If you are here to spread the toxic cancerous message

[ibegurpard]

That we are doomed and just need to pack it in and nothing can be done then please just leave. We don't need that shit here.

[GoneOffShore]

1. As a friend of mine would say: Too fecking right!

[ibegurpard]

3. I'm not talking about the people who are down or worried

So am I. it's one thing to look for support. It's another to just say "we're fucked and there's nothing we can do."
If that's the point of view someone is going to push then just leave.

[Stinky The Clown]

5. Can you please post examples of such threads?

[ibegurpard]

7. One that I replied to was self-deleted by the author

https://www.democraticunderground.com/100212981752

Here's another one
https://www.democraticunderground.com/100212981941

[usaf-vet]

29. It was self deleted so I could make it a full post. Yes I am concerned and stated my opinion. BUT..

.....this statement was in both versions.

For me, I will vote blue no matter who.
https://www.democraticunderground.com/100212981941
https://www.democraticunderground.com/100212981752

I am 73. I have voted in every election since I turned 18. I have always voted like my dad DEMOCRATIC. Nothing will change this time.

I hope I'm wrong and Trump will be gone but I'm not sticking my head in the sand.
Remember Hillary was going to win in 2016 hands down. Until Trump was elected President!

Please consider that none of the promised from any democratic candidate will ever see the light of day if Trump steals a second term.

Sorry I am not going anywhere.

[usaf-vet]

84. How about these post. Should these DUers leave too?

Last edited Thu Feb 13, 2020, 03:19 PM - Edit history (1)

The tide is turning. Others are seeing the way to beat Trump.

The key is being able to spend 1,000,000,000 or 10,000,000,000 or even 100,000,000,000 if necessary TO BEAT TRUMP

Here is my post from yesterday with some emphasis added to my key phrases.
Re-read it, I even spelled out the necessary steps as I see them, to beat Trump in 2020 and what to do between 2020 and 2024.
https://www.democraticunderground.com/100212981941

Here is what DUers are saying today.
They seem to see what I see one person can compete, toe to toe, dollar to dollar. TO BEAT TRUMP
https://www.democraticunderground.com/1287512384
https://www.democraticunderground.com/1287511234
https://www.democraticunderground.com/1287511453
https://www.democraticunderground.com/1287512290
https://www.democraticunderground.com/1287511687
https://www.democraticunderground.com/1287511762
https://www.democraticunderground.com/1287512334

And I still believe this from yesterday:
Trump's post impeachment behavior leads me to believe he's convinced 2020 is already a done deal.

[SWBTATTReg]

2. Thanks. I do get tired of hearing these doom and gloom scenarios, seemingly every 5 ...

minutes or so, if the nominee is person XXX, then we're doomed, if issue is XXX, and we do TTT about it, then we're doomed! On and on. Enough.

[ibegurpard]

4. Again people worried and looking for validation is one thing

People just saying "pack it in", in my opinion, are here to push an agenda of discouraging people from participating. And that's not what this forum is for.

[cwydro]

6. I haven't seen any "pack it in" threads, but I've been busy all day.

Not sure what you mean about that...I don’t know anyone here giving up.

[Maraya1969]

40. I've read things like that here. It really bothers me. I know some people have that

particular aspect in their personality; a kind of fatalism or an easy sense of doom.

But we are here to find answers and to fight. We need support and encouragement. People who say that there is no use do nothing for our cause and I end up questioning what their motivation is.

[cwydro]

54. I agree, I guess I've just missed those posts.

I see posts expressing worry, and I see nothing wrong with that.

I remember people worried the dotard would win last time, and they were called names here. I was worried he would win too, but never spoke of it simply to avoid the nonsense.

Sadly, we have quite the silencing machine at work here sometimes. Not healthy.

[ibegurpard]

57. I'm not talking about people expressing worry

I'm worried. But i've seen more than one sentiment stating it's over and they've won.

[mahina]

8. X1000

Mercy!

[IronLionZion]

9. Some DUers may legit need anti-depressants and therapy

but the ones who want us to give up already are probably not who they claim to be. There was a lot of that 4 years ago.

[ibegurpard]

10. precisely

there's a big difference between "i'm worried and scared" because there's more than enough reason to be MORE than worried and scared. This is legit scary shit.
But the election is already a done deal shit needs to stop.

[shanti]

51. or some LEGAL CBD

worth a try!

[lpbk2713]

11. I think part of that message is there's no point in trying.

Last edited Wed Feb 12, 2020, 07:00 PM - Edit history (1)

And then I have to wonder what agenda that represents.

