JK Rowling really is an awful human being.

[Drunken Irishman]

Link to tweet

[Codeine]

1. TERFs gonna TERF.

I’m glad we rooted that shit out at DU.

[msongs]

2. tried to read the 1st harry potter book - boring sludge, IMO nt

[Codeine]

3. Agreed.

I fail to understand adults reading books meant for small children.

[leftyladyfrommo]

5. I loved it. nt

[dhol82]

10. I have the whole collection and am currently watching the "Half-Blood Prince."

Love everything about the world of Harry Potter!
Was just opining on how amazingly fanciful Rowling was. The whole story line was fantastic!

[Skittles]

16. OMG, same

I found it ridiculous.

[Squidly]

43. You do know that she stole the story right?

[link:http://web.archive.org/web/20071223193628/www.geocities.com/sayswamp/worst.htm|

[USALiberal]

55. LOL, ok! nt

[Squinch]

4. Wait a minute. Someone said something about "people who menstruate" and she

made a joke that there is a word for people who menstruate, then implied that the word was "women."

That is transphobic?

[LuvNewcastle]

6. I don't get it either.

Some college group has found a way to be threatened by that, apparently.

[dhol82]

8. Idiots.

[obamanut2012]

14. they aren't the idiots

[Demonaut]

26. uh, they are

[Polybius]

72. Maybe not idiots

But they are wrong.

[obamanut2012]

12. wrong

[dhol82]

7. Is that what the brouhaha is all about?

Damn.

[Drunken Irishman]

18. No. She has suggested multiple times that there are only two genders...

And that someone born a male can identify as trans but not as a female.

[Jamastiene]

32. And she is wrong about only two genders in the first place. n/t

[smirkymonkey]

36. Gender is different from biological sex.

I believe she was speaking about biological sex here.

[Drunken Irishman]

47. She's speaking in overall general terms regardless.

If you're a trans woman, she supports the trans part but doesn't consider the person a real woman. It's hateful and wrong.

[boston bean]

49. I don't think she said that about gender.

I am pretty sure she was speaking of biological sex.

[Ms. Toad]

56. It was in response to a discussion about changing how we refer to people who get periods

or people who have prostates, or testicles, or uterii, or cervices.

It is offensive to tell trans men that they are not real men, because only women get periods.

It is medical insanity to deny a prostate exam to a woman who has a prostate (as universally happens to trans women who still have that body part), or a pap test to a man who has a cervix.

[boston bean]

61. I understand a trans male can have a period because biologically they can.

What is the issue? Is it not a biological fact? Is stating a biological fact really affectIng how one identifies with their gender?


I understand the reason for sensitivity but biological facts are just that. Facts.

Sex and gender are two different things aren’t they?

[Ms. Toad]

65. The statement that women are the only people who have periods

is flat out wrong and bigoted.

Anyone with a uterus can have a period.

Sex as a biological reality would only be useful for medical care, and is a fuzzy concept, at best. People are born with both genitalia and internal organs traditionally associated with a single sex. Chromosomes do not always match sex organs.

Trans men and women don't have separate markers for sex and gender. Do you remember providing two bits of information at your last health care visit: gender, and sex? I have NEVER seen a medical form that asked for both pieces of information, or made any distinction based on "sex."

Trans people are legally (in most states), for all purposes including health care, recognized as one or the other. Their insurance and health care are linked to the gender marker on their legal documents - not the body parts that may need care, and not to a "biological sex." that cannot even accurately identify what body parts you have, as noted above.

My high school sweetheart was denied coverage for her prostate exam because she is legally a woman, and women are not eligible for prostate exams. There is no reason, other than bigotry, to require trans individuals to claim a "sex" that is irrelevant. It's kind of like insisting that there be separate terms for workers by gender. If you are a police officer, it is irrelevant whether you are male or female. The appropriate term is police officer or law enforcement officer. If you have a uterus and need medical care for it the fact that you have it is what triggers the need for care, not whether you are male or female.

