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shockey80

(4,379 posts)
Tue Jun 4, 2019, 02:13 PM Jun 2019

I have bad news. Trump has figured something out.

Trump now knows he is above the law. I hate posting depressing news but this is what I am seeing. The Democrats may have to do something drastic to fix this mess.

Trump now knows if you claim executive privilege, charging people with contempt is pretty much worthless. You can ignore subpoenas, refuse to turn over documents. If you take it to court it can take years. The democrats could try something drastic like inherent contempt, we will have to wait and see. That hasn't happened in about a hundred years.

Mueller set precedent that a sitting president cannot be indicted. There is no law that says a president cannot be indicted. There was no set precedent. There is now.

Right now it doesn't look like Mueller wants to testify.

Trump has total and complete control of the Republicans in congress. They are terrified of him. Trump knows he can get them to block impeachment. The democrats would have to find a smoking gun in order to get the Republicans to impeach. Will the Democrats impeach? No one knows. Right now it doesn't look that way.

That's pretty much where we stand right now. I have been hoping something would happen that would show me that we can stop this lunatic. I'm not seeing it. I see Trump getting stronger by the day. and it is depressing. Something could happen that could change what is happening, but I would not bet on it.

89 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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I have bad news. Trump has figured something out. (Original Post) shockey80 Jun 2019 OP
Hmmmm ... yep, I was thinking similar earlier today, basically tRump does what he damn well pleases RKP5637 Jun 2019 #1
I forgot something that is important. shockey80 Jun 2019 #2
Yep. During Mueller period he placed his chess Laura PourMeADrink Jun 2019 #29
Actually, many report he's terrified. Pelosi wanting him in prison, Hortensis Jun 2019 #86
Well USA, it was a great run but all great things end eventually. Still In Wisconsin Jun 2019 #3
hey, on the bright side, it won't last long anarch Jun 2019 #16
Honestly I think they believe that they could just buy their way out of the effects of CC. Still In Wisconsin Jun 2019 #17
Even the bodies of the dead, the soylent green sources, will run out. erronis Jun 2019 #19
Hicks is turning over documents to Congress NewJeffCT Jun 2019 #4
Will she testify? shockey80 Jun 2019 #5
SOME documents. Grasswire2 Jun 2019 #8
+1 Celerity Jun 2019 #14
He allowed her to turn over campaign docs Laura PourMeADrink Jun 2019 #32
It's otherwise called a Dictatorship. Eyeball_Kid Jun 2019 #6
The Democrats have scads of investigations, but no major Democrat is DemocracyMouse Jun 2019 #62
It doesn't help that both Nadler and Cummings are not in the best of health sop Jun 2019 #66
It doesn't have to be this way. Grasswire2 Jun 2019 #7
Agree Kitchari Jun 2019 #58
+1, there's no reason to think 2020 election will be more free and fair than 2016 uponit7771 Jun 2019 #80
I think you're right and he's being aided and abetted by Barr. Vinca Jun 2019 #9
Yes, we must get rid of him someway and FAST! BigmanPigman Jun 2019 #39
America isn't going down. No way. Chin music Jun 2019 #76
WHO is going to lock them up??? pangaia Jun 2019 #73
trump has learned NOBODY is gonna stop him so why not do what he wants? nt msongs Jun 2019 #10
This answers the question, "What does a narcissistic sociopath with unrestrained power do?" LastLiberal in PalmSprings Jun 2019 #13
Or "if I can kill one person in NYC" why can't I kill a million wherever I want? erronis Jun 2019 #21
I was thinking of the effect of one nuke in downtown Teheran LastLiberal in PalmSprings Jun 2019 #50
I will celebrate D-Day early by reading quotes - DDE and Franklin D Roosevelt.... asiliveandbreathe Jun 2019 #11
Amen. shockey80 Jun 2019 #12
Here's a great interview of DDE 20 years later if you haven't seen it, really worth watching Thekaspervote Jun 2019 #40
Thank you for that - I will watch .. asiliveandbreathe Jun 2019 #49
