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.99center

(1,237 posts)
Tue May 28, 2019, 12:31 PM May 2019

The Guardian has viewed documents concerning Mueller's shelved obstruction of justice indictment

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2019/may/28/mueller-trump-obstruction-charge-michael-wolff-book-siege-under-fire-news

The Guardian obtained a copy of Siege and viewed the documents concerned.

According to a document seen by the Guardian, the first count, under Title 18, United States code, Section 1505, charged the president with corruptly – or by threats of force or threatening communication – influencing, obstructing or impeding a pending proceeding before a department or agency of the United States.

The second count, under section 1512, charged the president with tampering with a witness, victim or informant.

The third count, under section 1513, charged the president with retaliating against a witness, victim or informant.

Wolff writes that the draft indictment he examines says Trump’s attempts to obstruct justice “began on the seventh day of his administration, tracing the line of obstruction from National Security Advisor Michael Flynn’s lies to the FBI about his contacts with Russian representative[s], to the president’s efforts to have [FBI director] James Comey protect Flynn, to Comey’s firing, to the president’s efforts to interfere with the special counsel’s investigation, to his attempt to cover up his son and son-in-law’s meeting with Russian governmental agents, to his moves to interfere with Deputy Director of the FBI Andrew McCabe’s testimony …”
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The Guardian has viewed documents concerning Mueller's shelved obstruction of justice indictment (Original Post) .99center May 2019 OP
Hope the Guardian doesn't get burned on this the way they did on the Manafort/Assange enough May 2019 #1
Unnnnn, I'm starting to believe the outlets ... the Cohen story was true but the Mueller team ... uponit7771 May 2019 #2
I don't think that guy represented Mueller. gldstwmn May 2019 #3
Bingo! BadgerMom May 2019 #13
Let's hope this is legit and hope the leak forces more. Grasswire2 May 2019 #4
Keep Dan Rather in mind, though..... nt Grasswire2 May 2019 #5
Good Advice.... ewagner May 2019 #20
I have always believed Dan Rather's words were the truth. They vilified him with the document. usaf-vet May 2019 #23
exactly. Karl Rove got him with a bamboozle. Grasswire2 May 2019 #25
Rec 100 times EveHammond13 May 2019 #6
Holy shit! We all know it happened but to see it written like this is still startling. Pepsidog May 2019 #7
Cowardly Defeatists cautioning we need to move slowly to build a convincing case, in 3,2,1... Fiendish Thingy May 2019 #8
+1 Laura PourMeADrink May 2019 #24
I'll be watching this story closely medyhar May 2019 #9
If this story is true, Mueller also needs to provide the House with a copy of his draft indictment. Lonestarblue May 2019 #10
Very worthy questions. They deserve to be asked AND answered under oath. calimary May 2019 #11
It would also force the GOP to deal with it one way, or another. nt Progressive Jones May 2019 #18
Not Hidden -- just Redacted charliea May 2019 #12
Welcome to DU. Irrelevant? Hardly! lagomorph777 May 2019 #15
Problem is Mueller clearly said today that under the DOJ memo, revealing a sealed indictment would Nevermypresident May 2019 #26
Under oath and in public. BadgerMom May 2019 #14
My bet is Barr Curtis May 2019 #16
It is all tittilating marketing for the new book. debsy May 2019 #17
Wouldn't all of Mueller's electronic files be property of the US Congress? nt Progressive Jones May 2019 #19
Not under the current law. They belong to the DOJ tymorial May 2019 #22
K&R UTUSN May 2019 #21

enough

(13,259 posts)
1. Hope the Guardian doesn't get burned on this the way they did on the Manafort/Assange
Tue May 28, 2019, 12:37 PM
May 2019

story last year.

uponit7771

(90,335 posts)
2. Unnnnn, I'm starting to believe the outlets ... the Cohen story was true but the Mueller team ...
Tue May 28, 2019, 12:56 PM
May 2019

... sent out some double speak to make it seem like it wasn't in jist and substance.

Grasswire2

(13,569 posts)
4. Let's hope this is legit and hope the leak forces more.
Tue May 28, 2019, 01:24 PM
May 2019

Good to keep the perfidy in the spotlight EVERY FREAKING DAY.

ewagner

(18,964 posts)
20. Good Advice....
Tue May 28, 2019, 05:55 PM
May 2019

I still believe that Roger Stone and his dirty tricksters had something to do with setting Rather up...

There is also the slime-bag at "Project Veritis" to watch out for....

usaf-vet

(6,181 posts)
23. I have always believed Dan Rather's words were the truth. They vilified him with the document.
Wed May 29, 2019, 08:24 AM
May 2019

A document that was fed to him. So they could put his reporting into question based on a document without answering to the content of the document.

I was an air force medic when GWB was in the reserves. I believe Bush knew he couldn't pass the flight physical because of illicit substances in his system. It was not uncommon to order pilots to pee in the cup without warning. ESPECIALLY with air national guard troops.

Grasswire2

(13,569 posts)
25. exactly. Karl Rove got him with a bamboozle.
Wed May 29, 2019, 12:41 PM
May 2019

Rove was excellent at that kind of trick, from the time he worked for Bush Sr. in TX where he did something similar to win an election.