[ecstatic]

63. Thanks for the perspective

I admit, I was a little confused about the backlash, so thank you for taking the time to explain.

[obamanut2012]

11. Yes, it is extremely loaded and transphobic language

JFC educate yourself about this, and what an awful TERF Rowling is.

[PTWB]

21. What transphobic language specifically?

[Ms. Toad]

25. I have trans male friends who menstruate.

It implies that these friends of mine are not men, because in her world only women menstruate.

[smirkymonkey]

40. Wait, so these are biological women who now identify as men, right?

I'm not trying to argue, just trying to get it straight in my head. I think what the disconnect is here is that she was differentiating between biological sex and gender identity.

[Ms. Toad]

44. That is correct.

trans men are largely invisible. For one thing, (by and large) they pass better so no one notices them.

What she is doing is not as innocuous as diffferentiating. She is part of a movement (that has been around since the 80s, at least) to exclude trans men from the definition of women. (Someone earlier reffered to them as TERF: trans-exclusionary-radical-feminists).

They also intentionally exclude trans women (who may have male organs) from women's gatherings - and they insist that only women are capable of menstruating or bearing children - essentially erasing trans men from existence.

I didn't think you were being snarky. The resposes from LGBT folks in this thread are the result of exhaustion. Sometimes we get tired of pointing out what is really really obvious to us (especially on DU, where homophobic and transphobic posts are frequently left standing - and we are slammed for asking people to stop making them). And there are a whole series of posts using gay as an insult that are currently exhausting us already, before this came along.

But it seemed clear to me that most in this thread weren't thinking about men with organs most frequently associated with women when they dismissed the outrage, so I'm trying to take the time to explain.

[Jamastiene]

35. Tell me about it.

Plus, what she says about only two genders would not play well with a decent portion of the GLBT community. If more people knew she is saying that stuff, I think they would be surprised and hugely disappointed. I sure was. What horrid stance to take and preach about. This is how many times she has gone back to this topic to preach? She's preaching about it at this point.

[obamanut2012]

15. JFC you are disgusting wrong

And this has no place here.

[smirkymonkey]

17. How? Trans people don't get periods or give birth.

What is so hateful about mentioning that simple biological fact? I honestly don't see what is so offensive about what she said. Maybe you could explain it to me. I'm not being snarky, I just don't understand.

[Drunken Irishman]

20. So, are post-menopausal women not women then?

[Jamastiene]

24. Apparently not.

Where do we turn in our woman card? I cannot see why anyone would not want more women fighting for equal rights.

[EllieBC]

27. Ok that's a huge debate.

On Leftbook and Twitter. Some transwomen say they have periods but “period” is short for menstrual persist which involves blood and not just being emotional and gassy.

Transmen do have actual menstrual periods though unkept they’ve had a hysterectomy.

To be honest I got annoyed a couple of years ago when some activists were asking feminists to cool it on the heavy reproductive rights talk because it excludes transwomen. It’s a huge part of feminism. Feelings can peace out when it comes to control of our bodies.

[ismnotwasm]

29. There is more to gender than giving birth and having periods

You are talking about biological sex, which is different than gender. Even biological sex has its anomalies.

Gender is very fluid, always has been. Roles can switch, be static, be challenged.

And then issues like these

https://stanmed.stanford.edu/2017spring/how-sex-and-gender-which-are-not-the-same-thing-influence-our-health.html

There is a wealth of information out there.

[Ms. Toad]

34. many trans men have periods

and some give birth.

Being trans is not synonymous with having gender confirmation surgery, or even with taking hormones. If your body came with a uterus, even if you are a trans man, you are going to menstruate unless you take steps to prevent it. It doesn't make you not a man, as she implies.

Based on conversations with some of my male (trans) friends, this monthy reality can be emotionally challenging since it is a reminder that their gender does not match the body they were born with. They do not need to be accused of not being men because (in Rowling's world) only wome menstruate.

