16-year-old Boy Scout collapses, dies hiking in Arizona desert

[ansible]

PHOENIX -- No charges are expected after a 16-year-old Boy Scout died while on a troop hiking trip in the Arizona desert, authorities said Friday.

Joshua White, an active member of Troop 99, was on a training hike with two adults leading a small group of Scouts in Picacho Peak State Park last Saturday. On the 90-degree day, the group started off with plenty of water but ran out at some point on the second half of their hike.

White showed signs of extreme dehydration and died on the way down, authorities said. It remained unclear if the lack of water led to the boy's death or if he had some other medical issue.

The hikers called 911 but the boy was unconscious by the time a park ranger arrived. Two adults and one child were also evaluated by paramedics for exhaustion, but did not need to be taken to a hospital, officials said.

"When we arrived on scene, our crews had to hike about a mile in," Capt. Patrick Calhoun with the local fire department explained. "A park ranger was already on scene, trying to perform resuscitative efforts."

White was a member of the junior varsity football team at Estrella Foothills High School in Goodyear, a suburb west of Phoenix. A memorial service was scheduled for May 10.

"Scouting was an important part of Joshua's life, and we know the Scouts and leaders in the troop loved Joshua," his family said in a statement. "Joshua, the other Scouts and their leaders were experienced hikers and fully prepared for the activities they had planned last weekend. Our prayers are for everyone affected, and we appreciate the support from the community as we ask for privacy during this difficult time."

Andy Price, CEO of the Boy Scouts' Grand Canyon Council, released a statement saying the organization is saddened by the teen's death and is providing support for the family and the scouting community. He did not immediately respond Friday to a call seeking additional comment.

https://abc7chicago.com/16-year-old-boy-scout-collapses-dies-hiking-in-arizona-desert/5285441/

[mr_lebowski]

1. Sad story ... Godspeed, Joshua ...

I suspect something unexpected will be discovered in autopsy ... if everyone else made it okay, why did he drop dead? Presumably a JV football player would be pretty decent shape to begin with, and 16 y.o.s tend to be pretty resilient to begin with.

Thoughts going out to his friends and family ... what a tragedy

[ansible]

2. It's very easy to get dehydrated in the desert even at this time

It happens way too often every year with tourists too who have absolutely no idea just how dangerous it is

[Wounded Bear]

14. It would seem that these were locals who should know this...

Pretty scary. Sounds a bit like someone was not fully prepared.

[TexasBushwhacker]

25. I was thinking the same thing

I wonder if he had some unknown health problem that made him vulnerable.

[at140]

53. 6 years ago I had dehydration episode

after playing 18 holes on a hot day on a hilly course.
My own fault for walking instead of riding in a cart.

[mainer]

3. "Started off with plenty of water but ran out"

Obviously, "plenty" wasn't enough. The leaders were at fault.

[3Hotdogs]

4. This is not to start an argument, but a request for information.

How much water should be carried on a desert hike for about 5 miles.


I have never been to Az. and would like to experience a desert hike next year.

[maxsolomon]

6. General ROT is 1 gallon/person/day in the desert.

a 5 mile hike in 90 degree heat? i'd take 3 liters per person, but 2 should suffice.

water weighs a lot, so that's why backpacking in the desert is challenging. who wants to carry 3 gallons for a 2 night trip?

[NutmegYankee]

9. It no doubt varies by person.

I’ve burned through 4 liters here in New England on a 5 mile hike in the 90s temps. It would probably be better in desert with no humidity.

[maxsolomon]

18. wow. that's a gallon.

I rarely go through that much in the Cascades, but it's also rarely 90. or humid.

[Polybius]

46. I'm the opposite

I don't sweat very much, and 1 would be plenty. I also love hot weather.

[onethatcares]

11. on a hike like that

due to the weight of water the troop could have designated water carriers whos' personal pack items are divided among the rest of the hikers.

I am not tossing rocks, but that seems like a logical idea.

Sadly a young man died

[pnwmom]

43. It probably varies according to a person's size, too. A larger person

would need more water.

Someone here posted an article saying that at the Grand Canyon the recommendation is 1-2 gallons of water per day.

[MLAA]

65. That is why I have only done one night backpack trips in the desert.

[womanofthehills]

36. Regular hikers - recommended - drink 2 cups an hour

I would definitely say more in desert.