"They let me do anything..." Blue Owl Jun 2019 #15
No, you haven't. Bernardo de La Paz Jun 2019 #18
And we may find that justice happens after we vote his ass out Ilsa Jun 2019 #22
I sincerely hope you are right. It might be an epic struggle, however. erronis Jun 2019 #24
Yup. . . . nt Bernardo de La Paz Jun 2019 #25
Thank you! Thekaspervote Jun 2019 #27
As near as I can tell Bettie Jun 2019 #47
nor a significant portion of the legislative branch anarch Jun 2019 #53
At many critical junctures, it requires true educated-in-civics citizens to do the right thing Bernardo de La Paz Jun 2019 #54
I was hoping someone would tell me that I was wrong Bettie Jun 2019 #57
Nothing new. He's believed that for decades. TwilightZone Jun 2019 #20
Wrong - Mueller DID NOT set a precedent Auggie Jun 2019 #23
Yes he did. shockey80 Jun 2019 #28
It was never his order or job to indict. You are dead wrong. Auggie Jun 2019 #33
Wrong. Sessions set it. Barr upholds it. It is a RULE. Rules can be changed. Bernardo de La Paz Jun 2019 #41
You are wrong. former9thward Jun 2019 #74
The fact that it's only a rule is still a good point ... mr_lebowski Jun 2019 #77
Thanks. Great summary of the point. . . . nt Bernardo de La Paz Jun 2019 #88
Don't think it was meant in the legal sense Laura PourMeADrink Jun 2019 #34
Trump proves over and over that he does not like American or our way of government. world wide wally Jun 2019 #26
The orange ass is not who we are. SCVDem Jun 2019 #30
Trump always knew he was above the law, why do you think he is acting this way???? mgardener Jun 2019 #31
"the Republicans are cowards" FiveGoodMen Jun 2019 #42
Michael Wolff said Trump's been in litigation for the last 45 years sop Jun 2019 #69
Secure 2020 election!!! Laura PourMeADrink Jun 2019 #35
"I see Trump getting stronger by the day." LiberalLovinLug Jun 2019 #36
good points Locrian Jun 2019 #84
Your "concern" is noted Tarc Jun 2019 #37
His is false knowing. The Law is being adhered to while he sings like the grasshopper he is. ancianita Jun 2019 #38
This isn't on Mueller Dyedinthewoolliberal Jun 2019 #43
He has spent his life getting away with criminal activity Evergreen Emerald Jun 2019 #44
Gloom, despair, and resistance is futile! struggle4progress Jun 2019 #45
He's not above the law, as the recent decisions on Mazars & Deutsche Bank subpoenas show. CaptainTruth Jun 2019 #46
I see that the federal judge who watoos Jun 2019 #48
That was disappointing news. Turin_C3PO Jun 2019 #59
Pray for lightening The Wizard Jun 2019 #51
The founding fathers thought of everything but Trump Ohioboy Jun 2019 #52
it's not Trump... stillcool Jun 2019 #63
I agree. Ohioboy Jun 2019 #72
The way to make liars reveal themselves is to lie to them The Wizard Jun 2019 #55
More than 45, this insanity rests *entirely* on the Republican Party. VOX Jun 2019 #56
Great post. Turin_C3PO Jun 2019 #61
Republicans control 30 state legislatures and Democrats control 18... VOX Jun 2019 #64
We have our work cut out for us. Turin_C3PO Jun 2019 #65
Very true! VOX Jun 2019 #71
I'm sure we'll get a fabled state's rights opinion Buckeyeblue Jun 2019 #85
This is a GREAT post! Poiuyt Jun 2019 #67
A passionate Yes! to this post of yours. Outstanding. And I concur. n/t sprinkleeninow Jun 2019 #75
So correct about 1933, people think it's hyperbole ... It's not and it can happen here uponit7771 Jun 2019 #81
We need some of our Democratic candidates Kitchari Jun 2019 #60
I'm sure he does believe that. Turin_C3PO Jun 2019 #68
100% agree Ferrets are Cool Jun 2019 #70
All Mueller said was that his hands were currently tied by the DOJ which is led by Low Barr cstanleytech Jun 2019 #78
He also said he wouldn't testify outside of the report to congress uponit7771 Jun 2019 #82
I thought Trump blocked that by ordering Low Barr to refuse to comply with anything from Congress cstanleytech Jun 2019 #83
We put more hope in Mueller than we should have. Now he is the only hope to save the Republic if sarabelle Jun 2019 #79
These daily "sky is falling" posts really need at least ONE sentence of positivity. Is that too much hlthe2b Jun 2019 #87
Tomorrow, the sun will come out and the flowers will bloom. shockey80 Jun 2019 #89

