs, but it should be.

[SoCalNative]

2. Well, that certainly would be

one way to get rid of Trump.

[SunSeeker]

3. Yup, starting with Trump properties!

But EVERYONE uses undocumented labor, directly or indirectly, whether it's the gardener or maid service middle and upper class families employ, the meal prepared in your favorite restaurant, or the fruit and vegetables you buy in your supermarket.

[leftieNanner]

6. Trump must have gotten the memo

because he's been firing the undocumented workers at his golf clubs.

Wouldn't that just be frosting on the cake if he were arrested for hiring undocumented people and thrown in jail for it.

What's that word? Schadenfreude?

[global1]

11. Instead Of The MSM Making A Big Deal Out Of Trump Hiring.....

illegals and pointing out his hypocrisy - their silence gave him enough time to fire them so he could skate by again.

[Yo_Mama_Been_Loggin]

12. Exactly

[ZZenith]

4. I mentioned that solution to my immigrant-hating uncle

His response: “Oh they would never allow that - there’s too much money to lose!”

[elleng]

5. Right, and that would capture trump!!!

[AllaN01Bear]

7. thank you . my late mum said that too.

go after the employers .

[old guy]

8. +1

[panader0]

9. Living as close as I do to the border, I have seen this a lot.

The roofers, the landscapers, the concrete crews and more.
A few years back one of the roofing companies got hit. The penalty
was minimal. As a contractor here for years, I had to verify paperwork
or be liable. I can also say that the number of people crossing is much
lower than it was in the past.

[TexasBushwhacker]

10. One would think with all that cheap labor

that the cost of homes in states with lots of undocumented workers, including California, would be lower, but that's not the case. All it means is that builders' profits are higher. But the hypocrisy must be exposed. E-Verify should be MANDATORY and not using it should mean stiff fines and jail time for the employers who violate.

[Xipe Totec]

39. A relative of mine (now retired) worked for the CBP

He told me that the protocol when they discovered undocumented workers working in a farm was that they would talk to the owner, tell him the gig was up, but they wouldn't immediately arrest the undocumented workers. They would allow them to finish picking up the harvest, make sure that the owner paid all due wages, and then take the undocumented workers away for deportation. It was al very peaceful and orderly, no guns were drawn, nobody tried to run away, and nobody got cheated from their wages.

Not saying condone it, just that this is the way is used to be before they went Full Trump.

[KentuckyWoman]

47. "Nobody got cheated on their wages"

it is my bet cheating workers on their wages was built into the system in the form of underpayment or bogus fees. Add in the number of people who pick up day laborers and stiff them at the end of the day.

[rustydog]

13. I think we need to do what Republicans did in drug busts, seize the property of the criminals

A friend of mine served as border patrol for 20 years. She said the majority of immigrants crossing when asked where they were going said: Yakima. (The fruit bowl of the nation) Until she moved to Washington State, she had no clue what they were talking about.

I grew up in the Yakima valley and picked fruit for pocket money as a student. In high school, students were allowed to skip school to harvest apples in the fall. I remember when Oakies and Arkies came into the valley during picking season to harvest the crops.
slowly, over the years they were replaced with Mexican immigrants. In the 80's it was revealed, after a huge crop failure and the state was concerned about the huge number of immigrants in the State with no crops to harvest and no income how this came to be...It seems the fruit industry advertised in Mexico and South America with TV and radio ads INVITING workers to come to the beautiful Washington state and pick apples, pears, peaches, etc. The industry had been doing it for years.

They were INVITED and they came in droves. The apple industry used immigrants they invited who did not have the proper paperwork to work harvesting their crops... This practice (that Trump practices in his golf resorts) is illegal: hiring undocumented workers and keeping then through threats of having them deported if they cause problems... Why not seize the businesses that engage and encourage this practice? If you have undocumented workers in your warehouse, fields etc you lose your business and it is sold to someone who hires "Legal" workers.

How long would Trump's golf resorts continue using undocumented workers if we seized and auctioned off the properties of those who use and abuse undocumented aliens to their monetary advantage?

[Buckeyeblue]

14. Agreed. If there were no jobs, there would be no illegal immigrants, for the most part

But then, make it simple to get a work Visa. And make it simple for employers of any kind to verify the work Visa.

Otherwise, you hire a nanny for next to nothing and she is here illegally, you will go to prison. And might might lose your house.

This isn't rocket science.

[AllyCat]

25. Make it easier to get a work visa as you say.

That makes sense. Working without a visa? The onus is on the empire with stiff fines and jail time.

[Stonepounder]

37. The whole 'illegal immigrant' thing is a racket.

Suppose you are working in a minimum wage job in, say, Los Angeles. And suppose that you know that Canada pays its unskilled workers 10X what you make in LA. You think you might try and slip over the border into Canada if you knew that Canadian employers wouldn't check you visa and would be happy to hire you for 9X what you were making in LA?