[yardwork]

48. As other posts in this thread note, many trans people menstruate.

Rowling has a history of making hateful comments about trans people.

[Ms. Toad]

22. Yes. Many trans men menstruate.

Some bear children.

Implying that only women menstruate is transphobic.

[Silent3]

28. I just read the comments, and I don't get the angry reaction either.

I don't think supporting trans and non-binary people requires acting as if biology doesn't exist and/or has no connection whatsoever with gender.

There's a weird tension going on here, as I see it, between:

1) It being very important that we grant people the freedom to identify by whatever gender they choose.
2) Treating words like "male" and "female" as if they had little or no meaning.

I fully support point 1. But if I simultaneously accept point 2, then from what does the importance of point 1 derive?

How can it be so crucial to establish a personal identity by using words that paradoxically aren't supposed to have any special meanings or connotations?

[dhol82]

31. You said it much better than I.

Thank you.

[Ms. Toad]

51. trans men identify as male.

Many of them have periods. Some of them bear children.

Rowling's insistence on calling all people who have periods women erases their existence - because she is insisting that if they have a period, they are a woman.

The organs you are born with dictate what medical care you are entitled to, and we do associate special meanings with them.

If you are female, try obtaining a prostate exam from your doctor. Your insurance claim will almost certainly be denied. My high school sweetheart has birth certificate, social security card, passport, driver's license all of which identify her as legally female. Prostate exams are only covered medical procedures for males.

The fact that she is female does not erase the fact that she also has a prostate, and is at risk for prostate cancer if she is not having regular exams.

If you are male, substitute cervix.

It is a critical health issue (if nothing else) that we stop associating gender with body parts (or with how those parts work - like menstruating as long as one has a uterus, regardless of your gender).

If you have a uterus, you menstruate - regardless of gender. So stop insisting that only women menstruate.

[Silent3]

64. I don't think Rawling's comments have much to do with how fucked up our medical system is

Obviously people should get whatever medical care they need to get according to their personal biology and anatomy, and I'm pretty sure Rawling wouldn't say otherwise.

(And totally apart from gender issues, having to make any special effort to be "covered" for important medical services shouldn't be an issue at all in a truly civilized country.)

You can assign generalized definitions and connotations to words like "male" and "female", "man" and "woman", and that doesn't mean the same thing as being totally inflexible about those definitions. It doesn't mean treating those definitions as rigid checklists where no variations or exceptions are allowed.

When a person is born with a penis, but she feels like a woman, identifies as a woman, and struggles to have the rest of the world accept her as a woman, what exactly is she struggling for if there isn't some accepted and important constellation of meanings associated with the womanhood she is fighting for?

[Ms. Toad]

67. Did you even follow the link to her tweet?

She is EXPRESSLY talking about it in a medical context.

https://www.devex.com/news/sponsored/opinion-creating-a-more-equal-post-covid-19-world-for-people-who-menstruate-97312#.XtwLnv0aEeR.twitter

[WhiskeyGrinder]

39. Yes. People who are assigned female at birth (AFAB) but who are living as men may still

menstruate. It's possible to say "people who menstruate" and the world won't end.

[yardwork]

45. It's a dog whistle. Rowling goes out of her way to pick on transgender people.

In the context of her many other nasty comments about trans people, it's clear what she intended here.

[KentuckyWoman]

52. I am a little confused myself.

She may or may not be 'awful'. I do not know much about her. Yeah her post is smarmy but the rest I really don't understand. I got my parts out nearly 50 ago and I did not assume she means I am not a real woman because I don't get visits from Aunt Flo.

Clearly I am missing something.

[Ms. Toad]

59. She is saying trans men (many of whom menstruate)

aren't women. Many transmen retain their uterus, ovaries, and services. (Bottom surgery is complex, not necessarily covered by insurance, not necessarily successful, and some are just fine keeping their original issue parts.) Testosterone can terminate their periods, even without gender conforming surgery, but some choose not to take testosterone.

