BOTTOM LINE: This is a DISASTER for Donald J. Trump

[RHMerriman]

BOTTOM LINE: This is a disaster for Donald J. Trump

Get your attention?

Consider this -

[link:https://www.speaker.gov/newsroom/32419/|]

and have some guts, for god's sake.

Mueller, at least according to Barr, wrote that he CAN NOT "exonerate" Trump... so (as Matt Miller says) "congratulations to Individual 1 for only being the subject of one ongoing criminal investigation." that we know of... and now the whole scandal is firmly in the hands of a patriotic Congress, which will follow the leads wherever they go - unlike Barr's DOJ.

Don't forget, Nixon was reelected in '72 and gone in '74, so I don't see this as a win for the Trump Administration.

Mueller punted to Barr, and Barr punted to Congress. Neither one was a profile in courage, obviously; the only patriots in all this are the Democrats in Congress, and given the insight into how Trump does business, they have plenty to go after.

Bottom line, Trump hired a national security adviser, campaign chair, deputy campaign chair, personal attorney/national party finance co-chair, (all CONVICTS) and a dozen other losers who have consistently proven themselves untrustworthy for the positions they were given - and the GOP as an institution and organization have accepted that bottom line, which indicts them as just as badly. NO REPUBLICAN who continues to support Trump can be trusted on national security issues, obviously.

It comes down to the reality that Trump is surrounded by crooks that he hired... "I'm not a crook" didn't work for Nixon; I don't see that as really a winning slogan for Trump.

Using Nixon as the template, it's worth remembering Nixon won re-election in '72, despite multiple scandals and the debacle in SE Asia; and yet he didn't finish a second term.

Keep the faith, keep up the fire, and enough with the defeatism.

Cripes, if some of today's posters had been around in 1775, 1861, or 1941, one can only imagine the impact.

The United States has survived, and thrived, in the face of much tougher enemies than DJT and the GOP; start acting like it.

[MFM008]

1. maggot has begun crowing

no collusion.
Thats all he needs to do for his oatmeal brained trump humpers.

[RHMerriman]

3. What do you think Nixon said throughout all of '73-74?

What do you think Nixon said, repeatedly, throughout all of '73-74?

Do you think he hid out at San Clemente every weekend, like the cowardly fat man does at Merde-a-lago?

[mr_lebowski]

9. Was he basically exonerated by a Special Counsel?

I'll tell you what, I sure wish it was 2009, last time I was in San Clemente w/my ex-wife, in a house on the damn beach ...

[RHMerriman]

12. Ever hear of John Mitchell?

Ever hear of John Mitchell?

He was Nixon's ATTORNEY GENERAL. Spent 19 months in federal prison.

[mr_lebowski]

14. So ... no, then?

Yes, I'm familiar with the man and the charges.

[RHMerriman]

15. Barr's own words aren't even an exoneration...

And according to Barr, Mueller found his investigation can not "exonerate" Trump. as in: "...while this report does not conclude that the President did not commit a crime, it also does not exonerate him."

So your original statement regarding the special counsel's findings, at least as relayed by Barr, is incorrect.

[mr_lebowski]

22. You are familiar with the 'standard' when it comes to 'criminal justice', yes?

It's in no way required that Trump is 'exonerated'.

Nobody in a court of law is 'exonerated'. They are 'found not guilty beyond reasonable doubt'.

I understand clinging to the phrase 'not exonerated' at a time like now, but I'm not sure it really matters in the overall scheme.

ESPECIALLY since 'the crime' you're referring to is 'obstruction of justice'. If there's no underlying crime to begin with (conspiracy, which Barr's version at least says they didn't find evidence of) to 'obstruct justice' with, how powerful of an argument for criminal activity do you really think 'couldn't exonerate' ... really constitutes?

I'm pretty sure the answer to that is ... it's weak as hell.

[RHMerriman]

24. You're the one who brought it up in the original post

You're the one who brought it up in the original post, as in "Was he basically exonerated by a Special Counsel?"