[PoliticAverse]

5. Yeah, really. Clearly someone is ignoring the definition of "plenty" here.

The sentence should read: what they apparently thought was plenty of water but turned out not to be.

[former9thward]

8. The family of the boy disagrees with you.

The family of a 16-year-old Boy Scout who collapsed and died while on a troop hiking trip in the southern Arizona desert says he loved scouting and that he and fellow scouts and their leaders were experienced hikers "fully prepared" for their planned activities.

https://tucson.com/news/local/family-of-boy-scout-who-died-while-hiking-picacho-peak/article_4204b8f6-6e92-11e9-84d2-3f29328af6df.html

Everything that happens in life is not always someone else's fault.

[pnwmom]

12. That's a natural reaction on their part. They allowed their son to go on that hike,

so of course they have to believe they made the right judgment, that the leaders had been fully prepared -- that it was just fate or God or something.

To believe that it was an error on the part of the people they trusted might be too unbearable to think about.

[former9thward]

21. No it is the opposite of the "natural reaction" of their part.

Most people will immediately blame others and assume someone made a mistake. Such as you appear to be doing. Interesting how people thousands of miles away on an internet board know what happened and who is responsible.

[pnwmom]

22. Of course it is. If they blamed the scout leaders for not being fully prepared

they might have to realize that their son's death was avoidable, and they trusted the wrong people.

[former9thward]

24. So happy you know what happened there.

[pnwmom]

26. I know they "ran out of water on the second half of their hike."

In fact, they ran out of it before they started back down the mountain. That shouldn't have happened.

You don't take people hiking in 90 degree weather without preparing for the possibility of heat stroke. What increases the likelihood of heatstroke? Not having enough water. What does someone need who's having heat stroke? Water.

EVEN IF this boy turns out to have had aggravating circumstances, the fact is that they ran out of water halfway through the hike. That put everyone on this hike at risk and it shouldn't have happened.

https://www.azcentral.com/story/news/local/arizona/2019/05/03/boy-scout-who-died-hiking-picacho-peak-identified-joshua-white/1094875001/

The teen was hiking with a group that had water but ran out when they got to the top of the mountain, the Pinal County Sheriff's Office said.

On the hike down, he began to exhibit signs of extreme dehydration, officials said. Members of the group called for help, and emergency responders attempted to resuscitate White but were unsuccessful.

[former9thward]

28. I see you have edited your post.

You originally said "the second day of their hike". Just for your information, not that you care, the hike is 4 miles round trip. It is a 2 hour to 3.5 hour hike. Yet you know all about it. Your are desperate to blame the people who organized the hike. Desperate.

[pnwmom]

31. Yes, I quickly fixed that. But they ran out of water at the TOP of the mountain,

so they didn't have ANY water for the hike down.

They grossly underestimated how much water would be needed -- even for an afternoon hike.

This should be a warning to anyone planning exercise in an isolated, hot place. Acting as if they didn't err in failing to bring enough water won't help to save lives in the future.

[former9thward]

32. No.

You don't make rules based on what happens to one person in ten thousand (if that) and that person most probably had some pre-existing and unknown condition which caused his death. The trail is not "isolated" and 90 degrees is not "hot" for people acclimated to Arizona. It is a well used, short trail. Kids die in track meets. Kids die in basketball games. Tragedies happen in life but you want to find some way to blame others for every single one.

[pnwmom]

33. They ran out of water halfway through the hike. By definition, they didn't bring enough.

And they were "isolated" because there was no close-by place to get more water when they ran out. The boy died before they could get water or help.

Anyone hiking for more than an hour in dry, 90 degree weather needs access to water -- no matter how acclimated they are. I've hiked in hot desert climates, and bringing enough water and sun protection are the two major rules anyone should follow.

[former9thward]

34. So happy you know what to do.

[womanofthehills]

37. Agree - I live in the high desert of NM

I won’t even drive my car without lots of water with me.

[pnwmom]

42. You are doing the right thing. People we know in desert areas

always carry water in their trunks.

[Doodley]

51. Why are you arguing? It clearly says they ran out of water.

[former9thward]

52. No one here knows all the circumstances.

The family of the boy says everything was proper. Yet people on this board know better. Why are you arguing???

[pnwmom]

58. Logic and reason. They ran out of water halfway through a mountain hike in hot, dry weather.

That means they didn't bring enough water, no matter what the family thinks. They should have brought enough water to supply the whole hike.

