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Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsEffieblack was right. So far, the courts ARE holding
In fact they're doing more than just holding. They're looking Trump in the eye and say "not on our watch."
"The Judiciary branch is strong and WE. WILL. HOLD"
A few weeks ago, a dear old friend, a Republican-appointed federal judge, trying to console me during a moment of despair about the future of our country, said to me The Judiciary branch is strong and will hold. When I expressed skepticism, he leaned toward me, looked me dead in the eye, and said as firmly as he could without shouting: We are strong and WE. WILL. HOLD.
Today, thanks to Judge Mehta, I think he may be right ...
https://www.democraticunderground.com/100212113242
standingtall
(2,785 posts)but if Trump gets reelected or there are many more republican administrations like Trumps they might not hold. Which is why once we have the Presidency.senate and congress we need to expand the supreme court and add states to protect our reforms to the court.
brer cat
(24,523 posts)K&R
mopinko
(69,990 posts)pretty sure there aint enough money.
i dont think judges are too happy w the top of the doj right now.
nor on the attacks on fbi, et al, and other judges.
i dont think they want to be heroes, but i think they will be.
StarfishSaver
(18,486 posts)since the job pays less than what many first year associates make right out of law school and a fraction of what partners make.
mopinko
(69,990 posts)spent some time on the judicial evaluation committee for my local dem party. twas very interesting.
eta- some seemed to be looking to get their rocks off, and i guess they could land on either side, but i think their institution would seem to be their higher priority. few of them struck me as stupid.
Me.
(35,454 posts)sheshe2
(83,652 posts)So far they are holding and the fact that a Republican appointed judge looked her in the eye and said:
We are strong and WE. WILL. HOLD.
This gives me hope. Fact is not all of the eggs in the basket are good, yet not everyone of them are spoiled.
Love Effie's posts here. I have enjoyed reading yours as well StarfishSaver. Of late I have not been posting all that much since I am doing 24-7 home care for mom.
Glad you are here and a belated welcome to DU.
StarfishSaver
(18,486 posts)sheshe2
(83,652 posts)Keep posting, please.
EffieBlack
(14,249 posts)Thekaspervote
(32,705 posts)sheshe2
(83,652 posts)An old song/ditty came to mind tonight. One about buckling up your seat belts
Buckle up for safety, buckle up. Buckle up it is going to be a bumpy road ahead. We aren't going to see the end soon. However they will pay.
We will buckle up, while they are ALL lawyering up!
Thanks!
EffieBlack
(14,249 posts)Thanks!
sheshe2
(83,652 posts)mcar
(42,278 posts)betsuni
(25,376 posts)oasis
(49,326 posts)uponit7771
(90,301 posts)... Putin prostitution he's respected the courts to some degree.
StarfishSaver
(18,486 posts)He's not dealing with elected state court judges anymore. He's dealing with federal judges who aren't impressed by or afraid of him. And he isn't going up against small contractors who can't afford to fight him because he threatened to put them out of business. He's dealing with the Honorable Nancy D'Alesandro Pelosi and the United States Congress and they're not scared of or playing with him.
sheshe2
(83,652 posts)That would be the Honorable Nancy D'Alesandro Pelosi and the United States Congress, the courts and Democrats. You are right, the Democrats are not the ones who are scared it is donnie and his treasonous cohorts that are terrified.
Turin_C3PO
(13,909 posts)I have to lest I descend into despair.
Honeycombe8
(37,648 posts)But don't forget that the S.Ct. is going to be involved....maybe.
StarfishSaver
(18,486 posts)it will be very difficult for the Supreme Court to overrule in Trump's favor.
Honeycombe8
(37,648 posts)StarfishSaver
(18,486 posts)Especially if all of the appellate courts rule the same way - no need for the Supreme Court to step in
Mister Ed
(5,923 posts)EffieBlack
(14,249 posts)bdamomma
(63,799 posts)take down that bully wanna be dictator.
bitterross
(4,066 posts)Just to make sure I got it correct. I'm certain she posted a quote from her friend. That it wasn't her original statement.