In which case, the answer is "no," because even according to Barr's (potentially suspect) summary, the SCO did not, in fact, "exonerate" anyone.

Can't have it both ways.

[UniteFightBack]

2. It's a short term win...make no mistake. But Mueller farmed out enough corruption to bring him

down. He couldn't get him on this ...but we'll get him.

[RHMerriman]

4. It's not even a short-term win...

It's not even a short-term win...

Every paragraph from the SCO report that slips out will open the doors to a dozen different lines of inquiry.

[CentralMass]

5. Let's see if Barr allows congress to see the full report.

[RHMerriman]

6. Ever hear of the Pentagon Papers?

Ever hear of the Pentagon Papers?

This kind of material can NEVER be buried.

[malaise]

18. Thread winner

[RHMerriman]

20. Thanks ... I'm trying

Thanks ... I'm trying.

I'm willing to bet this is Trump's last good day.

[bluestarone]

7. THIS is important!

WE shall see!

[RHMerriman]

11. Yes it is...

Let your senators and representatives know you feel that way.

[Volaris]

21. Not of his own volition, he won't, because I hen he's on the hook for obstruction, too.

It will need to be subponeaed(sp).

[shockey80]

8. If they didn't find the tapes Nixon would have survived the investigation.

[RHMerriman]

10. And the difference between 2019 and 1973 in terms of electronic data records is

And the difference between 2019 and 1973 in terms of electronic data records is, literally, astronomical.

[lostnfound]

13. So is the earnestness of the public and of the senate leadership

There are major differences in the amount of corruption the American people is willing to tolerate.
The innocence is gone.

[RHMerriman]

16. Assuming facts not in evidence, counselor.

Assuming facts not in evidence, counselor.

[lostnfound]

68. You think they'll be persuaded by facts? The cult believes in trump more than their own eyes. Nt

[RHMerriman]

70. You mentioned the Senate, the House, and "Americans" - which ones are corruption tolerant, and

You mentioned the Senate, the House, and "Americans" - which ones are corruption tolerant, in your view, and upon what is that opinion based?

Given 40 new Democrats elected to the House in 2018, one would suspect the tolerance level for corruption is fairly low, but I'll wait for your evidence.

[lostnfound]

81. I did not mention the House for exactly that reason. Nt

[kurtcagle]

52. It also doesn't hurt

that Trump has created a backtrail of tweets that go back almost three years. Trump has very likely perjured himself repeatedly in the most public way imaginable.

[RHMerriman]

54. Good point... as it stands at the moment,

Good point... as it stands at the moment, Pelosi, Schumer, Nadler, and Feinstein have all come out and said, essentially, the Congressional investigators will ramp up their work, including subpeaoning Barr, Mueller, et al and requiring public testimony under oath.

Not exactly quivering in the corner, are they?

[Volaris]

17. 'start acting like it'

Yes this
Thank you.
I ain't scared. Donald Trump IS GONNA die in prison. By one means, or another.

[RHMerriman]

19. Damn straight...

Damn straight...

Keep the faith, and keep up the fire.

[Drunken Irishman]

23. I like to play pretend too.

So, your example to suggest this is a disaster for Trump, and not Democrats, is that Nixon was reelected and wasn't able to finish his second term?

Wow. That makes me feel better! We've got only another three more years of this bullshit to worry about and then maybe he can be forced to resign! Woohoo!

If Trump wins reelection like Nixon did in '72, we are fucked.

[Drunken Irishman]

28. I'm plenty grown...

Spare me the divisiveness. I've been around DU far too long to buy any type of hype. The same people who kept telling me to wait for the Mueller report at the same people telling me the truth will come out ... and who also happen to be the same people who told me, adamantly in 2016, that Trump had no chance of winning.

Yet here we are.

[RHMerriman]

29. So what are you going to do about it, Mick?

So what are you going to do about it, Mick?

