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left-of-center2012

(34,195 posts)
Sun Nov 10, 2019, 12:55 PM Nov 2019

The end of Florida orange juice? A lethal disease is devastating the state's citrus industry.

Ninety percent of the state’s groves are infected by a bacterium called huang long bing, which, like oranges, originated in China. The pathogen often prevents raw green fruit from ripening, a symptom called citrus greening. Even when the fruit does ripen, it sometimes drops to the ground before it can be picked. Under Florida law, citrus that falls from a tree untouched cannot be sold.

As the state prepares for the November to May harvest, thousands of growers have already quit, leaving “ghost groves” in their wake. More than 7,000 farmers grew citrus in 2004; since then, nearly 5,000 have dropped out.

About two-thirds of the factories that processed fruit to juice have shut down. The number of packing operations – which make oranges, tangerines and grapefruit look polished for picky buyers – has nosedived from nearly 80 to 26. And 34,000 jobs were eliminated in the 10 years up to 2016, according to a University of Florida study.

The loss of so many farmers and citrus cultivation could be the death the state’s second-largest industry behind tourism, and one that produces more than 80 percent of the country’s orange juice, some economists say.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/climate-environment/2019/11/09/end-florida-orange-juice-lethal-disease-is-decimating-its-citrus-industry/

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The end of Florida orange juice? A lethal disease is devastating the state's citrus industry. (Original Post) left-of-center2012 Nov 2019 OP
I could say something snarky about FL voting, but this just sucks RainCaster Nov 2019 #1
That citrus disease is also in California, and threatens all citrus growing MineralMan Nov 2019 #2
What Disney and growth didn't remove, this disease can. Sad to see. Grew up playing in groves. dameatball Nov 2019 #3
What percentage of Florida did Disney 'remove'? left-of-center2012 Nov 2019 #5
It wasn't just Disney that removed the groves. It was more the value of real estate for the "boom" dameatball Nov 2019 #6
well, that's one opinion n/t left-of-center2012 Nov 2019 #10
Indeed. There seem to be a lot of opinions on DU....:) dameatball Nov 2019 #12
I remember visiting all these wacky side attractions when I went there as a kid in the 80s. NCLefty Nov 2019 #22
The area between where I live on the edge of Ocala and Orlando used to be saturated with orange Blue_true Nov 2019 #19
"huang long bing, which originated in China" left-of-center2012 Nov 2019 #4
Yeah, I did a double take on that one too. nt Blue_true Nov 2019 #20
How depressing. smirkymonkey Nov 2019 #7
This one's globalization, not climate change. Igel Nov 2019 #17
Still, uncontrolled capitalism, fueled by republicans. They are destroying our environment smirkymonkey Nov 2019 #18
I wonder how much of it is due to a change in growing methods. Blue_true Nov 2019 #21
And Trump has crippled the govt agencies that do (did) research to combat diseases like this. CaptainTruth Nov 2019 #8
I wonder if that's the problem with the oranges I'm finding at the grocery store. Vinca Nov 2019 #9
No LeftInTX Nov 2019 #13
When I moved to FL 24 years ago coeur_de_lion Nov 2019 #11
Looks like Trump visited the orange groves, and he touched some. Everything he touches dies. NCjack Nov 2019 #14
This is a job for . . .Katherine Harris and Celestial Drops!! hatrack Nov 2019 #15
This same story Sogo Nov 2019 #16
Wasn't that an Eddie Murphy/Dan Akroyd movie? (nt) Recursion Nov 2019 #23
Apologies for getting sidetracked on a very good OP. Wasn't my intention, just a thought. dameatball Nov 2019 #24
Citrus growers have been worried about this for at least twenty years csziggy Nov 2019 #25
Thanks for the info. elleng Nov 2019 #26
It seems to me it just gets harder and harder to grow anything. Farmer-Rick Nov 2019 #27
I hadn't heard of this before Trump became a resident. gibraltar72 Nov 2019 #28
Probably CBW from California orange growers tirebiter Nov 2019 #29

RainCaster

(10,842 posts)
1. I could say something snarky about FL voting, but this just sucks
Sun Nov 10, 2019, 12:59 PM
Nov 2019

I had no idea the citrus industry was doing so poorly.

MineralMan

(146,262 posts)
2. That citrus disease is also in California, and threatens all citrus growing
Sun Nov 10, 2019, 01:02 PM
Nov 2019

there, too, although it has not advanced to the same degree as in Florida. Orange growers everywhere are very, very worried about this, and rightly so.

dameatball

(7,394 posts)
6. It wasn't just Disney that removed the groves. It was more the value of real estate for the "boom"
Sun Nov 10, 2019, 01:30 PM
Nov 2019

that followed. Land was worth more for developing than growing citrus. Freezes in the 80's did a lot of damage too. After Disney, every type of "World:" you can imagine followed along. So did the thousands upon thousands of lousy paying service jobs. Everyone needed housing.