In her world, the only correct identification for people who menstruate is woman/female.

Aside from being offensive, it is also a health care issue. Many health care services are gendered, so if you are a trans woman and have gone through the legal process of getting your gender marker changed, you may well be denied the prostate exam you need to ensure you don't get cancer - since insurance will typically only cover that exam for men. Even if it is patently obvious that anyone with a prostate over a certain age needs the exam.

[KentuckyWoman]

75. Well

I understand everything you said. However, the statement from her I read does not mention trans anything. So I am still a little confused on where that big leap comes from.

Sorry I don't mean to be hard headed.

[Ms. Toad]

76. When she says only women menstruate,

she is saying those men who menstruate (i.e. trans men) are not really men - they are women, because only women menstruate. She doesn't have to use the word "trans," to refer to trans men.

"People who menstruate" includes anyone with a uterus, regardless of gender. Insisting on uisng "Women" to describe this group erases trans men's lives and health care needs.

I have interacted with TERF - Trans Exclusionary Radical Feminists (or its informal predecessors) since the 1980s. A primary goal of this movement is to exclude trans women from the circle of radical feminists because in her view, they grew up as men, were socialized as men, benefitted from male privilege, so they cannot possibly understand what being a woman is, and therefore aren't. If pushed on it, in polite company, they often give llp service to supporting trans individuals - saving their blatant transphobia for less public convesations, while simultaneously continuing to exclude trans women from women only gatherings and to insisting (as she is doing here) that trans men are really women (since they menstruate)

Her language on this issue is part and parcel of how that group operates, and it is not the first time she has used it.

[KentuckyWoman]

78. So she is a member of this anti Trans group...

That builds the missing bridge. Thank you.

And I agree medical coding needs to be updated to separate gender and biology in patient records. It is outrageous to have to fight for basic medical care in that case. You would think of all places, medicine would be out front.

[Ms. Toad]

80. I'm not sure she is a member (not really a membership group any more than antifa is)

but for a long time she has publically supported that philosophy.

As to medicine, it is largely the insurance companies that are the roadblock. My friend's doctor's office gave up trying to get through to them to cover the prostate exam and they actually switched her gender (without her permission). She blew a gasket.

[A HERETIC I AM]

9. Oh, for fucks sake

[tavernier]

77. Amen.

[Jamastiene]

19. The thing with the ones like her is that they never say something bad once and move on.

They get preachy about it. They never STFU about it. They keep going back to it and saying it over and over and over again. We heard you the first time.

She truly sucks at being a decent human being, especially since she is not even trying. Preachy people who never STFU about their favorite form of bigotry are irritating. And one type of bigotry goes hand in hand with others. They are never bigoted about only one thing. I predict more BS coming out of her mouth in the future.

It reminds me of the pubic hair wars. If you have ever shaved, there are some who will say you cannot be a true feminist. There is no fucking trademark on how a person practices feminism. I know men who care more about equal rights for women than the ones who harp on transgender people and women who have ever trimmed a pube or this or that or whatever.

It's a bunch of divide and conquer bullshit. Women are too busy arguing with each other over petty particulars that don't matter. If we could quit sniping each other and bashing each other long enough we'd rule the planet by now.

This is going to piss a lot of women off, but it needs to be said by someone at some point:
Women are our own worst enemies. We can't quit blaming each other and hating each other long enough to fucking get anything done. It is why we still have so few rights.

There are NUMEROUS men who want us to have equal rights, far more than you believe. That means a huge majority of all people DO want women to have equal rights. And in this case, I am talking about cis men, just to be clear.

Lay off transgender women. They are women too and want us to have equal rights. Why complain?