StarfishSaver
(18,486 posts)bitterross
(4,066 posts)I can find things I agree with all day and post them here. It doesn't mean they are original thoughts and I should be credited for them.
I, personally, never want to take credit for someone else's work or statements. If other people do, then I guess that's their business.
StarfishSaver
(18,486 posts)She WAS right.
Although, either way, I don't understand why you're making such a big deal of it.
bitterross
(4,066 posts)If your title were to be correct it should be more like:
EB's opinion that her friend might be right is correct.
From the post:
"Today, thanks to Judge Mehta, I think he may be right ..."
The way your OP title reads it disrespects the person who said the statement to begin with. THAT is the problem I have. I have a problem with the person who made the argument that the judicial WILL. HOLD. isn't getting top credit for their statement. That person is the person who went out on the limb and made a statement of hope in the face of adversity. Not the person, who after the battle is won, say's "Oh, yep, I guess you were right after all."
sheshe2
(83,652 posts)The way your OP title reads it disrespects the person who said the statement to begin with. THAT is the problem I have. I have a problem with the person who made the argument that the judicial WILL. HOLD. isn't getting top credit for their statement.
Disrespects the person that made the statement? What? Which statement? How so?
Late. Gotta go.
bitterross
(4,066 posts)The original statement was made by a person who said the judicial branch would hold. That person deserves the credit for saying that. Not some person who didn't offer the thought in the first place.
Otherwise, I can take credit for saying "We have nothing to fear, but fear itself" simply because I agreed with that statement and posted it.
If I am understanding correctly the member of the judicial branch should be named and that would make you happy? You are saying Effie, unless she reveals the source, that it is not true?
Perhaps I misunderstood, yet not sure why this is such an issue for you. I am sorry, just not understanding your point.
Empowerer
(3,900 posts)sheshe2
(83,652 posts)Thanks, Empowerer.
You made me laugh and I sure as hell needed that tonight.
Empowerer
(3,900 posts)bitterross
(4,066 posts)I can re-post Rachel Maddow all I want when I agree with her. SHE should always be credited as the person who was the one who came up with what was a specific, original statement. Not me, just because I excerpted her statement.
You don't change the attribution for the original to someone who quotes it.
It would be improper to say "bitteross was right on ..." when I was not the person who said "..." but was simply the person who repeated it. It would be proper to say "bitteross was right when he agreed with XYZ who said ..."
In this particular case it's even worse. Support for her friend's position was not granted until there was some judicial act. If EB had come out in full force before any court decision and said "The Judiciary is STRONG. WILL. HOLD" then EB could be credited.
Fact is EB didn't bother to make any statement of support until AFTER the first battle was already won. It's always easy to agree with the current winner. It's a lot more difficult to stand up in front of the cannons.
sheshe2
(83,652 posts)The Velveteen Ocelot
(115,586 posts)Even Gorsuch and Kavanaugh have already sided with the four liberal justices on a couple of cases, so if Trump thinks they'll be his puppets when a case involving him comes before them, I think he's in for a big surprise. For one thing, having lifetime appointments frees them from all future obligations to him, unlike his cabinet officers - who get fired the minute they stop kissing his ass. The Supreme Court doesn't have to kiss anybody's ass. The so-called conservative justices are conservative in the sense that they tend to favor economic interests over civil rights whenever there's a conflict between those two policies. Their constitutional originalism means they will try to interpret the Constitution as meaning exactly what it meant in 1789, which IMO is kind of ridiculous, but with respect to the issues Trump is stirring up, that approach isn't likely to help him because there's nothing in the Constitution that suggests, let alone states specifically, that the president is superior to or more powerful than the other two branches of the government. I don't see them handing Congress' power over to the executive.
