New mask guidelines

[CountAllVotes]

I found this under WHO on twitter.

Dr. Tedros states that new guidelines for masks are out now.

Masks are to be three layers thick to be effective.

We hear nothing of this being the USA is no longer sending them money I guess (?).

In any event, if this is indeed true, you might as well throw the masks you have away unless they are three layers of some material which is not detailed.

>>Tedros Adhanom Ghebreyesus
@DrTedros
·
Jun 5
The updated guidance also contains new information on the composition of fabric masks. @WHO
advises that fabric masks should consist of at least three layers of different material. We also provide guidance on how to wash and maintain a fabric mask & how to use a mask safely.

Link:

Link to tweet

*************

Comments anyone?

What in the hell are we supposed to do?

I still cannot buy a mask where I live and the China ones I bought on ebay were contaminated so I threw them away (but yippee I got my money back --- big deal!).

[BigmanPigman]

1. I heard on CNN that protesters should be wearing goggles

as well as N95 masks. I am recycling my N95 ones since I know that they work and there will be another wave or two coming our way.

[CountAllVotes]

9. Good idea indeed!

Too bad they have FAILED to mention this before don't you think?

[BigmanPigman]

20. I got my goggles delivered 2 weeks ago

for under $10...can't beat that. There may be a shortage of them in the future too, who knew there would be a mask shortage (I got those at the beginning of March). I did research in March when Fauci and the rest told us that "masks don't help anyone much so don't even bother wearing one"...famous last words. When he said that I knew to go with my common sense and do what they were doing in other countries and not to listen to anyone speaking for the US govt.

[Jarqui]

17. I suspect they're right

https://www.aao.org/eye-health/tips-prevention/coronavirus-covid19-eye-infection-pinkeye

How can the coronavirus affect your eyes?
Coronavirus can spread through the eyes, just as it does through the mouth or nose. When someone who has coronavirus coughs, sneezes, or talks, virus particles can spray from their mouth or nose onto your face. You are likely to breathe these tiny droplets in through your mouth or nose. But the droplets can also enter your body through your eyes. You can also become infected by touching your eyes after touching something that has the virus on it.

ACE2 and TMPRSS2 are expressed on the human ocular surface, suggesting susceptibility to SARS-CoV-2 infection (Johns Hopkins related study)
https://www.biorxiv.org/content/10.1101/2020.05.09.086165v1.full.pdf

these results indicate that ocular surface cells including conjunctiva are susceptible to infection by SARS-CoV-2, and could therefore serve as a portal of entry as well as a reservoir for person-to-person transmission of this virus. This highlights the importance of safety practices including face masks and ocular contact precautions in preventing the spread of COVID-19 disease.

Err on the side of caution.
If you can protect your eyes, do so.

[brewens]

21. Beer goggles don't count. :) n/t

[ProudMNDemocrat]

2. I have masks cut out already I have not made.

I could easily cut out another layer of broadcloth to use as a 3rd layer.

[CountAllVotes]

4. Three layers of different material

What is the different material he speaks of?

I cannot find any guidelines as they mention.

Am I missing something?

I do not see real well any more so I could be not seeing everything.

I hope this is the case and that it is not The People not being properly informed, that is my fear!

[Blecht]

23. My wife sews

She made masks out of polypropylene (from some bed skirts we had), cotton and from old T-shirts, and we insert a coffee filter between those two layers.

[Midnight Writer]

31. Yes, my sister made some with a pocket, to change out blue shop paper or coffee filters. Very nice.

[LisaL]

27. I think different materials would be cotton and silk, for instance.

Combination of different fabrics apparently gives the best result if you are using cloth masks.

[Nay]

39. Also useful as the middle fabric is "nonwoven fabric" like iron-on interfacing. It's quite

protective, and was recommended at the very beginning of the epidemic.

[ProudMNDemocrat]

41. I have 2 with interfacing.

I made hundreds with it, but with fabric stirs still closed, orcering online takes weeks.