RKP5637

(67,112 posts)
1. Hmmmm ... yep, I was thinking similar earlier today, basically tRump does what he damn well pleases
Tue Jun 4, 2019, 02:17 PM
Jun 2019

and there do not seem to be any short term remedies. He could care less about the country, the people or the presidency. To him, it's all a reality show and he's the leading star. I do wonder just how far, how much longer this nonsense is going to continue. If the economy bottoms out the republicans will turn on him like a pit of snakes.

 

shockey80

(4,379 posts)
2. I forgot something that is important.
Tue Jun 4, 2019, 02:22 PM
Jun 2019

Trump has also found an AG who has pretty much admitted he will risk everything to protect Trump. Trump knows he is above the law.

 

Laura PourMeADrink

(42,770 posts)
29. Yep. During Mueller period he placed his chess
Tue Jun 4, 2019, 04:48 PM
Jun 2019

Blockers where they mattered, AG, Head of IRS too. He replaced any potential free thinkers in cabinet. Hired conniving Gulliani. Handpicked SDNY crony. Bet Christopher Wray out next.

Hortensis

(58,785 posts)
86. Actually, many report he's terrified. Pelosi wanting him in prison,
Thu Jun 6, 2019, 07:54 AM
Jun 2019

not just impeached, isn't exactly going to activate his nonexistent sense of humor.

That said, of course, the various techniques involving smashing the law by elected officials (including election theft) takes up all of chapters 3-6, 11-18, and 21-34, finishing up with 43-46 in How to Become a Fascist Dictator for Dummies.

With Republicans in control of the senate, he's not without hope.

 

Still In Wisconsin

(4,450 posts)
3. Well USA, it was a great run but all great things end eventually.
Tue Jun 4, 2019, 02:25 PM
Jun 2019

Welcome to Trumpmerica. Enjoy your stay, work hard, watch Fox News, and don't complain.

anarch

(6,536 posts)
16. hey, on the bright side, it won't last long
Tue Jun 4, 2019, 04:13 PM
Jun 2019

these bastards seem determined to hasten the effects of climate change, which are probably already unavoidable...so how about a nice fascist dictatorship to oversee the collapse of society? That ought to work out well, I'm sure....

 

Still In Wisconsin

(4,450 posts)
17. Honestly I think they believe that they could just buy their way out of the effects of CC.
Tue Jun 4, 2019, 04:18 PM
Jun 2019

Wait until they realize there will be literally NOTHING to eat. No, Donnie, not even KFC.

erronis

(23,880 posts)
19. Even the bodies of the dead, the soylent green sources, will run out.
Tue Jun 4, 2019, 04:36 PM
Jun 2019

Then they turn to their parents, rich relatives, maybe siblings.

Still the hunger and deprivation persists.

Then the children, especially the others' children.

The famine sets in.

Then they try to survive on the remaining body guards.

Then.

Eyeball_Kid

(7,604 posts)
6. It's otherwise called a Dictatorship.
Tue Jun 4, 2019, 02:33 PM
Jun 2019

The entire nation is in serious denial. Trumpy is now our Dictator. He’s proving it every day. He is ignoring subpoenas and Court orders, thus SHOWING that he is superior to both the Legislative and Judicial Branches. Neither branch is asserting its authority. The functional result is that both are acquiescing their authority to Trumpy.

So the game is over. Or so it appears.

Every hour that passes in which Trumpy is not successfully challenged is an hour that this Dictatorship is alive and prospering. And every hour that passes with no direct challenge is an hour of weakening power of both Congress and the Courts. Time is of the essence. But neither the Legislative nor the Judicial branches seem to be up to the task of re-taking their power.

DemocracyMouse

(2,275 posts)
62. The Democrats have scads of investigations, but no major Democrat is
Tue Jun 4, 2019, 09:35 PM
Jun 2019

...giving the play by play. We have no mouthpiece.