Vote? Donate? Volunteer? Canvas? Run for office?

Or be a defeatist on a forum?

[Drunken Irishman]

33. Yes. That's all I can do. I'm done hoping, tho.

Done hoping the GOP will grow a spine.

Done hoping voters would see through Trump's campaign rhetoric.

Done hoping the GOP would be a wall.

Done hoping Mueller would deliver the good.

I am done hoping. I'll fight and vote and donate but I'm done getting my hopes up.

[RHMerriman]

37. Perhaps you'd benefit from some more liquid courage, Mick

Perhaps you'd benefit from some more liquid courage, Mick...

[RHMerriman]

50. Nothing wrong with liquid courage if that's all you've got...

Nothing wrong with liquid courage if that's all you've got... speaking from personal experience.

I'll leave it to Mick if he saw it as rude.

[NotHardly]

49. I agree, HOPE is a nice platatude but little else. Kinda like 'thoughts and prayers';

or 'thank you for your service', or 'sorry for your loss'... or 'moving forward'... or... 'time to heal'... and all the other knee jerk jagoff

[RHMerriman]

51. Who the hell said we're "hoping"?

Who the hell said we're "hoping"?

All I've said is to consider how little information there actually is that's public at this point from the SCO report, don't give into defeatism, and fight like hell.

[sheshe2]

83. Mick?

Mick is a derogatory term for a person of Irish descent.

There is no need for this on a Democratic board.

[MrsCoffee]

84. Right?

How can anyone think that’s ok?

SMH.

[George II]

85. "Mick"? To an Irishman? Got any more ethnic slurs you can throw out?

[Stuart G]

25. It ain't over till it is OVER. and...IT AIN'T OVER..nt

[RHMerriman]

27. True enough, Coach Berra.

Keep the faith.

[Stuart G]

30. Why it ain't Over...

In my opinion, this is not over, it is just moving to another theater for some more acts..I remember seeing the first Star Wars. (1977.then the second, and after the 2nd, it left us hanging..more..I said on the way out, I guess we got to see another) This feels the same. It is not over..It may look that way. There appears to be more acts coming. But, I could be totally wrong, ? Hopefully we will all find out..

Also..........:
I also watched Watergate very closely. It took a lot of time..but they did get Nixon..Why? He is/was a crook
........................................This will also take a lot of time..but they will get Trump. Why? He is a crook

Repeat...............................Trump is a crook.too[.(and we all know it)

[RHMerriman]

31. Indeed ... historical perspective is a beautiful thing

Indeed ... historical perspective is a beautiful thing.

Keep the faith, and keep up the fire.

[dem4decades]

32. Jaworski just said Nixon is innocent. That's what we're looking at.

[RHMerriman]

34. A, Mueller has not said Trump is "innocent"... he hasn't said anything, honestly;

A, Mueller has not said Trump is "innocent"... he hasn't said anything publicly, honestly;

B, Barr has offered a summary of Mueller's findings, which remains to be evaluated as being accurate or not;

C, Jaworski was the second special counsel appointed.

All in all, I'd suggest not jumping to conclusions based on first impressions of a report that has not been made public.

[dem4decades]

36. Mueller folded his hand. I'm supposed to be happy. I went all in on him.

Bobby Three Sticks just have Trump a green light to declare his innocence. And Trump will beat that drum hard, long and often.

[RHMerriman]

38. Based on what, exactly? Barr's 4-page press release?

Based on what, exactly? Barr's 4-page press release?

Perspective is a glorious thing, friend.

[dem4decades]

42. You don't think Trump, the master of communications, will exploit this to his advantage?

[RHMerriman]

43. Have you ever been persuaded of anything by Trump?

Have you ever been persuaded of anything by Trump?

[Stuart G]

35. I don't think so..I think what was said..no federal laws were broken.

Now maybe the State of New York will prosecute for crimes there...Or there is more..
.... We will all see. I do not think this is over.