[former9thward]

59. Since you know better, how much water should they bring?

For a four mile hike. 16 times around a high school track. BTW they ran out with a mile to go on the way down -- not at the halfway point. The weather was 90 which was certainly not hot for someone acclimated to AZ which they all were. They were not tourists.

[pnwmom]

68. They took four and a half hours to get to the top, and he ran out of water there.

About 8 a.m. on April 27, the group — six scouts and two scoutmasters — began hiking the Sunset Trail and reached the top about 12:30 p.m., according to a Pinal County Sheriff’s Office incident report obtained by the Star on Wednesday.

The department was dispatched about 1:30 p.m. after someone from the group called for help.

A PCSO deputy was told White had two quarts of water with him on the start of the hike but was out of water by the time the group reached the top.

This isn't like circling around a high school track. It was in dry heat, and going up hill. And we KNOW for a fact he didn't have enough because he ran out halfway through the hike. Then someone shared water with him and ALL of them had run out of water by the time the boy collapsed, with a mile still to go.

At the start the boy only had 2 quarts of water with him, so less than a pint per hour, hiking on that hot, dry day, till he got to the top. 2 quarts of water for a 4.5 hour hike in that heat was barely enough for that distance -- and it left him nothing for the return trip. And no one in the group still had water with a mile left to hike.

https://tucson.com/news/local/call-report-released-about--year-old-boy-scout-who/article_bbe6febf-265e-5dbc-a147-1fe6ee2da466.html

[former9thward]

69. I knew you would not answer me.

I lived in AZ for 11 years and I know exactly what it is like. Do you think each one of them should have taken 20 pounds of water with them? This incident occurred on April 27. It is now May 12 and still no cause of death has been released. Why? An autopsy would have been done the next day at the latest. I will wait to see the cause of death.

[pnwmom]

70. 8.4 pounds of water each. Twice as much water as the boy brought would have been enough

to get him through the hike without running out.

He had 2 quarts, so that would mean 4 quarts, which is 1 gallon, or less than 8.4 pounds.

That wouldn't have guaranteed no one would have died of anything, but --- at the rate they were drinking, 2 cups per hour-- no one would have run out.

8.4 pounds of water to carry wouldn't have been too much, along with some salt tabs, which weigh very little, and food. He should have been able to accommodate everything in a 20 pound pack, which isn't heavy, even for me.

P. S. His cause of death is irrelevant. He didn't bring enough water, period, because he drank at a normal rate and he ran out halfway through.

[Blue_true]

38. I agree with you.

In that type of heat, the leaders should have done a water check after every mile and turned around if one person fell below a certain amount. There seems to have been some cluelessness involved, which makes me doubt the claim of "experienced".

[d_r]

55. I agree with you

Nt

[SoCalDem]

7. I still can't get over the fact that some people treat deserts/mountains/swamps

like amusement parks.. They are DANGEROUS, and should not be treated as a fun adventure..

No one knows their true limits until it's sometimes too late

[Codeine]

16. Danger is part of a fun adventure.

The hostility of the desert is part of its appeal.

[SoCalDem]

19. until someone dies

[Mariana]

27. Fortunately, very few people die while hiking. nt.

[Captain Stern]

20. It doesn't seem like anybody in this instance was treating the desert like an amusement park.

I'm sure there are times that happens, but this doesn't seem to be one of those times.

Evidently, the young man who died was sixteen years old, and an experienced hiker.

And as far as dangerous things not being treated as fun adventures........the literal definition of the word 'adventure' actually means that it's a thing you do involving danger.

https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/adventure

[Rambling Man]

29. Walking out the front door is dangerous

[EX500rider]

10. 90 degree day is on the cool side for Phoenix - regularly gets over 110. nt

[Wounded Bear]

15. Even so, RH tends to run under 50%...

often significantly less. Dehydration is always a threat out there.

[mokawanis]

13. I did a 5-day desert hike when the temp was around 100

and we were going through 1.5 to 2 gallons per person every day.

Sorry to hear of this young man's death. RIP.

[maxsolomon]

17. did you carry it all or did you have a water source?

8 gallons is 64 lbs.

[mokawanis]

23. There were 4 water sources in the canyons we were hiking (Grand Gulch in Utah)

So our daily hike pretty much consisted of hiking from one water source to the next and then setting up camp in that general area. I was really tired of pumping water through the filter, and then carrying 2 gallons, by the end of that hike.