[Maeve]

43. Yes, it's the "swiss cheese" concept

Everything has holes so you try to make sure the holes don't line up--using different fabrics helps with that

[KY_EnviroGuy]

45. See Post No. 44, below. I found the WHO info.

n/r

[dixiegrrrrl]

54. Rayon and thick batik cloth have been recommended.

Rayon and batik are very tight weaves.....if you can blow air with your mouth thru it, not good.
2-3 layers of tight weave cloth seems to work, I've been told. Plus, they are washable.

A pocket to slip even good plastic material into would be good.

[summer_in_TX]

13. NPR ran a story that scientists tested many fabrics and nylon, like nylon hose

works better than almost any other fabric. The study was in the aftermath of Three Mile Island and could keep out many of the fine particulates from a nuclear disaster.

[CountAllVotes]

14. The next best thing is microfiber

Supposed to knock out 75% I read.

Still what about the other 15%?



Not everyone knows what microfiber is much less do they know where or how to buy a mask made out of it!

OF COURSE!

[LisaL]

29. Nylon hose is supposed to go over your cotton mask to keep it in place and prevent air from

leaking around it. By itself nylon hose is not going to work. See, you put it on top of your mask like shown in the picture. Please don't use it by itself.
https://www.npr.org/sections/goatsandsoda/2020/04/22/840146830/adding-a-nylon-stocking-layer-could-boost-protection-from-cloth-masks-study-find

[Buckeye_Democrat]

30. Ah! Good tip! nt

[summer_in_TX]

57. I missed that detail.

Thank you!

[JT45242]

3. Inner paper towel

My masks have a slit on the top to insert a paper towel or dryer sheet that I can change every time.

When this all started, I saw an article that suggested this.

It is relatively easy way to be extra safe the few times I go out.

[CountAllVotes]

15. A paper towel?

Seriously?

[catrose]

18. As long as it's nonwoven it's supposed to be somewhat effective

Papdr towels, coffee filters, shop towels

[LisaL]

26. Shop towels supposedly make for good filters.

[StarryNite]

19. No to dryer sheets. They are toxic.

You definitely wouldn't want to be breathing through them. I have read before that paper towels will work though.

EWG
[link:https://www.ewg.org/guides/search/?page=1&per_page=15&q=dryer+sheets|

[ProfessorGAC]

53. The Residual Perfume Is Annoying, Too

Ok, just sitting there, but right on the face would be overwhelming.
The toxicity, in fact, is more linked to the fragrance than to the softening agents.
The softening agents have incredibly low vapor pressures so inhalation is highly unlikely to be of significant quantity.
In fact, the SDS of those type molecules (legal documents) list inhalation as "not expected to display toxicity".
The SDS for finished product sheets list the fragrance as the issue, because it can be a Class III irritant which is pretty harsh for people with respiratory maladies, like asthma.
The softening agent itself, while potentially bad in aquatic environments, is fairly benign to people.
Good note on the aquatic life concern: the next time one washes the clothing, the active ingredient in laundry detergent reacts with the residual softening agent, making a giant, non-soluble molecule which comes out in the sewage treatment rotary filters.
So, merely washing your clothes greatly mitigates the potential environmental impact.

[BamaRefugee]

5. I believe this has always been their guideline. Each layer is also supposed to be with the grain of

the fabric at a 90 degree angle to the one next to it.

[CountAllVotes]

7. Why are they saying to wear a cotton bandana

A sole cotton bandana?

A rag will do the same job!

What a scam this whole thing is!

Who else wants the truth?

If there is NO protection with a bandana, why the hell did they not tell the public this?

WHY?

GENOCIDE.

[pnwmom]

38. It's NOT TRUE that there is NO protection with a bandana. There is less protection,

and they've known that all along. But it will still do a good job at stopping the SPREAD of the germ, and that's been the emphasis all along.