Impeach now. Impeach now.

Ok, how's this:
Please, Nancy.

sop

(18,621 posts)
66. It doesn't help that both Nadler and Cummings are not in the best of health
Tue Jun 4, 2019, 10:07 PM
Jun 2019

Maybe it's affecting the process, I don't know.

Grasswire2

(13,849 posts)
7. It doesn't have to be this way.
Tue Jun 4, 2019, 03:02 PM
Jun 2019

Stopping Trump from garnering more power right now, every day unto himself, is MORE IMPORTANT than the political considerations for 2020.

Because, like a juggernaut, the more norms that are broken; the more setbacks to the Rule of Law and the Separation of Powers, the less likely we are able to save ourselves in an election.

Pelosi is wrong to let this dither.

Vinca

(53,994 posts)
9. I think you're right and he's being aided and abetted by Barr.
Tue Jun 4, 2019, 03:06 PM
Jun 2019

It's time to pursue the requests in court and start locking people up for contempt.

BigmanPigman

(55,137 posts)
39. Yes, we must get rid of him someway and FAST!
Tue Jun 4, 2019, 05:08 PM
Jun 2019

Next he is going to kill the ACA...he already is planning it and can do it.

Chin music

(24,999 posts)
76. America isn't going down. No way.
Tue Jun 4, 2019, 11:57 PM
Jun 2019

Like my forefathers, I'd die before I'd turn this country over to dictator don, to destroy the lives of my family. I'm sure I'm not the only one. The most dangerous people, are those with nothing left to lose. Key is to make red dons actions, hurt repubs. dons reign would end real quick.

13. This answers the question, "What does a narcissistic sociopath with unrestrained power do?"
Tue Jun 4, 2019, 04:10 PM
Jun 2019

Answer: Anything he wants.

Remember, this is the man who asked, "If we have nukes, why don't we use them?"

Be afraid, Iran.

erronis

(23,880 posts)
21. Or "if I can kill one person in NYC" why can't I kill a million wherever I want?
Tue Jun 4, 2019, 04:39 PM
Jun 2019

Iran will be harder to handle than some areas of the US. RW death squads?

If it works here, why not in Europe?

Bravo, poutine.

50. I was thinking of the effect of one nuke in downtown Teheran
Tue Jun 4, 2019, 08:29 PM
Jun 2019
https://nuclearsecrecy.com/nukemap/

Here's how it works:

1. Select Tehran from the city pulldown list

2. Choose a yield (I used the W87 Minuteman III warhead - 300 kilotons)

3. Detonate!

Here's the result:



The key is on the right side of the page.

Shhh! Don't tell Fat Donnie!

asiliveandbreathe

(8,203 posts)
11. I will celebrate D-Day early by reading quotes - DDE and Franklin D Roosevelt....
Tue Jun 4, 2019, 03:48 PM
Jun 2019

From Roosevelt -

“With Thy blessing, we shall prevail over the unholy forces of our enemy. Help us to conquer the apostles of greed and racial arrogances. Lead us to the saving of our country, and with our sister nations into a world unity that will spell a sure peace -- a peace invulnerable to the schemings of unworthy men. And a peace that will let all of men live in freedom, reaping the just rewards of their honest toil.”
― Franklin D. Roosevelt


We should never forget those who fought and served and died for their country..WW11

We are in a battle for democracy..again!!!!!!

Thekaspervote

(35,820 posts)
40. Here's a great interview of DDE 20 years later if you haven't seen it, really worth watching
Tue Jun 4, 2019, 05:20 PM
Jun 2019

It has been posted here on DU several times. Good words for the struggles we are facing from a great leader

https://www.cbsnews.com/video/eisenhower-recalls-sacrifices-of-d-day-20-years-later/

Blue Owl

(59,104 posts)
15. "They let me do anything..."
Tue Jun 4, 2019, 04:13 PM
Jun 2019

How I wish something would change this bullshit...

Seriously?! Why is this big dumb idiot allowed to prance around above the law???

