I wonder if anyone will do a study of how many Rs vs Ds die in the pandemic?

[Kablooie]

It might be interesting.

[jberryhill]

1. The virus doesn't care

It's amazing how many people take this pandemic as an opportunity to openly wish death on people they don't like.

It's pretty obvious that persons who live in high population density areas are at greater risk than people who live in low population density areas, simply because of inherent social distancing.

It's also obvious how high population density areas tend to vote.





You can use pretty much the same map for:

Population Density
Democratic Vote Concentration
Covid-19 Transmission

Because areas with higher population density tend to vote Democratic and have more efficient infectious disease transmission.

[Vivienne235729]

2. But you know, I am seeing a lot conservatives who are ignoring the shelter in place mandates

They think it's all a media hoax. I think they will give the high density areas a run for their money on +covid tests and deaths.

[jberryhill]

3. Do you see the map?

It does not matter.

"A lot of conservatives" are elected from places that already have something like 5 persons per square mile.

[Vivienne235729]

4. Did you not read my post? It doesn't matter if they live 5mi apart when they're having get togethers

They are going to church. They are not distancing themselves bc the grand puba says it's ok and not to worry.

[jberryhill]

6. The map disagrees with you

You can argue against reality all night. But I don't think you will beat it.

[Vivienne235729]

8. You don't understand how viruses work. Your precious map only takes into account population density.

It doesn't account for stupidity. Viruses need hosts for transmission. If people ignore the shelter in place, it negates anything your map says.

[cwydro]

11. Have you noticed the crowds at California farmers markets?

Or the crowds watching the Comfort arrive in NYC? Are they Republicans?

How about the fact that AA citizens seem to be dying at a higher rate?

This virus is not about politics.

[Vivienne235729]

17. Disagree. The virus IS political bc they made it political. I know people who

Last edited Sun Apr 5, 2020, 04:14 AM - Edit history (1)

Out of sheer political orientation think it is just a media hoax and are not sheltering in place. And if you don't think it is political, then you're not paying attention to how states are responding. Red states are dragging their feet at sheltering and quarantine. Hell, in AZ the gov didnt think about shutting down nail salons and barber shops until yesterday. And he had to be shamed into it. Blue states are on it and move fast. Look at Marin Co. They locked it down immediately and their numbers are flat.

To add: AA are innately going to be higher risk bc of their health. They have been historically predisposed to comorbidities. I get that. I also never said that political affiliation was the ONLY factor in this disease process. I thought that kinda goes without say. But I can argue that politics is a factor in the substandard healthcare access that AA have had as well.

[cwydro]

19. Is it political just here?

Or in other countries as well?

Fascinating.

[Vivienne235729]

22. Did other countries flatten their curve? I think so! bc their leadership said stay the hell home

Ours took weeks to accept that it even is a problem. So most definitely politics played a role. There has been abysmal federal leadership. State leadership has had to step up and take on the role that federal govt should have been doing but have been too incompetent to do so. Why? Bc trump. He dismantled the national response team. Here didn't accept supplies from WHO. He was campaigning instead of leading. Look at the difference between cuomo and the Gov from georgia who JUST realized asymptomatic people can transmit the virus. So, yeaaaah. Politics had played a huge role.

[Vivienne235729]

26. Tell me why Florida got all the provisions they asked for but NY didnt?

Especially since NY is the epicenter? Trump has said in not so many words: bend the knee if you want federal help. Tell me that's not politics.

[cwydro]

20. Please explain the excellent example in post 16.

[Vivienne235729]

29. Great opinion piece on politics and the pandemic response. How GOP

Gov are dragging their feet.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/foot-dragging-gop-governors-are-imperiling-the-whole-country/2020/04/03/b2fe45ee-75e0-11ea-85cb-8670579b863d_story.html?fbclid=IwAR0rRvKvh05gfPqMHZIh2Zd94ayQr3yAgXC5JNV5UdDxV2RnOh9CCKnF63s&utm_campaign=wp_opinions&utm_medium=social&utm_source=facebook

[jberryhill]

12. Italians are stupid?

The French are stupid?

The Spanish are stupid?

[Vivienne235729]

14. What are you talking about? When they sheltered in place, their numbers went DOWN.

When they didn't, it went UP.