NCLefty

(3,678 posts)
22. I remember visiting all these wacky side attractions when I went there as a kid in the 80s.
Mon Nov 11, 2019, 02:37 AM
Nov 2019

Ooo kids look, it's "Circus World!"

Thing was probably staffed by pedos. :p

Blue_true

(31,261 posts)
19. The area between where I live on the edge of Ocala and Orlando used to be saturated with orange
Sun Nov 10, 2019, 08:21 PM
Nov 2019

groves. Now that stretch is almost all retirement communities, including the massive Villages retirement community. The point that the poster made is valid for groves that were near major or decently large secondary roads. Even secondary roads from my youth have become major highways to support all the housing development. Florida is more than Disney, in fact a few of the old time tourist traps have closed down. Florida has a massive medical services infrastructure (Doctors, Nurses, hospitals, labs, ambulance companies), massive! The people that work in that industry are fairly well paid when compared to less skilled Floridians, they have purchased millions of homes, often in new developments that used to be orange groves.

 

smirkymonkey

(63,221 posts)
7. How depressing.
Sun Nov 10, 2019, 01:36 PM
Nov 2019

I keep hearing news like this, that our food sources are in peril and there is little that can be done about it unless environmental issues are addressed seriously. However as long as republicans are in power this is an issue that will never be on the front burner, if it is even addressed at all.

Igel

(35,274 posts)
17. This one's globalization, not climate change.
Sun Nov 10, 2019, 05:36 PM
Nov 2019

Until a strain that's immune to the virus is found, the number of groves will just continue to decrease.

It's like the demise of the Cavendish banana, going the same way as the Gros Michel. There are bananas that are immune to the new fungus, but they're not as popular or standardized. (I like some of them, but they're not always perfectly that unctuous "banana flavor" that people seem to prefer.)

 

smirkymonkey

(63,221 posts)
18. Still, uncontrolled capitalism, fueled by republicans. They are destroying our environment
Sun Nov 10, 2019, 06:35 PM
Nov 2019

and our food sources out of unmitigated greed. Nothing will stop them before it's all too late.

Blue_true

(31,261 posts)
21. I wonder how much of it is due to a change in growing methods.
Sun Nov 10, 2019, 08:30 PM
Nov 2019

When I was a youth I played around in orange groves. They had a lot of weeds and plant growth other than the trees in them. That growth was normally ploughed under before the harvest started. Groves that I have seen recently are perfect rows of trees with nothing else there. Maybe the chemicals in some of the weeds protected the orange trees against blight, that is not unheard of with some plant types (the beneficial relationship between tomatoes and basil for example).

CaptainTruth

(6,576 posts)
8. And Trump has crippled the govt agencies that do (did) research to combat diseases like this.
Sun Nov 10, 2019, 01:47 PM
Nov 2019

Will the farmers understand that? Not unless Democrats explain it to them. Hence the importance of effective messaging.

Vinca

(50,237 posts)
9. I wonder if that's the problem with the oranges I'm finding at the grocery store.
Sun Nov 10, 2019, 01:50 PM
Nov 2019

99 cents apiece for these things and when you cut into them they're tasteless, fibrous bits of horror. I've finally given up on them in favor of clementines.

LeftInTX

(25,137 posts)
13. No
Sun Nov 10, 2019, 03:28 PM
Nov 2019

Groves are constantly scouting for citrus greening. There are quarantines etc. Can't move citrus trees into and out of certain counties in Texas. I'm sure Florida is much stricter.

I don't know what's going on with the oranges in your store......Did you know that an orange is not a natural occurring fruit? It's a hybird between a mandarin and a pomelo (a large grapefruit type fruit).

Pomelo:



Mandarins will always have thinner skin than oranges, simply because of the pomelo parentage in sweet oranges.
Clementines are a mandarin.

coeur_de_lion

(3,676 posts)
11. When I moved to FL 24 years ago
Sun Nov 10, 2019, 02:25 PM
Nov 2019

The area where I live was (seemed to me) about half citrus groves and half cattle ranches.

I made the mistake of calling the groves orchards and I was scolded severely.

Now both the groves and the ranches are disappearing in favor of housing developments. Dozens of them.