Bernardo de La Paz

(60,320 posts)
18. No, you haven't.
Tue Jun 4, 2019, 04:31 PM
Jun 2019

tRump does not know he is above the law. He might wish it so, and he has a compliant AG and has a turtle puppet-master in the Senate. He's hoping he can skate through like he has so many times before. He can hope all he wants but that doesn't make it true.

But he is not above the law. It will take time.

The judiciary and the Intelligence Community and Democrats are fighting back. They will fight harder if he escalates.

Total negativity does not correspond with reality and leads to self-defeatism. It is not useful.

Ilsa

(64,371 posts)
22. And we may find that justice happens after we vote his ass out
Tue Jun 4, 2019, 04:40 PM
Jun 2019

of the White House. There is crap hanging over his head in NY.

erronis

(23,880 posts)
24. I sincerely hope you are right. It might be an epic struggle, however.
Tue Jun 4, 2019, 04:42 PM
Jun 2019

The worms that the RW/anti-democracy groups have inserted into the government are deep.

But the worms are not particularly intelligent and the career personnel know a lot more about government than the whole of the executive branch/appointees.

Bettie

(19,704 posts)
47. As near as I can tell
Tue Jun 4, 2019, 06:14 PM
Jun 2019

all of the actual enforcement comes from the DOJ.

Our DOJ is entirely corrupted at this point.

Who will force him to, say, turn over documents if (when) the courts rule against him? I truly do want to know, because from what I've read, the Marshall service would normally be the agency to deal with such things, but they are led by presidential appointees and governed by the DOJ. Barr can and will simply stop any enforcement action.

Unfortunately, it appears that our system is largely predicated on all branches having at least some decent humans who believe that laws are real and need to be followed. Right now, the executive branch has none.

anarch

(6,536 posts)
53. nor a significant portion of the legislative branch
Tue Jun 4, 2019, 08:47 PM
Jun 2019

and unfortunately their main project right now is packing the judiciary with right-wing ideologues and corporate cronies. It is pretty seriously FUBAR; these assholes have subverted and coopted our entire political system.

Bernardo de La Paz

(60,320 posts)
54. At many critical junctures, it requires true educated-in-civics citizens to do the right thing
Tue Jun 4, 2019, 08:49 PM
Jun 2019

Otherwise the corruption spreads a bit more and gets harder to fight.

Bettie

(19,704 posts)
57. I was hoping someone would tell me that I was wrong
Tue Jun 4, 2019, 09:18 PM
Jun 2019

and there is someone who has the power to make them comply.

TwilightZone

(28,836 posts)
20. Nothing new. He's believed that for decades.
Tue Jun 4, 2019, 04:38 PM
Jun 2019

Doesn't mean it's true.

"Mueller set precedent that a sitting president cannot be indicted."

False.

Auggie

(33,150 posts)
23. Wrong - Mueller DID NOT set a precedent
Tue Jun 4, 2019, 04:41 PM
Jun 2019

He was following instructions from the acting Attorney General.

If you want to blame someone, blame Rod Rosenstein.

Bernardo de La Paz

(60,320 posts)
41. Wrong. Sessions set it. Barr upholds it. It is a RULE. Rules can be changed.
Tue Jun 4, 2019, 05:34 PM
Jun 2019

In this case it will take changing the government and then some legislation.

 

mr_lebowski

(33,643 posts)
77. The fact that it's only a rule is still a good point ...
Wed Jun 5, 2019, 01:15 AM
Jun 2019

It's not a 'legal precedent', therefore no future prosecutors is ever going to go 'Well, Bob Mueller said XYZ, so I have to adhere to that'. A prosecutor's actions don't have that sort of legal weight.

Thus, it's wrong to refer to what Mueller did as 'setting a precedent'. He can't, really.

world wide wally

(21,836 posts)
26. Trump proves over and over that he does not like American or our way of government.
Tue Jun 4, 2019, 04:44 PM
Jun 2019

Go for impeachment and then vote his ass out. There are more of us... Period

 

SCVDem

(5,103 posts)
30. The orange ass is not who we are.
Tue Jun 4, 2019, 04:48 PM
Jun 2019

Better Presidents than him were removed from office.
Resign asshole!

mgardener

(2,360 posts)
31. Trump always knew he was above the law, why do you think he is acting this way????
Tue Jun 4, 2019, 04:49 PM
Jun 2019

He doesn't even think about it. He has had lawyers, money and knew the right people.
He has been doing this for YEARS.