[RHMerriman]

40. It is most definitely not "over"...

It is most definitely not "over"...

Which has been my point during today's alarums and excursions.

[lunatica]

39. I'm kicking every positive thread I see!

Screw getting dragged down by people with unrealistic expectations! This isn’t over by a long shot!

[RHMerriman]

41. Damn right

Damn right ... and thanks.

[Tipperary]

44. Me too.

Defeatism did not make this country. Pretty easy to see those on du who probably would have stayed home cowering when Paul Revere made his famous ride.

[RHMerriman]

47. True that...

Acknowledging they were men of their times, the Signers truly were writing their own death warrants...

Today, there are far too many Americans who would have hung back and waited. Summer soldiers and sunshine patriots, indeed.

Keep the faith, and keep up the fire

[treestar]

63. Unrealistic expectations

Nailed it.

[RHMerriman]

66. Hear, hear...

Stand up, dust yourself off, and line up. Here they come again...

[Tipperary]

45. Recommended.

It is time for strength, not surrender.

[RHMerriman]

46. Thanks ... as always, the Republicans NEED the Democrats to clean up the mess

Keep in mind, as always, the Republicans NEED the Democrats to clean up the mess they (the GOP) has created, in order to prevent the GOP from splintering into a mostly southern-Great Plains white supremacist "white hood" party and a Wall Street-aligned "white collar" party...

Same as it ever was, truthfully, at least since Nixon.

This will go down the same path, with just enough Republicans in the end, to replace Pence with someone like Nikki Haley and then ease Trump out ...

And Pelosi and Schumer have been around long enough that they understand this pattern.

[lunatica]

69. I'm 70 years old so I've been around long enough also

Experience is a great teacher

[RHMerriman]

71. Those who forget history are condemned to repeat it

Those who forget history are condemned to repeat it...

those who never study are continually surprised by it.

[lunatica]

72. That's good!

[RHMerriman]

74. Stole the first part from Georges Santayana, of course

Stole the first part from Georges Santayana, of course.

[lunatica]

77. It's the second part I was talking about.

I already knew about the first part.

[cutroot]

53. A janitor found some tape over a door lock at the Watergate hotel

It turned the tide and eventually brought down the nixon regime. We are going to need many more janitors to clean up this one.

[RHMerriman]

57. True, but what is clear is that the Democrats aren't buying it...

Frankly, the Republicans missed their chance to use Mueller to turn this into a "compromise" along the lines of Agnew-Ford-Nixon.

Now it comes down to Patriots vs. Trumpists.

[BamaRefugee]

55. OP:"now the whole scandal is firmly in the hands of a patriotic Congress" HUH? The SENATE,patriotic?

Not sure I get it, unless you meant "now the whole scandal is firmly in the hands of a patriotic House of Representatives"

[RHMerriman]

58. "the only patriots in all this are the Democrats in Congress"...

..."the only patriots in all this are the Democrats in Congress"... as in the original OP.

The GOP lost their chance to use the Mueller probe to forge some sort of "compromise/bargain" along the lines of Nixon-Ford. With a (small) number of honorable exceptions, the Republicans - certainly at the level of Barr and McConnell have made their bed and climbed in for the last time.

Today was Trump last "good" day in a lot of ways, and anyone on the right side of the aisle not laboring under Trump's personal intellectual and moral handicaps can see it.

[DirtEdonE]

56. Good luck with all that.

Really, I wish us all good luck. We'll all need it.

I'd say it was great while it lasted but in reality this country has always been full of shit, which makes this quite a fitting ending, trump I mean, the most full of shit person possibly ever to exist, flushing it all down the toilet.

I don't know if people are in a state of shock or what but the gravity of what mueller did and what barr is making of it will hit in a few days and I don't think it will be very pretty. It'll be like the days after we learned trump stole the election.

Oh. My. God. They really did it this time.