Stop sniping each other and we can get somewhere. The fact that we cannot just get on the same page with some very basics and quit arguing over petty nonsense is what is keeping us down. It is ours to have. We just can't quit hating each other long enough to take it. I'm tired of waiting for everyone to quit sniping each other.

I don't care what you do with your own body. It's your body. That's the fucking point. I refuse to be bogged down with stupid petty nonsense like that.

ALL of us, the Democratic Party too, should remember that and practice that. That's the point. Don't do the bad guys' work for them by dividing and conquering our own selves. That is called a circular firing squad. Those never end well.

Flame away. It needed to be said. I dgaf any more.

[yardwork]

50. Sing it! Great rant!

[EllieBC]

53. She should stay off Twitter. It's the worst for a lot of things.

Twitter is the extreme. She’s arguing some days with people who believe that lesbians who are AFAB who won’t have sex with transwomen who are pre-op they are transphobic.

[Sophia_Of_PlanetX]

81. Not only that, but people like this will NEVER say what you know they actually mean.

They always do this - J.K. Rowling, alt-righters, racists, homophobes, etc. They drop these vague stances that you know are dog whistles. When you call them out on it, they jump back and say "Whoa! Why are you calling me a transphobe/racist/Nazi/homophobe? I never said anything like that! Please point out where I said EXACTLY that!"

This is what we're going to get with these tweets, and in the future with J.K. Rowling. They mentally frustrate people by jumping through hoops and playing dumb until everyone gives up.

[Jamastiene]

83. Exactly.

In reality, they are showing who they really are, then claiming they are not who they really are.

[Peregrine Took]

23. She does so much body shaming in her novesl I really had to reject them.

I think she has some sort of obsession with physical appearance.

[dhol82]

33. What???

Examples?

[yardwork]

57. Well, only ultra thin girls are considered pretty in the novels.

Girls who don't have very slender bodies with smooth hair and classic features are described as unattractive. Hermione, for instance, is described as intelligent but not attractive. Her "frizzy" hair, etc. Fleur, on the other hand, is described as beautiful because she's very thin, with long straight blonde hair.

It's the same with the boys. Only the athletic slender boys are described as attractive.

Rowling does seem preoccupied with weight.

[WhiskeyGrinder]

37. She's been TERFing for years.

[WhiskeyGrinder]

41. She's a TERF. Quit making excuses for her.

[FreeState]

42. LGBT orgs are speaking out

If your not part of the community maybe you should listen.

Link to tweet

Link to tweet

Link to tweet

[Jamastiene]

54. Will you make this into an OP so I can Rec it too?

I plan to retweet the tweets you posted, but what you said needs to be said everywhere. Thank you.

[FreeState]

66. Sure!

Here it is: https://www.democraticunderground.com/100213556198

[Music Man]

58. She may have learning to do on trans issues,

But I tend to think that it is a lot to proclaim someone an awful human being due to a singular issue that, if we're being honest about it, even many liberals still are becoming enlightened about. At least, in my humble opinion.

J.K. Rowling is an active philanthropist on issues ranging from poverty to health to child welfare to veterans issues and more. She associates with Democratic politicians and liberal celebrities. Her heroes are civil rights figures. She is an icon to young women across the globe.

A more productive (and likely accurate) line of thinking is that Rowling is not awful, but ignorant. Her heart seems to be in the right place on most topics, and one would think that if she doesn't understand the biological or cultural issues at play here, she can be educated. Maybe it's the teacher in me, being optimistic that way.

[yardwork]

60. She's been making transphobic comments for years.

People have explained to her why her comments are wrong and hurtful, and she doubles down. She does this over and over. She won't let it go. It's a thing with her. A lot of us have run out of patience with her.

She's doing it on purpose.

[Ms. Toad]

62. This is not ignorance.

She belongs to a small group of women who fancy themsleves radical feminists that intentionally and persistenty exclude trans individuals.

Typically they exclude trans women by labeling their events for "womyn-born-womyn" only.