[jberryhill]

16. Explain this

Top ten states by cases per capita:

New York
New Jersey
Louisiana
Massachusetts
Connecticut
Michigan
District Of Columbia
Washington
Colorado
Pennsylvania

Bottom ten states by cases per capita (in descending order):

North Dakota
Oregon
South Dakota
Kansas
Alaska
Texas
Kentucky
Nebraska
Minnesota
West Virginia

[Aquaria]

33. Oh good grief

You’re relying on a snapshot of today. What that map will look like a month from now could be—and most likely will be—very different. It’s impossible to say that the per capita rates today will be the same rates after the virus runs its course.

Furthermore, you make the mistaken assumption that every person in those blue states is a Democrat. That isn’t the case.

The most we’ll ever be able to know about political persuasion of victims will be from inference. If heavily R states or counties show higher death rates, then probability alone says that more Rs became victims in those locations. If post-COVID-19 elections show a marked decrease in R voters, then it could suggest a greater number of Rs having succumbed to the virus.

But those will be academic exercises way down the road.

[cwydro]

18. How about the fact that blacks in the US are being more affected by this disease?

You seem to think people’s political party has something to do with mortality. Really?

[Vivienne235729]

21. What I said is that people who have certain political beliefs will have higher risk

Of getting infected bc they are not following the shelter in place mandates. They don't even think there is a pandemic. They think the country is over reacting. So yes. The #'s will later show higher infection rates in areas that are more red bc of their political beliefs. They think it is a media hoax. Maybe you don't live in an area where people are like this. But I do. They will increase the curve.

[cwydro]

23. You have yet to answer post 16.

This thing is far from over.

[Vivienne235729]

24. If you are talking about aa, i just edited to add my response.

I don't know which one is post 16. I can't see it on my phone.

[Aquaria]

34. When one party shows a greater inclination

To reject science, critical thinking and expertise of any kind, then, yes, it’s fair to predict that their political persuasion could have a negative effect on their mortality.

But do tell how a party overflowing with people who think kicking a cardiac patient in the chest will cure his congestive heart failure will have a higher survival rate than people more inclined to take their doctor-prescribed hypertension medications.

I’m all ears for that one.

And, yes, I know a repuke loon who thought the kick to the chest by his minister had cured him of heart disease. That lasted about two months—whereupon he joined the choir invisible.

Stupid kills, and one party went all in on being stupid decades ago.

[Aquaria]

31. Worse it takes account

Only of the cases to date. Not where they will be in the future. Right now, the blue states are getting hammered because they have ports of entry and the greater wealth to travel.

But that doesn’t mean that those states will have the highest rates of infection once this virus runs its course.

Worse, one would expect higher numbers of cases and deaths in places with higher population numbers. But that doesn’t mean that more blue staters died as a percentage of their population. This is the same bullshit lying with numbers that conservascum resort to for, say, crime stats. Oh, look how horrible Chicago is, they have more murders than Bumfuck Holler, Georgia. Except that 10 murders in Bumfuck Holler could very well equal 50 or more times the per capita crime rate of Chicago and its 98 murders a year. Same thing with the virus. 10000 people in NYC dying from it would result in a far lower per capita casualty rate than 500 deaths in Bumfuck Holler County.

This is the problem with bandying about numbers without understanding all that they’re saying. Because they don’t say what people always want them to say.

So what will be interesting to see is what per capita numbers look like a year from now. That will tell the real story of the effectiveness of early containment measures, not the total numbers of people dead per city or state.

If that’s not enough, there is no way to know what the maps will look like a year from now, so it’s as ignorant to assume that blue state Democrats will die in higher per capita numbers as it to say repukes will. We can try to predict some mathematical probabilities, but it’s really too early to do that without better data. Right now, the data sets are utter shit. We can’t even get a decent idea who has the virus and who doesn’t, or even who has died from it and who hasn’t because the testing process has been so fucked up,

But I don’t think it will take a math whiz to predict that those places instituting containment measures will have a greater chance of increasing their survival rates than those who waited or took half-ass measures. Or that every day of delay will have increased the incidences of fatal consequences on a population.

[OnDoutside]

41. Fantastic post.

[Vivienne235729]

43. I agree w everything you said except I think that early containment measures will

determine the eventual # dead. I don't think they are mutually exclusive. Great post.