[maxsolomon]

35. oh, cool. that one's on my list after we floated the San Juan 3 years back.

we saw the outlet of Grand Gulch and then the upper end on the drive out.

"god's country"

[mokawanis]

50. Floating the San Juan

Now's there's an adventure I'd love to try some day!

One of the great things about the Gulch was the number of Anasazi ruins scattered throughout the canyons we hiked. Kinda makes your spine tingle to stand next to a dwelling that was made 1,000 years ago.

[pnwmom]

30. They ran out of water halfway through. By definition, they didn't bring "plenty of water."

It wasn't even close.


https://www.azcentral.com/story/news/local/arizona/2019/05/03/boy-scout-who-died-hiking-picacho-peak-identified-joshua-white/1094875001/

The teen was hiking with a group that had water but ran out when they got to the top of the mountain, the Pinal County Sheriff's Office said.

On the hike down, he began to exhibit signs of extreme dehydration, officials said. Members of the group called for help, and emergency responders attempted to resuscitate White but were unsuccessful.

[Blue_true]

39. I saw your extended exchange with another poster.

Seems like there was some lack of planning or experience on the part of the scout leaders. They realized that they were out of water on a high point where cells were more likely to work. Why didn't they contact a ranger station and ask for advice, or found ANY shade and stayed in place until things cooled down some?
I suffered dehydration once and the person who I was out with had me stop and stay in shade while he went for help. Fortunately things cooled down and I recovered enough to get to safety on my own. If I had tried to continue moving earlier that day, I likely would have gotten in serious trouble physically.

[pnwmom]

40. Phew! I am so glad you were hiking with someone who knew what to do!

I get that people make mistakes, and I do not think anyone should have to suffer any more for what happened.

HOWEVER I think this is a good opportunity to remind people that water is really important on a hike that.

[Blue_true]

48. The other person's experience was not perfect.

His plan was to get to a phone to get in touch with his wife and have her drive in as close as possible to me with blankets and cold water. I have no idea how that would have worked out if I was still disabled and stayed that way. But after he felt my head, his decision to convince me to stop and get in shade likely saved my life.

I was younger and healthy, but my body was quitting. I could not drink because the water felt too hot. I was having what I can best describe now as hot chills running through my body.

Neither of us realized that the day would be as hot as it turned out, the highest temperature in something like a decade for that time of year. Maybe knowing that would have changed thinking. The weather report was maybe it would be hot, maybe not. Forecasting has improved a lot since them. We realized that morning at the queue point that it was unusually hot, but both being healthy and young, we set off anyway.

I normally don't talk about stuff like this, but one other poster was being dismissive toward you at times and I felt that I had personal experience that said that you were right.

[pnwmom]

49. Wow. What a story.

We have relatives who have taken us hiking in the desert, and my children have gone with friends, but I've never heard a story like yours before. (The "hot chills" sounds like when I was a child and had pneumonia.)

You were very lucky and I'm so glad you emerged unscathed.

[The Genealogist]

54. I must agree with you

Ironically, the Boy Scout motto is "be prepared." The leaders on this hike should have been trained to know how much water the group needed, and should have prepared accordingly. Perhaps the young man who passed away did have a health issue that lead to his death in this situation. Still, to me, "plenty" of water would mean enough for everyone for the full hike and probably a little left over when they got back.

[dustyscamp]

41. This happened before unfortunately

They should just cancel all Hiking Trips to the Grand Canyon and go on the regular tour bus hike

https://www.hcn.org/issues/86/2666

[NutmegYankee]

71. There is a reason I hiked it in December. nt

[Mosby]

44. Something is odd about this story

It sounds like heat stroke, not dehydration.

You really don't dehydrate to the point of death in that period of time and weather conditions.

I say that as a native of phx who has had to work outdoors, you lose so much water during the day you can't replace it, you rehydrate at night by downing qt bottles of gatoraid.

[Mariana]

45. It does seem there would have to be something else involved.

The story says some of the others were checked out by the rescue personnel, but none of them were bad enough off to need medical treatment.

Maybe something will come out when the autopsy is done.