So employers happily hire illegals, pay them more than they could make south of the border but less than minimum wage, don't pay overtime, don't do withholding of SS payments and pay them under the table.

[Bernardo de La Paz]

16. Trump is firing undoc workers at Mar-a-Lago rather than the managers who hired them.

https://www.democraticunderground.com/10142253772

Just another insight into the rottenness of his soul.

[greblach]

17. Incarceration Nation

The only thing with this is the continuance of the costly imprisonment of people...how about putting them on work gangs and requiring them to repay the costs of management...

[Hamlette]

18. I have been screaming this for years

you can't stop illegal immigration if you don't stop employers.

I worked for my state's unemployment office for 20 years and the labor commission before that. We've seen it all. We had a tea partier as head of the agency for a few years. She simply refused to believe employers did anything wrong as they ripped us off on a regular basis. My favorite was construction companies setting themselves up as limited liability partnerships then making all workers partners so they were no eligible for unemployment, workers' comp. nor did the employers have to pay any FICA or other taxes on them.

[Ilsa]

19. Trump would be in prison!

Yeah, I think enforcement of employers' legal responsibilities went away in the 1980s.

[UniteFightBack]

20. They have to realize and accept that we actually need these people. This refugee woman said she

just wants a safe home and get a job. Interviewer: what job would you like to do? The refugee said, clean.

So Ive been using that on every Repug. For fucks sake the woman wants to come here to clean and we can't let her in a give her a job cleaning? They need to GET REAL.,,,,and then they agree.

[IronLionZion]

21. It's already illegal and they do fine the employers and ban them from contracts

https://www.uscis.gov/i-9-central/penalties

EMPLOYERS WHO VIOLATE THE LAW MAY BE SUBJECT TO:
Civil fines and/or Criminal penalties (when there is a pattern or practice of violations). For more information on the current amounts please refer to the Civil Monetary Penalties Inflation Adjustment for 2017.
Debarment from government contracts
A court order requiring the payment of back pay to the individual discriminated against
A court order requiring the employer to hire the individual discriminated against

CIVIL VIOLATIONS
Knowingly hired, or to have knowingly recruited or referred for a fee, an unauthorized alien for employment in the United States or to have knowingly continued to employ an unauthorized alien in the United States
Failing to comply with Form I-9 employment verification requirements
Committing or participating in document fraud for satisfying a requirement or benefit of the employment verification process or the INA
Committing document abuse
Unlawful discrimination against an employment-authorized individual in hiring, firing, or recruitment or referral for a fee
Failing to notify DHS of a Final Nonconfirmation (FNC) of an employee’s employment eligibility
Requiring an individual to post a bond or security or to pay an amount or otherwise to provide financial guarantee or indemnity against any potential liability arising under the employment verification requirements
CRIMINAL VIOLATIONS
Engaging in a pattern or practice of hiring, recruiting or referring for a fee unauthorized aliens

It's About Time – Employer Hit by $96 Million Penalty for Hiring Illegal Aliens
https://cis.org/North/Its-About-Time-Employer-Hit-96-Million-Penalty-Hiring-Illegal-Aliens

I hear it all the time from racist idiots who refuse to believe I'm a US citizen when I apply for jobs. My birth certificate is just as fake as Obama's. I was born in the same city as Trump.

[dameatball]

22. Two comments on this subject:

1. Virtually every major or mid sized city in the country has certain gathering places (parking lots, parks, etc) where people will congregate and wait for cars/trucks/vans to pull up and offer day labor, usually cash. No background checks are done. Usually these are small time contractors or sub-contractors that need to supplement their work force on a temporary basis. No way are they going to hire someone permanently to do that verification process because it is largely temporary needs. In the city I am familiar with, Churches Fried Chicken was a popular gathering spot. Might not be true today. In a nearby, smaller city it was at a parking area outside of a farmers' market.

2. I ran a labor intensive business for a couple of years that sometimes had applicants that might be questionable. I complied with federal guidelines and submitted whatever was needed prior to hiring. It was not that big a deal. The only person I ever had to let go was a white guy. Him and his wife had fled some charges in New England. His initial clearance was okay, then I got a letter a few weeks later stating the opposite. He did a great job but I couldn't keep him. The weird thing is about a day after I gave him the news both he and his wife moved out of the area with no forwarding address.

To put this in perspective this was the late 1980's, so I am not pretending to know the current guidelines. But even back then, I could have been liable if I did not submit the necessary paperwork. I guess my main point is that there is absolutely no reason for these employers to NOT know the rules. They have been in place, with some modifications, for at least 30 years. I think the main difference is that prior to 9/11 no one cared. It was all about the bottom line.