[Squinch]

37. It does for now. This thing will roll through the country and it has just started.

We don't know yet the answer to the poster's question, but I think it's a valid one: how much will their refusal to listen to reason affect the eventual outcome in red areas?

[Demonaut]

5. yes, unfortunately they will play a higher price

as support for them will be weak at best

[Vivienne235729]

9. Yes! Amd that too. They don't have the medical system and infrastructure to support

This level of medical acuity.

[Aquaria]

30. Why do you assume that

All the people dying in blue states are Democrats?

Are you unaware of how there are repukes even in the bluest states?

Which political party is more likely to have elected officials who have been more likely to adopt COVID-19 responses in line with expert advice? Which political party do you think will have the voters most likely to follow expert recommendations to reduce the chances of infection or propagation?

Hint: The answer to both is Democrats.

It doesn’t matter where they live anymore. What matters now is who listens to the experts. And who doesn’t.

And we know how the political spectrum will shake out about that.

[jberryhill]

32. What a ridiculous post

I do not assume that “all the people dying in blue states are Democrats”.

If you think they virus gives a shit in NYC then you are insane.

It is beyond obvious that infectious diseases do better in high population density areas. It is beyond obvious that high population density areas are Democratic.

And it is becoming very obvious that there are sick disgusting creeps that give a shit about the politics of people who are sick and dying. Thank god you don’t work in a profession that cares for them.

When conservatives were downplaying AIDS, did you do the same stupid thing?

[Aquaria]

36. I'm not the one making stupid assumptions

About death rates in the early stages of a pandemic, bub. You are. We don’t know how the numbers will shake out a week from now, never mind a year.

But it doesn’t take a rocket scientist to predict that a population that rejects critical thinking, science and expertise likely will not do as well during a pandemic as those who don’t reject it.

That is reality, like it or not. And everything—including political persuasion—will be studied someday, like it or not. Because people will be curious to know what factors led to so many deaths, so that maybe—just maybe—they can try to do something to prevent it from happening again.

Burying heads in the sand about a glaring possible factor may assuage your oh-so-delicate fee-fees, but people who give a damn about making sure shit like this doesn’t happen again won’t be so craven as you apparently are.

[Tipperary]

7. Why would they?

What an awful thing to even think about. Smh.

Do you want to know the political views of people who die in other countries too? Or just here?

[Totally Tunsie]

10. How would their affiliation be determined?

Defined by their voting registration?
Categories for Independent and Unaffiliated?

What would be the purpose and conclusion of the study?

[jberryhill]

13. The purpose would be to obtain some sick satisfaction

...in the smug belief that people who disagree with you will die.

It's the same reason why conservatives blame it on gays or whatnot.

The urge to blame disastrous events on the morals or beliefs of one's enemies is apparently a basic human drive, as some on DU demonstrate daily.

[cwydro]

15. Yes indeed.

Revealing.

[EllieBC]

25. It's gross.

And I can’t believe some people honestly hope or believe this will affect one side more than the other.

[jberryhill]

27. Well.... ABC aired "The Ten Commandments" this evening

The idea of taking comfort in plagues being inflicted on one's enemies while having it pass over oneself is not really new.

[Raine]

45. Exactly and it's disgusting! 👎 nt

[Vivienne235729]

28. I think it will be VERY interesting to find out bc conservatives where I am

Seem to think this pandemic is a hoax. They don't think it is real bc Trump has done nothing but downplayed this. They are not sheltering in place and it WILL affect them.

[Phoenix61]

35. I'm sure there will be a study on how

social distancing, stay-at-home and other interventions as well as medical resources impacted the spread and severity of the disease. That this would be by states seems logical. It won’t be difficulty to cross reference that against party affiliation of state governments.

[Hortensis]

39. Everything is studied. Want to know, wait and look it up.

[OnDoutside]

40. John Meacham tends to agree with you.

From the 7 min 30 sec mark

Jon Meacham: Coronavirus Has Become A Partisan Pandemic | Morning Joe | MSNBC

[gibraltar72]

42. My guess they already have.

[Steelrolled]

44. Not sure if anyone will do a scientific study.

But the cable news "infotainment" industry will for sure find some "experts" to speculate and argue about it.

Anything to drive us further apart.