The only difference is that he is doing it in front of the nation and the world and the Republicans are cowards.

sop

(18,621 posts)
69. Michael Wolff said Trump's been in litigation for the last 45 years
Tue Jun 4, 2019, 10:18 PM
Jun 2019

Wolff: "And Trump brags a lot about how long he's been in - how many times he's been in court. He's basically been in litigation for 45 years."

LiberalLovinLug

(14,689 posts)
36. "I see Trump getting stronger by the day."
Tue Jun 4, 2019, 05:00 PM
Jun 2019

Especially if we do not impeach. He is well on his way to increasing his popularity. Because many Americans are conditioned, in part by movies and TV shows (ironically probably most all the actors were liberals) . Where its not about how "bad" you are, its how entertaining, how dominant, how successful, you are as a character. Case in point: Tony Soprano, Walter White, Don Draper, on and on...

And so it will be seen that he is a strong survivor who outlived his enemies. Survivors may not be the best character, (look at the original Survivor in the show of the same name) But they are always respected more than the second place person. Democrats will be painted as cowards, whether THEY think they are doing the 'right' thing by being prudently conservative, or not. They will lose votes from their own base, and they will not gain any new votes from those just outside the party waiting for a reason to vote Democratic.

Locrian

(4,523 posts)
84. good points
Thu Jun 6, 2019, 07:12 AM
Jun 2019

Too many people don't understand that, and how conditioned people are by the US culture. It changes where the battle is being fought (and won).

This is less a legal fight than a culture fight - and all the political calculations, keep your powder dry, behind closed doors strategizing etc isn't going to change that.

ancianita

(43,307 posts)
38. His is false knowing. The Law is being adhered to while he sings like the grasshopper he is.
Tue Jun 4, 2019, 05:03 PM
Jun 2019

He has false temporary leverage.

He's weaker by the day as the process of following The Law continues.

This process of The Law is the Democrats' leverage. The only true, not false, political leverage will be the political leverage given the public when it witnesses the evidence and story of his corruption.

They will then have THE political leverage, and will make it known in 2020.

That's how I see his "above the law" posing.

Dyedinthewoolliberal

(16,211 posts)
43. This isn't on Mueller
Tue Jun 4, 2019, 05:40 PM
Jun 2019

This is on Congress, which means it's on us. Hold your congress person's feet to the fire. Hold them accountable for holding 45 accountable.

Evergreen Emerald

(13,096 posts)
44. He has spent his life getting away with criminal activity
Tue Jun 4, 2019, 05:43 PM
Jun 2019

And the thugs he put in the White House (Barr, etc) are assisting him in his continued criminal enterprise.

They are now openly, and brazenly ignoring the rule of law.

They are equating themselves with royalty. And they expect to replace Orange Trump with a successor from his family. Like Kim does, like the Monarchy does.

It is way past time for us to stand up.

CaptainTruth

(8,200 posts)
46. He's not above the law, as the recent decisions on Mazars & Deutsche Bank subpoenas show.
Tue Jun 4, 2019, 05:58 PM
Jun 2019

Yes, he's going to fight everything in court but I can guarantee you judges aren't going to just throw up their hands & say "golly gee I can't do anything, he's above the law."

Hell no. Think about how the judiciary branch regards & guards its power. You think they're going to roll over & be lap dogs for the executive branch? You think they're just going to give up the co-equal status of their branch of government?

I have not seen a single thing that makes me believe that will happen, & in fact, I've seen things (the Mazars & Deutsche Bank rulings) that show me it WON'T happen.
 

watoos

(7,142 posts)
48. I see that the federal judge who
Tue Jun 4, 2019, 07:13 PM
Jun 2019

ordered the Flynn conversation with the Russian ambassador released, just changed his mind, did a 180. The DOJ doesn't have to release it now, Constitutional crisis averted because they weren't going to release that conversation anyway.

