****LIVE IMPEACHMENT TRIAL 1/31/20 THREAD 1****

[BumRushDaShow]

[hlthe2b]

1. So will they all find a way to IGNORE the latest Bolton bombshell?

[avebury]

4. What was the latest Bolton

bombshell?

[Kali]

5. ...

https://www.democraticunderground.com/10142426605

and

https://www.democraticunderground.com/100212933543

[Hermit-The-Prog]

12. Thanks for those links! ...

I missed both stories.

The first one would trigger at least one subpoena if this were a real, sane trial.

The second looks more like politico trying to stir the pot with speculation.

[bdamomma]

94. Wow thank you

Kali, for posting these, I feel a little better by reading this. I do not want to hear anyone crowing especially Moscow Mitch and tRump the thug.

[Kali]

95. I don't know that it matters, but things are so crazy...

the chaos of drumpf affects everything

[lamp_shade]

2. Sippylinni will deny it. He'll call Bolton a liar. Watch.

[BumRushDaShow]

7. But Bolton was in

[csziggy]

85. I like Randy Rainbow's version even if it was done before the Ukraine mess began

[lamp_shade]

3. I'll bet NSC labeled this story "top secret".

[in2herbs]

6. Doesn't the House still have an opportunity to make CJR expose his prejudice by forcing him to make

a judicial decision about whether to call witnesses?

[BumRushDaShow]

9. I would think they would have to vote to amend the current Rules to do that

and obviously Democrats are in the minority and would not be able to pass any amendments without GOP support.

[BumRushDaShow]

8. ***SENATE CAMERA FEED IS ON***

[BumRushDaShow]

10. I think I heard Steve Scully on CSPAN2 say that Roberts was still in court

[mahatmakanejeeves]

11. Executive Privilege has now been officially waived with this tweet. Defense lawyers have to answer.

Kevin M. Kruse Retweeted

Executive Privilege has now been officially waived with this tweet. Defense lawyers have to answer to this today.

Link to tweet

POTUS statement: “I never instructed John Bolton to set up a meeting for Rudy Giuliani, one of the greatest corruption fighters in America and by far the greatest mayor in the history of N.Y.C., to meet with President Zelensky. That meeting never happened”

Link to tweet

[Mersky]

15. Ha, Impotus just can't help himself.

[AtheistCrusader]

93. This is why it's imperative for Bolton to testify. Because Trump can't.

The only way Trump testifies on this, is if the secret service arrests every one of his defense lawyers, for trying to physically stop Trump from walking onto the senate floor.

[BumRushDaShow]

13. Turtle has entered the chamber

....real turtle like.

[Mersky]

22. Then was all, lettuce prey

Before pledging allegiance for unknown reasons.

[BumRushDaShow]

14. ***IN SESSION - BENEDICTION***

"We reap what we sow..."

(I swear this guy is amazing )

[irisblue]

16. Chaplin sounds kinda pissed.

[Hermit-The-Prog]

17. that pledge of allegiance looks more like mockery

[better]

18. Wow, this benediction...

he ain't holding back!

[BumRushDaShow]

19. ***DEPUTY SERGEANT OF ARMS PROCLATION***

[BumRushDaShow]

20. Turtle - 2 hours in there will be a break

[BumRushDaShow]

21. Roberts - There will be 4 hours of debate divided equally - House Managers up first.

[Hermit-The-Prog]

23. local ABC cut to regular programming

[BumRushDaShow]

24. Schiff - indicates that they will reserve balance of time to rebut the other side

[BumRushDaShow]

25. Schiff is reading the latest bombshell from the NYT regarding Bolton.

AND he has a slide up there!!

[gademocrat7]

27. Way to Chairman Schiff.

[denem]

26. Murkowski 'No' on witnesses.

[BumRushDaShow]

28. Yup - just saw that breaking news

[Hermit-The-Prog]

30. Moscow Mitch didn't want a tie vote. rubles talk.

[Mersky]

29. Slide: NYT - Bolton says tRump's aides heard the pResident

Bolton says tRump’s aides heard the pResident ask him in the Oval Office to help pressure Ukraine

The newest revelations from the book by President Trump’s former national security adviser, John R. Bolton, put top aides in the room when Mr. Trump asked Mr. Bolton to help with his pressure campaign on Ukraine.

Mr. Trump gave the instruction, Mr. Bolton wrote, in the Oval Office in early May and in front of the acting White House chief of staff, Mick Mulvaney, the president’s personal lawyer Rudolph W. Giuliani and the White House counsel, Pat A. Cipollone, who is now leading the president’s impeachment defense.