[RHMerriman]

59. Your understanding of " the gravity of what Mueller did" is based on what, exactly?

Your understanding of " the gravity of what Mueller did" is based on what, exactly?

Barr's four page press release?

Christ, I'm glad you were never on any of my juries.

[DirtEdonE]

61. Reality. nt

[RHMerriman]

64. Well that's, like, your opinion, man.

Very deep and well-reasoned case you made there, counselor.

[DirtEdonE]

82. No use overstating the obvious nt

[zentrum]

60. Had a different

...Repug party in those days. More old school, had some interest in rule of law. And we didn't have the Fox State propaganda channel.

Nixon didn't head up a cult, was not a cult figure and did not exercise cultic power over his rabid base. No matter that the base is small---the Repug leaders seem terrified of them and follow Trump in lock-step.

None of that was in place in Nixon's day.

[RHMerriman]

62. Different Democratic Party, as well...

Different Democratic Party, as well...

Is Nixon a perfect template? No, but it's as close as we get in recent history. Perspective is a valuable thing.

[zentrum]

80. Hope you're right, but

...I'm not too clear on what you mean.

I think the Democratic Party was more agressive in those days---another aspect that gives me less confidence about how this Trump monstrousness will play out.

[Kurt V.]

65. i don't have to have guts. i need my leaders to have guts

[RHMerriman]

67. Two-way street, Mr. Vonnegut

Two-way street, Mr. Vonnegut.

[thegoose]

73. And he's a criminal a jillion times over

The Russia probe is a smokescreen. He's a career mobster and he'll be nicked on other charges. Tax evasion, money laundering...the list goes on and on.

[RHMerriman]

75. Indeed he is...

Indeed he is...

There's a reason Al Capone went to prison for tax evasion and not multiple murder, of course.

It's easier to prove.

[thegoose]

76. You know it!

[George II]

78. Yes, it's not as much of a disaster as it could have been or as trump is "claiming"...

...a few points on the positive side,too:

But first, Mueller didn't punt to Barr, he had to report to Barr, no one else. However, Barr did "punt" to Congress, and Congress (Pelosi/Schumer), to keep the football analogy going, called for a fair catch. Now it's first and ten for Democrats and we're not pinned back near our end zone (enough of the football!!!!).

Now it's the job of Democrats in the House to keep this thing going, and from the looks of it they're almost relishing this. No doubt before long the full report will come out, with the supporting documentation. That is going to be bad - we've already seen some republicans in both houses turning on trump, it will get worse.

What we have going in our favor is that the Watergate break-in, the start of Nixon's downfall, was during the election campaign in 1972.
Yes, he got re-elected, but none of the REAL damaging information had come out yet before the election, and as much as I like McGovern, he wasn't a strong campaigner. Then a little over two years late Nixon was gone.

Now, almost two years before the next election, we already know a LOT of the damaging information, a half dozen of trump's campaign people have been convicted or pleaded guilty. We're WAY ahead of the game when comparing this to the Nixon situation.

Another thing, people are just now realizing what's going on with their income taxes, millions of every day Americans are paying much more than they did before their "tax cut". Despite the economy, factories are still closing, too. And we just came off a huge win in teh House elections, minor win in the Senate, but the republicans have almost three times as many Senators up for election than they did last year.

Despite some getting hurt (higher real taxes, loss of jobs, etc.) we're in a really good position:

Continued trump scandals
Electorate unhappy with republicans
Momentum in our favor

If we don't screw it up by allowing ourselves to bicker with each other for the next year and a half, this could be almost as good an election as we had in 1964.

[Freethinker65]

79. Not a disaster, but gloating about plausible deniability in being unknowingly used by Russia

Is nothing to gloat about.

Trump, the GOP, and the WH on on record being happy to be effectively duped by Russia's obvious help.

They can no longer deny it happened. They must admit they were happy about the deliberate misinformation and meddling that Russia provided for their win.

Questions to be asked....will they be happy if it happens again? What if the next foreign government decides to help the other side??