Turin_C3PO

(16,385 posts)
59. That was disappointing news.
Tue Jun 4, 2019, 09:25 PM
Jun 2019

I was hoping Judge Sullivan would at least attempt to send US Marshalls to arrest someone. There was questions of whether the Marshalls would back the Court or the DOJ but I wish he had at least tried to enforce it.

Ohioboy

(3,893 posts)
52. The founding fathers thought of everything but Trump
Tue Jun 4, 2019, 08:43 PM
Jun 2019

They designed a lot of checks and balances, but I think they were counting on future presidents to at least be honorable men ( I'm using "men" because I think that's what they would have said). Apparently the system has flaws when it comes to a complete egotistical con- artist with no character or morals like Trump.

stillcool

(34,407 posts)
63. it's not Trump...
Tue Jun 4, 2019, 09:50 PM
Jun 2019

it's the GOP. They've been cooking up this brew for a long time now, and are one election away from a permanent majority.

Ohioboy

(3,893 posts)
72. I agree.
Tue Jun 4, 2019, 10:47 PM
Jun 2019

But Trump is one of their main tools, and they need a tool like him to help do what they are doing.

The Wizard

(13,735 posts)
55. The way to make liars reveal themselves is to lie to them
Tue Jun 4, 2019, 09:05 PM
Jun 2019

They expect all others to tell the truth. Lying to them gums up their story line. Make them deny the lies by revealing the truth which may not be as bad as the lies, but nonetheless still damning. Once you get them talking / denying, anything can happen. Lack of ethics and morals does not constitute intelligence.

VOX

(22,976 posts)
56. More than 45, this insanity rests *entirely* on the Republican Party.
Tue Jun 4, 2019, 09:13 PM
Jun 2019

It was the GOP that wanted him, and they defend him to the hilt, even in the face of overt law-breaking, and a general attitude of lawlessness.

Republicans have put party over country, and they’d be happy as pigs in shit if their one-party rule never ended. THEY ARE THE ENEMIES OF DEMOCRACY, and need to be voted OUT.

It will take some time and serious resolve, as Republicans have never taken a break from their compulsive power accumulation, in small offices and large. They’ve been chipping away at bedrock American principles since Richard Nixon’s presidency.

I’ve been a proud Democrat since age 21 (couldn’t vote in a general election until age 23), and in all that time, I’ve realized that Democrats’ major weakness is long-standing: EXPECTATIONS.

Expectations of fair play, transparency, adherence to the law, truthfulness, inclusion, mutual cooperation, etc. Conversely, Republicans want none of this, It’s all-or-nothing with them. There is no gambit, no ploy, no smear, no false accusation that’s too low for them. They are long-standing, masterful practitioners of garbage politics. And sadly, it’s often effective.

Republicans in 2019 are to America as the Nazis were to Germany in 1933; sad to say, there’s no hyperbole in that statement. And that’s why impeachment proceedings NOW are a must, as a free and fair 2020 election (and its aftermath) isn’t a sure thing with the current configuration of power in Washington and Moscow.

Turin_C3PO

(16,385 posts)
61. Great post.
Tue Jun 4, 2019, 09:32 PM
Jun 2019

We have to get Republicans out of power in all three government branches as well as remove them from power in individual states. It will take a lot of hard work but Democrats are an absolute majority and demographics are such that our power will only increase with time.

Now, of course, we’ll never get Dems in office if we don’t deal with the GOP’s treason. We must impeach.

Hopefully, best case scenario, is that we elect a Dem President and flip the Senate in 2020. It could be our last chance to save the country.

VOX

(22,976 posts)
64. Republicans control 30 state legislatures and Democrats control 18...
Tue Jun 4, 2019, 10:02 PM
Jun 2019

Compared to 31 and 14 before the 2018 election.

In 21 states, there are both Republican governors and Republican majority legislatures. Democrats have full state control in 14 states.

However, Democrats did gain majorities in six state legislatures/houses: Colorado, Connecticut, Maine, New York, Minnesota and New Hampshire.

https://www.axios.com/midterms-2018-state-legislatures-chambers-democrats-18570e5e-7f5c-4fe3-a4ed-1d14fbd9b5c8.html

Turin_C3PO

(16,385 posts)
65. We have our work cut out for us.
Tue Jun 4, 2019, 10:04 PM
Jun 2019

Some of those states would be Democratic controlled but for gerrymandering.