One die hard citrus farmer around the corner from me keeps re-planting every time a disease takes out his groves. He sold most of his land to a housing development and (I suppose) used the money to re-plant and keep his remaining trees alive.

The scent of orange blossoms in March is so heavenly I can't even describe it. We make a point of walking the dog past his house so we can take in the beautiful perfume. It used to be that the whole town had the scent of orange blossoms but most of the groves are gone now.

I feel sad that Florida is changing like this.

I know most people think that Florida is beaches and knuckle dragging MAGA supporters. It's true that many in my town are republicans. But it is so beautiful where I live. I tried living nearer the beach for 6-7 years and missed my little rural town.

Florida is more than hanging chads and thieving republican politicians. I wish people from other states wouldn't assume all of us are MAGA supporters. Our elections have been stolen many times over now.

hatrack

(59,578 posts)
15. This is a job for . . .Katherine Harris and Celestial Drops!!
Sun Nov 10, 2019, 05:19 PM
Nov 2019

No, I am not making this up.

Four years ago, as the state labored to eradicate citrus canker by destroying trees, officials rejected other disease-fighting techniques, saying unproven methods would waste precious time and resources. But for more than six months, the state, at the behest of then-Secretary of State Katherine Harris, did pursue one alternative method -- a very alternative method.

Researchers worked with a rabbi and a cardiologist to test "Celestial Drops," promoted as a canker inhibitor because of its "improved fractal design," "infinite levels of order" and "high energy and low entropy." But the cure proved useless against canker. That's because it was water -- possibly, mystically blessed water. The "product is a hoax and not based on any credible known science," the state's chief of entomology, nematology and plant pathology wrote to agriculture officials and fellow scientists after testing Celestial Drops in October 2001.

In the same letter, Wayne Dixon recommended that the state break off its relationship with the promoters of Celestial Drops. "We have expended considerable effort in trying to responsibly deal with this group and their products," he stated. "I wish to maintain our standing in the scientific community and not allow these individuals to use our hard-earned credibility for further name-dropping." Dixon's sentiments were not a surprise to other scientists.

"The presentation of Celestial Drops as a citrus canker treatment was . . . largely unintelligible," according to a memo written more than a year earlier by one of the state's chief plant pathologists. "In general, the proposal comes across as unscientific and not worth pursuing." So why did Florida spend months discussing and developing test protocols for Celestial Drops? The initial push came from Harris, now a U.S. House representative and candidate for U.S. Senate. Harris, the granddaughter of legendary citrus baron Ben Hill Griffin Jr., said she was introduced to one of the product's promoters, New York Rabbi Abe Hardoon, in 2000.

EDIT

https://www.orlandosentinel.com/news/os-xpm-2005-07-05-canker05-story.html

Sogo

(4,986 posts)
16. This same story
Sun Nov 10, 2019, 05:24 PM
Nov 2019

....went around a few years ago....yet there didn't seem to be any scarcity or lack in quality.....

Does this story get floated so they can up the prices?

I'm suspicious....

csziggy

(34,131 posts)
25. Citrus growers have been worried about this for at least twenty years
Mon Nov 11, 2019, 10:28 PM
Nov 2019

My family owned groves since the 1920s when Grandfather bought land during the Florida land bust and my Dad and his brother helped plant the first citrus trees on them about 1928.

We just sold the last of our groves this year. Although our trees and the surrounding groves have not shown any symptoms of greening, they have had severe losses from the increasing freezes - one grove was decimated by the 1989 freeze and the trees we planted to replace them were not mature by the next bad freeze. Then a lot were damaged by the hurricanes of 2004.

Our grove managers recommended taking out the orange trees and planting other crops, such as blueberries, but since my Dad died in 2013, none of us kids were interested in keeping the groves. One went to the grove manager, the other to a family that wants to keep them in citrus.

I wish them all the best, but I don't even like oranges or orange juice, so I am happy to be done with the business.

Farmer-Rick

(10,140 posts)
27. It seems to me it just gets harder and harder to grow anything.
Mon Nov 11, 2019, 10:45 PM
Nov 2019

I use to have a garden as a kid. Grew most anything I wanted without too much insect or fungal problems. Today if I don't plan for how to fight fungal disease and insects, I will have nothing when harvest time comes.

Marmorated stink bugs, Colorado and blister beetles, weird out of control weeds and milky spore fungus. I never knew any of these things as a kid but I harvested most everything I planted. Not anymore.

tirebiter

(2,533 posts)
29. Probably CBW from California orange growers
Tue Nov 12, 2019, 01:30 AM
Nov 2019

They’ll be dropping dead when they have to eat noncalfornia oranges at the Arizona border.

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