[CountAllVotes]

11. The term "NEW GUIDANCE" is used as of yesterday

Link to tweet

[BamaRefugee]

16. They used to say 4 layers of fabric, so I guess 3 layers is new

[Javaman]

6. The stores are open here in Texas and hardly a soul was wearing a mask today

When I did a curbside pick up at Home Depot.

Our halfwit gov no longer think they are required, yet the daily case count goes up and is no where near flattening.

We are so fucked

[CountAllVotes]

8. You are so right!

and thank you!

I have an acquaintence in TX and he is relying on "herd immunity" to protect him.

He has his stash of hydroxy + zinc + lots of hot air to blow.

He's toast, that's what I happen to think!

They want us out there getting exposed!

I found a tweet not long ago saying that the police were herding people up and pulling their masks off of them before shoving them into a van to be carted off.

If this is not genocide, what is it?

Take care btw and join me in the lockdown.

I'm not going out!

HELL NO I WON'T GO!!!!

Wake the hell up America! You are being played and this is the final hand!

[bamagal62]

10. I have a few N95s. But the cloth ones I have, have an opening for a filter.

[CountAllVotes]

22. So where to you get the filter from?

China?

I cannot tell you how much $ I have wasted on the crappy masks I bought from them, some said to have filters but there wasn't one to be seen!

This is a sick game to be playing with people at the end of their lives.

Yes, you read that right, end of their lives.

Do this, sew with this, use cotton, use this don't use that need this don't need that!

A virtual quagmire of possibilities with absolutely NO direction!

Where the hell is the CDC?

Do they still exist?

[barbtries]

28. they've been coopted by the trump cabal

I'm hopeful they will return with the next administration. the BIDEN administration.

[ARPad95]

12. I've already been sewing masks with 3 layers - 2 layers of 100% cotton print fabric...

and the inner layer of pillow protector material that is water-proof facing out and breathable facing in. If I hold a mask up to the light, the light does not penetrate. I've made them for my family members, son's friends and now making a set for a group of my friends and their husbands.

One of these pillow protectors yields enough material to make about 10-12 masks:

[link:https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0747LVR8B/|]

Who knew when I bought them in January that I'd need them to make masks?

[Buckeye_Democrat]

24. Can't find masks? Here's some ideas...

Someone on DU recommended the masks from Joann Fabrics, so I tried them. They're pleated cotton masks with a pocket to hold a filter -- coffee filter, paper towel, etc.

I loved them because they're big enough for my large head (24.5" circumference) and proportionally large face! Others might find them too big and baggy?

They can be purchased online and shipped quickly within the USA, or picked up at a local store if they have that cloth pattern. I recommend choosing a local store right away and then the availability of the different cloth patterns will be shown. A large number of them should be displayed after typing "mask" in their website's search engine.

Some reviewers on their website were upset that the masks were sewn in China, but I was mostly happy that they actually fit me!

Here's a pic of a Joann mask on a female model, which indeed looks too big for her, but it's great for me! (Men with beards might consider them too.)


There's also something called an "RZ mask" that are made in Minnesota. It's what I'm using now! They have exhalation valves to let your breath escape, but that's what all the cloth masks do too! At least the valves can be pointed downward to speed up the droplets landing on the floor, versus exiting out the sides and every other direction! And the RZ masks will still block any "droplet projectiles" from talking, coughing or sneezing.

Meanwhile, the filters inside that mask offer N95-level protection. Actually even better according to tests, but they don't have an official NIOSH rating yet.

Some jurisdictions like San Francisco don't allow the valve-type masks (or so I read), but my state doesn't care. Almost nobody in my city is wearing masks anyway!

Just Google-search "RZ mask" and you'll find their website. I also like them because they're tight-fitting (with a velcro strap in the back) and don't cause my glasses to fog.

Edit: And some woodworking and other little stores have N100-level (and better) masks available, like the Trend Stealth, Sundstrom SR-100, etc. Those have valves too, like the RZ masks, but are more durable with better filtration. The manufacturers apparently don't sell them to the general public now, but a few small stores still have a few of them if you dig around the internet. (I bought a couple in case a tyrant employer puts me in a precarious social situation, telling me to "do it or else", but not for everyday-use.)