[ibegurpard]

12. that's exactly what it is

[Newest Reality]

21. And in a way...

The logic of that fails, because if there is no point in trying then, really now, there is no point in pointing that out because: pointless.

[lpbk2713]

33. Point well taken.

[Collimator]

75. Exactly!

What is someone trying to accomplish by posting All is Lost/Give Up Now messages?

If you are down and discouraged and need support, ask for it. If you are down and discouraged and want to give up, do you need to drag others down with you? Does that help you in some way?

Why spend whatever time you believe we may have left making sure that others feel as bad as possible? It things really are that bad, wouldn't it be self-evident to the point that everyone is already curled up waiting for the end and hoping it won't be too painful?

Someone mentioned the thought police. I am actually trying to think as clearly as possible to see through and overcome the messages out there that non-action and defeat are the only options available to me.

If my very last moment or breath were clearly presented to me, I would want to go down grateful for all that I ever had or experienced, even if I literally had no more fight left in me.

Expressions of anger, fear, frustration and despair may have their purpose--but a directed message to lay down and accept defeat?

That's the kind of the message of those who believe that God/Jesus/Satan are behind everything and human actions on earth only serve to determine one's fate after those characters have played out their pre-destined drama.

If you're alive and you know it--clap your hands. Or, stomp your feet. Maybe shout, scream, rage, jump into the fray.

If you really see nothing but doom, just go and take it easy somewhere. Will your doom be somehow less horrible if you don't have a bunch of terrified, whimpering companions patting you on the back for having been right all along?

[Paladin]

13. There's nothing going on that a vigorous civil war won't fix.

See you on the front lines.

[ibegurpard]

14. I don't think we are quite there yet

But I certainly am not deluding myself into thinking we aren't close. This upcoming election is really do or die.

[wnylib]

37. Well that answers my question of what

do we do if the worst does happen. I have no intention of declaring a lost cause before we even try. When I am frightened by authoritarian thugs, it makes me angry enough to double down on a conviction to fight.

But there is such a thing as fighting sensibly. And there is such a thing as preparing for the worst while working for the best. So I sometimes ask myself, if it comes to a real fight, what would the nature of it be and how can I best prepare to protect myself and others while fighting back?

[DanieRains]

15. Doomed? We Will Take Another 40 Seats From Republicans In The House

And take the White House and Senate back.

[ibegurpard]

18. I think that's overly optimistic

But I don't think we're in danger of losing our majority. Senate is touch and go. And if we all band together we can kick this fascists out of the White House.

[SWBTATTReg]

47. This is the kind of thinking I like, and you nailed it!

[LW1977]

16. I've trashing Debbie Downer threads like crazy lately

K&R

[we can do it]

17. Had to be said.👍🏼

[Rorey]

19. I'm the eternal optimist

I have to admit that I was destroyed after the 2016 election, and went through a period of disbelief and anger and gloom for a period of time.

But the real Rorey is back with optimism!

[ibegurpard]

22. I am not kidding when I say I think I have PTSD

and everything has been so much worse than I imagined and I imagined it would be bad. But the optimism is based in reality. We have had a lot of electoral successes in the past few years despite the terrifying shit that is going on.

[Rorey]

23. PTSD - Absolutely! NT

[wnylib]

43. PTSD? It feels to me like my divorce got

cancelled and I am back with my very dysfunctional husband again. And THAT makes me P.O.'d enough to REALLY fight.

[coti]

30. I'm not, and I still recognize that we're winning this fight now, and think we'll win in November. n

[Yo_Mama_Been_Loggin]

20. Thank you

[ibegurpard]

25. Anything that in effect says "the election is rigged"

"we are screwed".
Stuff like that. Being scared and worried is one thing. We should be because it means we are paying attention. But our system is not completely compromised yet.

[MFM008]

26. i know

its like if we nominate a DEMOCRAT we will lose.............

[ibegurpard]

27. more like the Russians have a lock on our elections... we are doomed.

i don't believe we are there yet.

[blakstoneranger]

28. GOD, OUR ALMIGHTY FATHER IN HEAVEN!!

During the National Prayer Breakfast, trump denied God's word. No other president that I know of in my lifetime has ever, in full view of the public has ever denied God's word in order to spread evil. WE GOT HIM, IT MAY SEEM STUPID, BUT WE'VE GOT HIM. In his arrogance and bombastic behavior, he went on and on railing against his self-perceived enemies at a prayer breakfast. He has denied God at every turn. He is now trying to hurt people who aren't loyal to him. He has denied God at every turn. He is the Golden Calf to evangelicals but......Trump can't beat God. His arms are too short to box with God (hands too small too!). Barr is nothing but a weak dog before God.