And the courts are also very protective of their own role as an equal branch of government. They'll find a way to tell Trump that he's not the boss of them, if it comes to that. Chief Justice Roberts isn't going to want the court with his name attached to it to be delegitimized and go down in history as Trump's tool. If such a case presents itself they will follow the precedent of US v. Nixon because they have no justification for deciding otherwise. And a word about that case: It was decided 8-0, with Rehnquist recusing himself because he'd worked in Nixon's White House. He was Nixon's Bob Barr:
In fall 1971, Nixon received the resignations of two Supreme Court justices, Hugo Black and John Marshall Harlan II. After compiling an initial list of possible appointees that ran afoul of Chief Justice Burger and the American Bar Association, Nixon considered Rehnquist for one of the slots. Henry Kissinger discussed the possible pick with presidential advisor H.R. Haldeman and asked. "Rehnquist is pretty far right, isn't he?" Haldeman responded, "Oh, Christ! He's way to the right of Buchanan," referring to then-presidential advisor Patrick Buchanan...
On the Burger Court, Rehnquist promptly established himself as the most conservative of Nixon's appointees, taking a narrow view of the Fourteenth Amendment and a broad view of state power. Rehnquist almost always voted "with the prosecution in criminal cases, with business in antitrust cases, with employers in labor cases, and with the government in speech cases."
Rehnquist was actually worse than any of the current justices. He had never been a judge of any kind before he was appointed to the Supreme Court; until then he'd spent most of his legal career as a political operative on behalf of the GOP, like Barr. He once wrote that he thought Plessy v. Ferguson was correctly decided! I mention this because, despite their political inclinations and unlike Rehnquist, all of the conservatives on the Supreme Court had been Court of Appeals judges before joining the Supreme Court (so were all of the liberals except for Kagan, who had been the Dean of Harvard Law School). Because all of them had been judges and not political operatives like Rehnquist (or Barr), they will not be thinking like political operatives but like judges. That is, they will follow the law - maybe with a more conservative slant, but they won't ignore it altogether, which is what they would have to do to save Trump.
When the Supremes rule against Trump in some case - and they will, sooner or later - Trump will shit a brick. He will try to defy their order if they order him to do something. He will rant about how "his" justices betrayed him and that they're losers and he never should have appointed them. It will be great fun to watch.
StarfishSaver
(18,486 posts)You should start a thread on this.
GulfCoast66
(11,949 posts)You have some Christofacist like Barr who dont really like liberal democracy at its core.
But many more are small government libertarian types in the way they read the constitution. The last thing they think is constitutional is an imperial president. Not defending them as a whole. They will never rule for an expansive constitution. Many would eliminate SS and Medicare given the chance.
But they will not agree with an all powerful president either.
Personally I would like to scrap the whole thing minus the bill of rights and a strong Supreme Court and become a parliamentary system! But too many Americans have placed the constitution on the level of the Bible. I value neither one as a mystical charter.
On edit: I love Effieblacks posts.
Demovictory9
(32,421 posts)otherwise, it's nothing but life long nutty bigoted judges
StarfishSaver
(18,486 posts)they don't want to let Trump fill their seat.
sheshe2
(83,652 posts)We need them. These men and women are true Americans and I thank them for their sacrifice of retirement for our country and or rule of law.
Empowerer
(3,900 posts)I love this story. Gives me hope.
Gothmog
(144,919 posts)Gothmog
(144,919 posts)Link to tweet
Ramos called Mehtas opinion thorough, and quoted it in his own ruling.
Ramoss decision came after lengthy and contentious oral arguments, during which the judge took pain to grill both sides.
The private attorney representing Trump at the hearing Patrick Strawbridge of Consovoy McCarthy Park stammered as he attempted to respond to an initial volley of questions from Ramos.
brush
(53,740 posts)was too big for Mueller. Now he doesn't even want to testify publicly which would help educate the country as to trump's crimes.
He had his chance and walked up to the edge but wouldn't cross the lineleft it to others.
Skittles
(153,111 posts)oh yes she is