[LisaL]

25. A lot of cotton masks have two layers and then a pocket for a filter.

So that will get you to three layers.

[lambchopp59]

32. No.. do not throw away your masks. They do work to flatten the curve. They do not fully protect YOU.

Wearing the masks in public enclosed spaces has little to do with protecting yourself. It's about protecting others from mouth breathing and yakking humans who may be carriers. Any animal breathing in a non-negative pressure enclosed space without covering is contaminating the area around with many bacteria, viruses, pathogens and otherwise. A surgeon wearing a mask is only reducing your risk of surgical infections by decreasing the number of potential pathogens in a wound, and is only one of many measures taken to help prevent that.
There are COVID carriers who never realize they are their entire infection course. There are others who can be exhaling millions of viruses for up to a couple days before noticeable symptoms.
And holy moly when they laugh, shout, sneeze or cough without a mask, they've contaminated a wide area, badly. With a mask they've still contaminated the area,and themselves, but in far fewer numbers of pathogens in their panorama and less distant spread.
If you are dead serious about protecting yourself until there's an effective vaccine, buy, continually carefully clean and maintain a PAPR, and walk around like a spaceman. That is the only highly effective way, other than staying completely clear of public enclosed spaces.
I'm older and have some risk factors. Working in the hospital I wear N95 for brief exposures, but if I have to be near the patient or a room they've contaminated for any extended time (more than a couple minutes), I won't do so without a fully disinfected PAPR.
And I'm slowly buying two, one for me, one for my adoptive son, piece at a time.
And I'll tell you why.
COVID 19 is only the first droplet and briefly airborne pathogen to get pandemically out of control in our lifetime. Humans are inadvertently creating horribly virulent pathogens with bad hygiene, environmental pollutants and careless habits...
So far we've just been lucky.
There are many, many other potential pathogens far worse than COVID, airborne, highly virulent and potential for weaponization.

[Buckeye_Democrat]

33. Excellent advice.

Social distancing is still the most effective prevention, like you indicated, and non-sealed masks are mostly to reduce droplet travel distance.

[SheltieLover]

34. Which brand?

I'd never heard of the PAPR masks. They have quite a wide price range. Is there a rating to look for?

TY!

[Buckeye_Democrat]

35. Powered air-purifying respirator.

I'm not touching those even if I could find them. Leaving them for healthcare workers and the most risky jobs.

Edit: Maybe I'd try to buy one if I thought I was in a very high risk group?

[CountAllVotes]

48. I might consider something like this

I am afraid to go out.

I'll have to go out sooner rather than later as food is running low.

I am high risk -- over 60 and I have a compromised immune system as I have multiple sclerosis.

Luckily, I have never fooled with the MS drugs that suppress/alter the immune system. Had I been doing this, I'd be absolutely terrified!

For the time being I'll try to not go out and order what food I can online.

I might stand a change, might.

[Buckeye_Democrat]

51. If it makes you feel more secure...

... in a setting where you must be around others, then I'm not going to criticize you.

And I'm sorry that you're in a higher-risk group during this nightmare!

I'm just using an RZ mask, but now I'm also considering putting a thin cotton mask under it. I have a few cotton masks that I ordered online weeks ago, and they seemed more appropriate for children despite being listed for adults. They're fine with the RZ mask holding them in place, though.

Your WHO link made me consider it, given their recommendation for an absorbent inner layer like cotton. Plus the RZ mask has exhalation valves, and I should really try to be more conscientious and block as many of my own droplets as possible. (The valves of my RZ masks are pointed downward, and they still block projectiles from talking, coughing or sneezing, but cotton would help block my droplets from escaping even more.)

[LisaL]

55. Those are extremely expensive.

[Buckeye_Democrat]

56. Yes, and they seem like overkill except for...

... people routinely exposed like in a hospital with known Covid-19 patients.