ALL WE HAVE TO DO IS PRAY, PRAY, PRAY AND PRAY SOME MORE--------THEN VOTE!!!!!!!

WE WILL SAVE AMERICA, DUMP TRUMP 2020!!!

[5X]

31. When we show up...

We bring a ladder instead of a flamethrower.

[Dukkha]

32. We are doomed if we don't acknowledge the severity of the crisis

Fascism has officially arrived and it's wrapped in the flag and carrying a cross. It will not be eradicated by wearing pink knit hats and creating cute signs to garner likes on Instagram. The tree of liberty must be refreshed with the blood of patriots and tyrants.

[ibegurpard]

36. I am not suggesting hiding our heads in the sand

nor ignoring what's going on. It's bad. It's worse than I imagined it could get this quickly. But they don't have full control yet. We can turn this around if enough of us get out and vote.

[Laura PourMeADrink]

74. +1

[stopdiggin]

83. you first, thanks

I don't plan on "refreshing any trees"

[yaesu]

34. fascism is like the borg, you will be assimilated. The borg must be destroyed before

we can take our country back.

[NurseJackie]

35. What about the people who spread LIES about the Democratic party?

Like the following lies:

-- "the Democratic party is corrupt"
-- "the Democrats are the party of the one-percent"
-- "the Democrats are the party of the elite"
-- "the Democrats are ideologically bankrupt"
-- "the Democrats are intellectually bankrupt"
-- "the Democrats are feeble"
-- "the Democrats focus too much on diversity"

... what should we do about them. Can we get rid of them too?

[ibegurpard]

41. there are legitimate criticisms to be made of many Democrats

Dan Lipinksi comes to mind for me. And I like her but plenty of people hate Alexandria Occasio Cortez. But the arguments about that should not be allowed to overshadow the existential crisis that we are in. Republicans have embraced fascism.
But they have not completely taken over yet. The election is not a done deal and we are not doomed. Yet.

[NurseJackie]

44. These are LIES not "legitimate criticisms" and LIES only feed into the...

These are LIES not "legitimate criticisms" and LIES only feed into the suspicion and resentment. It's negative and it drives people away from the party. Negativity generates apathy. Apathy discourages voter turnout. Low voter turnout gives Republicans a chance to steal the elections. What good purpose does that serve? Why would anyone be celebrated for smearing the party and sabotaging our chances of defeating the fascism of the GOP?

[ibegurpard]

45. yeah those ARE lies

and yet legitimate criticisms of people from BOTH ends of the political spectrum that are crowded in the Democratic tent get tarred with them.

[crimycarny]

39. Difference between Dems and Republican

I remember someone making a comment about the difference between Democrats and Republicans way back in 2008 when Obama was running. Everyone would freak out if a single bad poll came out and predict doom and gloom. The observation that stuck with me was:

Tell a Republican about bad poll numbers and they will want to kill you.
Tell a Democrat about bad poll numbers and they will want to kill themselves.

It's so true!

[ibegurpard]

42. Not false

[paleotn]

48. Ha! So true!

[ecstatic]

46. There's a simple way to shut down that type of talk

It's called transparency, planning, and preparation.

We all know trump plans to cheat and that the gop lets trump do anything he wants. Those points are not in question, they're well documented.

I think what some of the most gloomy people are crying out for is a plan. Marching orders.

What is the plan for combating suppression?
What is the plan for combating faulty voting machines?
What is the plan for voter purges?
What is the plan if, despite our best efforts, trump's thugs blatantly alter the election results? What will our legislators do and what should we the people do?

And finally, what is the plan if we win in a landslide, but trump refuses to leave?

These questions must be answered, and people need to know what they should be doing both before and after the election to assist in these efforts.

[ibegurpard]

49. i can't answer all of those on my own

I have some ideas about some of them but I certainly can't enact them on my own.
There has to be a sustained and ongoing effort to register people and keep them registered. We can't just drop volunteers in at elections times and expect them to miraculously make up for all of the community building the right-wing does with organizations like their fascist churches. We can help people make sense of all the propaganda poisoning our society by building our OWN local community organizations. Who is doing that?
Paper trails for voting. No all-electronic voting.
some of your questions have answers i don't think we want to discuss on public forums.

[Rollo]

60. Yup, but doom and gloom can motivate more than it discourages...

We all know Trump is bad news. But a lot of Americans are ignorant of his malfeasance and destruction. His misdeeds need to be exposed and deplored as much as possible.