[LeftInTX]

67. I haven't see those since the 80s

We had them here, now the people gathering for temporary work are citizens for the most part.

[tclambert]

23. Little to no consequence? They might get fined $250.

You know, if law enforcement thinks it's worth it to try to prove the employer knowingly hired an illegal immigrant.

If we made the fine, say, equal to the average American worker's income, what employer would risk it? They might as well hire an American citizen.

[Lonestarblue]

24. Employers need to be held accountable, but we need a new immigration policy.

Employers need workers to keep their businesses running. Last summer in Texas, at the peak of shrimp harvesting season Texas shrimpers were losing $1 million PER DAY because they could not hire enough people to work their entire fleet of shrimp boats. It’s hard work and pays minimum wage and US citizens have not been interested, so I understand why businesses hire undocumented workers. The situation will get worse with unemployment being so low.

Restaurants and hotels in seasonal resort areas also have trouble finding enough workers, and Trump has decreased the visas for temporary workers from other countries, except of course for his own golf resorts.

It was so ironic last summer that hundreds of migrants were locked in cages at great expense to all of us at a time when shrimp companies just in the Brownsville area down the road from those human cages wanted to hire 750 people and couldn’t find them.

[KY_EnviroGuy]

38. You hit the nail right on the head.

We can rant all we want about penalizing employers, but first let's see come concrete proposals for how we would replace all the migrant workers. I would submit that the illegals should either be replaced or legalized first.

A number of economic experts have said that if all illegal immigrant workers disappeared overnight, the nation's economy might even crash - but it would at least be severely damaged for a very long time. I don't think many Americans are aware of how dependent we are on migrant labor, since perhaps 90% or so of it is hidden from view.

Republicans have not really supported immigration reform because far too many of their corporate backers thrive on illegal migrant labor. They should be held accountable for their massive hypocrisy relating to this issue.

[Delmette2.0]

26. The RWingers complain that immigrants are tanking their jobs.

But it is really their neighbors/ employers hiring them at low wages. If the employers were held responsible then wages would go up and the RWingers would have a job.

[PeeJ52]

27. For sure... I don't think I've seen a non-Hispanic roofer in Central Florida in the last 10 years...

and I don't know of a single Hispanic owned roofing company. I'd turn these companies in if I didn't know the owner would get off free and any illegal would get punished. I feel so sorry for them knowing they probably aren't even being paid minimum wages either.

[Ligyron]

43. Ditto here in South Florida.

Guatemalans did my roof around ten years ago and did a fantastic job. Worked their asses off and were smiling the whole time. I say Guatemalans "did" it because they performed all the actual work. The owners of the company were white guys (naturally).

[guillaumeb]

28. Does anyone really think that the GOP wants to stop it? eom

[LonePirate]

29. Investing and creating economic opportunities in Central America will also help do this.

[Timewas]

30. I don't understand

Why the southern border states don't go back to the Bracero programs...

[rocktivity]

31. Give them an extra five years if they were hired by their contactors OR subcontractors

Otherwise, they'll just contract out their hiring and blame the contractors.


rocktivity

[elmac]

32. Illegal employers are the biggest problem for sure. nt

[muntrv]

33. I often like to say "It's the employer, stupid."

[Blue_true]

34. Have you ever run a small business?

Let me tell you, verifying someone's immigration status is not easy. If your solution is followed, a lot of honest people will get thrown in jail.

I think better solutions are working with governments to address the reasons why people leave home and establishing a work visa program (with solid verification) that allow people to come here, do seasonal work and go home with assurance that they can come back the next season, employees could apply for extensions. Rule would be in place to insure that immigrant laborers are not taken advantage of and that jobs Americans are willing to do don't go to immigrants simply because they work for less. States can set the degree that they participate in the program, states with areas like the one that I live in (lots of poor people doing work like yard work), may choose to limit the program to wealthier areas of the state.

[Farmer-Rick]

56. It doesn't have to be difficult

E-verify is pretty easy to use. I used it up until last year...when I stopped farming.

If it would be mandatory, then it would be more accurate and efficient but right now it is only voluntary.

When it first started, it was pretty awful because it would pop up notifications on people who were clearly not undocumented workers. They were just not in the system yet. But by the year before last, it worked really well and fast. Filling in the I-9 has to be done anyway so might as well load the info on E-verify and get a response back by the next day.

And even if they do pop on E-verify, they can still work for you while they straighten out any mis-identification. I had a lot of that back in 2010 but by last year, I rarely had anyone pop.

[Blue_true]

70. Systems like E-Verify will be part of the solution.

A large issue are employers that don't typically hire immigrant class workers (not due to discrimination as much as it is due to the skill sets required). Those people may be ignorant of systems like E-Verify, so education when they apply for business licenses may be needed.