There was plenty of talk throughout his rise to power about W and cocaine. He did some unexplained community service. Lots of strings to pull, but the stories never made it to the national conversation.

Regarding George and the draft, I did some research in the runup to the election to identify the poor fellow from Midland TX who went to Vietnam in W's place. The person most likely to have replaced him was killed in a rice paddy on his first day there. I have the name tucked away somewhere.

In addition to avoiding Vietnam by getting into the Texas Air National Guard by his daddy's privilege, W went AWOL from his duties. He simply stopped showing up. In wartime. THAT info should have kept him from winning an election. Plenty of citizen investigators put the proof together. A pig farmer in Iowa did the deep dive reseasch and found his records. Dozens of us did everything we could to break that story in the national press. On the Friday before Election Day, Senator Bob Kerrey called a press conference where he planned to ask George W. to explain his absence from duty to the American people. On that day, A FOX affiliate reporter in New England broke the story of W's old DUI. And that obliterated the AWOL story. Karl Rove was a master at obliterating bad news with other news. It's unsettling that Rove is now working with Brad Parscale on the Trump campaign.

There we are.

Pepsidog

(6,254 posts)
7. Holy shit! We all know it happened but to see it written like this is still startling.
Tue May 28, 2019, 01:58 PM
May 2019

And yes let us hope it is true.

Fiendish Thingy

(15,605 posts)
8. Cowardly Defeatists cautioning we need to move slowly to build a convincing case, in 3,2,1...
Tue May 28, 2019, 02:10 PM
May 2019

If Meuller drafted actual indictments, what more proof is need for impeachment?

Lonestarblue

(9,986 posts)
10. If this story is true, Mueller also needs to provide the House with a copy of his draft indictment.
Tue May 28, 2019, 02:35 PM
May 2019

If the draft indictment exists, the next question is why it was not released with the report—or was it and then hidden by Barr?

calimary

(81,238 posts)
11. Very worthy questions. They deserve to be asked AND answered under oath.
Tue May 28, 2019, 02:45 PM
May 2019

Sure seems like it’s high time we started an impeachment inquiry! As I understand it, such an formal inquiry sets the table for all that foot-dragging and refusal to testify and defying subpoenas to be knocked down and cleared away. Puts more teeth into House investigations.

And we all need this!

charliea

(260 posts)
12. Not Hidden -- just Redacted
Tue May 28, 2019, 02:51 PM
May 2019

Since Mueller specifically didn't include an indictment in the final report, there was no need to release any proposed indictment filing. Why clutter the airwaves with irrelevant material?

#RESIST

lagomorph777

(30,613 posts)
15. Welcome to DU. Irrelevant? Hardly!
Tue May 28, 2019, 03:03 PM
May 2019

If we discover that Mueller actually did intend to indict, but Barr blocked him, that is a big deal. The exact opposite of irrelevant in a Barr impeachment inquiry.

Nevermypresident

(781 posts)
26. Problem is Mueller clearly said today that under the DOJ memo, revealing a sealed indictment would
Wed May 29, 2019, 12:51 PM
May 2019

be prohibited . He stated he has and will continue to follow the DOJ memo, therefore, I do not think he would confirm or provide the House with such.

From his press conference today (snipped):

"It explains that under long-standing department policy, a president can not be charged with a federal crime while he is in office. That is unconstitutional. Even if the charge is kept under seal and hidden from public view, that too is prohibited."

https://www.npr.org/2019/05/29/727889232/read-special-counsel-robert-muellers-full-statement?utm_campaign=npr&utm_medium=social&utm_source=twitter.com&utm_term=nprnews

Curtis

(348 posts)
16. My bet is Barr
Tue May 28, 2019, 03:19 PM
May 2019

I bet Barr not only shut down the entire Mueller probe but also didn't include the indictments and told Mueller it isn't his job to indict a sitting president because of the standing DOJ policy to not do so.

Of course we need to have the testimony under oath, and I bet that's why Mueller wants to have it behind closed doors. He knows he isn't allowed to make those statements in public and knows what kind of public uproar it would cause. Of course to do so behind closed doors would continue to he said/he said between the Democrats and the lying GOP, which would get us no where.

In my most humble opinion, beginning an impeachment process with Mueller and his team as the first witnesses walking the entire nation through what happened would be the best thing to happen. Have Mueller testify for a week or so and play out the movie for the world to watch on their television so there's no more hiding behind closed doors or transcripts or ignoring subpoenas. Just do it and get it over with already.

debsy

(530 posts)
17. It is all tittilating marketing for the new book.
Tue May 28, 2019, 05:07 PM
May 2019

My bet is there is no "there" there. Just an attempt to inflate book sales. Corporate America at its finest.

tymorial

(3,433 posts)
22. Not under the current law. They belong to the DOJ
Wed May 29, 2019, 07:23 AM
May 2019

Mueller is a special counsel not an independent counsel. The latter reported to Congress. The special counsel reports to the attorney general.

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