[ibegurpard]

62. without a doubt

[uponit7771]

66. THANK YOU !!! Part of the plan should include not certifying Trumps cheated win in congress

... but we would need the pressure on the house to take such steps

[ecstatic]

67. Absolutely! That's a great, concrete example

that I hope they are considering. They probably shouldn't share that out loud, but I hope they're at least thinking of something behind closed doors.

[Sherman A1]

50. Pardon Me

Were You designated as the Thought Police?

Many of us have very real concerns about many issues and as long as posts are within the terms of service, I don't believe that they are inappropriate.

[ibegurpard]

53. you do you

[Sherman A1]

64. YES

In fact I DO.

[Laura PourMeADrink]

73. Like getting told to leave by a non-star member

[Sherman A1]

77. Precisely

[Moral Compass]

52. Agree absolutely!

I’ve posted some pretty dark shit and I decided to stop.

We have only begun to fight. And the notion that a socialist is going to lose just because of that label? Bull.

Look at the alternative. This motherfucker is crazy and mean and had 0 redeeming qualities.

We’re not doomed. We’re coming for them. They will not survive now that they’ve awakened the slumbering giant.

[ibegurpard]

56. dark shit is fine

anyone with a functioning brain and eyes in their head should be scared shitless. But they don't have total control yet and the election is not a done deal.

[Kitchari]

55. Exactly

The doom and gloom is not for us

[Rollo]

58. Take nothing for granted...

It is nearly always an uphill battle to unseat an incumbent president. A big part of that problem is, like Trump, the incumbent doesn't have to deal with substantive rivals for his party's nomination. The Dem candidates don't have that luxury, so they are tearing each other down, which provides fodder for the GOP attack machine.

However, this is not a reason to give up. If anything it should make us even more determined to unite behind our eventual nominee and get rid of Trump. What we really need is for supporters of ALL the Dem candidates to pledge that they will do everything they can to support the party's nominee. Nobody who cares about America should sit this one out.

[Kingofalldems]

59. RW trolls do it on a daily basis.

They are taunting us.

[Cary]

61. No shit!

[kimbutgar]

65. Thank you

I have been getting depressed reading the doom and gloom about the primaries. Two states that are not representative of our multicultural country does not reflect the Democratic electorate. We have 48 states to go and the cable news needs to create bs controversaries that are big nothing burgers. Lately I have been not watching MSNBC and CNN because they are negative against The Democratic Party.

[Kingofalldems]

68. Kick this one.

[mcar]

69. Thank you

Real concern is one thing. "Concern" and "we are doomed" is quite another.

[ibegurpard]

70. Yup

And it's pretty easy to spot the difference

[TwilightZone]

71. I'm a born pessimist and even I don't do that.

We won just about everything in sight in 2018. There's no reason we can't repeat the strategy and make further progress in 2020.

Turnout, turnout, turnout, turnout.

Did I mention turnout?

Issues, issues, issues, issues.

Turnout.

[herding cats]

72. We have our still voices and our votes.

We'll survive this in time.

[ZZenith]

76. Thanks, it needs to be said.

Belief in the achievement must precede it.

[maxrandb]

78. I don't know if it's gloom and doom

It's probably people being prepared for when the eventual Democratic nominee is chosen and we have to hear how; "they're just as bad as Donnie Shit for Brains".

That's how democracy dies.

It's what happened in 2016 and I'm not seeing it prevented in 2020.

It's scary, but it's true. We have one chance... JUST ONE FUCKING CHANCE!!!!

We won't have to worry about people posting gloom and doom... we'll be living it!

[MyMission]

79. I agree! If worried or fearful, use those words

Rather than predicting doom and spreading gloom.

Mindful semantics are needed here and anyone who doesn't use them shouldn't be posting.

As I replied to another post that was negative, many of us are FEARFUL or WORRIED about the outcome of the election. And just using either word makes the post more personal and less predictive. Then the rest of us can offer hope, encouragement, etc or share our own feelings without making it about negativity.

Thanks for your post.

[Quixote1818]

80. I believe this will be our finest hour.

[greymattermom]

81. All of the news about the Trump budget

makes folks forget who actually sets the budget. Facts can help.

[Nitram]

82. Agree!

[Mersky]

85. I recently caught myself being unintentionally defeatist

And reworded a sentence before posting from a message of waiting for the tRumpers to do something, over to the more active message of clearing them out of the way.

I felt better, and my message was stronger - one of empowerment.

I’m not rolling over for the fascists criminals. Can call out what they’re doing and use language to activate against their power grab.