You were a farmer. The visa program that I mentioned would largely affect your former area of business. How would you set up a program that works in areas where Americans are unwilling to do certain jobs that immigrants will do?

Some jobs that used to be labor intensive no longer are, for example, trash and recycle pickup in my town is fully automated now, one person in a truck using a mechanized lift, I see lots of Black and White and Hispanic Americans driving the trucks, those are jobs that counties may want to keep open to citizens, so a visa program must take that into account.

[Lunabell]

36. I don't know about that sentence,

but fine them out the ying yang.

[Hermit-The-Prog]

41. work visa booths

Set up little booths at ports of entry. Issue temporary work visas on demand. If they bring a stub back, they get quicker processing the next time.

[GulfCoast66]

42. Don't know how it works other places but here is what a farmer I know does...

He hires a couple of legal folks to pick his crops. All verified and legal. Which is ridiculous because he has 60 acres that has to be picked in a few weeks.

And when 30-40 folks show up he just says it is not his problem. Because they are contracted as far as he knows. Trump voter of course.

We make land and property owners responsible for the people working on their land or in their shops and we would have a guest worker program in 6 months.

But democrats would only do so if they migrants were given rights like guaranteed minimum pay and housing. That would be a nonstarter with farmers. At least here in the South.

I am a Southern White male. With roots in rural areas. Many of the largest farmers are ancestors of men who used Slavery to gain their wealth. They take exploitation of farm workers as their god given right.

Look at Jeff Sessions and his beliefs. He is against immigration and social programs because he thinks it would force African Americans back in the field to perform ‘honest work’! Of course he couches it in more civilized language but it means the same thing.

[delisen]

44. People are making a lot of money off these workers and voting for Trump at same time.

It is a bad situation in the construction industry. In many states undocumented workers can't get licensed as general or specialty contractors so they become cheap labor for contractors-many of whom are big Trump supporters.

They don't believe the flow of labor is going to stop and don't expect Trump is going end it . What they are opposed to is letting people work legally.
.
My neighbors hire a contractor to do their lawn and landscaping. The contractor sits in his truck while the laborers do all the work. If everyone went back to Central America and Mexico, there would a lot of contractors losing their "supervisor" status and getting their fancy trucks repossessed.

[Wounded Bear]

45. The only way to stop illegal immigration...

is to work to make the countries they come from less of a hellhole.

As long as the cartels own Central America, people will be trying to escape to here.

[FreeJoe]

49. I have a better idea

Radically increase the amount of people that we allow to immigrate here legally.

[ck4829]

50. K&R

[treestar]

51. That would shrink the economy

We need to give them visas so they can work legally and can go home and return if their job is seasonal.

[treestar]

52. Employer sanctions have been on the books since 1986

That was Reagan's tradeoff for amnesty. That is why you have to fill in I-9 to get a job.

[MichMan]

59. There is widespread use of false documents from what I understand

[treestar]

61. There are also illegals voting

In enough numbers to sway the popular vote, from what I’ve heard

[USALiberal]

53. I 100% agree!!! nt

[rampartc]

54. jail would be too easy

if you hire illegals to work on your farm, we shoulf ise asset forfeiture laws to sieze your farm.

probably auctioned, but under my plan break the farm into 40 acre plots and open for homesteading.

the former agribusinessmen would, hopefully, be reduced to finding a job with the rest of us.

[MichMan]

55. Should the same apply if you hire an undocumented person to mow your lawn?

You would get your house seized under the same forfeiture laws?

[rampartc]

60. absolutely

or maybe not. some homeowners may not be capable of checking the credentials of a 1 hour a week employee.

how about a larger house with a full time staff?

[SHRED]

63. I have had a lot of work done on my home and yard

I hired my co-workers and friends or did it myself.
It's not that difficult to do the right thing.

[MichMan]

64. My elderly mother lives in Florida

She has no co workers and her friends are in their 80's

[spanone]

58. what happened to those illegals that worked for trump golf courses...????

[Iggo]

71. They're people. Not illegals.

[dogman]

65. They could pay enough in fines to fund border security too.

[Hulk]

69. There sure are consequences for employers to hire illegals...

....slave labor at a dime on the dollar and big profits. NOBODY talks about them. Sort of like NOBODY talks about the drug users demand or the gun runners heading south.

Let’s just build that fucking wall, and we’ll all be safe!

[Iggo]

74. They're people, not illegals.

[oldsoftie]

72. We all keep saying this, yet Congress does little. Regardless of which party is in control.

Maybe "we the people' need to get louder about it.
Because it really WOULD have a big impact. People won't risk the trip if they dont think they can get work

[citizen blues]

73. It's far worse than simply illegal hiring.

These companies are actively recruiting in Mexico, enticing anyone who can make it over the border with a job that pays more than they can earn in Mexico.

That's why these scumbag employers deserve to go to prison.