I bought a couple much cheaper masks from woodworking stores, rated N100+, if I'm forced to be around a bunch of other people (of unknown infection) at a job or whatever. Hope to never need them, but my past employers have endangered me in various ways, and the truth is that OSHA isn't big enough to really stop the nonsense.

Here's the mask I bought with particle filtration about 10 times better than an N100 rating. I found one for about $65.

[lambchopp59]

59. PAPR-- powered air purifying respirator

Are fully hooded air purification systems, expensive and commonly used by handlers of hazardous materials. They consist of a full or partial hood , connecting hose and a battery operated forced air through a HEPA filter system. It is the "space suit" many medical personnel wear when extensive time is required in with airborne or droplet pathogen patients.
The ones I'm assembling are made by Honeywell, several varieties are available through Grainger. I don't have the exact model readily referenced I'm buying, but it is one of the lower priced setups available, parts are coming as they get manufactured. I'm no expert on these, only regularly wear one when extended procedures are required. Greater protection is provided to the wearer by the full facial or total head coverage, eliminates some of the waste from wearing paper hoods common in the surgical suites.
Between the close call with EBOLA a few years back and now this... I'm getting prepared for what's next? Of course it certainly didn't help to have the party of stupid's mishandling of this epidemic, which could have been far less devastating... but you know that debacle.

[Vivid Lizard]

36. This From Test Results

I read this a short while back on a science news site...

"The researchers used an aerosol mixing chamber to produce particles ranging from 10 nm to 6 ?m in diameter. A fan blew the aerosol across various cloth samples at an airflow rate corresponding to a person's respiration at rest, and the team measured the number and size of particles in air before and after passing through the fabric. One layer of a tightly woven cotton sheet combined with two layers of polyester-spandex chiffon -- a sheer fabric often used in evening gowns -- filtered out the most aerosol particles (80-99%, depending on particle size), with performance close to that of an N95 mask material. Substituting the chiffon with natural silk or flannel, or simply using a cotton quilt with cotton-polyester batting, produced similar results. The researchers point out that tightly woven fabrics, such as cotton, can act as a mechanical barrier to particles, whereas fabrics that hold a static charge, like certain types of chiffon and natural silk, serve as an electrostatic barrier. However, a 1% gap reduced the filtering efficiency of all masks by half or more, emphasizing the importance of a properly fitted mask."

[MANative]

37. Cotton and chiffon is what I've been using to make mine

600 thread count cotton outer layers and two layers of chiffon inside. They do get warm, and chiffon is not easy to work with (I work for a company that makes ladies' evening gowns, seriously!) but, I saw this info several places.

[Kaleva]

40. The 2nd part of the tweet is what we've been told to do for a few months now

"Masks on their own will not protect you from #COVID19 and should only ever be used as part of a comprehensive strategy that includes physical distancing and #handhygiene."

Link to tweet

?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1268992927533072385&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fdemocraticunderground.com%2F%3Fcom%3Dview_post%26forum%3D1002%26pid%3D13556674

The wearing of masks along with proper washing of hands and practicing social distancing will only reduce the chance of getting infected. Other then complete social isolation, there is no way to protect yourself 100%.

so i have been doing and continue to do what WHO advises. I wash my hands, wear a mask and practice social distancing when out and about.

[uncle ray]

42. Masks should be three layers thick to be most effective. FTFY.

"What in the hell are we supposed to do?" do what you can. if you have one or two layer masks, keep using them. try to find better ones if you can. transmission of the virus is not binary. no mask is 100% effective. wearing a mask that reduces the viral particle count by 50% may be enough to prevent infection in a light contact incident.

I'd say a practical approach would be to try to use the mask appropriate for the situation. if you're in very close proximity to other people for long periods of time in a small space, then yes, seek out the best masks possible for that activity. going for a hike on a hot day and passing people at a safe distance? a light single layer is probably fine and appropriate for that level of contact.