[pnwmom]

57. So? That's a bit like saying cigarettes aren't bad because not everyone dies of cancer.

They ran out of water at the top of the mountain in the middle of a hike in hot, dry weather. That means they didn't bring enough water -- even if "only" one of the boys died that day. They should have brought or had access to enough water to supply all their needs for the whole hike. Period.

[Mariana]

60. I agree, they should have brought more water.

I also agree with Mosby, in that I think it's likely there was another factor that contributed to his death. As the story in the OP says, "It remained unclear if the lack of water led to the boy's death or if he had some other medical issue."

Here is a link to a more recent story. It says, "The cause of White's death has not yet been released."
https://www.azcentral.com/story/news/local/southwest-valley-breaking/2019/05/08/911-call-boy-scout-who-died-picacho-peak-released/1149373001/

[pnwmom]

62. EVEN IF he also had another medical issue, the lack of water, on a hot, dry, hike

would have contributed to whatever problem he had.

[Mariana]

64. "The cause of White's death has not yet been released."

So, there's no way for us to know, at this point, if it had anything to do with lack of water. I prefer not to draw conclusions based on speculation.

[pnwmom]

67. The scoutmaster on site at the time said they "desperately need water."

And they were in the position to know.

We might never learn more than this, depending on the parent's decision whether to release the info or not.

"Two of our scouts ran out of water. We shared our water. We're now all out of our water," the caller told the 911 operator, adding that the rest of the group was already at the trailhead near their cars.

"We desperately need water," the caller later said.

An additional 911 call was placed by a different caller, who said that one of the scoutmasters was also having heat-related problems. The scoutmaster did not need medical assistance, the report said.

[pnwmom]

63. Thanks for the link. Among other things, it says:

"Two of our scouts ran out of water. We shared our water. We're now all out of our water," the caller told the 911 operator, adding that the rest of the group was already at the trailhead near their cars.

"We desperately need water," the caller later said.

An additional 911 call was placed by a different caller, who said that one of the scoutmasters was also having heat-related problems. The scoutmaster did not need medical assistance, the report said.

[maxsolomon]

47. That makes much more sense

the elevation gain was a cumulative 2000' in 2.7 miles - steep, but not crazy in 90 degree heat.

[pnwmom]

56. But one of the things you need to do to avoid heat stroke is drink enough water.

And they ran out at the top of the mountain with half their hike still to go.

https://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-conditions/heat-stroke/symptoms-causes/syc-20353581

In either type of heatstroke, your condition can be brought on by:

Wearing excess clothing that prevents sweat from evaporating easily and cooling your body
Drinking alcohol, which can affect your body's ability to regulate your temperature
Becoming dehydrated by not drinking enough water to replenish fluids lost through sweating

SNIP

Prevention
Heatstroke is predictable and preventable. Take these steps to prevent heatstroke during hot weather:

Wear loosefitting, lightweight clothing. Wearing excess clothing or clothing that fits tightly won't allow your body to cool properly.
Protect against sunburn. Sunburn affects your body's ability to cool itself, so protect yourself outdoors with a wide-brimmed hat and sunglasses and use a broad-spectrum sunscreen with an SPF of at least 15. Apply sunscreen generously, and reapply every two hours — or more often if you're swimming or sweating.
Drink plenty of fluids. Staying hydrated will help your body sweat and maintain a normal body temperature.

[defacto7]

61. It does sound like a combination of heat stroke and some level if dehydration.

There are a lot of missing pieces to the story that aren't necessarily human error and other possibilities that could be. There is no perfect and solid rule on water consumption because human metabolisms are so different. I'm a person who has hiked in the high desert for decades. I hydrate a day prior, sip small amounts during the hike (less than a quart per 10 miles per day) and rehyderate at the end. It just works for me. I don't know many who are like this but it just shows the differeces in people.
Was he hydrated before he started? Was his pee running clear before? If not, then he was starting out dry. It wouldn't matter how much he drank during the hike because it takes at least a full day to hydrate. He could drink a gallon during the hike and it would mostly run right through him and he'd still be dehydrated. Under such conditions you can actually drink too much water. If you give a dehydrated person too much water, they could die from it. It starves the system of salt. If he was very dehydrated before, hiked hard uphill, drank a ton of water in dry hot conditions... that is very dangerous and no one would have known unless they had checked his urin beforehand.
None of this can be known until after the autopsy.

[NightWatcher]

66. Sounds like they weren't prepared. I thought that was their thing