The account supports testimony from witnesses who testified in the House impeachment inquiry, including Gordon D. Sondland, who said that “everyone was in the loop.”

https://www.nytimes.com/live/2020/trump-impeachment-trial-01-31



https://www.c-span.org/video/?c4851265/user-clip-schiff-covers-nyt-bolton-piece

Go to 01:10 for the slide.

[Hermit-The-Prog]

31. Val Demings up

[Kali]

33. I don't like her necklace.

[BumRushDaShow]

32. Val Demmings (D-FL) up a part of the House Managers debate

[Mersky]

34. Slide: Importance of Obtaining Evidence

Last edited Fri Jan 31, 2020, 04:28 PM - Edit history (1)

Fundamental fairness requires evidence in trials

History And Precedent: New evidence in all 15 full Senate impeachment trials
1. Witnesses in every trial
2. Average witnesses heard: 33
3. Hundreds or thousands of pages of new documents

[BumRushDaShow]

35. Demmings - Is this a fair trial? No!

[BumRushDaShow]

36. Demmings said that they were going to discuss Bolton's manuscript

[Hermit-The-Prog]

37. Demings: "We are simply asking you to follow the Senate's own unbroken record."

[Mersky]

38. Slide: Hundreds of Years of Precedent

Last edited Fri Jan 31, 2020, 04:45 PM - Edit history (2)

Impeached Official - # Witnesses

Judge Pickering (1804) - 11
Justice Chase (1805) - 49
Judge Peck (1830-31) - 19
Judge Humphreys (1862) - 9
President Johnson (1868) - 40
Sec. of War Belknap (1876) - 40
Judge Swayne (1905) - 44
Judge Archibald (1913) - 112
Judge Louderback (1933) - 44
Judge Ritter (1936) - 25
Judge Claiborne (1986) - 19
Judge Hastings (1989) - 55
Judge Nixon (1989) - 3
Judge Porteous (2010) - 26


Average # Witnesses per Senate Trial: 33

[BumRushDaShow]

39. Demmings is handing off to Sylvia Garcia (D-TX) to continue the debate

[Hermit-The-Prog]

40. Garcia: "The Trump administration has not produced a single document ..."

[BumRushDaShow]

41. Garcia is reiterating the total blocking of all witnesses and documents from any agency

[Hermit-The-Prog]

42. Garcia plays clip of Cipollone claiming House managers hid facts

[elleng]

56. THAT's rich!!!

[BumRushDaShow]

43. Garcia is playing clips of Cippycup

WH counsel cherry-picked transcripts and left out the revised statements by witnesses that reversed their original testimony.

[Hermit-The-Prog]

44. Garcia: "If he is innocent, he should have nothing to hide ..."

[Mersky]

45. Video of Garcia's presentation regarding Cippy's claims

Last edited Fri Jan 31, 2020, 03:26 PM - Edit history (2)

https://www.c-span.org/video/?c4851289/user-clip-garcia-reviews-wh-counsel-claims

Go to 03:50 for Cippy footage

[nolabear]

46. Late here but been listening. That CHAPLAIN!! 😍

He went Samuel L. Jackson on them! I wish I had it on loop.

[BumRushDaShow]

47. Most important thing is not wether to acquit or convict.

It's whether the American people can get a fair trial. Americans deserve a fair trial.

Slide - 3/4 of voters - believe trial should have witnesses.

[Hermit-The-Prog]

48. Crow: 4 key witnesses: Bolton, Mulvaney, Blair, Duffey

[BumRushDaShow]

49. Garcia has handed off to Jason Crow to continue

[BumRushDaShow]

50. Crow is playing clips of the WH counsels.

[Hermit-The-Prog]

51. Crow: clip of WH counsel, tweets by trumPutin

[Mersky]

52. Slide: NYT - tRump Tied Ukraine Aide to Inquiries He Sought, Bolton Book Says

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/01/26/us/politics/trump-bolton-book-ukraine.html

(Paywall, d’oh! I’ll add excerpts, later.)

[BumRushDaShow]

53. Crow - Bolton was there and called the scheme a "drug deal"

All questions we can get the answers to.

[BumRushDaShow]

54. Bolton has direct evidence of what Ghouliani's role was.

Let's ask John Bolton what Ghouliani WAS doing. He would know.

Also called him a "hand grenade".

[Hermit-The-Prog]

55. Crow uses a sequence of slides to argue 5 key reasons to call Bolton as a witness

[Hermit-The-Prog]

57. Crow uses another clip of WH counsel false claims -- they're "disingenuous"

[BumRushDaShow]

58. Crow conclusion - our place in history - "Let's hear the truth or we don't want to hear it"

[Hermit-The-Prog]

59. Jeffries shows slide of 4 key reasons Mulvaney should be a witness

[BumRushDaShow]

60. Crow handed off to Hakeem Jeffries (D-NY) to continue...

[Mersky]

61. Slide: Bolton quote from 1/30/20

“The idea that somehow testifying to what you think is true is destructive to the system of government we have — I think, is very nearly the reverse — the exact reverse of the truth,” said Bolton.