[KY_EnviroGuy]

44. Here's the information you are seeking....

Go to: https://www.who.int/publications/i/item/advice-on-the-use-of-masks-in-the-community-during-home-care-and-in-healthcare-settings-in-the-context-of-the-novel-coronavirus-(2019-ncov)-outbreak

Click on "Download" and either open the PDF or save it and then open it.

Go to Pages 9 and 10.

There, it says:

b) Number of layers
A minimum of three layers is required for non-medical masks, depending on the fabric used. The innermost layer of the mask is in contact with the wearer’s face. The outermost layer is exposed to the environment.(78)
Fabric cloths (e.g., nylon blends and 100% polyester) when folded into two layers, provides 2-5 times increased filtration efficiency compared to a single layer of the same cloth, and filtration efficiency increases 2-7 times if it is folded into 4 layers.(75) Masks made of cotton handkerchiefs alone should consist of at least 4 layers, but have achieved only 13% filtration efficiency.(73) Very porous materials, such as gauze, even with multiple layers will not provide sufficient filtration; only 3% filtration efficiency. (73)
It is important to note that with more tightly woven materials, as the number of layers increases, the breathability may be
reduced. A quick check for breathability may be performed by attempting to breathe, through the mouth, and through the multiple layers.

c) Combination of material used
The ideal combination of material for non-medical masks should include three layers as follows: 1) an innermost layer of a hydrophilic material (e.g. cotton or cotton blends); 2), an outermost layer made of hydrophobic material (e.g., polypropylene, polyester, or their blends) which may limit external contamination from penetration through to the wearer’s nose and mouth; 3) a middle hydrophobic layer of synthetic non-woven material such as polyproplylene or a cotton layer which may enhance filtration or retain droplets.

Also note Table 3. Non-medical mask filtration efficiency, pressure drop and filter quality factor on Page 9 which shows the effectivenes of various household-type fabrics regarding filtration effectiveness.

There are other commonly available materials available which are far more effective than those listed which I'll try to address in a separate reply or OP later.

KY........

[CountAllVotes]

47. Thank you!

I am listening to Dr. Campbell right now.

Fortunately he is addressing this issue in detail right here:

[mokawanis]

46. My wife sewed some masks using baby burp-cloths

They're soft and comfortable, with multiple layers, and only cost about $1 each.

[Liberal In Texas]

49. Doctor on MSNBC a week or so ago said that

with all the people running around NOT wearing masks and social distancing he was recommending that to protect yourself you should start to wear N95 masks not just cloth or surgical masks.

Cloth masks prevent an infected person from spreading a significant amount of the virus. But they don't protect the wearer very well from getting it through airborne particles. The 95 in N95s means that 95% of particles in the air are filtered out.

I see so many people around here after we've gone back to "normal" business not wearing masks and congregating in groups that I started looking to buy more N95s (I had 2 I found in the shed and the attic.) Found a place in Long Beach, California that makes them for about $10 each. A little pricey, but I don't mind paying a bit more if it keeps me from getting the virus from some idiot running around with no PPE.

I also ran across masks for sale called KN95. Wondering what the difference was I found out that the K indicated that they must meet the Asian standards. Very much the same as the regular N95s but apparently a bit harder to breathe through.



https://www.hackensackmeridianhealth.org/HealthU/2020/03/06/answered-4-questions-about-flu-masks/

[LisaL]

50. I got some KN95s. They are not hard to breathe through at all-at least for me.

The issue with them is that apparently there are a lot of fake KN95 masks being sold. So a lot of these KN95 masks being sold are not really up to standard they claim to be. But yes, cloth and even surgical masks are only going to be effective if at least 80 % of people are wearing them. If 80 % of people aren't wearing them, you have to protect yourself with a mask such as N95.

[CountAllVotes]

52. That was what I got from China

They were so cheap that it was ridiculous!

They were falling apart and I don't know how old they were.

They appeared to be dirty so I threw them away as I became frightened of them!

It amazes me how greedy some people are, so greedy that they sell masks that are filthy and useless.

[burrowowl]

58. Kick kick