I notice some discussion of Columbus and his statues these days, and did some checking...

[TreasonousBastard]

First, Columbus Day was decreed by FDR because, well, they needed holiday around that time, and weren't too particular.

But, about Columbus hisself-- he was apparently worse than some of even his detractors think. He wiped out the populations of several Bahamian and Caribbean islands and started a profitable sex slave trade with Spain, since at first he couldn't find anything else to trade with.

He did oversee gold mining and plantations after a while, but enslaved whole populations working them. Most of them died-- the men from being overworked in the mines and the women from sexual savagery.

Eventually, he was "fired" due to the savagery and inept governing, but good ol' Ferdinand had his gold hoards overflowing so instead of beheading him, gave him his job back.

Now, there are those who deny all of this and insist the happy and peaceful island natives were actually worse, and Columbus saved them from themselves.

Considering the other Spanish actions in this here New World, I tend to believe the worst of him.

Oh, and his son is believed to be the first African slave trader in the Americas.

[Beakybird]

1. The cruelty that Columbus and his men openly discuss in their letters is breathtakingly depraved.

Genocide, child rape, enslavement, etc. It's all there for the reading.

[ARPad95]

2. I don't think the Columbus statue in the center of Syracuse will be standing much longer.

[link:https://cnycentral.com/news/local/debate-reignites-over-columbus-circle-monument-as-petition-for-its-removal-nears-8000|]

A petition asking Syracuse Mayor Ben Walsh to take down the Christopher Columbus statue in the city now has nearly 8,000 signatures.

The mayor says he wants to ensure any discussion made about the statue is one that contributes to a healing process and does not do more harm to the Syracuse community.

The debate surrounding this statue is of course nothing new, usually flaring up around what is historically known as Columbus Day - a day that some believe should instead be called Indigenous People's Day.

That day isn't for another 4 months - instead, this petition is linked to the Black Lives Matter movement.

Thousands rallied in Syracuse on Saturday and hundreds marched in support of the movement, eventually arriving at the base of the statue of Columbus. While they were there, they discussed his role in sparking hundreds of years of genocide and slavery in the Americas.

Robert Searing, a curator of history at the Onondaga Historical Society, discussed the complex issue with CNY Central.

“How this symbol of oppression and genocide for one group can also be a symbol of pride and self-worth in the other, I find that to be a fascinating conversation to have,” Searing says.

In 1910, at a time when Italians had faced violent racism in the United States, Searing says Italian Americans in Syracuse raised $21,000 to build the Columbus statue.

"He is the hero of Italian Americans of that era and to this day,” says Bob Gardino, Columbus Monument Corporation board member.

Gardino says its why the statue needs to stay up.

At the time that Columbus Day began, Italian Americans were largely unaware of Christopher Columbus' violence.

The petition to take down the monument says it serves as a way for the community to remove a symbol of oppression from the city. Its why some are looking to remove the statue entirely from the city center, including Cindy Squillace, a member of the Neighbors of the Onondaga Nation, and an Italian American.

The reality of the symbol of what Columbus did is inarguable, Columbus was a monster and he was recognized as such by his contemporaries and certainly by history as well,” Squillace says. “Columbus represents the first domination of colonialism in this part of the world, I do not want Columbus as the symbol of what’s good about Italy.”

Mayor Walsh says discussions have been ongoing for two years with different members of the community. No official decision has been made.

[keithbvadu2]

3. Bringing Christianity to the savages.

Bringing Christianity to the savages.

[UTUSN]

4. "Spanish actions" - "European actions" - although the indigenous actions to one another

were icky, too - ripping out hearts, wearing the flayed skins, more.

We might take a view higher up the mountain, that humankind as a whole is a mixture of good and horrible tendencies.

[BannonsLiver]

5. We should also start thinking about what we are going to do to FDR

Given that he did nothing about lynchings in the south and put hundreds of thousands of American citizens in gulags. He should come off the dime as soon as possible.

[Thomas Hurt]

6. The bravery of venturing into the unknown to discover new lands is something commemorate

Problem is the reason he was doing it in the first place was avarice and conquest.

No way in hell that needs to be display in a statue. Keep him in the history books sure, keep him the museums sure.

Move the statues to a museum, we don't need to equate him with being a person of note in the public square.

[Tipperary]

7. Columbus was actually Italian. nt

[TreasonousBastard]

10. Yes, but the Italians threw him out, largely because if they spent the money to...

send him off and he was right it could screw up existing trade routes. Besides, there was no "Italy" then. Like "Germany" it was an admixture of various city-states and kingdoms. If anything, he was Genoese.

[Bradshaw3]

13. Not necessarily

The Italians certainly think so but there have been many others who believe he was Portugese.

https://www.biography.com/news/christopher-columbus-heritage-nationality

[Aristus]

8. Oh yeah; Columbus was a monster.

I can't believe I grew up singing happy little songs about how great it was that Columbus 'discovered America'. There would be no baseball, hot dogs, apple pie, or Chevrolet if Columbus hadn't 'discovered America'. Aren't we lucky?

Then I read the words of his own hand as to what his 'discovery' meant to him and the people who funded his voyage. I nearly vomited...

[Sneederbunk]

9. Washington and Jefferson must be removed from Mt. Rushmore.

Slave owners don't you know.

[Sgent]

11. Meh

Columbus was considered cruel by contemporary standards.

Washington was constrained by circumstance and did all he could while still keeping the nation in one piece. He freed his slaves after death and Virginia promptly changed the law so no future slaveholders would be able to.

Jefferson I'm still on the fence about. He was a slave and plantation owner and benefited from it -- yet he (illegally) freed his children by Sally Flemmings, and she voluntarily returned with him from France.

[stopdiggin]

12. maybe not

But you would agree that it's high time the blinders came off .. on how the subject of racism informs the entire history of our country (as well as many others)? Better that we should know the real history here, right? And be a little ashamed for parroting "1492 .." (and 'remember the Alamo') in school curriculum for so many years? Or should we just take a pass on things like that for another 4 or 500 years?
--- --- -- --- ---

[lunatica]

14. Teaching factual history would make us a better nation.

One of the reasons we are so insufferable is that we think we’re better than other nations. It’s kept us unable to evolve.

It really isn’t all that hard to teach our true history in middle and high schools and in college. Otherwise it’s all just propaganda (which we all think is something only Germany did under Hitler).

We would survive just fine.