These statements hit at trans men by telling them they are not real women.

This is far from her first bigoted statement about trans people.

[Withywindle]

73. Yup, she's been on this soapbox for a long time now.

Also defended a researcher who was fired for transphobic remarks: https://twitter.com/i/events/1207690260496318465

This has been going on for years. This is not a case of meaning well but phrasing something badly, or just being ignorant. She's really hateful to trans people, and I'm not impressed with her "but I have a trans friend" or "I'm not a transphobe BUT..." When someone shows you who they really are, believe them.

I loved the Harry Potter books. Went to a con and wrote fanfiction even. But she's not getting a penny more from me.

[SiliconValley_Dem]

68. agree with you

[delisen]

69. She is a woman and feminist. In the search for a new scapegoat

Women will be defending themselves. You may disagree with them but the name calling is an attempt to drive women out of the public space.

Women were always murdered in far greater numbers than men as witches. Our society has built itself on scapegoating and the search is on for the new scapegoat.

Elderly people have already been told to die for everyone elses economic benefit. Mentally disabled people are already killed by nervous police and jailed rather than given medical care. Their situation will worsen as our society seeks to preserve the current power structure.

The eons old maltreatment of women in our society is well documented in law and tradition. We are still having to fight for the right to control our own bodies.

You want to discuss TERF, fine. You want to offer up for sacrifice a group to which you belong thay has never been scapegoated, you can ( personally I intend to build a society that does not bind itself together on the backs of scapegoated persons).

But you don't get to protect your own dominant position or the patriarch-privileged by pushing us out of the public space or silencing us.

We must protect our own human rights because history has taught us they will not be gifted to us.

We are people not created from Adam's rib or any such ignorant nonsense. No god has ever deemed us inferior, only the ravings of ignorant fearful men have done so.

[gulliver]

70. Not a fan of the books, but Rowling is not an "awful human being" at all.

[Lithos]

71. *sigh*

yes, she's a TERF - she learned her values from a different age. I realize she has a podium, but she also should realize she lives a wholly different life, with a lot of her reality frozen in time, and needs to know where she's out of her depth.

I too am old and probably would be of like mind had not several good Trans friends invested the time and beer sitting down with me. Hopefully, someone in her network will do the same for her. But I would not necessarily throw her under the bus as she does an awful lot of good in other areas, but rather feel pity for her living in the past.

L-

[hunter]

74. Let's hope she figures it out.

I've got posts I made here on DU from the awful 'oughts that now embarrass the hell of me.

Well, except for the naked pics.

I'm still proud of those.

Damn I'm hot. Always have been.

[Sophia_Of_PlanetX]

79. She speaks vaguely like most bigots, but it's obvious what she means.

I think it's pretty obvious at this point that J.K. Rowling is a TERF and a transphobe. She would no doubt totally deny this, but she sounds no different from alt-right Nazis (for example) who "Don't really hate black people" despite every other word coming them being vague racist dog whistles. The reason for this is that they want to get their ideas out while at the same time maintaining plausible deniability. It's completely dishonest.

In her tweets, she invokes the transgender equivalent to "I love black people and have tons of black friends!" She also claims that "she would stand with transpeople who are discriminated against (paraphrased)." Much like misogynists who would "support women who are ACTUALLY victims of harrassment," this is a metric that will never be met. It's also no different from smug white people saying that "Black Lives Matter is BS! When you people are ACTUALLY oppressed, then I'll march with you!" The bigotry is cloaked in insincere messages of fake concern.

At the end of the day, her tweets are loaded, full of cloaked bigotry, and in bad faith. She will never write how she really feels. Rather, see'll keep dropping these bizarre, ambiguous explanations and comments that beat around the bush.

[Tipperary]

82. I remember everyone loving her here with how she calls out rump.

Things sure change fast! I have not delved into whatever this latest outrage is, but I enjoyed all the Potter books.