[BumRushDaShow]

62. Jeffries discussing Mulvaney (with a slide listing motives)

Let's just hear from Mulvaney.

[BumRushDaShow]

63. Jeffries playing clips of Fiona Hill's testimony about Mulvaney...

[mahatmakanejeeves]

64. Murkowski: "The congress has failed."

From https://twitter.com/washingtonpost

Murkowski: "The congress has failed."

Link to tweet

LISA MURKOWSKI: “It has also become clear some of my colleagues intend to further politicize this process, and drag the Supreme Court into the fray, while attacking the Chief Justice. I will not stand for nor support that effort."

Link to tweet

[Hermit-The-Prog]

67. Murkowski's tiny fig leaf is insufficient to cover her cowardice

[madaboutharry]

80. I think this statement is nonsense.

It is the statement of a coward. She is throwing her hands up in the air and claiming it’s just too hard.

[BumRushDaShow]

65. Jeffries played extended clip of Mulvaney leading to his "Get over it" comment

[Mersky]

75. "Get Over It" VIDEO LINK

https://www.c-span.org/video/?c4851299/user-clip-jeffries-reviews-get-it

[Miles Archer]

66. Showing the Mulvaney "GET OVER IT" clip

So even if Mickey didn't testify, he's now in the official trial record.

[BumRushDaShow]

68. Jeffries focussing on Duffy (OMB)

[Mossfern]

69. Unfortunately

the trial record means nothing to the Republicans in the Senate.

Only time will tell of the grave consequences of this debacle.

[BumRushDaShow]

70. Running through the time line of the funds hold

and how DOD could no longer support this view. DOD was told by Duffy that there was a "clear direction from POTUS to continue the hold", after warning the hold was unlawful.

[BumRushDaShow]

71. Jeffries ends with - "No one is above the law" and hands off to Zoe Lofgren (D-CA)

[BumRushDaShow]

72. Lofgren is now going over the issue of documents that have being blocked

including the handwritten notes and policy memoranda....

I think it's a cover-up.

[Tommy_Carcetti]

73. Question: Can the House Managers divide their time?

They're given 2 hours....could they keep a half hour for rebuttal?

I really would love to see them put the double-whammy on Cippilone after he attempts to explain away his lying.

[Kali]

78. I am pretty sure Schiff reserved the balance of their time for rebuttal.

[nolabear]

74. I know they're tired but I wish they'd show some outrage.

Schiff’s anger at the outset was enlivening. We need for them to yell this at the tops of their lungs. They sound like they’re asking, not demanding.

[Kali]

76. I think they will get to rebutt the butts

I bet that will have some passion.

[nolabear]

87. I hope so.

[BumRushDaShow]

77. Lofgren reiterating all the previous National Security Advisors had testified for Congress

Had slide showing them.

[Hermit-The-Prog]

79. hanging on every word of Lofgren; meticulous without pendantry, clear, on point

[BumRushDaShow]

81. Lofgren has handed off to Schiff...

[Mersky]

82. Slide: A Fair Trial Requires Witnesses and Documents

1. The pResident’s obstruction compels subpoenas.
2. The Senate requires a complete record.
3. The pResident should want a fair trial.
4. The American people deserve a fair trial.
5. The requested witnesses and documents are necessary.
6. The subpoenas will not cause delay.
7. The pResident has no basis to block these witnesses and documents.
8. A “No” vote will have long-lasting, harmful consequences

___
Each manager has been working through this list. Garcia addressed item 7, before handing the floor over to Schiff.

[BumRushDaShow]

83. Schiff - if this is voted on to have no witnesses it will set a dangerous and long-lasting precedent

[Hermit-The-Prog]

84. Schiff: "If the Senate allows ... obstruction to stand ... nullifies the impeachment process"

[Tommy_Carcetti]

86. Damn, Schiff is good.

I mean, really, really, really good.

[nolabear]

88. He is. I hope we see a lot of him in the future.

[BumRushDaShow]

89. Schiff - Assure the American people that they get a fair trial.

Otherwise the government has become arbitrary.

[woodsprite]

96. Actually, the Govt. has become an accessory. nt

[BumRushDaShow]

90. ****15 MINUTE RECESS****

[Hermit-The-Prog]

91. Moscow Mitch wants a recess. Probably to continue coordinating with accused.

[BumRushDaShow]

92. ****LIVE IMPEACHMENT TRIAL 1/31/20 THREAD 2**** UP

https://www.democraticunderground.com/100212934619