VOX

(22,976 posts)
71. Very true!
Tue Jun 4, 2019, 10:32 PM
Jun 2019

Unfortunately, the SCOTUS recently punted on the crucial issue of gerrymandering.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.nbcnews.com/news/amp/ncna987516
Supreme Court appears likely to leave issue of partisan gerrymandering to states
The court heard challenges to congressional maps that locked in an advantage for Republicans in North Carolina and that gave an extra seat to Democrats in Maryland.
NBC News
March 26, 2019, 12:56 PM ET
By Pete Williams
WASHINGTON — The Supreme Court appeared unlikely Tuesday to rule that federal courts have a role in deciding how much partisanship is too much when state legislatures draw the maps for voting districts.

In the past, the court has said that because redistricting is essentially a partisan political act, it would be impossible to determine when partisan gerrymandering became unconstitutional. Based on Tuesday's courtroom argument, a majority of the justices have not been persuaded that there's a way around that problem.
<snip>

Buckeyeblue

(6,352 posts)
85. I'm sure we'll get a fabled state's rights opinion
Thu Jun 6, 2019, 07:33 AM
Jun 2019

The problem is that these districts impact not just state legislators but the the House as well. So wouldn't state A which is gerrymandered to elect Republicans impact the rights of state B which is not? You can flip the argument for either party. But the only recourse state B has over state A is federal court.

Anyway, I'm tired of the states rights argument. That argument should have been put to bed with the civil war.

uponit7771

(93,532 posts)
81. So correct about 1933, people think it's hyperbole ... It's not and it can happen here
Wed Jun 5, 2019, 07:08 AM
Jun 2019

Kitchari

(2,951 posts)
60. We need some of our Democratic candidates
Tue Jun 4, 2019, 09:26 PM
Jun 2019

who want to run for the presidential nomination to run for Senate seats instead -- & get rid of the Republican enablers

Turin_C3PO

(16,385 posts)
68. I'm sure he does believe that.
Tue Jun 4, 2019, 10:13 PM
Jun 2019

But he’s terribly mistaken. I firmly believe he will face justice one way or another.

cstanleytech

(28,471 posts)
78. All Mueller said was that his hands were currently tied by the DOJ which is led by Low Barr
Wed Jun 5, 2019, 06:11 AM
Jun 2019

currently.
As for Trump I think legally he had better worry about NY and other states that are investigating him as his pardon power wont help him against state charges unless the state itself acknowledges federal pardons as pardoning for state crimes at the same time.

cstanleytech

(28,471 posts)
83. I thought Trump blocked that by ordering Low Barr to refuse to comply with anything from Congress
Wed Jun 5, 2019, 07:35 AM
Jun 2019

and thus Mueller could not testify for that reason?

 

sarabelle

(453 posts)
79. We put more hope in Mueller than we should have. Now he is the only hope to save the Republic if
Wed Jun 5, 2019, 06:22 AM
Jun 2019

the Democrats will not. He must testify. He must speak to and for the American people. If he does not, it now becomes Mueller whose legacy will bear the brunt of helping Trump to destroy US democracy. Mueller's testimony is so necessary.

FOX and the GOP will bear the label of enablers of the destruction of US democracy.

hlthe2b

(113,971 posts)
87. These daily "sky is falling" posts really need at least ONE sentence of positivity. Is that too much
Thu Jun 6, 2019, 07:58 AM
Jun 2019

to ask? Honestly, you are demoralizing the very DUers we need to take action. I'm no advocate of self-delusion but you daily go too far in the opposite direction.

Do your paragraphs of "all hope is lost" but kindly find ONE thing, just ONE thing to halt a stampede for the proverbial cliff.

 

shockey80

(4,379 posts)
89. Tomorrow, the sun will come out and the flowers will bloom.
Thu Jun 6, 2019, 03:22 PM
Jun 2019

Trump will be impeached and all the Republicans in the Senate will come to their senses and convict Trump. Barr and all of Trumps band of crooks will all be convicted and sent to prison. How's that , better?

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